Riff_Raff_Rascal Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 @will pollock Quick thoughts: Anytime you have bells or warpseers, be confident in running MSU battleline. 10 man units of stormvermin are just as effective because of all out attack CA This list screams verminous melee, I say drop the warlock for another clawlord. Or swap HPA for a Warbringer somehow. Theres so much lords bring to the table now. I sense you will be aggressive and less reactive with your grinder. If so, swap your Inspired triumph for the re-roll charge so that unit can have fun. Swap spells with Bell and Seer on foot. Seer has better chance to cast Frenzy while bell can still play support by putting heroes where they need to go. Every instinct tells me not to make a squishy warlock your general. If its an archwarlock, now we're cookin'. The bell is a solid 2nd choice with your current list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shalvan Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 7 hours ago, will pollock said: thoughts on this list? 2 drop with double regiment Allegiance: Skaventide- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line- Triumphs: InspiredLeadersWarlock Engineer (125) in Battle Regiment- General- Command Trait: Overseer of Destruction- Universal Spell Lore: LevitateGrey Seer on Screaming Bell (265) in Battle Regiment- Artefact: Suspicious Stone- Lore of Ruin: Death FrenzyClawlord (105) in Battle Regiment- Mighty Warlord Command Trait: Brutal FuryGrey Seer (140) in Battle Regiment- Lore of Ruin: SkitterleapBattleline40 x Clanrats (260) in Battle Regiment- Rusty Blade- Reinforced x 140 x Clanrats (260) in Battle Regiment- Rusty Blade- Reinforced x 130 x Stormvermin (330) in Battle Regiment- Halberd & Shield- Reinforced x 2Units1 x Warp-Grinder (75) in Battle Regiment1 x Ratling Gun (60) in Battle Regiment1 x Ratling Gun (60) in Battle Regiment1 x Ratling Gun (60) in Battle RegimentBehemothsHell Pit Abomination (240) in Battle Regiment- Mutation: Toughened SinewsTotal: 1980 / 2000Reinforced Units: 4 / 4Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 162 You can fit this in a one drop, if ratlings are hidden in clanrats they don't count as a drop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will pollock Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 11 hours ago, Riff_Raff_Rascal said: @will pollock Quick thoughts: Anytime you have bells or warpseers, be confident in running MSU battleline. 10 man units of stormvermin are just as effective because of all out attack CA This list screams verminous melee, I say drop the warlock for another clawlord. Or swap HPA for a Warbringer somehow. Theres so much lords bring to the table now. I sense you will be aggressive and less reactive with your grinder. If so, swap your Inspired triumph for the re-roll charge so that unit can have fun. Swap spells with Bell and Seer on foot. Seer has better chance to cast Frenzy while bell can still play support by putting heroes where they need to go. Every instinct tells me not to make a squishy warlock your general. If its an archwarlock, now we're cookin'. The bell is a solid 2nd choice with your current list. •i prefer 30 stormvermin so the whole unit can be given extra attack from the clawlord •I need the warlock to fully buff the ratlings, I think being able to give them +1 damage and reroll hits is more valuable than another clawlord •fair point on this one however the clanrats don't always charge when they come out from the grinder, more just screen the ratlings •I prefer skitterleap on the Seer on foot since he's able to transport himself whereas the bell wouldn't be able to •warlock has to be the general for overseer of destruction and I don't have the points for an arch warlock without dropping something more significant 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocKeule Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 Apparently Gnawholes and Skaven endless spells are going to become online exclusives. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coyote Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 Discussion - Grey Seer on Screaming Bell - “Pushed into Battle” - Says we can’t start our move unless 10 SKAVENTIDE models are within 6”. Do all 10 need to be from the same unit? I had been playing that way, and making it work. (I play with 4 Bells in my list.) But - The rules as written do not stipulate the Skaventide models have to be from the same unit. I had been really leery about 1x10 Stormvermin because- in my thought process - lose 1 and no more Bell being pushed. The only units we can really use to Push are - Clanrats - Best Choice - I assign 1 to each bell for a 33 wound action team right there. Stormvermin Giant Rats - (need x2- don’t laugh, 80 points - cheaper than 130 for Clanrats Plague Monks Maybe Plague Censer Bearers (but why?) - with a reinforcement and as long as they don’t die Acolytes (why, same argument as PCB). Another later