AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion

[Grimrock]

4 hours ago, Big Kim Woof-Woof said:

Greetings, spiky-armour-type people!

I'm a deep-rooted Hedonites player who has recently realised he's invested in a veritable shipload of coalition models... so much so that he could be running a whole Slaves to Darkness army too! I've got loads of Chaos Warriors, Marauders, Knights, a Warshrine, Chosen, and a plethora of suitable hero models. Almost enough for a 2000 point force. 

My question is this; what allied Slaaneshi unit/s would fill out my Slaves army nicely? I've got the models of pretty much everything in the book. Thoughts? 

Normally I'm not a huge fan of coalition units, but thinking about it Slaanesh has some pretty solid picks. Off the top of my head the masque should be pretty great since she has all the pertinent rules on her warscroll and usually dies before the depravity bonuses kick in anyway. Taking a couple blissbarb units and a lord of pain should also work pretty well. Slaves is really lacking in ranged abilities but blissbarbs can be devastating with that +1 to hit/wound buff. Blissbarb seekers could be good as well but they're pretty pricy. Seekers could work since they're just so ridiculously fast but I think marauder horsemen fill a similar role well enough while also being cheaper and more resilient. 

[Lord Krungharr]

I had no takers for a game yesterday so I decided to practice vs my Slaves to Darkness ( Bring Ruin to the Realms GS) on my floor (needed to try them out anyways too).  Lurkers Below.  StD had 2 Karka-Lords, 2 foot Sorcerers, 10 Nurgle Knights, 10 Tzeentch Chosen, 4 Chariots.  I used my Eshin Murderforce (Masters of Execution GS) w 2 Deceivers, 4 Deathmasters, 3x10 Gutter Runners, and Slynk's Clawpack.  The upcoming tournament lets us bring a free Underworlds Warband, but I only had the 1, so Eshin got that bonus.

T1-StD dropped first so chose to go first and move up towards the center objective to lock in the turn 2 control better.  Rolled on the Eye of the Gods table to get the BT, buffed up the Chosen to extremes w Daemonic Speed and Power, Mystic Shield, and Oracular Visions, then Warped Reality to teleport them across the table to the Eshin backfield....where they then charged 3D6+1" (from the drummer) into the non-general Deceiver and plain Deathmaster...Deathmaster died, and Deceiver got rid of 1 Chosen....and the Chosen did their strike-again thing and killed off the Deceiver.  Chariots moved to block the gnawholes from being used.

Bottom of T1-General Deceiver failed Flaming Weapon but got Skitterleap off, and Slynk's Pack along with the Tunneling and Farskittering Deathmasters joined him in the StD backfield with a unit of Gutter Runners.  The other Gutter Runners popped up midfield hoping to take out a couple flanking chariots, succeeding in 1, doing 6 wounds to the other.  Alpha Deathmaster had to retreat from the Chosen as it turns out he was actually within 3" of them.  The massed shooting and followup charges by Deceiver and the Clawpack (Slynk failed his charge roll) killed 1 Sorcerer and both Karkadraks.  Eyes for Eyes!

T2-StD got Priority and decided to Run Them Down (making at least 3 charge rolls).  3 Chariots did that no problem and ended up killing most of the invading Gutter Runners (but they stabbed the chariot with 1 wound left to death) and putting a couple wounds on Slynk.  Chosen charged and wiped a midfield unit of Gutter Runners but lost a couple to Unleash Hell.  Knights came back to charge and kill off the Clawpack and take the Deceiver down to 3 wounds.  Knights lost 1 or 2 dudes though.

Bottom T2-Deceiver Skitterlept outta there, going for This One's Mine on the chariot battling Slynk; an easy one since it had a couple wounds on it already....even though the Doomstar completely whiffed, which it always seems to do!  the stiletto did its work.  The 2 Deathmasters shot and got rid of another knight or two, they were down to 7 then, and then charged the last chariot and finished it.

