GammaMage Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Lots of tournaments houserule base-to-base measurement instead of model-to-model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Techn0magier Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Uhh, that sucks. When I look to our veteran players, they would had to rebase nearly everything from square to round. I didn't envy you guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiny Norman Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 12 minutes ago, Techn0magier said: I try to understand why so many people here are concerned about base sizes? In my area bases are the most unimportant thing on an AoS model. The rules never talk about them, and they are ignored for literally everything. Has the oversea tournament scene agreed to a houserule or smth? Dude, wrong attitude. New at tournaments, right? Every slight advantage is worth fighting for! Now you: Every slight.... Idoneth rules seem nothing but strong af to me. Probably the same procedure like every big release: Get the initial sells done, dominating the scene, after a year or so raising point cost with the new GHB....next release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Techn0magier Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 New to the AoS tournament scene, yes. And the local events here use model-to-model. Which I prefere for different reasons. Especially for the upcoming idoneth. I waited for a new naval themed army for so long. My cosairs can use the support. Sadly I couldn't see the twitch stream yesterday. Is there any channel that discusses the yesterdays news/game indepth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookiez Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 23 minutes ago, Spiny Norman said: Idoneth rules seem nothing but strong af to me. Probably the same procedure like every big release: Get the initial sells done, dominating the scene, after a year or so raising point cost with the new GHB....next release. I doubt thet will dominate anything, they lack cheap bodies which is single most important thing in every top list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiny Norman Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Cookiez said: I doubt thet will dominate anything, they lack cheap bodies which is single most important thing in every top list. Had some hard BCR winners before the nerf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookiez Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Just now, Spiny Norman said: Had some hard BCR winners before the nerf. With 100+ goblins or 80+ savage orks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiny Norman Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Cookiez said: With 100+ goblins or 80+ savage orks. You can blink emos as you want, but you still made a false statement. https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/10/09/the-warhammer-age-of-sigmar-grand-tournament-the-winning-army/ Just a quick google with no effort to proof you nonsense. Do 20 skins count as cheap body horde list? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amradiel Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 I don't really care about base sizes or how competitive the army will be. I just love everything about it. To have fun is the most important thing for me. And I know that I will enjoy building and painting them. And by what I have read so far playing them will be great fun too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledha Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 So there is still people using model to model measurement. What a strange world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burf Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 34 minutes ago, Spiny Norman said: You can blink emos as you want, but you still made a false statement. https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/10/09/the-warhammer-age-of-sigmar-grand-tournament-the-winning-army/ Just a quick google with no effort to proof you nonsense. Do 20 skins count as cheap body horde list? Just a quick aside here, 'cheap bodies' and 'horde lists' are different things and you're counting the 20 skinks but not the 10 highborn spearman or the 20 glade guard, which make up 50 bodies for 440pts. He could have phrased it more politely, but he's kinda right. The only armies that have been successful when 'super elite' are stormcasts and pre-nerf Mourngul death. Almost everything else brings screening chaff units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rokapoke Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 2 hours ago, ledha said: what is interesting is the hero that give +3 to charge against a specific unit Maybe i'm wrong, but today, you don't specify which ennemy unit you charge. You roll the dice, and see how far you can go. Is it a clue that in the V2, you'll have to specify which ennemy unit you charge ? It may work like the Troglodon’s charge bonus. You get 3” of extra distance, but only if you end up within 1/2” of one specific enemy unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiny Norman Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 15 minutes ago, Burf said: Just a quick aside here, 'cheap bodies' and 'horde lists' are different things and you're counting the 20 skinks but not the 10 highborn spearman or the 20 glade guard, which make up 50 bodies for 440pts. Implying "100+ goblins and 80+ savage orcs" gives me a stern notion that he indeed lumped horde and cheap body lists together. Therefore I insist that he wasn't distinguishing it. It's not about using chaff, there's quite a difference in using 20 skins and some glade guard compared to 80 goblins or skeletons. Also there are armies like KO and DK without classic chaff doing fairly well in a tournament enviroment and I'm expecting ID to do aswell. Not regarding many other top tier list / armies not working with classic mass cheap bodies and still winning tournaments. I may remind you of this discussions' premise statement: "I doubt thet will dominate anything, they lack cheap bodies which is single most important thing in every top list. " which is false, indeed. Chaff might be a common strategy when your army has access, but it is provenly not the single most important thing in a top list. That's where we started before you jumped in and that's where this off topic pettiness comes to an end right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledha Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 11 hours ago, Spiny Norman said: Implying "100+ goblins and 80+ savage orcs" gives me a stern notion that he indeed lumped horde and cheap body lists together. Therefore I insist that he wasn't distinguishing it. It's not about using chaff, there's quite a difference in using 20 skins and some glade guard compared to 80 goblins or skeletons. Also there are armies like KO and DK without classic chaff doing fairly well in a tournament enviroment and I'm expecting ID to do aswell. Not regarding many other top tier list / armies not working with classic mass cheap bodies and still winning tournaments. I may remind you of this discussions' premise statement: "I