AoS 2 - Ogor Mawtribe Discussion

[Arcce]

7 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

My new magnets got delivered today; now I can swap between that way-too-long pokey spear and the mighty splatter cleaver with ease

For Mournfang weapons it seems like half prefer gargant hackers and half go with the clubs/prey hackers and fists.  The 4+ to hit plus 1 less attack gives me pause, I'm leaning towards the clubs/prey hackers.  Is the rend-1 of the gargant hackers  the winning detail?   

Either way seems like units of 4 is pretty awesome.

Gargant hackers are good for the range mostly. Would only use them in large units of Mournfang and large units arent good cause their base size is so immense. 

Clubs have more synergy with Eurlbad and even without MWs on hit, they still do more damage in most cases than Gargant hackers...and thats not even counting the MWs that Ironfists do. 

I have posted before about how I think 2 man units of MF with Clubs and Ironfists are super versatile and do a surprising amount of MWs before going down. 

If ever running more than 4 mournfang in a unit though, Gargant hackers all the way for the range. 

[rosa]

The rend does make a difference though.

Wasn't the exact math that both option are quite similar!?

 

[Baron Wastelands]

1 hour ago, rosa said:

The rend does make a difference though.

Wasn't the exact math that both option are quite similar!?

 

The difference between a hacker and a club in terms of raw damage output are minimal, yes. Without factoring any damage from the iron fists on defence, on attack: against 3+ (Non-ethereal) save, the hacker is a bit better. Against 4+ they are identical. Against 5+ and 6+, the club edges it, but again, only very slightly. 

So what separates the two really is 2” range on the one hand, and iron fists on the other. So it depends a bit on how you are going to use them. As @Arcce said, the bigger the unit, the more mileage you will get from longer range, as they are big models. Also, 2” range allows you to fight over a line of bulls and avoid 1” return strikes, which can be harder to set up but very defensive from the mournfangs point of view. Tusks can’t hit from 2” of course. 

Meanwhile iron fists can give you some nice mortal wounds on defence, particularly good if you are going to take lots of small no rend hits, so can be good against hordes.

Personally, I think both are useful, and have 2 units of 4, one with hackers and one with clubs and iron fists. 4 seems to be the sweet spot, unless you are running multiple small units of 2 without relying much on buffs.

[Ganigumo]

7 hours ago, rosa said:

The rend does make a difference though.

Wasn't the exact math that both option are quite similar!?

 

9 club attacks vs a 5+ save: expected 5.33 damage  (4.89 if target is rerolling 1s, 3.56 if target is rerolling saves)

9 club attacks vs a 4+ save: expected 4 damage (3.33 if target is rerolling 1s, 2 if target is rerolling saves)
9 club attacks vs a 3+ save: expected 2.67 damage (1.78 if target is rerolling 1s, 0.89 if target is rerolling saves)

 

6 hacker attacks vs a 5+ save: expected 5 damage (4.83 if target is rerolling 1s, 4.33 if target is rerolling saves)

6 hacker attacks vs a 4+ save: expected 4 damage (3.67 if target is rerolling 1s, 3 if target is rerolling saves)

6 hacker attacks vs a 3+ save: expected 3 damage (2.5 if target is rerolling 1s, 2 if target is rerolling saves)

 

As you can see they numbers favor the gargant hackers against anything with rerolls or saves higher than a 4+. However, the clubs will actually come up on top in almost all cases once you factor in the ironfist triggers, as you only need 1 to outdo the hacker against anything other than a 3+ rerollable.

[Charly2912]

And in Eurlbad clubs are possibly more MW than hackers 

[Lord Krungharr]

Good math-hammers!  Thank yous.  I think I'll go with the clubs as I do want to use 4 max or sometimes just 2 Mournfangs per unit; and then I can use the gargant hackers to make more Ironguts, whose bits are really hard to find.  Those guys were steamrolling through everything in my two starter games.

[Causalis]

So, I am joining the Cult of devoted Fat Men Worshipers and am starting a OM army. Already ordered the SC! BCR box, which brings me to my question: Are the 4 Mournfang in the box any good? The internet seems to favor Gluttons and Ironguts but I hardly see any Mournfangs being taken. 

[KriticalKhan]

Apologies for the fridge pick, but I'm mostly done with a conversion for a Butcher/Slaughtermaster. I was hoping for some feedback before I move on to painting, and opinions on which wizard I should run it as.

