AoS 2 - Beasts of Chaos Discussion

[Chaos Shepard]

53 minutes ago, TheArborealWalrus said:

I was thinking of trying out some dragon ogors and wanted to avoid the old shaggoth model. What have others done for their shaggoths? Thoughts, ideas, or better yet, pictures?

For Morghur!

Well I don't know how much this can help but this is my Shaggoth.

Very much not your typical Shaggoth. The bottom half is that of a Gryph-chargers, while the upper torso, arms, and some of the head are that of a Vargheist. Everything else is pretty much green stuff.

[TheArborealWalrus]

21 minutes ago, Chaos Shepard said:

Well I don't know how much this can help but this is my Shaggoth.

Very cool! Keeps closer to the look of the brayherd part of the army.  I dig it. Also feels very ghur or chamon to me. I'm not sure where I want to take my dragon ogres yet design wise, but I hadn't considered tying them to the more furry elements of the army. How does she compare in size to the regular dragon ogres? 

[TheArborealWalrus]

1 hour ago, cyberhawk94 said:

1) How viable is a Gravespawn + Pestilent Throng army with lots of MSU? I really like the idea of ~5 Chariots and a few Characters bum-rushing the enemy to soften it up right off the bat, but every list I see around uses Desolating Brayherd instead. 

2) The Slaves allies that Ive seen talked about are a Khorne Prince, Be'lakor, Hypnocat, and a Gaunt Summoner. Any of these particularly useful? The Summoner looks fun but expensive on points. 

3) What endless spells are the go-tos? Any of the generic/tzeentch ones?

Welcome aboard! I'm not very experienced with using the army out of our book yet, but I'll try to help.

1: I'd rate it as okay.  It's usable, just not likely to go big in the nasty tournaments (although you probably didn't pick BoC for that). It'd be super hilarious if your heroes' spawns exploded when they died too, but alas, they aren't a part of the battalion. So, solid enough, good for finishing wounded heroes , but not a super competitive build. I've heard people talk about it being good out of the Nurgle book, but have no experience with that. Nurgle allies might help to push it up? I don't know how much of their warscroll abilities work off of the Nurgle keyword alone. Besides that, chariots are just fun, so go for it!

The desolating beastherd helps us in the area of damage dealing  (which we need) and allows you to put almost any brayherd or bull units you want into a single drop. It encourages the aggressive plays that we're known for and  those bonus hits can be devastating on the right units (aka high damage ones). It gives us what we want and reduces our drops, which is why it's the go to battalion.  Plus it feels very fluffy. Gors, ungors and bulls swarming you in your territory while you desperately try to survive? Straight out of the old gotrek books right there.

2: The summoner gets you pink horrors for free, and the other three are about controling the flow of the game. Hypnocat is somewhat hard to use (he hypnos at an awkward time) Khorne prince stops your opponent from charging effectively at any greater distance than 6" and Belakor stops that one key unit from doing stuff for a turn. They're all pretty okay, I'd personally rate hypnocat at the bottom, but they all suffer from our herdstone aura (except Belakor) greatly limiting their survivability. The two princes are decently killy (which makes them very killy for us) on top of their utility ability and the summoner has a useful personal spell and comes with goons. Since he doesn't want to be in combat anyways, the aura hurts him less. I've never personally tried them, so that's all I got.

3: The tauros is popular for helping to protect our troops so we can gang up on enemy units, plus it hurts people. I like the idea of throwing a tzaangor shaman forward to cast the brayhorn, at a crucial time, but I haven't heard much about it. Cogs are always nice for a CC army like us, but we're pretty fast already.  Otherwise nothing is specifically helpful for us. I unfortunately have been told that the Tzeentch endless spells aren't very good, but haven't looked at them myself. All the other generically helpful ones can be used, but typically aren't featured. From what I've seen it's usually the tauros for a go to spell.

Edited July 15, 2020 by TheArborealWalrus

[Myrdin]

There are some quite nice options for proxi dragon ogors.
Personally I am using this one:

He fits nicely on the DAS base, and I converted my other DA with Cold One heads to give off more reptilian vibe and thus be more truthful to the "Dragon" part in their name.

There is even larger, more beefy and bad ass version of this guy, but that one goes on 120mm base minimum, so thats not really an option.

