AoS 2 - Fyreslayers Discussion

[madmac]

18 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

Magmadroth article.

Runesons on Magmadroths are now Battleline for Lofnir.

Pretty much expected, but still useful, maybe. Depends on how playable Magmadroths are going to be, and the incomplete look at the new Fyrestream rule (why is this rule always stupidly complex!?) isn't really helping with that.

I'm guessing this means Runesons on Magmadroth lose the leader keyword, but then how does that work for Runesons on foot? Are they also not heroes/leaders anymore? Janky, just janky all around.

Edited February 24, 2022 by madmac

[Malakithe]

Well color me interested. I can only pray that the Runesons themselves wont be total ass like they are now. Also we need to see what this new Fyrestream attack does

Looks like they already edited the article lol 

Edited February 24, 2022 by Malakithe

[Doko]

Lofnir nerfed from every magma to only 3.

Roaring shooting nerfed from 12" to 9" and from mortal wounds to only 1 rend.

The damage is better against units of 10+ models and more than 6" than old profile but is only 1 rend and not  mortals.

I allways play with two gyrocopters because they are fun,but in aos3 where every unit is msu this profile of attacks are useless when every meta army are single monsters.

And no word about more changes to other profiles of magmas.......so every unit scroll is useless and now seems magmas that were the last hope gonna continue being garbagge.

[Doko]

Btw new magmadroths in a web where someone have the book have said:

Magmadroths now have 16 wounds but only save 4 now.

Claws now hit on 3.

Maw have 2 extra attacks.

Ryders now have been buffed a bit.

But now have been increased the points a lot of also,but dont say tye amount.

He said that magmadroth have gone from garbagge to only bad when someone asked 

Old magmadroths had a median damage at melle of 5 and new have 8'8.

A extra of 3'8 more damage at melle,the new breath and 2 extrawounds for a increase in points........we need see how big increase but dont look great. Also a bad save 4 when almost any monster have save 3 those days

Also mounts traits nerfed from 6 to only 3.

-reduce damage in 1

-stomp makes 3 extra mortals

-shooting allways do a min of 5 models

Edited February 24, 2022 by Doko

[Baron Klatz]

1 hour ago, madmac said:

I'm guessing this means Runesons on Magmadroth lose the leader keyword, but then how does that work for Runesons on foot? Are they also not heroes/leaders anymore? Janky, just janky all around.

Sons of Behemat are both Leaders & Battleline so I imagine that happening here too.  

3 minutes ago, Doko said:

But now have been increased the points a lot of also,but dont say tye amount.

Yeah, it’ll probably be like the Deepkin turtles where you’ll probably be only able to fit in 3 or 4 which could be why it specifies up to 3 getting buffs. 

[madmac]

36 minutes ago, Doko said:

Btw new magmadroths in a web where someone have the book have said:

Magmadroths now have 16 wounds but only save 4 now.

Claws now hit on 3.

Maw have 2 extra attacks.

Ryders now have been buffed a bit.

But now have been increased the points a lot of also,but dont say tye amount.

He said that magmadroth have gone from garbagge to only bad when someone asked 

Old magmadroths had a median damage at melle of 5 and new have 8'8.

A extra of 3'8 more damage at melle,the new breath and 2 extrawounds for a increase in points........we need see how big increase but dont look great. Also a bad save 4 when almost any monster have save 3 those days

Also mounts traits nerfed from 6 to only 3.

-reduce damage in 1

-stomp makes 3 extra mortals

-shooting allways do a min of 5 models

Sounds unfortunately plausible as far as changes go.

Everything I've seen from the new Fyreslayers rules has that same tone of "gentle buffs, gently now, not too much! Oh dear oh dear, this unit seems slightly better than it was before I fiddled with it, better add some nerfs to balance everything out, whew!"

The whole tome was probably written a long time ago before Fyreslayers crumbled their way into 3rd Edition so it was made under the assumption that everything was pretty much perfectly balanced already.

[Doko]

Yes,i dont see anything so far giving me hope.

-as every 3.0 book we gonna loose the lodges warloed traits and reliks etc,so we gonna loose the -1 wound aura or the run and charge or the attack first.

-vulkites base 33" and range 1" so they are useless with 3.0 coherency

-vulkites with shield 170 points for10 attacks at  melle of 4\3\1\1 doing them the single worst unit in points per damage of entire aos

-hearthguard rangued lost bodyguard and bonus to monsters and only have 3 damage for 120 doing them also garbagge the ratio damage per points

-hearthguard melle got deleted the 6++ withouth hero and changed from within 10" to wholy within 9" doing them umplayable in units of 15

-grimwrath hero was nerfed in broken realms

-new magmadroths,got a new breath(worse against less than 10 models),2 more wounds and 4 extra damage but increased a lot of in points that if the % of increase in points is bigger than the % of increase in damage then is a nerf

-we know new runes are same than olds but with some sligth buff.

 

So far i only see how in general a army that was a 7 is now a 4. As the 90% of changes are huge nerfs. 

I had some hope for magmadroths or runes that were great and makeup for these nerfs but the time is close and we know almost everything allready and dont look good

[PJetski]

If they lose Behemoth when they become Battleline in Lofnir, Auric Runesons on Magmadroths can be put in Battle Regiments and Hunters of the Heartland as Troops, but as a HERO they can still take Enhancements. 

Really interesting

[Baron Klatz]

Ohh, hadn’t considered that. A team of Magmadroth Hunters of the Heartland would both make great counter-monster units and be fluffy with Lofnir’s lodges in the Realm of Beasts.  
 

Edit: well thanks to a certain someone who spells melee as melle one of the leakers noted the full Fyreslayer tome is looking good.

