AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

[ledha]

21 hours ago, Requizen said:

Lords of the Storm changed to just a 4+ to get an extra CP with the same restrictions, which does kinda suck, but again a good way to get extra stuff and less drops.

 

meh. Lord of the storm was not easy at all to take but it was hilariously broken against full melee armies, making half of the ennemy army retreat during it's turn and creating an enormous chaos

[PJetski]

14 minutes ago, Requizen said:

Oh, also: Judicators with Crossbows gained an Attack, so they're 3 normally, 4 when they don't move. And the new FAQ/Commentary clarified that being set up is not a move. Also nice for Hurricane Raptors, that.

So, a unit of Crossbow Judicators (still a Shockbolt on the Prime, because it's that good), drops in and unloads 16 shots (not counting the Prime). ~5-6 wounds with no Rend is a lot more than Bows do, though you're basically required to put them in Scions and drop them quite close. Still, way more worth the consideration than they were a couple weeks ago.

Is that in the new battletome or on the app? The app has a lot of errors

The Shockbolt Bow has gotten a lot less valuable with LOS making it more difficult to hit characters and I think the Thunderbolt Crossbow is worth considering now. If you're dropping into range for crossbows then you should be in range to hit some kind of 5+ model unit with a Thunderbolt for D3 mortal wounds. Since it doesn't need to hit, you can give the Prime a crossbow.

I think Hurricanes will probably do more damage (and cost less points) but if you you're bringing Judicators for battleline then they can get a lot of value clearing screens with crossbows.

[Memnoch]

Is it just me or does the male Knight Incator look a lot more like the Evocators armor wise than the female Knight Incantor?

Although he has a lion head motive on both is chest and staff that neither of the others have.

[Greven]

So, quick one, what dracothian gaurd is everbody putting on the table with the new scrolls?

[Namelessone81]

18 minutes ago, Greven said:

So, quick one, what dracothian gaurd is everbody putting on the table with the new scrolls?

What changes ??? Damn I can’t keep up with the leeks  

any links maybe ?

[Trayanee]

Is anyone still going to use paladins? Which do you think are viable? Evocators and their MW output makes Retributors obsolete to me especially with the spell and unbind being a bonus for Evocators. Protectors are still not bad for fighting monsters, provide cover and are easier to take in larger units so they could be ok in their niche, but I quite like the Decimators if they were really changed to count every model of every unit around them to determine the attack count.

[aceytrixx]

40 minutes ago, Greven said:

So, quick one, what dracothian gaurd is everbody putting on the table with the new scrolls?

Im going to try concussors I think. I liked Fulminators because of the breath attack but with them all the same I wonder if concussors will work out better in extended combat. If you have a heraldor then maybe Fulminators are still better. Maybe they are still better even without the improved breath. I really just want to run like 8 desolators one day haha. 

[ledha]

I'm a bit disapointed with the new battletome

None of the general traits or items (except the battle standards who became really nice) have changed, so it's still Staunch defenders > everything else, with mirrorshield and a few classics being still better than the rest. The new items are very good but one time per game.

The bataillions are cheapers but have now lost all their rules except one, making them much more weaker than before. It's the same for the nighthaunts, so it seems that now, bataillions will onely give one special rule.

The unmodified rolls as well as the wholly within everywhere make the units and heroes less effective (good bye retributors!). For example, the celestant on foot need to be in melee to give his +1 attacks, and units need to be wholly within 12" of him now. The heraldor only affect units and sceneries wholly within of him too.

The paladin didn't changed (except the starsoul mace : roll a dice instead of auto hit, 1 do nothing 2-5 do D3 mortal, 6 do D6 mortals) making the evocators a completely obvious choice in comparison. I don't really know any reason to bring paladins instead of evocators.

And i didn't take in account the new spells, who are very very good. The new mount trait are quite insane too, with the Tauralon giving a 6++, or the dracolone giving +1 attacks to every dracoline units around the hero.

The prayers can't be spammed anymore. It was obvious it would arrive, but still..it's a nerf.

Interesting change, the tempestor make a auto debuff of -1 to hit to ennemy units within 12... but only against shooting units. This time.

However, some surprise buffs here and here. Neaeve as well as the crossbow judicators or the vanguard-hunter are better than before.