[Kramer]

2 hours ago, KriticalKhan said:

Apologies for the fridge pick, but I'm mostly done with a conversion for a Butcher/Slaughtermaster. I was hoping for some feedback before I move on to painting, and opinions on which wizard I should run it as.

Imma say butcher. Because the two defining features in my mind for the slaughtermaster are imo: the cauldron and the stump weapons. 
your, very well executed, conversions lack both in this picture. 

just realised even bigger difference I’d the base size. So whatever base your pit it on it will work as. But still think a slaughtermaster should at the very least have a cauldron  

[Lord Krungharr]

22 hours ago, Causalis said:

So, I am joining the Cult of devoted Fat Men Worshipers and am starting a OM army. Already ordered the SC! BCR box, which brings me to my question: Are the 4 Mournfang in the box any good? The internet seems to favor Gluttons and Ironguts but I hardly see any Mournfangs being taken. 

Defnitely, Mournfangs are good!  They're faster Gluttons who do more damage in general, as their tusks are way better on the charge than Gulping Bites, plus they have better armor.  (I'm arming mine with the clubs and fists).   I have seen them used as a first wave, then followed up by the footsloggers for cleanup.  Ironguts are also awesome.  Eurlbad + Tyrant Gutguard=profit.

[gillio]

Anyone know how GW use to paint the oldschool ogres with the grey green skin? 

 

And how would I go about replicating that with the new paints?

[Kramer]

3 hours ago, gillio said:

Anyone know how GW use to paint the oldschool ogres with the grey green skin? 

 

And how would I go about replicating that with the new paints?

Tag me in a post tomorrow afternoon gmt and I’ll check if the fantasy battletome has a painting guide 👍

[Causalis]

Any recommendations for endless spells?

[JCar09]

 

Balewind vortex in bloodgullet, next to the kitchen and with the object that gives more a spell. We would have a magician with 4 casts, +1 to cast,-+1 dispell and +6 '' of range

[Charly2912]

Burning head for underguts so the cannons can reroll 1s to hit 

[Laststand]

On 8/8/2020 at 6:22 PM, gillio said:

Anyone know how GW use to paint the oldschool ogres with the grey green skin? 

 

And how would I go about replicating that with the new paints?

From the battletome

[Lord Krungharr]

10 hours ago, Causalis said:

Any recommendations for endless spells?

The Balewind Vortex suggestion sounds pretty excellent!  I'll have to reinforce it to support my old metal Butcher.

I was thinking of getting a Soulscream Bridge for bunches of Leadbelchers to get them into range.  I never did it when I had 40 Fireglaives in Legion of Azgorh, and now regret that.  Of course then I would still have Azgorh, and not Ogors, and that would suck because OGORS RULE!

[Jmason]

Is the fungoid cave shaman still a legal option for match play lists?

[Kramer]

1 hour ago, Jmason said:

Is the fungoid cave shaman still a legal option for match play lists?

Personally I think the FAQ is a bit unclear as everything (including battletomes) are a publication. 

but the generals handbook FAQ says that you can only use older publications with your opponents permission. 
the rule that allows the heralds in every army, including the cave shaman, is in the malign portents publication. 

so No, you can’t anymore according to the FAQ. 

but I expect a more detailed answer from GW soon. Because you can either take the faq literally and not allow anything before the generals handbook. or you take a more sensible approach and look at each publication in turn but that way confusion lies. 
for example wrath of the everchosen and malign portents are both Soul war supplements. So why one and not the other? 

[Kramer]

Frosty Underguts list. Not really a point to it, or sharing it for that matter 😅 Just a fun game on TTS coming up soon. 

Might even drop the cannons for more leadbelchers. Bringing the powder! (And re-testing the Frostlord)

[Lord Krungharr]

I think I'd take a Hunter somewhere in there, rack up the CPs, then have him pop out turn 3 and toss the Gnoblar Blastkeg, and shoot his crossbow and spears to nuke a hero or two.  He'd be the Sly Marbo of the Mortal Realms! (that's an old 40k Imperial Guard character).

Underguts are intriguing; can they be good without having to take Ironblasters?  What about tons of Leadbelchers on the march?  They're pretty solid in melee too.  