conversation- we are finally HUGE winners with Stormvermin now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocKeule Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 7 hours ago, Coyote said: Do all 10 need to be from the same unit? No, they don't. And they could push more than one Screaming bell or Furnace as well if you move the wagons first and then let the pushing units catch up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aelford Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 What’s people’s thoughts on this list? Skaventide - Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery - Triumphs: Bloodthirsty Leaders Verminlord Warpseer (335) in Battle Regiment - General - Command Trait: Supreme Manipulator - Universal Spell Lore: Levitate Arch-Warlock (175) in Battle Regiment - Artefact: Vigordust Injector - Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power! Master Moulder (95) in Battle Regiment Battleline 10 x Stormvermin (110) in Battle Regiment - Halberd & Shield 10 x Stormvermin (110) in Battle Regiment - Halberd & Shield 10 x Stormvermin (110) in Battle Regiment - Halberd & Shield Units 6 x Stormfiends (630) in Battle Regiment - 2x Windlaunchers - 2x Ratling Cannons - 2x Doomflayer Gauntlets - Reinforced x 1 4 x Rat Ogors (190) in Battle Regiment - Mutation: Toughened Sinews - Reinforced x 1 Behemoths Hell Pit Abomination (240) in Battle Regiment - Mutation: Toughened Sinews Total: 1995 / 2000 Reinforced Units: 2 / 4 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 117 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimeToWaste85 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 So I bought two Verminlords, just finished painting up the second (Deceiver), largely because of the Wrath of the Everchosen list, which now discontinued usage of Verminlords. Is there any reason for me to keep my Deceiver? Or should I dump it for some Chimera’s (for Khorne army)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shirtripper Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 42 minutes ago, TimeToWaste85 said: So I bought two Verminlords, just finished painting up the second (Deceiver), largely because of the Wrath of the Everchosen list, which now discontinued usage of Verminlords. Is there any reason for me to keep my Deceiver? Or should I dump it for some Chimera’s (for Khorne army)? I would argue that the Deceiver is better than ever since he can benefit from Monstrous Rampages, Heroic Actions, and Flaming Weapons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coyote Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 @Aelford Like the list, may want a Different Grand Strategy (Hold the line?) as I think you only have 2 Wizards and they’re both going to be aggressive and near the enemy. You don’t want to lose 2 and then have to pull back from there trying to keep the other fella alive just to succeed at the Grand Strategy. As for the Hold the Line, you just need 1 Stormvermin to live to succeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 2 hours ago, Aelford said: What’s people’s thoughts on this list? Skaventide - Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery - Triumphs: Bloodthirsty Leaders Verminlord Warpseer (335) in Battle Regiment - General - Command Trait: Supreme Manipulator - Universal Spell Lore: Levitate Arch-Warlock (175) in Battle Regiment - Artefact: Vigordust Injector - Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power! Master Moulder (95) in Battle Regiment Battleline 10 x Stormvermin (110) in Battle Regiment - Halberd & Shield 10 x Stormvermin (110) in Battle Regiment - Halberd & Shield 10 x Stormvermin (110) in Battle Regiment - Halberd & Shield Units 6 x Stormfiends (630) in Battle Regiment - 2x Windlaunchers - 2x Ratling Cannons - 2x Doomflayer Gauntlets - Reinforced x 1 4 x Rat Ogors (190) in Battle Regiment - Mutation: Toughened Sinews - Reinforced x 1 Behemoths Hell Pit Abomination (240) in Battle Regiment - Mutation: Toughened Sinews Total: 1995 / 2000 Reinforced Units: 2 / 4 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 117 Your list really looks interesting a lot. Although only 30 bodies to take-steal objectives! I’m not sure if that is going to be enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aelford Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) @Coyote thanks for that little tip. It slipped my mind and a worthwhile change for sure. Coupled up with @Skreech Verminkings comment, I’m debating dropping the rat ogors and 2x10 stormvermin and upping the last unit of stormvermin to 20 and adding in 2x20 clanrats. Holds the Grand Strategy a lot better, and the stormvermin in a 20 can fight if needed. I should have command points aplenty. I have also been thinking about a deceiver. As @Shirtrippersaid, I think they’re very strong with the minus to hit for shooting, their command trait and of course Dreaded Skitterleap. Thinking of switching the Warpseer for the Deceiver. That