”I think fs are going to be pretty strong ! I know it look bad from the reveal but this is not the full book.
I am actually quite stoked on them...

In fact the battletome is like Maggotkin, they want the rules to reflect how the Slayers army should fight.”

Edited February 24, 2022 by Baron Klatz

[Warboss Gorbolg]

I imagine that your first shooting phase you always declare, “inferno raging inside” to get rend 3 on Roaring Fyrestream. Seems pretty good. Looking forward to the full rules.

[Doko]

Another posible leak:

 

the strike first is the Mighty destroyer of the FS now

[Malakithe]

For now im placing what little hope I have in a small bottle and putting that on ice.

[madmac]

Well, one more week until we have enough leaks to assess the damage, but definitely no happy surprises lurking around the corner at this point.

Droth going buyable separately again, makes sense with GW trying to lean hard into promoting the Magmadroth spam build. Honestly, what else would people buy for Fyreslayers at this point? They nerfed Vulkites so hard that no buff could possible salvage them, Auric HG are...nothing, and HGB spam is also probably a thing of the past with the much more restrictive positioning.

[Clan's Cynic]

If there's a positive to the dice being so boring, you'll be able to pick them up cheap with how often they'll go on sale like the Daughters of Khaine dice.

[Lord Krungharr]

I already have the FS dice, and they are super cool!  I will be using them with my other Duardin for sure....not sure if I'll be keeping any of my FS (they could pay for many other thingies I have recently bought on impulse).  But gotta wait and see though; if they give a unique playstyle amidst my other armies then I'd be okay keeping them for variety.  Also I'm wanting them to have coalition allies.  If they don't have that, they may not be satisfactory for the rest of my short folks.

[Doko]

I heard a leaker say that we wont have coalition dwarfs,but one lodge let us use runes on every dwarf ally.

So only 400 points,but if it is true gotrek gonna can have runes. Seems fun even if it isnt competitive

[Fellman]

can someone make out tha battle tactics

[Iamanbo]

2 hours ago, Fellman said:

can someone make out tha battle tactics

this is the most i could do but since it's not my main language I can't guess some words that don't look good

 

[angrycontra]

Rune that is barely shown appears to be the former "reroll hit rolls of 1" rune, which now has been changed most likely to just "+1 to hit rolls" (with the +1 to attacks with enhanced effect same as before). However there's chance that it only affects melee attacks now as it appears it reads "made with melee weapons".

[madmac]

5 hours ago, angrycontra said:

Rune that is barely shown appears to be the former "reroll hit rolls of 1" rune, which now has been changed most likely to just "+1 to hit rolls" (with the +1 to attacks with enhanced effect same as before). However there's chance that it only affects melee attacks now as it appears it reads "made with melee weapons".

Well, that's fair. Gotta remove all possible ranged buffs so that no one contemplates taking Auric Hearthguard for even a second.

In slightly better news:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/02/28/the-battlesmith-tells-stories-so-riveting-that-fyreslayers-will-literally-cheat-death-to-hear-them/

We lost the +1 armor save for a 6+ ward which is...yeah thanks so much for removing the 6+ ward and easy +1 save on HGB and giving them back instead a nonstackable 6+ ward in a case where they are wholly within 12" but not 9" of a Battlesmith, huge buff, much thanks.

Rally on a 4+ is pretty good though, I'll give him that. Gotta do something to offset all those extra dead HGBs anyway.

[Clan's Cynic]

There's so many ways to get Ward Saves flying around that I don't know why they didn't just give the entire army an innate 5+ Ward Save. Would've saved on ink.

 

[Doko]

As every unit of the tome now again battlesmith nerfed from +1 save to a useless 6 ward.

The rally of 4 is cool but i dont know if worth bring the cost of a hero 100% useless hero to use rally with 4 when i could use his cost and bring one extra unit since the beggining.

This would be cool and fun if vulkites could attack when die every turn and not only one time per game doing the interaction useless.

[madmac]

2 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

There's so many ways to get Ward Saves flying around that I don't know why they didn't just give the entire army an innate 5+ Ward Save. Would've saved on ink.

 

Yeah, way too much redundancy on an effect that never stacks.

Honestly the new Battlesmith only really exists for the Bard thing, his ward is almost never going to be relevant. Doesn't matter for Vulkites or Aurics because no one is ever going to use those units with their new warscrolls, too slow to keep up with Magmadroths, only does anything for HGB on a turn where they are very slightly out of position for their 4+ ward and also none of the other various 6+ ward effects are going, etc.

From what I can tell so far, the only play in the new book is either static HGB blob supported by both a Battlesmith and the new guy, good luck charging even once and keeping both guys in range, or Magmadroth spam, assuming that's halfway playable. Neither of them sound particularly strong even, I just don't know what else you can do.

[Doko]

Yes,i dont know what more can be nerfed,because EVERY single unit that we know new stats have been nerfed.

Even magmadroth new breath is a nerf of old.

If rally could be used in melle i would see any use for new battlesmith,but really for me is 100% useless and i wont use him never.

As you said he would be playable together vulkites,but vulkites are umplayables and so this heroe also is useless.

So far i only see same build that 2.0 but nerfed hard,with only hearthguards playable but now lost the +1 save of battlesmith and his aura is almost imposible to get with 15 models........i dont know if something in the tome can fix this,when every single new leak are only more nerfs

[Baron Klatz]

Me and my brother finally grabbed the Fury of the Deep box among other goodies.  

 

Going by the new Battlesmith rules and his love of the “fire Viking” infantry looks like he wants to go heavy on Flamekeepers and “bards” to keep cycling his forces between life and death to build up that Ur-gold.