 

I'm nearly done assembling my full on monster mash:

Boulderhead

FLoSH (general, Brand of the Svard, Black Clatterhorn)

FLoSH (Metalcruncher)

HoTT (Alvagr Ancient, Vulture, the prayer that Boulderhead gets a bonus for)

3xSHBR

Any good?  We shall see!

Just a big ol' fashioned stampede!  And not much to remember to do.

[Kramer]

51 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:

I think I'd take a Hunter somewhere in there, rack up the CPs, then have him pop out turn 3 and toss the Gnoblar Blastkeg, and shoot his crossbow and spears to nuke a hero or two.  He'd be the Sly Marbo of the Mortal Realms! (that's an old 40k Imperial Guard character).

 

Yeah I took one with the blast keg before I had the monster painted (still not fully painted sadly). In any other list I'd take him. But just want to give the Thundertusk a go. 

But yeah hunter with cats gives you so many options. Love it. 

55 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:

Underguts are intriguing; can they be good without having to take Ironblasters?  What about tons of Leadbelchers on the march?  They're pretty solid in melee too.  

 

I went from 4 to 3 and now to 2 ironblasters. It's good. But the biggest impact is when they make a a charging impact. If you get the spell off of course. So I might go full Leadbeclhers at one point. Although Then I also start to wonder what the value of Underguts is. 

 

 

[Arcce]

4 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

I think I'd take a Hunter somewhere in there, rack up the CPs, then have him pop out turn 3 and toss the Gnoblar Blastkeg, and shoot his crossbow and spears to nuke a hero or two.  He'd be the Sly Marbo of the Mortal Realms! (that's an old 40k Imperial Guard character).

Underguts are intriguing; can they be good without having to take Ironblasters?  What about tons of Leadbelchers on the march?  They're pretty solid in melee too.  

 

I'm nearly done assembling my full on monster mash:

Boulderhead

FLoSH (general, Brand of the Svard, Black Clatterhorn)

FLoSH (Metalcruncher)

HoTT (Alvagr Ancient, Vulture, the prayer that Boulderhead gets a bonus for)

3xSHBR

Any good?  We shall see!

Just a big ol' fashioned stampede!  And not much to remember to do.

I am working up to the Monster Mash as well. Atm I am running the same thing but replacing 2 SHBR with a 3rd FLoSH and a Hunter General with 2xsabres to get battleline. 

[Baron Wastelands]

22 hours ago, Kramer said:

 So I might go full Leadbeclhers at one point. Although Then I also start to wonder what the value of Underguts is. 

 

To be fair, if you are going full leadbelchers, then Gunmasters in itself is worth taking Underguts for. And dropping Ironblasters only invalidates the command ability, and there are other things to spend CPs on. Mass of scars is still useful, maybe more so on a monster general if you go that route. And the blast keg - well, although there are certainly better artefacts, it still has the potential to be a nasty surprise for even units of 10, particularly heavily armoured ones.

I also think that the trophy rack is actually better with a large mob of leadbelchers than with ironblasters, if you can fit in a support tyrant. But maybe less need to anyway, if we’re thinking outside the usual underguts list.

[Kramer]

1 hour ago, Baron Wastelands said:

To be fair, if you are going full leadbelchers, then Gunmasters in itself is worth taking Underguts for. And dropping Ironblasters only invalidates the command ability, and there are other things to spend CPs on. Mass of scars is still useful, maybe more so on a monster general if you go that route. And the blast keg - well, although there are certainly better artefacts, it still has the potential to be a nasty surprise for even units of 10, particularly heavily armoured ones.

I also think that the trophy rack is actually better with a large mob of leadbelchers than with ironblasters, if you can fit in a support tyrant. But maybe less need to anyway, if we’re thinking outside the usual underguts list.

The extra 6 inches range are nice. But honestly haven’t been the biggest deal for me. It’s that long range threat that the cannons pose with the double shot.  But that has a the drawback of clumping 400-640 points together. That’s why I want to try a 3rd big leadbelcher squad instead of the cannons. Just to see if I can spread out a bit more. 

mass of scars on a behemoth hero would be great. But I cannot seem to get it to work with battleline. 

throphy rack near leadbelchers is a good call. I’m so focussed on the aura’s between the tyrant and the cannons, that o don’t think I ever had them shoot within throphy rack range. the extra range suddenly becomes more appealing then. 

blast leg is fine for a forced faction artefact. On a hunter behind the lines is useful. Or on a butcher to refill the pot