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Returning Special Characters Speculation/Bingo


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Since Ungrim came back and GW said he'll be joined by another new/old dwarf in the Arcane Journal, there's been rife speculation about who else could be brought back at an earlier point in their lives, plus cool 'historical' characters from the era TOW's set who might see rules and models, so I figured why not compile it all and bring the discussion to a single thread.

Note: Even though nothing's been announced, a lot of people are taking it at a given that the Old World's storyline is leading up to the Great War Against Chaos. The Old World is currently set in 2776 IC, and the Great War took place 25 years later. Even if it's safe to assume we'll get there eventually, we've got a heckuva lot of Arcane Journals to get through first, so I won't be including any characters who rose to prominence during the Great War Against Chaos like Magnus the Pious, Volans, and Asavar Kul, but will be including characters who fought in it and were active prior.

 

DWARFS

Dwarfs are up next, and we know we're getting an second returning character in the Arcane Journal. Dwarf life expectancy's been pretty elastic over the years, with most WFRP character generators having them live to about the 200 mark, but the 8th edition Dwarf book establishing Throgrim and Ungrim as having been around slightly longer than that. Who knows why and how Kragg the Grim is so old.

  • Grombrindal is obviously immortal, and not having had his 500th mag anniversary model revealed yet feels like a good reason the second Arcane Journal character hasn't been announced.
  • Thorgrim as the hotheaded young go-getting prince he was established as pre High King in 8th also feels like a really safe bet. I had worried that he'd have very little to set himself apart from a regular Dwarf Lord rules-wise, but him and the regiment he's joined being able to ignore the traditional -1 to pursuit rolls dwarfs are afflicted with would be both a characterful way to show off his vigour and eagerness, as well as make him a pretty competitive choice.
  • High King Alrikson is Thorgrim's predecessor, and would sit on the Throne of Power with the same runic clobber we're used to seeing Thorgrim with. Would make a great centrepiece, and wouldn't even need a new mini, just rerelease the 6th ed Thorgrim with a new head. Might be one worth saving for the Great War Against Chaos, he fought prominently during.
  • Kragg the Grim has already lived several times longer than a regular dwarf by TOW.
  • Burlok Damminson is old enough to have an established adult son by the 2500s, which would put him at around Ungrim's age, and could given an engineer lord option. Deeper cut engineer lord: 'The Magnificent' Sven Hasselfriesian's a contempory of Burlok's and would also be around. If around, both Bulok and and Sven would be very young mind, TOW predating their blowing up the Engineer's Guild (and Burlok's arm) by 74 years!
  • Dullest option: Thorek Ironbrow. They're already rereleasing the Anvil, so why not make the basic kit a special character for the fifth edition in a row?
  • There's been a bit of chatter in the previous threads about Joseph Bugman, and while I'd previously written him off (Bugman's Brewery not having been destroyed yet), we could see a wealthy topside merchant version of either Bugman or his father Zamnil/Samuel could be a could be a fun earlier take on Warhammer's first (**** off Kemmler) and most iconic special character, to accompany the rerelease of Bugman's Beer Cart, and the Imperial Dwarf Army of Infamy a lot of people suspect happening alongside a Slayer one.
  • Invariably, the subject of Gotrek has also been raised. If Gotrek were alive during 2276 IC, he'd be very young, and living happily in the foothills of Karaz-a-Karak with a sensible haircut. However... I've always liked the idea that his axe has had multiple bearers over the centauries, with Grimnir trying to create a new avatar each time, and somehow ending up back in the Chaos Wastes for the next unlucky dwarf to find - we could see it in TOW with a completely different wielder, maybe a lady dwarf, there are never enough of them. Also there's that one novel where Gotrek and Felix travelled back in time to visit Mordheim, so who the heck knows. 🤷‍♂️

 

ORC AND GOBLINS

Sorry lads, you spore hard and die fast. Orc and Goblin special characters have always been divvied up between 'historical' ones who've had their day in the sun, and taken half the Empire with them, like Grom and Gorbad Ironclaw; and 'present day' warbosses who are on the rise, and haven't got round to burning the Empire to the ground yet, like Skarsnik and Grimgor. Unfortunately there's no established warboss responsible for making a sizeable dent in the Empire at the time TOW's set, and knowing what happens immediately after means it's hard to establish one on his way up, and O&G are effectively a neutered faction, stuck with troll molesting shamans and cowardly wolf bosses. 🫤

 

WARRIORS OF CHAOS

Conversely, there are loads of potential Warriors of Chaos returnees, and I've probably missed a bunch below.