would give me 3 decent threats and the 20 Stormvermin on top. The other list I’m considering is this. Deceiver again can be a warpseer Allegiance: Skaventide - Grand Strategy: Hold the Line - Triumphs: Bloodthirsty Leaders Master Moulder (95) in Warlord - General - Command Trait: Hordemaster - Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact) Master Moulder (95) in Warlord - Artefact: Rabid Crown Master Moulder (95) in Warlord Verminlord Deceiver (345) in Warlord - Universal Spell Lore: Flaming Weapon - Allies Battleline 6 x Rat Ogors (285) in Hunters of the Heartlands - Mutation: Toughened Sinews - Reinforced x 2 6 x Rat Ogors (285) in Hunters of the Heartlands - Mutation: Insanely Rabid - Reinforced x 2 6 x Giant Rats (40) in Warlord 6 x Giant Rats (40) in Warlord 6 x Giant Rats (40) 6 x Giant Rats (40) Units 3 x Packmasters (60) 3 x Packmasters (60) in Hunters of the Heartlands Behemoths Hell Pit Abomination (240) in Alpha-Beast Pack - Mutation: Never-never Die-die Hell Pit Abomination (240) in Alpha-Beast Pack - Mutation: Toughened Sinews Core Battalions Alpha-Beast Pack Warlord Hunters of the Heartlands Total: 1960 / 2000 Reinforced Units: 4 / 4 Allies: 345 / 400 Wounds: 135 I guess the question we should be asking now days - Can the list reliably inflict 35 wounds on a 3+ save in one turn? Apologies, not sure how to hide text (armylist) on mobile. Edited July 12, 2021 by Aelford Trying to hide text Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coyote Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Deceiver is not an Ally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shirtripper Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 17 hours ago, Aelford said: The other list I’m considering is this. Deceiver again can be a warpseer Verminlord Deceiver (345) in Warlord - Universal Spell Lore: Flaming Weapon - Allies Skaven cannot ally with Skaven, so you can't bring a Deceiver in an all-Moulder army. You'd need to change it to a Warpseer to make your army legal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coyote Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 (edited) Mystic Shield + Clanshields question - I think I already clarified this before- but please confirm- If casting Mystic Shield on Clanrats/Stormvermin while unit is 10+ Models - We don’t get an additional +1. But still worthwhile if opponent uses Rend weapon against us, as we may lose -1 (or whatever) but get a +1 back. Right? Edited July 13, 2021 by Coyote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shirtripper Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 31 minutes ago, Coyote said: Mystic Shield + Clanshields question - I think I already clarified this before- but please confirm- If casting Mystic Shield on Clanrats/Stormvermin while unit is 10+ Models - We don’t get an additional +1. But still worthwhile if opponent uses Rend weapon against us, as we may lose -1 (or whatever) but get a +1 back. Right? Right. You can only ever at most get a +1 to your save after modifiers are calculated, meaning that you can stack +1 saves to negate rend but the most you can get after rend is a +1 to save characteristic. This is important because some units can get really tough to kill. I played a game yesterday where I stacked Mystic Shield and All-out-Defense on a unit of Stormfiends which gave them a 3+ against -1 rend attacks. Similarly, my opponent playing OBR with Petrifex (reduces rend by 1) had an Arkhan buffed by Mystic Shield and Finest Hour. That meant my Verminlord had effectively zero rend! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Shirtripper said: Right. You can only ever at most get a +1 to your save after modifiers are calculated, meaning that you can stack +1 saves to negate rend but the most you can get after rend is a +1 to save characteristic. This is important because some units can get really tough to kill. I played a game yesterday where I stacked Mystic Shield and All-out-Defense on a unit of Stormfiends which gave them a 3+ against -1 rend attacks. Similarly, my opponent playing OBR with Petrifex (reduces rend by 1) had an Arkhan buffed by Mystic Shield and Finest Hour. That meant my Verminlord had effectively zero rend! Yeah, with the current system, I’m literally seeing rend -1 or less as almost useless. Thankfully, we are skaven players, and for that reason have a ton of option to just out straight deal mortal wounds. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bregor Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Ok, so after playing two games in 3.0 with my ratboys ( smaller games unfortunately, haven't gotten to try my 2k lists yet)... If you haven't tried out the Cunning command trait, you definitely need to. It's gone off so many times in my games, and it's noticeable how many extra command points you get from it (and denying the same amount, even more important!