Ofc. there is bunch of different conversion out there on the internet, some of them are really well done so I recommend browsing a little to see what you like and what you could potentially recreate for your own use

Edited July 15, 2020 by Myrdin

[Chaos Shepard]

10 hours ago, TheArborealWalrus said:

Very cool! Keeps closer to the look of the brayherd part of the army.  I dig it. Also feels very ghur or chamon to me. I'm not sure where I want to take my dragon ogres yet design wise, but I hadn't considered tying them to the more furry elements of the army. How does she compare in size to the regular dragon ogres? 

While I don't have any regular dragon ogres to directly compare her with, I do have this image of her with my Gorgon and Shaman.

I would say she is fairly close in size to a regular Shaggoth, maybe a little larger in some ways and smaller in others.

[Popisdead]

12 hours ago, TheArborealWalrus said:

I was thinking of trying out some dragon ogors and wanted to avoid the old shaggoth model. What have others done for their shaggoths? Thoughts, ideas, or better yet, pictures?

There are lots of dragons in the game with proper bulk these days.  And lots of larger top bodies.  the Ogroid is a good top for example.

11 hours ago, cyberhawk94 said:

1) How viable is a Gravespawn + Pestilent Throng army with lots of MSU? I really like the idea of ~5 Chariots and a few Characters bum-rushing the enemy to soften it up right off the bat, but every list I see around uses Desolating Brayherd instead. 

3) What endless spells are the go-tos? Any of the generic/tzeentch ones?

Gavespawn (the lore is old, the mutated human was given to the beasts in the woods) not Grave 😉They gave away their baby.  

Pestilent Throng works well with spamming Ungors.  6 x 10.  Also spamming 10 man Bestigors.  Last time I played with it I did 1 MW.  I rolled three 1s in a row regarding the ability.  It abandoned me hard.  I think Chariots are better in Khorne.  

 Desolating is good and cheap but there are uses for the others.  The Khorne, Slaanesh, Warherd, Thunderscorn ones see play.  The bad one is the Marauding one (first one).   Tzeentch sees a little play too.  

The bull.  It goes well with Pesitlent Throng and Gavespawn cause you spam out MSU.  It is so good when KO got that ability to auto-cast the running joke was "bull in a bottle".  Generic Endless Spells are good value for points.  

[Lord Krungharr]

I for one am very excited with the Cygor and Ghorgon points drops;  I ordered bits to make 2 of each.  Figure outflanking all 4 when using pure BoC would be a super fun shock tactic and give some enemies major hesitation to push foward with some of their stuff as the big boys will be threatening those key backfield objectives in some missions (like that Take n Hold mission which I always lose).  

Also glad they dropped the battalions a bit.  Almost ready to take two battalions to make up for the crappy Desolate Shard with the Darkwalkers.  Teleporting Bullgors with outflanking Ghorgons/Cygors is very appealing but so are pretty much any other Doombull relics.

[cyberhawk94]

The Current List Im planning on testing once we open back up:

Allegiance: Beasts of Chaos, Greatfray: Gavespawn, Realm: ???

HEROES

Great Bray-Shaman (100pt)

• Spell: Stranglethorn
• General: Unravelling Aura

Beastlord (90pt) - PT

• Artefact: Mutating Gnarlblade

Beastlord (90pt) - PT

• Artefact: Volcanic Axe

Doombull(100pt) - PT

Doombull(100pt) - PT

Gaunt Summoner (240pt) - Allies

BATTLELINE

#1 x10 Bestigors (120pt) - PT

#2 x10 Bestigors (120pt) - PT

#3 x10 Bestigors (120pt) - PT

UNITS

Tuskgor Chariots (4 units of 1) (240pt) - PT

x10 Ungor Raiders (80pt) - PT

x10 Ungor Raiders (80pt) - PT

x10 Tzaangors (180pt)

• 4 greatblades, 1 shield, rest paired

Ghorgon (160pt) - PT

BATTALIONS

Pestilent Throng (180pt)

DESCRIPTION

4 Drops total.

2 of the chariots and possibly one Beastlord start in ambush. 

Turn 1, Everything but the casters, Tzaangors, and 1 unit of raiders runs forward and makes any charges it can, with the ambushers trying to pick out casters and ranged units. I expect the chariots, Doombulls, and Beastlords to be dead by the end of round 2, but thats 8 mortal wound bombs and 4 chaos spawn I just got. Depending on how MSU the opponent is, that could easily cause 30+ mortal wounds, softening everything up and possibly taking out a character without even counting my attacks. If they are in bigger units, then happy days for the Bestigors! 