  • Scyla Anfingrimm only turned into a Khorgorath Chaos Spawn a couple of years before the Great War Against Chaos, so seeing him pop up as a Mortal Champion could be neat.
  • Not a lot is known about Engra Deathsword, bar looking utterly badass on the cover of the 6th ed Hordes of Chaos book, and having been one of Khul's main lieutenants during the Great War Against Chaos, but he presumably would have been around before the Great War, and turning that illustration into a modern mini would be a licence to print money.
  • Araball the Undefeated and Valnir the Reaper were both active during the Great War Against Chaos, and presumably active before it.
  • Galrauch, Dechala, Azazel, Kholek Suneater, Sigvald and debatably Aekold Hellbrass and Valkia had also all been around for centauries by this point.
  • No idea how old Vilitch, Festus and Throgg are supposed to be.
  • If Prince Ulther's Imperial Dwarfs have set a precedent for bringing back very old Regiments of Renown, who predate and disappeared before they could get a place in any kind of Warhammer timeline, the Disciples of the Red Redemption could be a good outside bet. They're namechecked on p311 of the TOW, and as robed, sacrifice obsessed cultists, bring a different energy to Chaos/Khorne.

 

BEASTMEN

  • Morghur's whole deal is being reborn, so no reason he couldn't be around. 🤷‍♂️
  • Ghorros Warhoof's 'unnaturally long life has spanned many centauries', and 'many' is more than two, so he's fair game to show up. Thanks to @Jator for flagging this guy!
  • Um... uh... Dragon Ogres are a Beastmen thing first and a Warriors thing second now, right? Maybe just give them Kholek Suneater to be nice?

 

THE EMPIRE

I bet you're thinking humans live as long as we do, and if you're not covering Magnus or Volans this is gonna be a short list. You're probably right, but holy **** am I a sponge for abstruse background/great at grasping at straws.

  • Fredrich von Taurnus is a character who's been teased in Empire armybooks since 4th and would have been active during TOW. He'd go on to become the first Patriarch of the Bright Order, trained up by Teclis, but before the Great War Against Chaos was the commander of the Carroburg Greatswords, before being disgraced when he was discovered as a hedge wizard. He's notable for making magic items and being a 'warrior mage' who wore armour, and presumably swung a big sword. He'd have to be quite young at the time of TOW, and probably wouldn't have been discovered yet, but could still cast spells on the DL (don't put him in the same unit as any Witch Hunters).
  • Ludwig Schwarzhelm would not have been born by now, that much is abundantly clear. However, the 2003 Gav Thorpe novel Blades of Chaos (the second book of a really wonderful, underrated trilogy, check it out if you can), set during the 18th centaury, 500 years before TOW (bear with me), features a supporting character named Grunner Schwartzhelm, Ludwig's presumed ancestor. Much more on an Easter egg, and without a lot of impact on the book's plot, after the main events of the novel, Grunner goes on to recover the Reikland Runefang from the clutches of Gorbad Ironclaw after he slew the Elector at the siege of Altdorf, cementing his family's position as the martial champions and personal bodyguards of the Princes of Altdorf ever since, and so there would almost definitely be a Schwartzhelm in the retinue of Wilhelm I (though possibly not wielding the Sword of Justice if it's already a magic item any Empire character can take).
  • Easily the most contrived entry on the list, but hear me out... Heinrich Kemmler. White Dwarf 309 gives a brilliant timeline of Kemmler's misadventures, and while he didn't do anything noteworthy until 2401, he was described as 'Already a powerful necromancer' prior to that, meaning he could have easily extended his lifespan a centaury or so. Kemmler's also said to have plied his services as an advisor to rulers across the Old World in the early days of his career, not making him too different to any other unlicenced wizard in the Empire at the time, using the Lore of Necromancy (no reason he couldn't fight for Bretonnian Exiles either). We're not getting Vampire Counts back, and even if he wasn't the first special character (Bugman was), Necromancer With Hat is a Warhammer icon, and having him at an earlier stage in his career acting as magic consultant to an Elector or two while stringing them along towards his own nefarious ends could paint a fun picture of what he got up to before declaring all out war on life.

