New GHB leaks

[Lord Krungharr]

Good stuff!  Fresh leeks, soup recipe included - Imgur

[Beliman]

A lot to unpack here.

Personally, I don't like that we can snipe mini-heroes again, and I'm a KO player that it's just my jam... but it's not fun. Another thing that I don't like is the option to take Veteran-units and allow them to hit in two rows with 1" weapons, even if their base is bigger than 1".  Imo, both of this rules must stay in the Core Rules instead of seasons or battalions, they are fun and that's what the games is about.

About the main rules, let's start for the Realm Rules:

• I don't know what to think. We already have units with +3 or +4 to cast that can't be challenged by 70% of the armies in the game. Of course a miscast will help some of them, but not sure if it will be enough.

Command Traits:

• As a KO player, I'm out!

Nullstone Enhancements:

• They are nice because they are free, but I don't know if they are enough to stop all armies with crazy spellcasting and spells that can make units attack with -3 rend or 2+ to wound... doesn't seems fair, at least my army has once-per-battle anti-cast item.

Realmsphere magic:

• Crazy good! 4D6 mw or -3 rend is top magic. Even with their own handicap (high CV, range, etc...), they can win the game.

Core Battalions:

• They both seems fine. Andtorian Acolytes with Command Traits gives you some dice to reach that powerful cast that you need. With all ranged units going up, it seems that melee units specialized in charge and kill wizards are going to be good.

Grand Strategies & Battle Tactics: 

• As a KO, I can't complete Control the Nexus, Spellcasting Savant and Magic made manifest (unless I use Allies). But that makes easier for me to accomplish some other Strategies like Slaughter of Sorcery.
• Some BT are imposible for my KOs, but other seems easier to do, a big meh overall.

Battleplans, CRAZY!

• Some of them are a big no-no:  imagine Line of Communication (Disruption) with Eclipse from Lumineth. The Icefields with an army that moves slow or doesn't have any teleport or set-up. The Frigid Zephyr for armies based on long range weapons. Towers in the Tundra just feels bad for any army that doesn't use any wizard and Faction Terrain.
• Other battleplans like Spring the Trap with Outflank or Limited Resources seems really fun to play, giving some mechanics and forcing people to move around the battlefield without feeling bad.

Let's play a few games without building a strong opinion about this GHB.

 

 

 

Edited June 29, 2023 by Beliman

[Marcvs]

quick hot takes just for the pleasure of seeing how right/wrong (especially wrong) I was once the GHB properly starts:

• New battalions are "ok-ish". This plus the fact that there are a couple of battleplans (I count 3) which strongly favour controlling the initative, makes me think we're in for a year of Battle Regiments and 1 or 2 drops
• Some scenarios seem to provide big advantages/disadvantages for very specific types of armies. This should reinforce the already present trend of having rock/paper/scissors matchups -which, from the point of view of the indicators they use for Metawatch, might result in a perfectly healthy meta numbers-wise but less interesting games.
• The rules themselves seem to push towards polarisation with the special enhancements only available to those who have no wizards at all. So magic as a whole might become the realm of supercasters, with a disincentive to bring "normal" wizards in non-magic-oriented armies.
• Battle tactics (and, to a lesser extent, Grand Strategies) seem even harder than the ones in the present season. Book battle tactics (and, again, to a lesser extent, Grand Strategies) will be even more impactful.
• If you can't play the supermagic game, the alternative is of course to specialise in killing the opponent's wizards. The most reliable way to do it is shooting, and wizards just lot the protection of the present season. So, more shooting, especially of the low damage/high quality type (the high damage/low quality is already great of course).

Edited June 29, 2023 by Marcvs

[JackStreicher]

From a first-ish read-through I am not a fan.

as mentioned above it’s a reinforcement of r/p/s. There are obvious abuses (Tzeentch guaranteeing a 4D6 MW blizzard) und resulting NPEs.

