AoS 3 - Nighthaunt Discussion

[EnixLHQ]

2 hours ago, Liquidsteel said:

Do you think Bounty Hunters is worth sacrificing the 1 drop here?

I feel like having the choice turn 1 is quite important.

Quite a few lists now that will be invested in magic with the new endless spell, some like Sylvaneth can yeet them at you from outside standard range.

Getting to go first and moving in to unbind range can really mess with them, along with getting your defences up potentially.

I can't comment about the tourney lists since I haven't seen any commentary about how they were played, but the battle reports I've been following online suggest pretty strongly that we benefit from going second much more than we do going first.

This means that the draw for a one- or two-drop list is to guarantee going second. Depending on your opponent that might not be worth it if they'd always opt to go first.

6 hours ago, lare2 said:

Am I right in thinking one of those won a tourney? The list was posted earlier.

*frantically begins building Nagash*

 

4 hours ago, Boggler said:

He's a really great model!

The current state of the game is that you can literally wind up laying a huge variety of lists, unless you know your local meta so well that you already know exactly who you'll be playing and what army they're hot on.

One thing that does stand out is that a lot of people are preferring to go magic heavy and include the Purple Sun.

This pairs with Nagash very well as we all know he can shut down the hero phase all by himself. If you give him Cogs you're almost certain to avoid the normal T1/T2 miscast. Cogs are strong.

People seem to be swapping the Portal for Sun. Sun is dumb and a lot of people are jumping on it while it so good. The math makes it almost as likely that you outright kill something quicker than the Hand of Dust.

I think Nagash/Quicksilver/40Harridans gives enough spare points to upgrade the Spirit Torment to a Kruciator.

  Reveal hidden contents

Allegiance: Nighthaunt
- Procession: Scarlet Doom
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
- Grand Strategy: Fright or Flight
- Triumphs:

Leaders
Nagash, Supreme Lord of the Undead (955)
Spirit Torment (115)
- General
- Command Trait: Master of Magic
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist

Battleline
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (350)
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Bladegheist Revenants (175)
10 x Bladegheist Revenants (175)

Units
4 x Myrmourn Banshees (105)

Endless Spells & Invocations
Chronomantic Cogs (40)
Purple Sun of Shyish (70)

Total: 1985 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 65
Drops: 6
 

Tempts me to play Nagash next weekend. Without the purple sun so likely not the silly OP NPE he is.

  Reveal hidden contents

Allegiance: Nighthaunt
- Procession: Quicksilver Dead
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
- Grand Strategy: Fright or Flight
- Triumphs: Bloodthirsty

Leaders
Nagash, Supreme Lord of the Undead (955)*
Spirit Torment (115)*
- General
- Command Trait: Master of Magic
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist

Battleline
10 x Dreadscythe Harridans (160)*
10 x Dreadscythe Harridans (160)*
5 x Hexwraiths (160)**
5 x Hexwraiths (160)**
5 x Hexwraiths (160)**

Endless Spells & Invocations
Chronomantic Cogs (40)
Umbral Spellportal (70)

Core Battalions
*Battle Regiment
**Bounty Hunters

Total: 1980 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 0 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 71
Drops: 4
 

 

Nagash so stronk. I hope he doesn't get meta-nerfed in response.

Something about tying half your points in one model damages my steez. I get... nervous? I dunno, I have commitment fear about it.

[Liquidsteel]

11 minutes ago, EnixLHQ said:

I can't comment about the tourney lists since I haven't seen any commentary about how they were played, but the battle reports I've been following online suggest pretty strongly that we benefit from going second much more than we do going first.

This means that the draw for a one- or two-drop list is to guarantee going second. Depending on your opponent that might not be worth it if they'd always opt to go first.

 

Nagash so stronk. I hope he doesn't get meta-nerfed in response.

Something about tying half your points in one model damages my steez. I get... nervous? I dunno, I have commitment fear about it.

Yes of course, if you can then giving away turn 1 is often ideal.

With that said, the way some of the new missions score and the battle tactics available, giving away first is not a foregone conclusion anymore. 

My main point was that I feel Nagash should definitely be a 1 drop so you have the decision. 

 

[lare2]

It's a tough one. I agree that I think a one drop is the best for Nagash lists but I really don't know whether going first or second is best. On the one hand, going first means you can get all defenses up, dictate board control, and place yourself appropriately for magic defences. On the other, everything in me and many years experience running Death reminds me that IGOUGO is the way I like to play. I find that Death need that recursion and the double turn, more so now with NH, absolutely destroys us. 