Tzaangors are there to protect the backfield objectives / casters and fire off their Banner, and the Gaunt summons Horrors to act as a solid tarpit with some bonus shooting. 

Also, normal Primordial Call shenanigans, focusing on fast things like more Chariots or a Cockatrice.

Unsure on:

• The 2nd Beastlords weapon, dont know the realm artefacts that well. 
• The 2nd doombull vs a 2nd Shaman. Especially if I take an endless spell I think I need a shaman that can move with the army, but the Doombull gives another Pestilent Spawn Bomb.
• Do I need Cogs with this? I dont fancy trying to find the points for a Tzaangor Shaman to reliably cast it. 
• The Tzaangors. really good for holding an objective, but expensive and add an extra drop over a Brayherd unit. They do get buffed by the Gaunt so there is that. 

What do you think? 

Edited July 17, 2020 by cyberhawk94

[Sauriv]

58 minutes ago, cyberhawk94 said:

 

• Do I need Cogs with this? I dont fancy trying to find the points for a Tzaangor Shaman to reliably cast it.

What do you think? 

I dont remember exactly what was in my list (can look it up later if you wish) but i know i had 7 units of bestigor, 7 chariot, Tzaangor shaman, cogs and some bray shamans, i think i run a doombull for summoning (he was hurting himself). I liked to ambush all chariot + a unit of bestigors to max out  the ambush. To me cogs was really crucial and i managed to get that roll of 7 (+2) very often (with the built-in rr-charge from the chariot) to get the charge. Tzaangor shaman felt lika a must as well to cast cogs reliable. 

Mw when they die is nice but this cant be your only plan when playing because some lists just laugh at that. I faces a CoS list with 30 Phoenix guards, 1 anointed on frost Phoenix, 1 hurricanum and a celestant prime(drops down later so hard to chase). In that list there were no good target to focus the mw more than an unimportant battlemage. 

The strength, according to me, is that you can swarm your opponent and tie them into weird combats(charge both flanks of a big unit to not everyone can fight) 

And alot of bestigors are great as well! 

Edited July 17, 2020 by Sauriv

[Popisdead]

2 hours ago, cyberhawk94 said:

 

Unsure on:

• The 2nd Beastlords weapon, dont know the realm artefacts that well. 
• Do I need Cogs with this? I dont fancy trying to find the points for a Tzaangor Shaman to reliably cast it. 

What do you think? 

Chariots do better out of ambush, cogs wouldn't be bad.  Don't worry too much about low drops over squeezing more out of your list.  A Tzangor Shaman gets his reroll on the second spell attempt I think.  

Tzeentch and Nurgle hate each other.  Just saying.  You maybe want to check allying in.  I know there are some restrictions.

Realm artifacts are going away aren't they?

With the Pestilent throng you are just wanting things to hold up, capture objectives and cause MWs.  Single Razorgors aren't a bad option either.

1 hour ago, Sauriv said:

 i think i run a doombull for summoning (he was hurting himself).

You can also use a Shaman to just stab himself and spew out the rend spell but the Doombull is good too   Shaggoth can also do this healing himself.  Just pricy.  

[cyberhawk94]

7 minutes ago, Popisdead said:

Tzeentch and Nurgle hate each other.  Just saying.  You maybe want to check allying in.  I know there are some restrictions.

I know, but Im modeling my army in such a way that it doesnt look Tzeentch-y or Nurgle-y (full fey Beasts, using Dryads as Tzaangors), and there are no actual rules restricting bringing in Tzeetch units in a Nurgle list. 

 

7 minutes ago, Popisdead said:

Realm artifacts are going away aren't they?

They are? Im just getting back into Sigmar and only just this week looked up all the realm rules and stuff

[Sauriv]

1 hour ago, cyberhawk94 said:

They are? Im just getting back into Sigmar and only just this week looked up all the realm rules and stuff

Yes, this is new and came with the new GHB20, the old malign sorcery book is replaced by the new stuff, new artifact/spells/realm rules, in the GHB20. 