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmicsheep Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 1 minute ago, Bregor said: Ok, so after playing two games in 3.0 with my ratboys ( smaller games unfortunately, haven't gotten to try my 2k lists yet)... If you haven't tried out the Cunning command trait, you definitely need to. It's gone off so many times in my games, and it's noticeable how many extra command points you get from it (and denying the same amount, even more important!) I'd forgotten about cunning. So if your opponent goes second and has their general on the field, you'd roll 3D6 for the cunning ability? Hmmm, that does sound like a lot of fun 😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shirtripper Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 52 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said: Yeah, with the current system, I’m literally seeing rend -1 or less as almost useless. Thankfully, we are skaven players, and for that reason have a ton of option to just out straight deal mortal wounds. This is definitely a volume of fire game now. Hopefully 9d6 of shots from Stormfiends all at 2D each can get the job done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shirtripper Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 (edited) Here is a theoretical list of mine that I'm looking to test. It has poor objectives game, but there's something to be said about having your entire army do shooting. Stormfiends continue to over-perform, and with Mystic Shield and such they can be surprisingly tanky. All of the Engineers have MMMWP for redundancy. I've learned that -1 to hit is not all that great, so every unit will be able to land shots at -2, or completely bypass in the case of WLC's. The idea would be to park the WLC's in the backfield and demolish things one at a time while the deathball of Stormfiends + Arch-Warlock march up the field flanked by the Acolytes, who can run and tag objectives as necessary. The single Warpfire Projector is to shore up matches against Immortek guard, basically. I'm going to test this out soon, so let me know what you think! Comes out to 2k exactly. Command Entourage (Command Point) Arch-Warlock (175) --General --Command Trait: Deranged Inventor --Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (or Vigordust Injector, not sure which yet) --Spell: MMM-Warp-Power! Warlock Engineer (125) --Spell: MMM-Warp-Power! Warlock Engineer (125) --Spell: MMM-Warp-Power! Hunters of the Heartland Skryre Acolytes x10 (130) Skryre Acolytes x10 (130) Stormfiends x9 (945) --3x Ratling Guns --2x Windlaunchers --1x Warpfire Projectors --3x Shock Gauntlets No Battalion Warp Lightning Cannon (185) Warp Lightning Cannon (185) Edited July 13, 2021 by Shirtripper 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coyote Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 I forget Masterclan 5+ EVERY time use a CP. EVERY time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scythian Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 Just had my first two games against Troggoths and OBR. Two victories for the rats but I’m just getting started with this army. Pics and list provided below. 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 7 hours ago, Scythian said: Just had my first two games against Troggoths and OBR. Two victories for the rats but I’m just getting started with this army. Pics and list provided below. Looks amazing, yet I wonder, where your Arch warlock/ warlock egnineer/bombardier is. kinda am missing all this great buff that, that one small hero can push out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 (edited) So I’ll probably be taking part at a 1000points tournament, coming up next month. Considering that I don’t often take part at events with such low number of points, and having nit played the new edition with the new battleplans, my knowledge is kinda well lacking currently (I’ll be able to pick up the missing books next week) I’ve made this list with a high number of uncertainty: Allegiance: Skaventide- Grand Strategy: Dominating Presence- Triumphs: IndomitableLeadersWarlock Bombardier (125)- General- Command Trait: Overseer of Destruction - Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!Plague Priest (85)- Universal Prayer Scripture: HealBattleline40 x Clanrats (260)- Rusty Blade- 01x Standard Bearers- 01x Standard Bell Ringers- Reinforced x 120 x Clanrats (130)- Rusty Blade- 01x Standard Bearers- 01x Standard Bell RingersUnits1 x Warp-Grinder (75)1 x Warpfire Thrower (70)1 x Ratling Gun (65)1 x Ratling Gun (65)1 x Ratling Gun (65)6 x Giant Rats (40)Total: 980 / 2000Reinforced Units: 1 / 4Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 91 I might have to try it out, as soon as I can. anyways what are your thoughts, any comment (good/ bad or worse) are welcome ps: The whole army is in the one drop battailon. Edited July 14, 2021 by Skreech Verminking 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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