T3-StD got Priority AGAIN, and ran the Chosen onto Eshin's objective, ran the Sorcerer to the center one, and still had the Knights on theirs, and TAHDAH, they won instantly.  Which is lame.  But Eshin made a big tactical error not forseeing this and should have kept the other midfield Gutter Runners either towards their objective or the center in Turn 2.  For kicks I played it as if Eshin got the Priority, and they ended up killing all the knights with shooting and then charges, but the Chosen would have remained.  But it wouldn't have been instant winning for anyone at that point.

Deceivers really need the MW hits like Deathmasters have, and random shots make no sense from the Doomstar.  For the points they cost, they deserve to have those.  Without Flaming Weapon they just don't do that much except vs heroes with the hit/wound bonus.  I might magnetize my custom Verminlord to be a Warbringer or even Skreech.  More utility though it won't be pure Eshin then.

Gutter Runners are certainly fragile and swingy, but I like the units of 10 as they can fit in their needed footprint better than 15.  However it seems unnecessary to always deepstrike them.  Playing it out in my head, this game would have been very different had I started them on the table.  Fun learning match!  StD Chosen are no joke.

[JackStreicher]

A Harbinger of decay is a priest.

If I ally one of them it should be able to choose a generic prayer, does it not? (The app won‘t let me)

 

Meaning curse and the likes. (My warshrine can’t choose either)

Edited July 16, 2023 by JackStreicher

[RocketPropelledGrenade]

18 hours ago, JackStreicher said:

A Harbinger of decay is a priest.

If I ally one of them it should be able to choose a generic prayer, does it not? (The app won‘t let me)

 

Meaning curse and the likes. (My warshrine can’t choose either)

I would send this in as a bug to the AoS apps team. I haven't always had great success getting the bugs I've found fixed, but I have gotten real responses before, including seeing fixes rolled out that addressed some of the stuff. Can't recall the email address offhand, but it's on GW's website.

[Lord Krungharr]

Hello fellow Slaves, I have some strategic questions, or perhaps tactical questions.  I'm in a league this quarter, and my first game is vs Seraphon Starborne player with the list in the screenshot I attached.  Mission will be Every Step is Forward.

I'll be running Cabalists: Bring Ruin to the Realms

KarkaLord (BattleLust trait, Nurgle, Helm of the Oppressor, Chaotic Conduit)

KarkaLord (Nurgle, Binding Damnation)

Sorcerer Lord (Tzeentch, D.Speed, Hoarfrost)

Sorcerer Lord (Tzeentch, D. Speed, Merciless Blizzard)

4 Undivided Chariots for Battleline w flail'n'whip (idea being they can get buffed when nabbing objectives)

10 Tzeentch Chosen w Blasted Standard (to protect vs Unleash Hell and teleport when needed)

10 Nurgle Knights w Eroding Icon

allied Cockatrice

I had originally written Battle Regiment/Warlord, but meant to do 2 Battle Regiments as I like the idea of lower drops.  If I can go first vs this Seraphon guy, who will inevitably form a magic castle, does it seem feasible that I could maybe get my buff spells off with the Cabalist Draw From Power shenanigans, then launch my Chosen and maybe my Knights into his Saurus Warriors and Guard to erase them early?  Then if I can survive his magic hero phase (and not get double-turned) I think I could get into his wizards to finish it off.   

Taking care of his Saurus Guard ablative wounds early might be something the teleporting Chosen could do if lucky with a good 3D6 casting roll plus maybe a Primal Dice.

Not really sure what else I could do except be very aggressive.  If I let him go first he can get all his buffs off and launch all the Comet spells all over the place and probably summon stuff turn 1 with all that Cosmic Power Points or whatever.  Even if get a double turn afterwards my forces will most likely be crippled and ineffective much.  I've never beaten any Seraphon army, or this guy with any army, and sorely want to win or give him a good game at least. 

Any advice?  Haven't played this new mission yet, seems to favor a charging army.  I was considering also changing Battle Lust trait to Arch Sorcerer, but getting a KarkaLord a successful charge is great next the Knights.

[RocketPropelledGrenade]

I'd probably make the Sorcerers and Chosen Slaanesh marked instead. You lose the shooting protection from the banners, but I find the biggest losses to my chosen are usually either melee hammers or people with massive mortal wound dumps through spells (which the banner doesn't help with) like Tzeentch. Starborne are in the latter category, and their shooting is not as big a deal as it used to be.

