Age of Sigmar: Second Edition

[Skabnoze]

It will also be interesting to see how the full rules are worded.  It sounds like this happens during the battleshock phase - so I am curious if these are considered to be battleshock casualties or not.  If they are then that means you can potentially use command points to prevent losses if you want to replicate the v1 tactic to hold a point through the use of Inspiring Presence.

The more I think about it the more I hope that is actually the case.  I think that would be a cool little feature.  I am perfectly ok with coherency being avoided/exploited for strategic gain through the expenditure of command points.

[Skabnoze]

11 hours ago, Kramer said:

True I personally love the excitement of a tie and why take exciting rolls out of the game? 2 or 3 ties in a row in a priority roll is always memorable  Love those. Also the impact is a bit bigger, so I wouldn't call it a more elegant rule, it's a game decision: how big of an advantage do you want to give the player, and do you want a streamlined game with less rolls. But again that's a personal preference, but now we started the conversation I think the first houserule is born here ?

I called it a more elegant rule in the software engineering sense of "elegant".  Basically the "wins ties" version that I listed solves all corner cases for the priority roll in a single roll-off between both players and requires the least amount of explanation text in the book.  Hence it is the most "elegant".

Now, that does not mean it is the most fun.  I agree with you that roll-offs are memorable and fun.  It is hilarious when both players tie 3-4 times in a row.  I have played long enough to see that happen a fair amount of times and both players usually get pretty excited when it does.  Having fun should be the ultimate goal of the game and the best games are the ones that leave you with memorable stories (both for good or bad) years or decades down the road.

But the professional software engineer in me appreciates an elegant algorithm and I expect that many game designers share that same appreciation.  So, I honestly expect that my idea is probably what we will see.  Another thing to consider is that it means they can handle the first turn roll-off with the exact same rules that they wrote for subsequent turns and spoiled.  The only thing they have to do at that point is explain which player gets the previous priority status for tie-breakers - which I think will be the bonus for finishing deployment first.

[Changer]

Apologies if this has already been brought up, but I’m sat here reading the battle report in white dwarf and a bit popped out to me. It tells of Prosecutors charging into combat to kill a Lord Executioner, where they only suffered one wound in return.

To me this shows that chargers don’t strike first in combat, which is something I know was speculated in recent weeks.

[Furuzzolo]

3 hours ago, stratigo said:

Man I am hoping that "only wizards can dispel persistent spells" thing is NOT true. Making so dwarves simply can't dispel this stuff would be silly

Why so? I guess we still can dispel them on cast, we can still move them if we're not going first...

Diversity among factions is pretty good. Plus, thing like endless spells, are good grudges materials.

[Mayple]

@Skabnoze

I really like that new rule which deals with breaking cohesion. With good positioning, one can get some seriously above-their-value usage out of units when removing casualties. I'm probably one of those extreme cases when it comes to breaking cohesion; I do it every game, several times. 

Buff unit with battleshock immunity - Charge them in/Block an area, leaving a conga line back to a buffing hero - Remove casualties wherever - Pile-in - next casualty: Remove the conga line, except a single model left behind to receive buffs - Unable to pile in due to breaking cohesion, but already in perfect position anyway.

Usually this was to receive the Chaos allegiance buff, and 'Dark avenger'; my heroes are cowards, so they rarely leave my side of the map. 

It has been such a no-brainer to do it like this, as it has neglible trade-offs (no movement) that is easy to work around. I really like this new change, makes it a real choice, and not an automatic response

Do we think this removal of models happen before or after battleshock?

[GeneralZero]

3 minutes ago, Mayple said:

Do we think this removal of models happen before or after battleshock?

ATM, all we know is speculation...

[Mayple]

11 minutes ago, GeneralZero said:

ATM, all we know is speculation...

Do we speculate the removal of models happens before, or after battleshock?

[GeneralZero]

The weight of this decision is too heavy for me. 

[DantePQ]

1 hour ago, Mayple said:

Do we speculate the removal of models happens before, or after battleshock?

Rumors say that it's at the end of the turn so after Battleshock (as Battleshock as for right know is last phase of a turn)

[Drib]

1 hour ago, Mayple said:

Do we speculate the removal of models happens before, or after battleshock?

Why not both?

[Vanger]

Idoneth Deepkin faction focus is up.

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/06/09/9th-june-faction-focus-idoneth-deepkingw

[Mayple]

Oh. That is interesting! It almost sounds like your general could be a non-hero.

I don't know why you would do that (appears to receive no command trait unless they're a hero), but still interesting.

[Drib]

Just now, Mayple said:

Oh. That is interesting! It almost sounds like your general could be a non-hero.

I don't know why you would do that (appears to receive no command trait unless they're a hero), but still interesting.

You can choose every model to be your genaral. Only in Pitched Battle it needs to be a Hero.

[Mayple]

8 minutes ago, Drib said:

You can choose every model to be your genaral. Only in Pitched Battle it needs to be a Hero.