 

BRETONNIA

Vous venez de tenir un Journal Arcanique, alors ne retenez pas votre souffle.

  • Louen Orc-Slayer is the reigning king, and feels like a given at some point.
  • However... we've got a couple kings to get through before we even get to the Great War Against Chaos. Jules the Just was really, really into jousting, going as far as to regulate it with blunted weapons to stop knights murder each other over minor disagreements, and holding an awful lot of tournaments. However... Jules met an untimely end in IC 2297, when he decided to joust at a mounted Chaos Lord from the other side of a battlefield and was promptly cut to shreds (though did manage to kill his opponent in the process). This brought about...
  • The Affair of the False Grail. Bretonnia. Maldred of Mousillon and his wife Malfleur (presumably a dark sorceress of no small power) used Jules' untimely death to make a play for the throne, imprisoning the Fay Enchantress, and getting up to all kinds of underhand shenanigans before the new king revoked their titles and they died of the Rex Pox in IC 2300, one year before the Great War. Vampire Counts are dead and buried, but I could think of worse band-aids than Maldred and a 'spooky' Bretonnian army.
  • Obviously the Fay Enchantress is a thing. Is she still supposed to be a Wood Elf? I don't keep up. Would love to see that toad model back mind.

 

HIGH ELVES

  • The Elric twins, Tyrion and Teclis are a given as far as popularity goes. According to Bill King's trilogy of novels, they spent the decades or so between beating N'kari at the shrine of Asuryan and loading up on magic items and beating N'kari and Malekith whatever he's called at Finuval Plain as young elves on a sort of 'gap centaury' exploring the world and making names for themselves, so yeah, junior versions of the characters we're used to could be neat.
  • Apart from that, elves live a really long time, so anyone's fair game really. Aislinn or the previous Sea Lord getting a model might be neat if they need boats to get to the Old World?

 

WOOD ELVES

Again, these guys live for a really long time. Even the Sisters of Twilight, who are supposed to be young had be been around for about three centauries at this point.

  • I nominate Scarloc's Wood Elf Archers for the Prince Ulther's Regiment of Renown treatment, because Jes Goodwin's Slaine hair metallers are gnarliest and coolest Wood Elves have ever been.
  • By contrast I also nominate Skaw the Falconer, because he's the about goofiest Wood Elves have ever been.
  • @Scáthborn pointed out that Araloth had a whole thing going on with Morghur around the time of TOW, and he's got a very modern plastic kit, so he's going on the list.

 

TOMB KINGS

Not like these guys exactly went out looking for new recruits after they all died, anyone is fair game.

  • Khalida not making the Arcane Journal is a travesty.  I hope she shows up soon.
  • Arkhan the Black back in his flying chariot and not on a Zoid would be neat. Arkhan and a Nagashite Army of Infamy could also bring a lot of classic Undead flavour back for Tomb Kings players who want it if Vampire Counts aren't resurrected.

 

OTHER

  • Mengil Manhide's Manflayers are a Regiment of Renown with fairly recent (<20 years!) models who are both elves with really long lifespans, and not established as having been founded at any particular point in the timeline.
  • Richter Kreugar's Cursed Company, also a Regiment of Renown released during 6th, and Richter got cursed centauries ago. Scratch not only that non khopesh wielding Undead itch, but also sneak a skaven and a lizardman in too.
  • Genevieve was also around at the time, and could I guess turn up in Empire or Bretonnian armies at a push if people really, really need a vampire fix...? She's not really the battlefield type though, and I've got no idea if GW or Kim Newman own the rights to her. Would be neat to see a model for her mind!
  • Drachenfels/The Nameless is also presumably just chillin' in his castle.