Meanwhile, Sorcerers already have many spells they want to cast even before this season that I can't see them typically being able to cast the teleport without sacrificing something else valuable. Between Daemonic Power, Mystic Shield, the lore spells and now the Andtor spells, there just isn't room. And the Slaanesh mark helps the Sorcerers get around the board with the run bonus and lets them order the Chosen to have good mobility as well.

Can't speak as to the chariots, sort of intrigued by the idea, but also suspect any Chariot that rolls on EotG is gonna get blown to hell in short order before it can use it.

Cockatrice is super toxic, but it's not your fault it exists.

Other than that, looks solid?

 

 

I am eager to play in this season with my Cabalists once I figure out how to capitalize on the new points changes myself. I was running a lot of Endless Spells before, but I don't think they'll survive more than one hero phase with Primal Magic Dice for dispelling. On the plus side, I think Primal Magic dice are going to be huge for making our spellcasting ever harder to stop when necessary and (probably more importantly) shoring up our defensive weaknesses in the magic side of things.

If I'd known this was going to be how the season would shake out a few months ago, I might have been pushing more on getting my S2D painted for NOVA instead of falling back on my Soulblight again. I mean...I'm still super happy with the new Soulblight book (honestly glad they got nerfed--the meta chased my existing list this battletome go-around, and I don't like having everyone complain about me fielding an OP army when I didn't want to). But even so, Cabalists are super intriguing to me right now.

[Lord Krungharr]

Playing Game2 of my current League vs this OBR army soon. I don't even know what these guys do other than be very tanky, Katakros hands out commands to everyone or something? and Arkhan is a good wizard probably?

I'm running my Cabalists with 2 Karka Lords, 2 foot Sorcerers, 10 Nurgle Knights/Eroding, 10 Chosen who I might change to Slaanesh ( I marked them Tzeentch last time and they did ignor 1 spell vs Seraphon), 4 undivided chariots, and allied Cockatrice. Gonna give the KarkaLords Daemonic Speed as they need to be near the Knights and launch them.

Doing 2 Battle Regiments for low drops....or should I switch back to Warlord to get a 2nd banner for the Chosen? They are sooo slow, which is why I went Tzeentch originally to teleport them, but that requires magic which is tougher to get off these days, even with Cabalists.

Any advice? I can't switch out units really since the league has started but switching around spells and battalions and Marks should be okay.

[RocketPropelledGrenade]

They can also have very good rend, which can be dangerous to S2D. Multiple units with 2 or even 3 rend are pretty easy if they save the command points for it.

[Lord Krungharr]

Oh, man, that was the most brutal game I've played in a long time, way harder than vs the magic space-frogs (which I could have played better and been more aggressive I think).

Mission was Lines of Communication, and the OBR player had no problem getting all of his commands off even when going 2nd.  The mission favored him actually since he didn't really have to split his forces.  My Knights and Chosen took out his horses by end of the top of turn 2, but then just flopped vs the Immortis Guard and Stalkers plus Katakros.  I got almost all of my spells off even with massive Primal Magic battles, but it didn't help as much as I liked because we can't use Draw From Power for unbinding (which really really stinks). 

But the clutch rolls of the game I think were 2 Redeploys he did for 6" denying me the charge for my chariots and thus the turn 2 battle tactic I needed.  Also him being able to charge a unit at me anywhere on the table, not just at a unit that I used to charge, really boned me good a couple times too.  Mortis Praetorians was the subfaction.

The recursion for the Immortis/Stalkers/healing in general is waaaaay too good, much like Squigs, but better, AND those units kill everything.  The amount of free debuffs OBR can get is astounding and frankly unbalanced in a huge way.  I realize big K and Arkhan together are almost 1000 points, but the fancy skeletons are undercosted for what they do (compared to 3 Stormfiends for what, about 100 MORE points?!).

Ended 28-13.  Good fun game, but just over the top brutal.  Maybe if Mortarchs were 0-1 per army.  Soulblight could probably fit 3 in there.