Well, yes, in the current edition; but the wording here implies that might be a matched play thing in the next one. Unless they plan to remove a portion of that wording specifically for matched play.

[Drib]

The rules shown in the preview are almost all from the core rules, so nothing special here.

[Gotrek]

1 hour ago, Drib said:

The rules shown in the preview are almost all from the core rules, so nothing special here.

Except every time they mention realm spells/artifacts/endless spells which, from my understanding,  are all from malign sorcery

[Drib]

4 minutes ago, Gotrek said:

Except every time they mention realm spells/artifacts/endless spells which, from my understanding,  are all from malign sorcery

These where never mentioned with rules, only their warscrolls or describtion.

[amysrevenge]

10 hours ago, Skabnoze said:

But the professional software engineer in me appreciates an elegant algorithm and I expect that many game designers share that same appreciation.  So, I honestly expect that my idea is probably what we will see.  Another thing to consider is that it means they can handle the first turn roll-off with the exact same rules that they wrote for subsequent turns and spoiled.  The only thing they have to do at that point is explain which player gets the previous priority status for tie-breakers - which I think will be the bonus for finishing deployment first.

Something occurred to me about the math of the dice rolls.

In your "advantaged player wins ties" scheme, the advantaged player wins for 21 of 36 dice combinations. 58%

In the "advantaged player gets +1, reroll ties" scheme, you still get 21 wins but there are only 31 final dice combinations (the ties are not a result).  68%.

[Aelfric]

15 minutes ago, amysrevenge said:

Something occurred to me about the math of the dice rolls.

In your "advantaged player wins ties" scheme, the advantaged player wins for 21 of 36 dice combinations. 58%

In the "advantaged player gets +1, reroll ties" scheme, you still get 21 wins but there are only 31 final dice combinations (the ties are not a result).  68%.

It's also true that if you are double-turned it is harder to then get a double turn yourself.

[angrycontra]

48 minutes ago, Gotrek said:

Except every time they mention realm spells/artifacts/endless spells which, from my understanding,  are all from malign sorcery

No, realm spells are part of the core rules. There's a reason why 2nd edition has 18 pages of rules and one of those reasons is the spell lores for all realms (along with other realm rules). Artifacts also are part of the new rules although I'm not sure whether they are in core book or ghb2018. Malign sorcery is just the endless spells.

[Skabnoze]

33 minutes ago, amysrevenge said:

Something occurred to me about the math of the dice rolls.

In your "advantaged player wins ties" scheme, the advantaged player wins for 21 of 36 dice combinations. 58%

In the "advantaged player gets +1, reroll ties" scheme, you still get 21 wins but there are only 31 final dice combinations (the ties are not a result).  68%.

You still have to account for the success/fail in the rerolls.  Those 5 results that can result in a tie cannot be removed from the probability pool.  You still outright win on 21/36 and not 21/31.  But, you will win roughly 58% of the rerolls and that will give you about ~7.5% more wins.  So you end up winning about 65.5%

It’s close to your math, but slightly less.

[Drib]

14 minutes ago, angrycontra said:

No, realm spells are part of the core rules. There's a reason why 2nd edition has 18 pages of rules and one of those reasons is the spell lores for all realms (along with other realm rules). Artifacts also are part of the new rules although I'm not sure whether they are in core book or ghb2018. Malign sorcery is just the endless spells.

Spells and Artifacts are in the Malign Sorcery set. The core rules have 18 pages because they include all changed allegiances, summoning for every faction, FAQs and Erratas.

[Skabnoze]

14 minutes ago, Drib said:

Spells and Artifacts are in the Malign Sorcery set. The core rules have 18 pages because they include all changed allegiances, summoning for every faction, FAQs and Erratas.

What I heard from a little bird is that the rules to build your army, determine realm spells & artifacts are indeed in the core 18pages of rules.  However the spell tables and item tables are located elsewhere.  So that can be in battletomes, generals handbook, or malign sorcery.  But supposedly the rules for how you select them is located in the core rules.

 

 

[Elmir]

So about this "choosing a new general thing", do you think that'll make it to matched play? If it does, LoN are going to be tricky to shut down in terms of summoning...

[Brightstar]

41 minutes ago, Elmir said:

So about this "choosing a new general thing", do you think that'll make it to matched play? If it does, LoN are going to be tricky to shut down in terms of summoning...

I think that will be up to organizers and groups, but I believe it will make it in. 

GW seems really into their new summoning rules.  I don't think they are designing it to be "shut down," per se.  They want us to use it and, "as they say" take advantage of the mechanics.

 

1 hour ago, Skabnoze said:

What I heard from a little bird is that the rules to build your army, determine realm spells & artifacts are indeed in the core 18pages of rules.  However the spell tables and item tables are located elsewhere.  So that can be in battletomes, generals handbook, or malign sorcery.  But supposedly the rules for how you select them is located in the core rules.

 

 

With options like this, GW usually gives some general ones in the core rules which are expanded in battletomes, etc.   I imagine we might get something similar here.