This feels like a step back from the previous GHB. It feels a lot like the Galletian-Fiasko GHB (maybe about 80% as bad)

I might give this a try. However I think I might skip this GHB: imo it adds nothing to the game but frustration and very whacky matchups.

 

Sorry for the negativity folks.

 

[Scythian]

OBR’s Null Myriad just became the most valuable subfaction in the game. 

[PJetski]

Need the Battlescroll to know the full context of these changes

45 minutes ago, Scythian said:

OBR’s Null Myriad just became the most valuable subfaction in the game. 

Not really... most spells worth casting in the game are buffs that get around the 2+ spell ignore

 

[pnkdth]

On 6/29/2023 at 11:57 AM, JackStreicher said:

From a first-ish read-through I am not a fan.

as mentioned above it’s a reinforcement of r/p/s. There are obvious abuses (Tzeentch guaranteeing a 4D6 MW blizzard) und resulting NPEs.

This feels like a step back from the previous GHB. It feels a lot like the Galletian-Fiasko GHB (maybe about 80% as bad)

I might give this a try. However I think I might skip this GHB: imo it adds nothing to the game but frustration and very whacky matchups.

 

Sorry for the negativity folks.

 

I wouldn't call it negativity. Especially since it looks like you're right.

Watching the latest SoW report this season is going to produce very one-sided games. In the post-game discussion they talk about just how ridiculous the MW output was and that unless you're playing an army with STRONG magic defence there's no answer for it. Of course, there are armies who will just shrug it off like Null Myriad OBR (though only effective versus targetted spells). This might be an issue with the army itself (won't spoil which) but with the new GHB toys it gets so much worse.

The biggest issue with the new GHB is how flat out boosts magic dominant armies and the only drawback is more damaging miscasts. Very little nuance or interesting counter-play and it really adds to the lethality of the game. If SoB used to be a DPS check, then in this GHB its added in a magic/MW tanking check. Adding, as mentioned, to the issue of heavy-handed RPS in AoS.

That said, hopefully life finds a way.

[Skreech Verminking]

12 hours ago, pnkdth said:

That said, hopefully life finds a way.

True, yet I’m pretty much interested in seeing how well skaven will do considering thanqoul and launchon combo isn’t going to be a thing anymore

[Ganigumo]

There is usually counterplay to blizzard, 12" range that can't be increased or cast through things like spellportals is a pretty firm cap, plus the CV 12 usually requires you to use primal dice on it. Its just liking giving other armies a wurgogg eye lasers (same range requirements, and can't be cheesed since its start of hero phase).
Armies with hero phase moves or teleports could get a lot out of it. For me only warclans (Mighty destroyers, fast 'un maniak wierdnob, hand of gork) and Gitz (hand of gork) come to mind.

My poor kruleboyz are looking to be just awful in this season, those BTs are really tough for them.

Big Waaagh! is looking interesting though, primal dice to force hand of gorks, maniak wierdnob to have 24" range on blizzard, Gobsprakk is good for anti-magic since you can hoard primal dice to force unbinds that do mortal wounds, and 'ardboyz make a great target for hoarfrost. Bonesplitterz get some nice tools too but we'll need to see if it actually has any impact.

Overall I like what I see, but the loss of something to fix coherency will be painful. Tzeentch is going to be a menace though, the BTs combined with their book ones will make getting all your battle tactics pretty trivial.

[Skreech Verminking]

5 hours ago, Ganigumo said:

maniak wierdnob, hand of gork) and Gitz (hand of gork) come to mind.

Skitterleap

or dreaded skitterleap with a grey seer.

although slaven don’t have anything reliable to get a casting throw of 12.

also I’m not certain how warpstone sparks will work with the new primortial dice rules (need to see the rules myself)

[Ganigumo]

6 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Skitterleap

or dreaded skitterleap with a grey seer.

although slaven don’t have anything reliable to get a casting throw of 12.

also I’m not certain how warpstone sparks will work with the new primortial dice rules (need to see the rules myself)

oh how could I forget skaven after I got wrecked by them with my kruleboyz. skitterleap + gnashing jaws with high rolls deleted my boltboyz, then ran away through the gnawhole.