[The_Tallest_Ork]

So I've been having a blast putting together some of the new Chaos kits, but the push-fit Knights are a major headache. Out of curiosity, can you run a somewhat viable list without them?

The core of footslogging smashy guys definitely needs a faster element to jump on objectives or disrupt the opponent's backline. Can Varanguard, Chariots, or some ally fill that role well enough? Or would knuckling up and finishing these fiddly guys be the only real solution?

[Lord Krungharr]

I also must admit I find my Knights very boring but I've been running them in a block of 10 and Nurgle.  And I also don't like those push-fit models, then pegs are always too tight, and with tiny bits sticking out all over, they always break for me.  Is it that hard to teach kids about super glue safely?  They still have to type in an 'old enough' key at Walmart when I buy the stuff, like I'm gonna drink it!  I digress....

Anyways, yes, I think Varanguard could provide a fast, durable, and killy unit to buy time for the Warriors to do the 2nd wave.  A chariot or 2 though is also great, and low cost for objective grabbing and weakling pestering...they're charge smash, if lucky, can often prove enough to take out small heroes or a random Warband.  I've also seen folks rave about the Corvus Cabal for deepstriking, and I think they're invisible if in terrain, and can fly if charging out of terrain.

For allies, the Cockatrice comes in handy but not really a great speedbump, though it is fast and flies; Cygor or Ghorgon could be good too, both a bit faster than Warriors, and do neat things.  Nurglings are super annoying and can deepstrike off of terrain; they require overkill, or I think all their wounds and possibly models just come back.  And while not speedy, a couple allied Skull Cannons of Khorne might provide some ranged support to give them something else to think about; and if they get in combat and kill something, they get to immediately shoot.

[Ekrund Oath Splitters]

On 7/16/2023 at 9:22 PM, JackStreicher said:

A Harbinger of decay is a priest.

If I ally one of them it should be able to choose a generic prayer, does it not? (The app won‘t let me)

 

Meaning curse and the likes. (My warshrine can’t choose either)

Allies don't get enhancements? So no prayer. Like I take a Thaumaturge in my slaves and he doesn't get a spell. 

[Lord Krungharr]

Hello fellow evildoers!  I'm once again fighting in the local League, and this Thursday's match is vs the Sylvaneth.  I've attached pics of the lists though I've altered mine to be just 2 battle regiments, and gone with SLaanesh non-general KarkaLord and Chosen (no banner on them).

I kinda know Sylvaneth and am wondering should I try to bait Durthu with the Knights?  I think they can handle him actually....and then make space to try and cram 4 chariots into him to avoid the ethereal save he'll have?  The terrain will be annoying, but if I'm not mistaken if I have a unit with 3" of the terrain he's near...can he not Strike'n'Fade then?  Alarielle I'd love to get rid of, maybe the Blizzard for her.  Cabalists should be able to get some spells off I hope.  Gonna be a weird game, any hints or ideas are appreciated!  I'm 0-2 so far (fought Kroak&Co game 1, then Katakros w Arkan and Immortis Guard, etc game 2, UGH).

[Agent of Chaos]

On 6/25/2023 at 12:33 PM, Lord Krungharr said:

T1-StD dropped first so chose to go first and move up towards the center objective to lock in the turn 2 control better.  Rolled on the Eye of the Gods table to get the BT, buffed up the Chosen to extremes w Daemonic Speed and Power, Mystic Shield, and Oracular Visions, then Warped Reality to teleport them across the table to the Eshin backfield....where they then charged 3D6+1"

Hate to be that guy but you have a few rules wrong here...

Warp Reality teleports a unit from anywhere to within 9" of the caster, not from within 9" of the caster to anywhere, so you can't teleport into their backfield unless your wizard somehow gets there in the hero phase before casting the spell. The only unit with the traditional teleport spell is Zarshia Bittersoul and she can only cast it on Khagra's Ravagers.

Secondly Daemonic Speed can only be cast on mounted units so Chosen cant benefit from it. Hence why most people run Chosen as Slaanesh for run & charge with +1/+2".