 

Phew, way longer list than expected! Let me know if there any glaring omissions, or if you think anyone I've listed is just too convoluted and dumb. :) 

Edited by Double Misfire
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I think Orion and Alarielle are the most obvious candidates when it comes to Wood Elves. But they'll need new miniatures to dothem justice if they're getting rules, so if the TOW team couldn't put the resources for that then they won't appear.
Finubar, the future Phoenix King, is also travelling the world and making contact with the Wood Elves, if I remember correctly.

Great job with the thread, btw!.

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I'm honestly hoping they don't bring back too many old characters. In particular, I don't want Tyrion and Teclis to be in the High Elf Arcane Journal (if they come back later that's fine). Let's create some cool new characters and let them shine a bit.

As for Dwarfs, I'm a bit disappointed that they are only getting two. I kinda hoped for the White Dwarf to be included in a similar way to the Green Knight (similar idea to them), and then two normal characters.

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Those are all great shouts for the Empire characters. Von Tarnus suffers from a similar issue as a Schwarzhelm - his signature magic item is already generally available. But that may not mean anything. 
 

Heinrich Kemmler is a great out-there prediction that would be awesome, and makes some sense given that Empire wizards can take necromancy as a lore. 
 

I don’t know the background at the Old World’s timeframe as well, but I would expect we’ll probably get at least one famous Elector or maybe a priest of Sigmar or Ulric. 

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@Vakarian I'd totally forgotten the Armour of Von Tarnus was in the Empire magic item pool (but had somehow remembered the Sword of Justice). Von Tarnus is described as a 'warrior-Wizard' in the colour text, so I guess it's safe to assume he'd been outed by 2276. 🤷‍♂️

 

@JerekKruger You know this is the nostalgia game, right? 😜

It's weird that Brets and TK get three wieners special characters in their Arcane Journals, and Dwarfs and O&G are stuck with two. Dwarfs might get lucky with Grombrindal if his rules are included in issue 500, freeing up the Arcane Journal slot for someone else.

 

@Jator Orion and Ariel are fine, but if Wood Elves get a centrepiece kit I'd much rather see a unit of Zoats to help differentiate them from Sylvaneth a bit more:

zoat.jpg.06373856d4e90109ea42d454b5eae2a7.jpg

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Top thread, and great ideas there @Double Misfire

 

Warhammer, is, and always will be, about the Special Characters for me first and Foremost. Utter Joy when I see the Likes of Kroak and Ungrim with new Models.

My Shoot from the Hip List - 

 

Dwarfs

-Young Thorgrim in a Similar Style to Ungrim. 

- At a Later stage Closer to the Great War Chaos we will see High King Alrikson.

- I think Grombrindal is going to have a card or have rules in WD issue 500 with rules if he does indeed  get a miniature. If it is the case I reckon he will have rules for Both Old World and for Age of Sigmar so he will be left out of the arcane Journal excpt as a Myth or as a brief lore entry. Until later editions. 

 

 

Brettonia

-The Fay Enchantress, From what I understand an Immortal being and also active during the time period.

- Gilles, I mean the Green Knight, it’s a must. 

 

High Elves

-It’s those Rascally twins I guarantee it. But I think we’ll get Tyrion first followed by Teclis. In the Meantime I think we might get either and already Named Prince or a new Lore Character. 
 

Wood Elves

- I wantto see a Nice new Orion and Ariel but I doubt this will come to be any time soon. So possibly we will see a New Prince/Princess and Possibly a rerelease of Drycha, we also Technically still have Durthu in plastic Form ready to go. 
 

Orcs and Goblins

We just saw their release,I was quite surprised not to see any form of Prc Warboss Character, so I think they’re holding  out to Sometim closer to the Great War. I was really hoping for an aspring Morglum Necksnapper building up his Waaagh but I think the dates are off.

 

Tomb Kings

Settra - I think he will receive a New miniature, if not in plastic then Resin. I don’t think they’ll keep this version for too much longer, and next Arcane journal or Edition will see a new Settra to pump some more hype into the Tomb Kings. 
 