doubt thet will dominate anything, they lack cheap bodies which is single most important thing in every top list. " which is false, indeed. Chaff might be a common strategy when your army has access, but it is provenly not the single most important thing in a top list. That's where we started before you jumped in and that's where this off topic pettiness comes to an end right now. Honestly, only the clowncar do good result in Kharadron. And DK (daughter of khaine) have cheap infantry with witch aleves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyOcean Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 However you want to spin it, a lack of cheap bodies is clearly a limitation as long as we are playing under GHB2017 rules. Bodies hold objectives, objectives win games. Do some armies have ways of mitigating that limitation? Sure. KO alpha striking half of their opponents army off the table turn 1 is a nice way to level the field. Will ID have a way to mitigate the limitation? Who knows. If thralls are the cheapest unit and rock in at 160pts+ per 10, then thats a bit of hurdle to overcome. Their speed will certainly help in scenarios with lots of objectives or Starstrike where they appear randomly. And the tanky turtle seems solid for Duality. And there's always allies. Only time will tell if its enough. Since first seeing the forgotten nightmare rule, my whole thinking on its utility has inverted. On initially seeing it (and before seeing any model rules), I assumed you would use cheap infantry to soak up damage until glass cannon cavalry are ready to make their charge. Now it seems like maybe you use tanky cavalry to screen the glass cannon infantry until they are ready to do the damage! Its very interesting, I can't wait to see full rules and points and math out some lists!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soulsmith Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 2 minutes ago, BillyOcean said: However you want to spin it, a lack of cheap bodies is clearly a limitation as long as we are playing under GHB2017 rules. Bodies hold objectives, objectives win games. Do some armies have ways of mitigating that limitation? Sure. KO alpha striking half of their opponents army off the table turn 1 is a nice way to level the field. Will ID have a way to mitigate the limitation? Who knows. If thralls are the cheapest unit and rock in at 160pts+ per 10, then thats a bit of hurdle to overcome. Their speed will certainly help in scenarios with lots of objectives or Starstrike where they appear randomly. And the tanky turtle seems solid for Duality. And there's always allies. Only time will tell if its enough. Since first seeing the forgotten nightmare rule, my whole thinking on its utility has inverted. On initially seeing it (and before seeing any model rules), I assumed you would use cheap infantry to soak up damage until glass cannon cavalry are ready to make their charge. Now it seems like maybe you use tanky cavalry to screen the glass cannon infantry until they are ready to do the damage! Its very interesting, I can't wait to see full rules and points and math out some lists!! I think he raised a good point on warhammer live yesterday, the leviadon will make a good spearhead for the force, creating its tanking bubble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.J Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/04/12/who-are-the-isharanngw-homepage-post-1/ Article on the Ishrann is up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Themoocher Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Lame preview. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connelj2 Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 This preview really didn't give any new information Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acid_Nine Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Can I just say how much I dislike the "Wholly within 12" " thing? It just seems like a whole bunch of busy work per game to worry about a guy's toes being a centimeter out of the bubble compared to having a few bases in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyOcean Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Acid_Nine said: Can I just say how much I dislike the "Wholly within 12" " thing? It just seems like a whole bunch of busy work per game to worry about a guy's toes being a centimeter out of the bubble compared to having a few bases in. Agree - its annoying, especially when you start to consider piling in and how complicated that already gets. You pile one guy in a little too far and all of a sudden you lose the buff for the whole unit. Ugh. Also means he won't be buffing many units at once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drofnum Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 6 minutes ago, Acid_Nine said: Can I just say how much I dislike the "Wholly within 12" " thing? It just seems like a whole bunch of busy work per game to worry about a guy's toes being a centimeter out of the bubble compared to having a few bases in. It makes for a lot less cheesy stuff though. Stringing a unit out 35 inches to get buffs to the guys in front was silly(Vanguard wing!) everything is going to start going to wholly within rather than the old method and i think its way better for the game even if it does add a little more measuring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richelieu Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 15 hours ago, BillyOcean said: Agree - its annoying, especially when you start to consider piling in and how complicated that already gets. You pile one guy in a little too far and all of a sudden you lose the buff for the whole unit. Ugh. Also means he won't be buffing many units at once. People can't have it both ways. There have always been complaints about conga lines, so GW starts using "wholly within," including the DoK bloodshield. Now we'll get complaints about "wholly within." I personally enjoy conga lines quite a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Themoocher Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Eliminating unit stringing is a good thing. As a 40k tyranid player I can tell you how stupid it is my whole guant army is -1 to hit and covers literally my entire half of the board. That should not be a thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freejack02 Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 17 minutes ago, Richelieu said: People can't have it both ways. There have always been complaints about conga lines, so GW starts using "wholly within," including the DoK bloodshield. Now we'll get complaints about "wholly within." I personally enjoy conga lines quite a bit. I think my vote would go to "mostly within", which would mean more than half the unit in range. Takes away the extreme of conga-lining, and can make for decisions when removing models - do you take away from one side and negate your buff, or take away from the other side and potentially ****** up your pile-in? But given one or the other, I would probably say "wholly within" is a more healthy approach for the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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