[Lord Krungharr]

Thank you for the corrections; I need to practice reading things more.  Alas, my Slaves lost again, this time vs Sylvaneth. 

Close game though in Nexus Collapse.  I (wrongly) teleported my BLizzard guy to try and nail Alarielle, but she healed everything in her turn.  Turn 2 he went into Durthu, and he later healed everything too.  Guess that wouldn't have happened at all had I read correctly.  The Speed I realized though, and didn't even matter much, as after the Knights plunged into the Dryads (who are AMAZINGLY tanky due to their debuffs), Durthu came in and whacked them apart despite being Eroding Nurgle Knights over a few rounds of combat.  I very very very nearly got the Bring Ruin to the Realms but lacked the heroes enough to make that 3 within 3" of an enemy tactic.  And I couldn't shut down his Grand Strat of battleline survival either cuz he of course could teleport his last 3 Dryads across the table.  My chariots were hanging in there until Alarielle took out two in one swoop (she can fly 16"!).  I held the Chosen back too much but shoulda run them up 6" turn 1 to the center and see where they needed to go.

2 more games in this quarter of the League.  Not looking forward to them.

[Agent of Chaos]

23 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

Thank you for the corrections; I need to practice reading things more.  Alas, my Slaves lost again, this time vs Sylvaneth. 

All good! If I recall correctly daemonic speed became mount only via FAQ so easy to miss. Also the reverse teleport spell is a new and frankly quite wierd mechanic from GW. So far I havnt seen anybody make it work. 

I guess the idea is to send out fast mounted units like knights or chariots to attack flanks, then use the spell to recall one of those units, slap the 3D6 charge spell on them and send them off in a direction your opponent didn't expect. Problem is they have to take the trash tzeentch mark to be eligible and it's such a niche use-case I just don't think it's worth using over more effective marks.

In the few games I tries my knights were all dead before the opportunity arose to recall them, if the situation even presented itself at all...

[JackStreicher]

5 hours ago, Agent of Chaos said:

All good! If I recall correctly daemonic speed became mount only via FAQ so easy to miss. Also the reverse teleport spell is a new and frankly quite wierd mechanic from GW. So far I havnt seen anybody make it work. 

I guess the idea is to send out fast mounted units like knights or chariots to attack flanks, then use the spell to recall one of those units, slap the 3D6 charge spell on them and send them off in a direction your opponent didn't expect. Problem is they have to take the trash tzeentch mark to be eligible and it's such a niche use-case I just don't think it's worth using over more effective marks.

In the few games I tries my knights were all dead before the opportunity arose to recall them, if the situation even presented itself at all...

I agree. Either your knights don't die and don't deal damage (nurgle mark + Banner), they maybe deal a little damage and die (Khorne, Slaanesh) or they don't do anything and die (Tzeentch) XD

Make Chaos Knights hit on 3s already

 

 

Edited August 24, 2023 by JackStreicher

[RocketPropelledGrenade]

13 hours ago, Agent of Chaos said:

All good! If I recall correctly daemonic speed became mount only via FAQ so easy to miss.

The errata was to the casting number. I'm pretty sure it was always mounted only.

[Lord Krungharr]

Chosen are so bloody slow, I think I liked it better when they were Tzeentch w the shooty-ward-save banner, and flung them up the field, though now only going 9" is pretty meh.  

If nobody buys my Chaos Dwarves Bull-Centaur Knights, I'll just make 1 more KarkaLords and run this list.  I think they can all run'n'charge then in there.  And I get to use my beloved Chaos Dwarves Lammasu!  

My Chariots are going to be moving back to Ogor country, since they're piloted by Ogor-Rhinos centaurs anyways....and get big ol' cannons slapped on there.

