Enoby Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 Not exactly an FAQ, but soms FW units have been changed a little; from what I can see, the greater daemons have regained their leader keyword. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyriakin Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 36 minutes ago, Enoby said: Not exactly an FAQ, but soms FW units have been changed a little; from what I can see, the greater daemons have regained their leader keyword. Is that Battleline back on Fimir Warriors, I see? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravinsild Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 Anyone play Khorne know if that Mazarak the Butcher fella is worth it??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 a few profiles changed also, chaos dwarfs got a little alteration on some Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sal4m4nd3r Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 The exalted GUO went down another 40 points. Model is still a roughly $150 paperweight though. It is objectively worse then the cheaper, better model, and less expensive (currency) then the GW GUO... so yay for that..? This nerf hammer has baffled me still as it wasnt OP just really good but really expensive. Chaos War Mammoth is still LOL inducing at 320 points. That warscroll is so broken. Also OOP and about $1200 on ebay last I checked so unless you have one already its infuriating how good yet unattainable it is.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjnoronh Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 Talk to me about the Chaos War Mammoth. I haven't seen one fielded yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Scribe Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 We have some guys using the mammoth now. There is a scleich (sp) mammoth model being used and some are using the lord of the rings mumak. That thing is so OP gross at 320 points, I'd love to know how FW pointed it at what it is... 22 wounds... does about 18-20 wounds guaranteed at full strength and even damaged is doing about 10-12 wounds (after saves / mortal wounds) ... and 320 points. It should be more like 550 points. It out performs greater demons and costs less than they do. I can see why people ban forge world outright. There is literally no balance in some of those models. They are either ridiculously undercosted or ridiculously overcosted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 2 hours ago, Dead Scribe said: We have some guys using the mammoth now. There is a scleich (sp) mammoth model being used and some are using the lord of the rings mumak. That thing is so OP gross at 320 points, I'd love to know how FW pointed it at what it is... 22 wounds... does about 18-20 wounds guaranteed at full strength and even damaged is doing about 10-12 wounds (after saves / mortal wounds) ... and 320 points. It should be more like 550 points. It out performs greater demons and costs less than they do. I can see why people ban forge world outright. There is literally no balance in some of those models. They are either ridiculously undercosted or ridiculously overcosted. the mammoths cost is unchanged for about a year. the only change was marks added. banning forgeworld is a bad move, some games workshop proper stuff is equally as broken. its just a old stigma that has surrounded forgeworld and is an easy excuse to ban stuff people dont want to face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amysrevenge Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 5 minutes ago, Arkiham said: banning forgeworld is a bad move, some games workshop proper stuff is equally as broken. its just a old stigma that has surrounded forgeworld and is an easy excuse to ban stuff people dont want to face. Same as named characters lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, amysrevenge said: Same as named characters lol precisely, people always used to moan about named characters in 8th edition.... you could build more broken ones for cheaper and it was fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Scribe Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 For me I just realize that as long as tournaments allow them that its something that I have to face. But 320 points really needs looked at. All of my chaos opponents have one now because of how good it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swarmofseals Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 8 hours ago, sal4m4nd3r said: Chaos War Mammoth is still LOL inducing at 320 points. That warscroll is so broken. 