Edited July 22, 2022 by lare2

[Boggler]

11 hours ago, Liquidsteel said:

Do you think Bounty Hunters is worth sacrificing the 1 drop here?

That's the huge question. The one drop is almost a guaranteed choice of turn order at this point in time.

I'm not sure its worth the risk to go to a 2 or 3 drop since you'll only be adding more Bounty Hunter damage vs GV's and people seem to be tech'ing out of them.

Nagash, 40 Harridans, Hex, Cogs, Sun? 2x20 or 4x10?

I have another 1 day event at the end of the month. I'm so excited and I have no clue what to bring. I haven't had a chance to play twice in a month in a few years! I created my VLog to help keep my spirits up and get ready for the games. I have received a bunch of positive commentary from people all over the globe. That's enough for me to keep trying stuff. Painting and hobby is my go to since I don't get much time out of the house. Hopefully I'll be able to make some videos of the army in a future vid.

I hope I play new Skaven and Sylvaneth in one day! Nighthaunt keep on doing new Nighthaunt things...

And people are probably taking the Black Coach for it's mobility. The new objective game is great as that teleport can get to where it wants. Just roll high!

[Gitzdee]

Hi all i have a 1000p game this week vs a DoK Snakes list. Sadly i know close to nothing about DoK.

I dont own a lot of models yet but i want to try out the new tome because it seems fun. I kind of want to run the Black Coach or Lady O but dont know if it is worth it in a 1000p game. What would u add to this list? 

Spoiler

Allegiance: Nighthaunt
Procession: Emerald Host
LEADERS
Lord Executioner (140)
UNITS
3 x Spirit Hosts (125)
3 x Spirit Hosts (125)
3 x Spirit Hosts (125) (could drop this if needed)

Other models i have painted are:
Spirit Torment
Reikenor
Lady O
Chainghasts
Black Coach

[Rors]

With that many spirit host your list already seems to be leaning into hero hammer to me. Chuck in lady O and have a blast watching them waste all their snake shots on spirit host body guard.

[Gitzdee]

Would this be any good?

 Army Faction: Nighthaunt
     - Subfaction: The Emerald Host
     - Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
     - Triumph: Inspired

LEADERS
Lady Olynder (340)*
     - General
     - Spells: Shademist
Spirit Torment (115)*
     - Artefacts of Power: Arcane Tome
     - Spells: Lifestealer
Lord Executioner (140)*
     - Artefacts of Power: Lightshard of the Harvest Moon
BATTLELINE
Spirit Hosts (250)*
Spirit Hosts (125)*
ENDLESS SPELLS & INVOCATIONS
1 x The Burning Head (20)
CORE BATTALIONS
*Warlord
TOTAL POINTS: 990/1000

Edited July 27, 2022 by Gitzdee

[Boggler]

Spoiler

12 hours ago, Gitzdee said:

Would this be any good?

 Army Faction: Nighthaunt
     - Subfaction: The Emerald Host
     - Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
     - Triumph: Inspired

LEADERS
Lady Olynder (340)*
     - General
     - Spells: Shademist
Spirit Torment (115)*
     - Artefacts of Power: Arcane Tome
     - Spells: Lifestealer
Lord Executioner (140)*
     - Artefacts of Power: Lightshard of the Harvest Moon
BATTLELINE
Spirit Hosts (250)*
Spirit Hosts (125)*
ENDLESS SPELLS & INVOCATIONS
1 x The Burning Head (20)
CORE BATTALIONS
*Warlord
TOTAL POINTS: 990/1000

It'll be great. You'll have a lot of fun.

Its got recursion, spellcasting, buffs/debuffs shooting, combat, and combat phase recursion. You'll be active in every phase and that will help you understand the game more. Just try and remember everything you do!

Maybe put Seal of Shyish on the Spirit Torment and make him the General with Master of Magic. Lady O is a warmaster already.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Boggler

[Rors]

Looks good.

Only thing I'd say is remember that your list is very focused on bunching up. In a blob you'll smash through stuff but at some point in the game you'll also need to work out the trigger point to spread out and nab objectives.

This isn't a recommendation to change your list more a consideration for how it will play.

I think you'll get your best results generally playing as an aggressive castle that looks to cripple their strong pieces in the first turns then start looking for victory points.

On the battles that tend to push everything into the center, you'll find this a lot easier, the battles that spread out objectives further, you'll need to really consider when you stop blobbing and start spreading.