 

Edited July 17, 2020 by Sauriv

[Maddpainting]

Meet my Avatar of Krakanrok


 

[Myrdin]

43 minutes ago, Maddpainting said:

snip

I like the conversion, though the arms look a bit flimsy for such massive weapon. Especially when compared to the bottom half. But in general it looks impressive and I am sure will be quite intimidating once fully painted *thumbsup*

Regarding the Profile page, its kinda all over the place, the description makes little sense and the abilities are also not written in the format how GW tends to word their rules. I would look into a bit more. Regarding the stats personally I think those front claws should be 4+ 3+ - 2, just going be sheer bulk of that thing. Also the range should be 2 maybe even 3" on the great hammer and 2" on the tail. Weapons need some adjustments.  Basically: the concept is good, its neat you build a model to represent it, all it needs is some polishing and adjustments so that it feels more cohesive.

[Maddpainting]

It written in the way the best i can do with the rules in the AoA, i followed the Custom hero rules, so it was written that way. In Tte AoA maker there is no adding "Range" option, and if i want to make the claws better it'll make him 36DP (AKA 360 points) or more depending what you add, tho i was trying to stay under 35 as the more you add the more it costs. Finally the max points you can have are 40 (400pts) I don't think 400pts, just to give him Ethereal would be +40pts more for example. 

This is a fully legal unit b.c i followed their rules. I could make it up however i wanted and play in Open play, but i want to bring it to match play.

PS: It doesn't need to be written perfectly, its more of a reminder and flavor instead of just listing the abilities from the book and referencing it to the book.

Edited July 18, 2020 by Maddpainting

[Chaos Shepard]

I think you may have made some mistakes. Based on key words and weapon profile I'm assuming you started with a Gor and gave them the mounted beast trait. With this you should only be able to get to a maximum of 10 wound, but you seem to have 13. You can get to 13 if you take the Gargantuan Beast trait, or if you started with the Dragon Ogor as your base. You also might want to note that the Front Claw and Tail Spike attacks technically count as coming from a mount.

As for the model, it looks top notch. If I had to nit pick it would be the position of the right hand. Given his stance, I feel it would look better the other way around.

[Sinfullyvannila]

On 7/15/2020 at 12:45 AM, TheArborealWalrus said:

Welcome aboard! I'm not very experienced with using the army out of our book yet, but I'll try to help.

1: I'd rate it as okay.  It's usable, just not likely to go big in the nasty tournaments (although you probably didn't pick BoC for that). It'd be super hilarious if your heroes' spawns exploded when they died too, but alas, they aren't a part of the battalion. So, solid enough, good for finishing wounded heroes , but not a super competitive build. I've heard people talk about it being good out of the Nurgle book, but have no experience with that. Nurgle allies might help to push it up? I don't know how much of their warscroll abilities work off of the Nurgle keyword alone. Besides that, chariots are just fun, so go for it!

The desolating beastherd helps us in the area of damage dealing  (which we need) and allows you to put almost any brayherd or bull units you want into a single drop. It encourages the aggressive plays that we're known for and  those bonus hits can be devastating on the right units (aka high damage ones). It gives us what we want and reduces our drops, which is why it's the go to battalion.  Plus it feels very fluffy. Gors, ungors and bulls swarming you in your territory while you desperately try to survive? Straight out of the old gotrek books right there.

2: The summoner gets you pink horrors for free, and the other three are about controling the flow of the game. Hypnocat is somewhat hard to use (he hypnos at an awkward time) Khorne prince stops your opponent from charging effectively at any greater distance than 6" and Belakor stops that one key unit from doing stuff for a turn. They're all pretty okay, I'd personally rate hypnocat at the bottom, but they all suffer from our herdstone aura (except Belakor) greatly limiting their survivability. The two princes are decently killy (which makes them very killy for us) on top of their utility ability and the summoner has a useful personal spell and comes with goons. Since he doesn't want to be in combat anyways, the aura hurts him less. I've never personally tried them, so that's all I got.

3: The tauros is popular for helping to protect our troops so we can gang up on enemy units, plus it hurts people. I like the idea of throwing a tzaangor shaman forward to cast the brayhorn, at a crucial time, but I haven't heard much about it. Cogs are always nice for a CC army like us, but we're pretty fast already.  Otherwise nothing is specifically helpful for us. I unfortunately have been told that the Tzeentch endless spells aren't very good, but haven't looked at them myself. All the other generically helpful ones can be used, but typically aren't featured. From what I've seen it's usually the tauros for a go to spell.