5 hours ago, Dead Scribe said: That thing is so OP gross at 320 points I don't think the math bears this out at all. Against rend 0/1/2/mortal attacks it has a points per expected wound of: 7.27/9.69/12.12/14.54. That's pretty good for a monster but nothing to write home about. Compare to 30 hag narr witch elves with dual knives and a hag queen (cost: 330): 5.06/6.11/6.29/6.29. And that isn't factoring the possibility of prayer buffs. On offense the Chaos War Mammoth deals 5 mortal wounds on average vs. normal targets and 6.67 mortal wounds on average vs monsters plus an additional 6.67 rend 2 damage vs either target. So vs armor -/6+/5+/4+/3+/2+ we are looking at a total of .036/.036/.036/.033/.03/.026 damage per point vs. non-monsters and .042/.042/.042/.038/.035/.031 damage per point vs. monsters. That same block of witch elves plus hag queen (not counting the hag queen's attacks or any possible prayer buffs or bonuses from Daughters of Khaine allegiance abilities) 60.5 deal .183/.152/.122/.092/.061/.031 damage per point. Basically, the Witch Aelves are more defensively efficient against all damage types (and twice or more as efficient against rend 2+ and mortal wounds) AND equal or better against on offense against all targets. Against light targets the Witch Aelves are basically FIVE TIMES more efficient. Against a 3+ save the Witch Aelves are still nearly twice as efficient. They only even out against monsters with a 2+ save (not many of those). The mammoth is faster at 12", but Witch Aelves can run and charge which reduces the difference substantially. Basically, if you think the war mammoth is "LOL inducing" and "so OP gross" then I can't even imagine what you must think of Witch Aelves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 On 7/27/2018 at 6:00 PM, Dead Scribe said: For me I just realize that as long as tournaments allow them that its something that I have to face. But 320 points really needs looked at. All of my chaos opponents have one now because of how good it is. good.. or finally viable ? the EGUO is arguably better at 400 points, but no one takes him. it may be good, but it certainly isnt broken on the correct base Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sal4m4nd3r Posted July 30, 2018 Share Posted July 30, 2018 On 7/28/2018 at 3:44 PM, Arkiham said: good.. or finally viable ? the EGUO is arguably better at 400 points, but no one takes him. it may be good, but it certainly isnt broken on the correct base You are wrong on two accounts. The war mammoth changed SIGNIFICANTLY. He got a better save, better attack characteristics, better tusk profile, and got the ability to take marks which is HUGE upgrade. Now its not an ally and can be affected by all chaos god keyword abilities. The EGUO lost a save point, and now has a worse shooting attack to the GUO because it actually degrades further then the GUO does... which never goes to a 5+. How was the EGUO never viable in the first place? 2d6 shots that did d3 damage each was frickin dope. and a base 3+ save he WAS a tank. Now for 40 points more then a GUO you get one extra attack on the sword, and a couple extra inches of movement. Cool story. Oh and a WORSE shooting attack. He is also way more expensive (money) then the GUO and arguably not as good as a model. Objectively smaller. Way less options for list versatility. Its cool though. I learned my lesson. Forgeworld isnt worth buying because randomly they will render the VERY expensive boutique model you bought worthless on the tabletop after they have made their sales. @swarm of seals. your math is irrelevant because he can take marks and buffed by god specific abilities. He also debuffs bravery and has 22 wounds with a 4+ save. If you think he isnt broken at 320 points you are just trying to be edgy and contrarian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedraxis Posted July 30, 2018 Share Posted July 30, 2018 Yeah the War Mammoth needs to be at least 440 in my book, and even then he'd still be very cheap for what it brings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girgutz StormStompa Posted July 30, 2018 Share Posted July 30, 2018 CAn anyone let me know how the Exalted Bloodthirster looks at this new price? I really want this one to lead my BLoodbound but I am just unsure before I pay the FW tax :s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sal4m4nd3r Posted July 30, 2018 Share Posted July 30, 2018 Im imagining a war mammoth charging first turn with a 4+/5++/6++ save in my nurgle army, re-rollings 1s to hit and wound. Possibly +1 to wound if I got the cycle on stage two (fecund vigor) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted July 30, 2018 Share Posted July 30, 2018 46 minutes ago, sal4m4nd3r said: You are wrong on two accounts. The war mammoth changed SIGNIFICANTLY. He got a better save, better attack characteristics, better tusk profile, and got the ability to take marks which is HUGE upgrade. Now its not an ally and can be affected by all chaos god keyword abilities. The EGUO lost a save point, and now has a worse shooting attack to the GUO because it actually degrades further then the GUO does... which never goes to a 5+. How was the EGUO never viable in the first place? 