Oh, I'd also recommend changing the battalion to battle regiment. You'll get a lot of advantage out of being one drop and going second.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Rors
additional thought

[Gitzdee]

4 hours ago, Boggler said:

  Reveal hidden contents

It'll be great. You'll have a lot of fun.

Its got recursion, spellcasting, buffs/debuffs shooting, combat, and combat phase recursion. You'll be active in every phase and that will help you understand the game more. Just try and remember everything you do!

Maybe put Seal of Shyish on the Spirit Torment and make him the General with Master of Magic. Lady O is a warmaster already.

Wont Seal of Shyish clash with the bodyguard rule and be useless most of the time as it replaces the ward save?   

[Rors]

I think lifestealer is fine. It'll help keep your general alive as you occasionally rolls 1s and 2s for body guard.

In terms of Seal, you could in theory, give your Tourment a ward and let him take a few wounds with less risk before you start putting them onto the spirit host. You can do the same strategy with Olynder, you don't need the body guard to tank everything, you can let her take a few wounds then start guarding, spreading the damage keeps everything around a little longer.

That said you could also use a CP to do that and then you don't need to worry about failing the cast or being dispelled, and you could still take lifestealer to heal.

As you play games you'll get a feel for what works for you.

[Boggler]

12 hours ago, Gitzdee said:

Wont Seal of Shyish clash with the bodyguard rule and be useless most of the time as it replaces the ward save?   

It really depends on how you want to play your list.

I looked at your list and wanted to run my heroes behind the units of SH. Especially the 6 SH's Then setup some counter charges.

Seal of Shyish will help them take less damage. Seal is also CV5 (83% chance)vs Lifestealer CV7 (58% chance)/ range of 12". Seal is way more useful in my opinion. If you get Seal/Shademist on that unit of 6SH they'll be really tanky/good and if they get close to dying then Oly will hopefully bring em back to full.

The bodyguard rule only applies if your heroes are taking damage, which they shouldn't be except from shooting.

[Rors]

I accidentally posted this in the AoS2 chat awhile back.

There's a tournament (sovereign smash) coming up and I'm thinking I'll take my night haunt. I have a fairly meme list I'd like to share for thoughts.

The idea is to follow these strategies as a basic idea for how the list functions:

- rasps go into the underworld - wait until there's space in oppents territory and drop them down for Barge through enemy lines (extra VP), then probably go for Desecrate lands the next turn. If I drop them turn 3 or 4 I can bait hunters out of position or focus on removing them.

- GoS and Harrows are CP engine for the list. 5 redeploys, ward saves, or all out attacks a battle round as needed. Towards end of game Harrows become teleporting objective stealers. The artifacts give me one turn to utterly wreck a problem unit with the +1 attack bubble and one turn where I can reload Banshees that are damaged. They'll usually either kill or die but I had room for another artifact so why not.

Banshee spam is the core of the list. The idea is to always be trading and MSU multicharge. They're simultaneously screens and hammers. With redeploy I can bait it so that the when one banshee is charged, on my turn I can trade up and multicharge that unit. Double turn hurts but it also resets my CP farm. If I can't redeploy to safety I spam 5+ wards. In a magic meta this many Banshees also just hard counters magic Dom lists.

I've had alright success play testing the list, I'm most concerned about facing off against other Night Haunt, unless they bring Nagash. Banshees are great at wrecking high armor so an ethereal opponent is going to dramatically reduce their output.

Allegiance: Nighthaunt
- Procession: Emerald Host
- Grand Strategy: Fright or Flight

Leaders
Dreadblade Harrow (145)**
- Artefact: Lightshard of the Harvest Moon
Dreadblade Harrow (145)***
- Artefact: Beacon of Nagashizzar
Dreadblade Harrow (145)**
Dreadblade Harrow (145)*
Reikenor the Grimhailer (190)*
- Lore of the Underworlds: Lifestealer
Guardian of Souls (150)*
- General
- Command Trait: Cloaked in Shadow
- Artefact: Cloak of the Waxing Moon
- Lore of the Underworlds: Soul Cage

Battleline
3 x Spirit Hosts (125)****
10 x Chainrasps (110)****
10 x Chainrasps (110)****

Units
4 x Myrmourn Banshees (105)***
4 x Myrmourn Banshees (105)***
4 x Myrmourn Banshees (105)***
4 x Myrmourn Banshees (105)
4 x Myrmourn Banshees (105)
4 x Myrmourn Banshees (105)
4 x Myrmourn Banshees (105)

Core Battalions
*Command Entourage - Magnificent
**Command Entourage - Magnificent
***Bounty Hunters
****Expert Conquerors

Additional Enhancements
Artefact
Artefact

Total: 2000 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 0 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 89
Drops: 16

[Arzalyn]

Anyone here had any success with using bladegheists outside of Scarlet doom? I really like the models, but not enough to get the 40+ most scarlet doom lists seen to use. I was thinking of using 2 MSU units of them in a Emerald host list has harassers, but I not sure they fit this role well without the mortals scarlet provides.