Sorry to wall of text quote; I play Tzeentch with Tzaangors and the Burning Sigil is a good spell, and it’s really nice combined with Dirgehorn to make a part of the board an absolute nightmare for your opponent. The Bull and the Horn are better spells though and since we’re limited to 3 now it’s a hard ask to go for the Sigil over Geminids.

Edited July 18, 2020 by Sinfullyvannila

[Maddpainting]

4 hours ago, Chaos Shepard said:

I think you may have made some mistakes. Based on key words and weapon profile I'm assuming you started with a Gor and gave them the mounted beast trait. With this you should only be able to get to a maximum of 10 wound, but you seem to have 13. You can get to 13 if you take the Gargantuan Beast trait, or if you started with the Dragon Ogor as your base. You also might want to note that the Front Claw and Tail Spike attacks technically count as coming from a mount.

As for the model, it looks top notch. If I had to nit pick it would be the position of the right hand. Given his stance, I feel it would look better the other way around.

I put the stats on the hero/weapons, the warcroll is just a reference for me. It is missing the Monster keyword (I just wrote it in later) and its a Gor with Gargantuan mount +8 wounds.  The hands are in the correct spot, its just the models arms are a pit farther back then one is normally used to, he is just right handed, GW for some reason makes most of their models left handed.

[Blood_Tiger]

I'm starting Beasts of Chaos soon, this is a list I would like feedback on.  I thought about gavespawn but I like the summoning bonus you get from Allherd. 

My playgroup are these armies:  LON, Ogres, COS, Seraphon, Kharadron, SCE, and Tzeentch

Allegiance

 Beasts of Chaos: Allherd

Leader:

Great Bray-shaman [100pts]: Viletide, Blade of the Desecrator

Great Bray-shaman [100pts]: Vicious Stranglethorns, Dominator, General

Great Bray-shaman [100pts]: Tendrils of Atrophy

Great Bray-shaman [100pts]: Titanic Fury

Battleline

Ungors [60pts]:  10 Ungors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns, Ungor Blade

Ungors [60pts]:  10 Ungors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns, Ungor Blade

Ungors [60pts]:  10 Ungors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns, Ungor Blade

Battalion: Brass Despoilers [1,370pts] Brass Despoilers

 Beastlord: Volcanic Axe

 Doombull

 Bestigors: 10 Bestigors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns

 Bestigors: 10 Bestigors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns

 Bullgors: 2x 3 Bullgors, Bullgor Great Axes, Warherd Banner Bearer, Warherd Drummer

 Gors: 3x 10 Gors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns, Gor Blade and Beastshield

 Gors: 10 Gors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns, Gor Blade and Beastshield

 Gors: 10 Gors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns, Gor Blade and Beastshield

 Tuskgor Chariots: Tuskgor Chariot

 Tuskgor Chariots: Tuskgor Chariot

 

Endless Spell: Purple Sun of Shyish [50pts]

Total: 2,000pts

 

[Maddpainting]

IDK about the Purple Sun, if you are going for Summoning why not buy +1CP instead? Especially vs SCE, DoT, KO, and Seraphon, they can all easily deny spells. Otherwise its fine for what you want to do.

[Blood_Tiger]

4 minutes ago, Maddpainting said:

IDK about the Purple Sun, if you are going for Summoning why not buy +1CP instead? Especially vs SCE, DoT, KO, and Seraphon, they can all easily deny spells. Otherwise its fine for what you want to do.

Testing it out, would likely be dispelled yes. 

Still thinking about the command point because 3cp to start is fairly good for summon points.

 

[Maddpainting]

Yes if you are going summoning, just by the extra CP.

[Popisdead]

On 7/18/2020 at 2:39 PM, Maddpainting said:

PS: It doesn't need to be written perfectly, its more of a reminder and flavor instead of just listing the abilities from the book and referencing it to the book.

There was a short story about Krakanrok from the Time of Legends novel they put out (collection of short stories from "super ancient times" back in Fantasy.  

If you can buy it in iBooks or whatever pdf book platform you use it's worth a read.  A Sunmage and Krakanrok and no one else.  

[Maddpainting]

I like the little fluff about Archaon being scared when he realizes he is hiking on Krakanrok, freaks out and gets mad at his champion for wanting to fight it, kills his champion and gets out of there as fast as he could.  HAHAHA

[cyberhawk94]

New FAQ, the Gaunt Summoner now only summons 5 Horrors. Still worth as an ally or cut from the list?