Allegiance: Slaves to Darkness
- Damned Legion: Knights of the Empty Throne
- Grand Strategy: Take What's Theirs
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Chaos Lord on Karkadrak (200)*
- General
- Artefact: The Conqueror's Crown
- Mark of Chaos: Khorne
Chaos Lord on Karkadrak (200)*
- Mark of Chaos: Khorne
Chaos Lord on Karkadrak (200)*
- Mark of Chaos: Khorne
Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Manticore (240)**
- Mark of Chaos: Tzeentch
- The Lore of the Damned: Chaotic Conduit
Chaos Sorcerer Lord (120)**
- Mark of Chaos: Tzeentch
- Lore of Primal Frost: Merciless Blizzard
Chaos Sorcerer Lord (120)**
- Mark of Chaos: Tzeentch
- Lore of Primal Frost: Hoarfrost

Battleline
5 x Chaos Knights (220)*
- Mark of Chaos: Khorne
- Ensorcelled Banner: The Banner of Rage
5 x Chaos Knights (220)*
- Mark of Chaos: Khorne
5 x Chaos Knights (220)**
- Mark of Chaos: Khorne
5 x Chaos Knights (220)**
- Mark of Chaos: Khorne

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Warlord

Total: 1960 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 0 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 109
Drops: 10
 

[Lord Krungharr]

FINALLY got a win with my StD army, and simultaneously my first win vs Seraphon!   Very gratifying.   He had kotals claw which cut my damage in half basically, and had a Slann, Skink star guy, lizard hero and aggridon hero, plus 2*3 aggros, 20 + 10 saurus warriors.   Mission geomantic pulse.  

-I gave him first turn and he moved up to the center line.   I did the same but couldn't quite reach his Aggros w my knights but crammed 4 chariots into his 10 warriors and got em down to 4,  chosen ran n charged into the 20 lizards and that combat lasted many rounds.   Chosen really sucked this game.  As they usually do.

-The knights held their own vs the aggro general and unit but then my Blizzard wizzard got the unit down to 1 wound which my karkaLord finished off.  But he failed to kill the general so failed Lust for Power after his knight incantor auto unbound my Chaotic Conduit previously.    karkaLords really kinda sucked this game too actually but mainly cuz of the Seraphon coalesced damage debuff.  

But at least I was able to achieve 3 tactics.  Had I realized I could have gotten the List for Power from Blizzarding a hero I coulda gotten my grand strategy.    Tried to do Champions if Chaos turn 5 but my karkaLord killed him in the charge so I could not have even charged w my last wiz in 11" which probably would have failed anyways.   End 24-12. 

I got a chariot to his pyramid to deny him the grand strat also, and unbound his magical dominance, and he only got 2 total tactics, plus couldn't keep on the objectives except the big block of saurus guys.  

Maybe I'll try the Chosen as allied SkullReapers instead, and see if I can fit in a whip guy.  Sold my Bull Centaurs, so will need another battleline unit if I stick with StD.

[Neverchosen]

Not sure if this appropriate to ask here, but I got the Slaves to Darkness army box in a trade but it came without building instructions. Is there a place online that I can find the building instructions for Ogroids, Demon Prince and Chosen?

I am really excited as this really fleshes out my collection but puts my army at 4000+ points... so hopefully we get an apocalypse style game for AOS. 

[Mazrick]

https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerInstructions/   has instructions for many warhamer models.   you can also email warhammer custommer service CustServ@gwplc.com   and ask for instructions.

[etlm1987]

I have a Slaves to Darkness list and I'm putting 30 warriors on the field. I wanted advice if I should stack one unit to have 20 warriors so more warriors get the encorcelled banner buff and they're easier to buff with magic, or if I should keep them separate in 3 groups of 10 so to better go after objectives. It's an important choice bc I am putting the kits together and I want to know if I'm making 3 banner men and musicians or just 2?

[DJJazzyFred]

What is the rest of your list?

[RocketPropelledGrenade]

On 12/8/2023 at 2:57 PM, etlm1987 said:

I have a Slaves to Darkness list and I'm putting 30 warriors on the field. I wanted advice if I should stack one unit to have 20 warriors so more warriors get the encorcelled banner buff and they're easier to buff with magic, or if I should keep them separate in 3 groups of 10 so to better go after objectives. It's an important choice bc I am putting the kits together and I want to know if I'm making 3 banner men and musicians or just 2?

You can have 1 banner and musician per 10 warriors regardless. Redundancy can be useful if you get caught out by something like a Mega Gargant grabbing and killing specific models.