[lare2]

Played against my friend’s NH last night with my SCE. Was interesting to be on the other side of a NH army. Going into the game I wasn’t too confident as my SCE are very elite with high rend, high damage attacks. I was very surprised by how much damage I did cause though. Longstrikes, despite GW’s attempts to nerf them, are still super strong and definitely something to watch out for. I popped Reikenor, 10x Grimghast and some miscellaneous CRH in the first turn using a combo of them and 3x Grandhammers. Second turn, bye bye Lady O… and on and on the game went. Despite the damage I was pumping out though, he won due to the sheer number of bodies he had on the table. I couldn’t compete with primaries and slowly fell behind on score. Lessons I learned though for when fighting SCE with my NH, I think it would be useful to get across the board asap. Hit them hard and fast as I did lose the units that he could actually touch.

Edited July 29, 2022 by lare2

[Fellman]

Brakdown of Nighthounts by Aos Coachand Ronya A

 

[EnixLHQ]

Another attempt at MidJourney. This prompt was "Lady Olynder of the Nighthaunt."

[DrThunder]

Mispost

Edited July 31, 2022 by DrThunder

[EnixLHQ]

So now that the guide's been out and sat a bit, does anyone have any suggestions they'd like to see from it?

Or, in other words, anything missing? Anything that would make it the go-to guide for you or anyone you'd want to learn the army?

After watching both Coach's deployment masterclass and Ronya's overview I'm thinking of distilling some of that info down into a deployment strategies section. That ended up being my takeaway from both videos.

[Boggler]

5 hours ago, EnixLHQ said:

So now that the guide's been out and sat a bit, does anyone have any suggestions they'd like to see from it?

Your guide is great. Deployment and general tactics could be good.

I had a crazy morning. My wife told me that our plans for next weekend had been cancelled. I then looked at the Season of War GT and saw that there were tickets available. I bought one and will be heading there next weekend. Bringing Nighthaunt.

I'm going to do a video series again about my list and my matchups. It will break down deployment for the battleplans and how I felt going in to each matchup. I hope people find it somewhat useful but if not its certainly helping me to be a better player myself.

[Lord Krungharr]

On 7/28/2022 at 7:10 PM, Arzalyn said:

Anyone here had any success with using bladegheists outside of Scarlet doom? I really like the models, but not enough to get the 40+ most scarlet doom lists seen to use. I was thinking of using 2 MSU units of them in a Emerald host list has harassers, but I not sure they fit this role well without the mortals scarlet provides.

My friend had success vs my Warherd army a couple weeks ago with his Scarlet Doom.  I found the table wide de-buffing to be the secret sauce, besides ignoring my amazing rend capabilities.  And his big hordes just making it tough to move across the table (we were doing I think Lurkers from Below, where the table goes the long way and a big no-man's land in the center).

[Rors]

11 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

My friend had success vs my Warherd army a couple weeks ago with his Scarlet Doom.  I found the table wide de-buffing to be the secret sauce, besides ignoring my amazing rend capabilities.  And his big hordes just making it tough to move across the table (we were doing I think Lurkers from Below, where the table goes the long way and a big no-man's land in the center).

Yeah poor beasts have a rough time with Night Haunt. Before their update they were one of the weakest books and against night haunt they're basically playing with their old book.

[EnixLHQ]

https://woehammer.com/2022/07/31/aos-meta-stats-w-e-24th-july-2022/

It looks like we've officially arrived, guys! Welcome to the 50%+ club.

[dmorley21]

1 hour ago, EnixLHQ said:

https://woehammer.com/2022/07/31/aos-meta-stats-w-e-24th-july-2022/

It looks like we've officially arrived, guys! Welcome to the 50%+ club.

Yep, all that stats I’ve seen have NH as a top 5 army and even above 55% since the new GHB. We should expect points increases and/or a nerf in the next battlescroll. 

[Boggler]

Ugh. I hope not. Nighthaunt is also one of the most played factions.

Nothing sticks out as OP.