Beastmen

I don’t know on this one. I know Kholek was there during the Great War and Led a Vanguard, but thatnwould be me saying they’re finally releasing an update on a Shaggoth either in plastic to multi build Kholek and Shaggoth or just a big old Resin Kholek. It’s anyones guess when it Comes to BoC.I’d like to see a fresh zMorgjur update, bit then again, that would be too much hope. 

 

Empire

Magnus for sure, but thats as far as my knowledge on the Empire goes during this period. However it being the Time of 3 Emperors then it could possibly be all 3? 

 

Chaos Warriors

Asavar Kul - I think we may see a couple versions of him. Of Him as a rising Champion, and Finally him as the Everchosen, a bit like they did with Valten during Storm of Chaos. 
 

 

 

Edited by Kronos
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Yea, makes sense to me! Didn’t Schwarzhelm have the Sword of Justice in 7th and 8th when he had special rules, even though it was in the magic items section too? Assuming I remember that right, I don’t see any reason why a special character couldn’t be written as carrying a magic item that’s already in the list. Personally I would prefer Von Tarnus of the two, another Schwarzhelm would be very similar to Ludwig but a battle wizard would be very cool and unique. 
 

 

Edited to add: 

 

@Kronos, I suspect we will see Magnus later in the inevitable Great War against Chaos campaign / supplement. But if we get him sooner, all the better! 

Edited by Vakarian
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@Double Misfire oh yeah, but my nostalgia is more for the setting than specific characters, and I'd like the writers to be given a chance at creativity. I won't be terribly upset if the Twins are included, but it would be cool to see some new heroes instead.

@Kronos I think they'll hold off on Kul until a later campaign book release. That's where I'd like to see Teclis too: in a great way against chaos campaign release when he came and taught the humans magic (although me being me, I'd prefer Finreir).

I wonder about Dwarfs. Young Thorgrim arms the most obvious, but I feel like if he were getting a mini he'd have been previewed, which makes me less confident.

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1 hour ago, Double Misfire said:

@Vakarian

@Jator Orion and Ariel are fine, but if Wood Elves get a centrepiece kit I'd much rather see a unit of Zoats to help differentiate them from Sylvaneth a bit more:

zoat.jpg.06373856d4e90109ea42d454b5eae2a7.jpg

Funny you mentioned Zoats. I have my fingers crossed for fimirs to be included in a Norscan Army of Infamy. Having a precedent on Total War makes that seems plausible and not totally copium on my part, I think.

I haven't thought about the zoats, but of course I'll be all for it, and more tempted by wood elves if that finally happens.

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Posted (edited)

@Kronos Settra and the Green Knight have both already come back in their respective Arcane Journals. No new models though (giving the Green Knight one would be sacrilege)

Asavar Kul on tour collecting the treasures of Chaos is a great idea, especially with Valten style Pokemon evolution minis.

 

@Vakarian From memory, Ludwig had the Sword of Justice when it was a regular magic item choice in 7th, and 8th ed army books had massively slimmed down magic item lists. I mean every Empire army book bar 6th has had Runefang armed characters in it 🤷‍♂️

 

@JerekKruger Yrtle 4lyfe

The nostalgia's more than just characters for me too, and I agree it would be nice to see a mix of old faves and fresh faces, much like 6th. Old faves get the Total War crowd mind!

 

@JackStreicher Please no tank. Though if it did exist, I'd rather it were the bespoke creation of a single special character engineer (maybe even Sven Hasselfriesian) than a production line.

Edited by Double Misfire
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@Double MisfireThat sounds right! At least with the Runefangs they had the convenient reason that there were a lot of them (12? 14? My time away from the Old World is showing lol). Also I’m pretty sure there were White Dwarfs or some other supplements with Runefang characters in 6th, I thought Marius Leitdorfer still had a useable profile at some point, and maybe Boris Todbringer too. At any rate there’s definitely no reason a magic item existing as an option would keep an Empire special character from having it then. 