2d6 shots that did d3 damage each was frickin dope. and a base 3+ save he WAS a tank. Now for 40 points more then a GUO you get one extra attack on the sword, and a couple extra inches of movement. Cool story. Oh and a WORSE shooting attack. He is also way more expensive (money) then the GUO and arguably not as good as a model. Objectively smaller. Way less options for list versatility. Its cool though. I learned my lesson. Forgeworld isnt worth buying because randomly they will render the VERY expensive boutique model you bought worthless on the tabletop after they have made their sales. @swarm of seals. your math is irrelevant because he can take marks and buffed by god specific abilities. He also debuffs bravery and has 22 wounds with a 4+ save. If you think he isnt broken at 320 points you are just trying to be edgy and contrarian. i meant better in comparison to the mammoth. pretty sure the mammoth is on archaons base or slightly smaller meaning terrain/spells etc etc can be used to completely nullify him hes as much wounds as 5 blightkings basically, with the same save, dies just as easily if not easier due to having monster keyword and is on a huge base. if you cant kill the mammoth how you going to kill 5 kings?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Scribe Posted July 30, 2018 Share Posted July 30, 2018 I think the difference is that the mammoth can also pump out a shed load of mortal wounds as well as high damage wounds, which the blight kings cannot do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurglesFirstChosen Posted July 30, 2018 Share Posted July 30, 2018 Negative point - after the incredible destruction of my favourite miniature (eguo) I won’t be buying anything from forgeworld again (not to mention the 12 toads I brought!). Positive point - this won’t stop my love for the hobby... or me spending daft sums of money on toys from gw haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infernalslayer Posted July 30, 2018 Share Posted July 30, 2018 Agreed, after what they did to Plague Toads and the Exalted Greater Unclean one i lost the good faith to continue to purchase anything in their Age of Sigmar range. I am pretty sure they will nerf the mammoth to the ground next time as well, upsetting people that converted mammoths or hunted online for them at over the top prices. That does not apply to the entirety of Forge World products, but Age of Sigmar in my experience. (The team behind FW Lord of the Rings is very dedicated to it and it's balance for example) I mostly blame the lack of any FW printed material for AoS. Games Workshop are more consistent and mainly change warscrolls when there really is a need for it as they have to keep existing battletomes valid and errata them. Forge World just releases a new PDF that completely replaces the old one and the only consistency they have shown, is their lack of it, nerfing warscrolls that did not deserve it while leaving others that need a buff in the mud. I much prefer the way GW handles their material and will let my wallet speak for that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enoby Posted July 30, 2018 Author Share Posted July 30, 2018 Big changes in usefulness make me much less confident in a FW purchase - it feels too unstable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Scribe Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 Yeah its too swingy. Rules and power should not variate that wildly, especially for very expensive product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Marius Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 It fascinates me that anyone would pay the premium for FW models (generally amazing) for their rules (generally inconsistent with the main range). Shoddy rules writing for the mourngul and Sayl the Faithless elevated them to 'must-have' status for competitive Death and Chaos players, thus disappointing many who bought or converted them when they were rightfully nerfed into line. I stay well away, even though i could conceivably be tempted by some of the lovely monsters they make, just to own them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurglesFirstChosen Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 1 hour ago, Captain Marius said: It fascinates me that anyone would pay the premium for FW models (generally amazing) for their rules (generally inconsistent with the main range). Shoddy rules writing for the mourngul and Sayl the Faithless elevated them to 'must-have' status for competitive Death and Chaos players, thus disappointing many who bought or converted them when they were rightfully nerfed into line. I stay well away, even though i could conceivably be tempted by some of the lovely monsters they make, just to own them! Something being appropriately nerfed is something we should expect, but we aren’t referring to appropriate nerfing Tbf I only got back into the warhammer under a year ago (from a 20 year hiatus) . So wasn’t aware spending nearly 500 quid with fw was such a mistake. Oh well, you live and learn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.