You can use the primal dice to roll extra dice to try to get up to a 12.
You need to do rerolls before you use any primal dice, and if you reroll you can't use any primal dice on that roll.
after rolling you decide whether or not you want to use one, and you can use multiple on a single spellcast, but you decide whether to use another after rolling the previous.
So as long as you have primal dice and haven't miscast you can keep rolling until you get the number you need to force a spell out.

[Skreech Verminking]

10 hours ago, Ganigumo said:

oh how could I forget skaven after I got wrecked by them with my kruleboyz. skitterleap + gnashing jaws with high rolls deleted my boltboyz, then ran away through the gnawhole.

You can use the primal dice to roll extra dice to try to get up to a 12.
You need to do rerolls before you use any primal dice, and if you reroll you can't use any primal dice on that roll.
after rolling you decide whether or not you want to use one, and you can use multiple on a single spellcast, but you decide whether to use another after rolling the previous.
So as long as you have primal dice and haven't miscast you can keep rolling until you get the number you need to force a spell out.

Good to know.

yeah then bonuses to cast as well as the rule for warpstone chunks for the grey seers works pretty well with this new rule set

i do think that skaven are going to fail miserably against tzeentch, the pointy ears-things and seraphon, but they are able to hold their water against other faction

[JackStreicher]

Nagash could be Nasty with the new Spelllore.... oh boy
idk why "magic heavy" is almost always resulting in absurd amounts of Mortal Wounds - it's so uncreative

[Beliman]

14 minutes ago, JackStreicher said:

Nagash could be Nasty with the new Spelllore.... oh boy

Take in mind that Nagash can't use the new spell lore, it's only for Andtorian Locus. But, for whatever reason, he can still use Primal dice.

[Gailon]

26 minutes ago, Beliman said:

Take in mind that Nagash can't use the new spell lore, it's only for Andtorian Locus. But, for whatever reason, he can still use Primal dice.

And cogs don’t reroll. Won’t he be really vulnerable to a miss cast? 
 

feels like Khorne is a big winner here? Hexgorger skulls will wreak and using blood tithe for an auto unbind on some of these spells could be huge. 

[JackStreicher]

44 minutes ago, Beliman said:

Take in mind that Nagash can't use the new spell lore, it's only for Andtorian Locus. But, for whatever reason, he can still use Primal dice.

 

this game… I tell you.

[Skreech Verminking]

1 hour ago, Gailon said:

And cogs don’t reroll. Won’t he be really vulnerable to a miss cast? 
 

feels like Khorne is a big winner here? Hexgorger skulls will wreak and using blood tithe for an auto unbind on some of these spells could be huge. 

Slanns players, I got a 24 for the casting throw.

khorne: banned!!

[Silvertongue]

Have points been leaked - asking for a friend? 😂

[Beliman]

5 hours ago, Silvertongue said:

Have points been leaked - asking for a friend? 😂

I don't think so. But it seems that they are going to be posted on WarCom. 

[Skreech Verminking]

2 hours ago, Beliman said:

I don't think so. But it seems that they are going to be posted on WarCom. 

Warcom?

you mean like by gw themself, ir a potential leaker

[Beliman]

5 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Warcom?

you mean like by gw themself, ir a potential leaker

I mean like a regular WarCom article. But hey, nobody knows if the potatocam will attack again!

[Arzalyn]

13 hours ago, Silvertongue said:

Have points been leaked - asking for a friend? 😂

Some people saw a update of the beasts of chaos FAQ with tomorrows date in it, bu it was removed pretty fast. They probably dropping them tomorrow with he metawatch article.

[Skreech Verminking]

1 hour ago, Arzalyn said:

Some people saw a update of the beasts of chaos FAQ with tomorrows date in it, bu it was removed pretty fast. They probably dropping them tomorrow with he metawatch article.

It would make sense, well I’ll be working tomorrow, so there should be a bit of time (I hope) to see the stuff that will happen