The battletome make stormcast in line with the second edition (unmodified rolls, only 1 battletome prayer per turn, less powerful battalions, everything is now wholly within) but... before everyone else, so, concerning the old units, it's more a global nerf than a buff (baring few exceptions). don't expect to see the sucessor of the old Vanguard Wing or any "whoah this thing will kick ass" 

Edited July 4, 2018 by ledha

[Sedraxis]

What's that about prayers? Are all prayers subject to a rule of 1 now?

[ledha]

5 minutes ago, Sedraxis said:

What's that about prayers? Are all prayers subject to a rule of 1 now?

Only the battletome prayers. So one lightning chariot per turn now

[GeneralZero]

what would you complete?

3 evocators 

5 castigators

8 sequitors

and how?

The question is "is it worth buying 2 sets  and which unit is the most interesting"?

Edited July 4, 2018 by GeneralZero

[The Wanderer]

7 minutes ago, GeneralZero said:

what would you complete?

3 evocators 

5 castigators

8 sequitors

?

Sequitors definitely. Evocatis maybe.

 

 

[GeneralZero]

up to 20?

[The Wanderer]

26 minutes ago, ledha said:

I'm a bit disapointed with the new battletome

None of the general traits or items (except the battle standards who became really nice) have changed, so it's still Staunch defenders > everything else, with mirrorshield and a few classics being still better than the rest. The new items are very good but one time per game.

The bataillions are cheapers but have now lost all their rules except one, making them much more weaker than before. It's the same for the nighthaunts, so it seems that now, bataillions will onely give one special rule.

Yeah I don't get the Batallion changes at all. You could argue Angelo's conclave is better but overall they mostly look meh. Hailstorm Battery looks ridiculous, you're basically paying 340 points to make a single Ballista shoot a bit better.

[Peegee]

With all of the Arcanum versions being crappy, but being the tax to get Sequitors as Battleline, I foresee the one on Gryph-Charger being the obvious choice.

[Kadanga]

I am quite happy with the changes. Our already big toolbox became even bigger. Stormcast is not "pop-up in your face"-powerful and I think it will be more important to build with multiple synergies in mind in order for SCE to really shine. 

I am looking forward to running a Justicar Conclave paired with a Knight-Incantor holding the Staff of Focus, riding on a balewind vortex. 

 

[DanielFM]

Soulstrike Brotherhood doesn't sound that bad. If you were going to field two units of Hunters (like I usually do) and a Ballista, for only 160 points (2 min sized Castigators) and 120 for the battalion you get 5 drops into one, a CP, an artifact and a meaningful rule (2 shots Castigators go from meh to decent).

[Peegee]

2 minutes ago, DanielFM said:

Soulstrike Brotherhood doesn't sound that bad.

Agreed. It's the only Battalion worth considering for me.

[DanielFM]

25 minutes ago, Peegee said:

With all of the Arcanum versions being crappy, but being the tax to get Sequitors as Battleline, I foresee the one on Gryph-Charger being the obvious choice.

Don't dismiss the Lord-Arcanum on Tauralon so fast. The CA is useless, but the spell is a better Starfall and the Steel Pinions trait is awesome.

[Peegee]

7 minutes ago, DanielFM said:

Don't dismiss the Lord-Arcanum on Tauralon so fast. The CA is useless, but the spell is a better Starfall and the Steel Pinions trait is awesome.

You're right but for 100 pts difference (with the Gryph-Charger) I think I'd rather take the Everblaze Comet. And I'm not even speaking about that face... ^^

[Erdemo86]

I wouldnt say that they got nerfed. I would say they got a major buff. All of the other Army will get that unmodified 6s and wholly within description sooner or later.

1. Scions of the Storm is now very usefull.

2. Sequitors are one of the Best and strongest Battleline units out there.

3. For 400  points you can field 4 Balistas which you can drop in 18“ Range.

4. The Stormhost Abilitys are not bad, maybe better than staunch defender, but we will see.

5. Being able to drop half of your army in 9“ Range whenever you want is very powerfull.( and getting -1 hit debuff that turn)

6. The Lord Incantor is very good for his points. 

7. Battalion were bad before and are bad now, vanguard wing got nerfed thru errata before battletome.

8. The Comet Endless Spell is very good.

Combine that everything in one list and i think it will be a top tier list. Think about something like this:

Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
Lord-Castellant (100) + gryph hound
Knight-Incantor (140)
Lord-Arkanum(180)
20 x Sequitors (400)
4 x Fulminators (480)
5 x Sequitors (120)
5 x Sequitors (120)
Celestar Ballista (100)
Celestar Ballista (100)
Celestar Ballista (100)
Chronomantic Cogs (60)
Comet (100)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 119

 

 or hammers of Sigmar with this:
Round about 160 wounds. And if a unit of Sequitors dies on 5+ they are back. All with a 6+ Ward Save.

Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals

Leaders
Lord-Castellant (100)
Knight-Incantor (140)
Lord-Arkanum (180)

Battleline

Units
20 x Sequitors (400)
20 x Sequitors (400)
20 x Sequitors (400)

War Machines
Celestar Ballista (100)
Celestar Ballista (100)
Celestar Ballista (100)

Endless Spells
Chronomantic Cogs (60)

Total: 1980 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 159
 

Edited July 4, 2018 by Erdemo86

[aceytrixx]

7 minutes ago, Erdemo86 said:

I wouldnt say that they got nerfed. I would say they got a major buff. All of the other Army will get that unmodified 6s and wholly within description sooner or later.

1. Scions of the Storm is now very usefull.

2. Sequitors are one of the Best and strongest Battleline units out there.

3. For 400  points you can field 4 Balistas which you can drop in 18“ Range.

4. The Stormhost Abilitys are not bad, maybe better than staunch defender, but we will see.

5. Being able to drop half of your army in 9“ Range whenever you want is very powerfull.

6. The Lord Incantor is very good for his points. 

7. Battalion were bad before and are bad now, vanguard wing got nerfed thru errata before battletome.

8. The Comet Endless Spell is very good.

Point 3 - is that how we want to field ballista? I hadnt really considered dropping them close. I had decided I would keep them in the sky and drop them turn 1 so my opponent can't deploy away from them but I was always planning to keep them back 

[Erdemo86]

17 minutes ago, aceytrixx said:

Point 3 - is that how we want to field ballista? I hadnt really considered dropping them close. I had decided I would keep them in the sky and drop them turn 1 so my opponent can't deploy away from them but I was always planning to keep them back 

18“ is where the ballistas shine, but you can do it how you want. 

[aceytrixx]

21 minutes ago, Erdemo86 said:

18“ is where the ballistas shine, but you can do it how you want. 

Yeah im. Just always wary of the 5+. In my head you pick off at long range untill they get close. I hadn't considered just dumping them down at 18inches and letting rip turn 1. Have to try it though. 

[Bradipo322]

I've seen the whole rules-part of the new battletome.

Barring a few minor buffs everything has been nerfed:

• Lord-Celestant (on foot) to use his command ability has to stand near an enemy unit (3") and the +1 to hit last only for 1 combat phase (this is a common theme)
• Vandus Hammerhand's command ability only lasts 1 turn and works only for units wholly within 12"
• Gavriel Sureheart's starbound blade is now 3+ 3+ instead of 3+ 2+ and his command ability affects units wholly within 12"
• Neave Blacktalon no longer generates extra attacks
• Two Lord-Castellants cant have the same target in a single hero phase for their lantern
• Lord-Relictor (and other priests) can't pray two times in the same hero phase, and both his preyers (healing storm and lighting storm) now have to target someone wholly within 12"
• Lord-Ordinator no longer lets you shoot twice and his command ability now is just a battleshock immunity for units wholly within 18"
• Knight-Heraldor onward to glory now target a unit wholly within 12" and his thunderblast is now targeting a terrain feature wholly within 18" and has his range fixed at 3"
• Gryph-Hounds has changed a lot, loyal companion now has a range of 6" and works also for Lord-Veritant, warning cry now is activated by the setup of enemy reserve units within 10" of Gryph-Hounds and lets friendly Stormcasts wholly within 9" shoot at the unit that has been setup and this can be done only once per phase
• Retributors blast to ashes and other similar abilities now triggers only on unmodified rolls
• All the warscroll battalions have now only one ability and some are just useless (lord of the strom now costs 140 ponts and his ability lets you get 1 CP at the start of your turn on a roll of 4+, but if you ditch the battalion and do not spend the points on other things you are guaranteed 2 CP instead of 1 and an half)

I expected some buffs, not this number of nerfs.

In this edition Stormcast are CP hungry, battalions are just overpriced traps (do not pick them for the +1 CP) and a lot of the old models/units are just weaker.

Edited July 4, 2018 by Bradipo322
Grammar Fixes