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I don't know enough about WHFB lore to do lots of these but my stuff I would like and some stuff i reckon:

Wood elves:

-Sisters of twilight, i just love the idea of two sassy sisters flying around hecking stuff up.

 

Warriors of chaos:

-I would go with Valkia since she has such an easily attainable model. But there's the whole AoS/Old World competetive selling debate.

-Possibly the old chaos troll king that they did as a made to order before, could be good for the more norsca-ey theme (if hes even born at this point)

 

Empire:

-I'd expect fresh new characters like they did with two of the Brett ones.

 

Tomb kings:

-Khalida would make sense and is a pretty great model

 

 

Edited by Lightbox
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Loving the posts here. 🙂

I am hoping for  a deep dive on some Empire knightly orders + some special characters for it. I would love to see some attention for the Knight panthers, Reiksguard knights, Blazing Sun and White Wolf.

Fredrich von Taurnus. Would love rules for him.

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I'd absolutely love to see both the Cult of Ulric, Middenheim, and the Knights of the White Wolf fleshed out in the Arcane Journal. I've always really liked them. So a named Grand Master would be cool (or an Army Ulric or Elector Count).

I'd also really like to see some other priests get rules. Priests of Taal, or Morr or whatever. Not named characters obviously, but cool nonetheless.

I assume we won't get Magnus until later (a bit like Kul).

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2 hours ago, Tonhel said:

Loving the posts here. 🙂

I am hoping for  a deep dive on some Empire knightly orders + some special characters for it. I would love to see some attention for the Knight panthers, Reiksguard knights, Blazing Sun and White Wolf.

I'd just like to see Empire Knights get a new kit 😬

 

1 hour ago, JerekKruger said:

I'd also really like to see some other priests get rules. Priests of Taal, or Morr or whatever. Not named characters obviously, but cool nonetheless.

I'd love to see Warrior Priests of Myrmidia, and am planning on converting one out of CoS bits. I'm definitely in a minority here, especially after the last two editions of WFRP explicitly said that most gods have Warrior Priests, but I've always felt that Warhammer isn't Dungeons and Dragons, and that priests who's gods' jurisdictions don't explicitly include warfare shouldn't be seen on the battlefield - a priest of Morr is just a guy who conducts funerals, a priest of Verena is just a judge, ect.

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5 hours ago, Big Kim Woof-Woof said:

Azazel! Come on, they did him dirty with an absolute dud of a model first time around... he's owed a new lease of life! 

I'd love to see Azazel for TOW, but at risk of going off topic, have have been stressing the case for him and N'kari in AoS for years.

Azazel's got built in beef with Sigmar, going back to both of their mortal lives, which would make him totally unique in AoS, tethering Sigmar to the fact he was 'just a guy once'.

N'kari's probably the most prominent named greater daemon ever, and is way overdue rules and a model. He's got history with every aelf god bar Morathi (who it's probably safe to say he's at least hooked up with), and as an added bonus pops up in 40k from time to time too. But nope, Shalaxi Hellbane, whoever the heck you are (I actually had to look up that name).

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With how they added Warrior priests of Sigmar and Ulric to the armylist (3 prayers each). I expect (hope) that they will add more warrior priests for i.e Taal and Myrmidia with their own 3 unique prayers. Either through Arcane journals or campaign books.

Lots of cool stuff they can add through those books!

 

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4 hours ago, Double Misfire said:

I'd love to see Warrior Priests of Myrmidia, and am planning on converting one out of CoS bits. I'm definitely in a minority here, especially after the last two editions of WFRP explicitly said that most gods have Warrior Priests, but I've always felt that Warhammer isn't Dungeons and Dragons, and that priests who's gods' jurisdictions don't explicitly include warfare shouldn't be seen on the battlefield - a priest of Morr is just a guy who conducts funerals, a priest of Verena is just a judge, ect.

I can understand this point of view. Certainly a Priest of Shallya shouldn't be any good at fighting, and shouldn't have any offensive prayers, but I could see them working as a support/healer character. A Priest of Morr could be anti-undead, and a Priest of Taal could definitely be a scouty offensive character. When you get to Verena or Ranald I'll admit it starts to get harder. Manaan too.

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