AoS 2 - Hedonites of Slaanesh Discussion

[Carnith]

3 hours ago, Kasper said:

Have anyone tried Syll'esske or is it really that bad? What attack would you use first - The whp? Then rerolls on axe?

Syll'Esske likes to be in Invaders so that you get the command trait on a Keeper, but Syll can use their Command Ability. Also if you use the fane on Syll' then all of your attacks get rerolls! It's a win-win. But if you don't use the fane, then whip first, it's likely to hit and you want the reroll on the 4+ axe. 

Also if you use the Keeper's ability, then you go either Axe - Whip - Axe or Whip - Axe - Whip, which if that thats your plan, I think you want A - W - A for the higher rend potential, doublely so if you use the fane so you get 3 attacks all rerolls. 

[Enoby]

The Lord of Chaos all painted up for my narrative list

[Rock Lobster]

Finally got my keeper done, super happy with it, I have never tried blending colours before so I gave it a crack for the cloak to blend the red\pink blue and purple of my colour scheme together. I don’t know how people get it to look 100% smooth, but it’s the best I can do.

 

[Saiken]

@CB42 and @SwampHeart, would you guys mind sharing a picture of your armies ? Especially because I'm super interested in Slaanesh BoC, and I'd love to see how you guys integrated those units in your armies

 

[Dr.E]

So I got my first series of games with the new battletome. I'd like to share my experience with you. Please note that the atmosphere was quite casual and friendly rather than being competitive.

 

Game 1 vs Khornite Beastmen

The game was tilted in the very early stage for two reasons. First, my opponent brought a lot of bulgores that acted as a great DP source for me.  I actually summoned two keepers and an unit of three fiends while my opponent managed to summon the single blood thirster. Second, in this mission only heroes and casters could secure an objective. My opponent's list had only a few heroes and no casters. He fought to the last with an honor, but his army was tabled out in turn 3.

 

 

 

 

Game 2 vs Flesh Eater Courts

The army was something like 'endless ghouls'. The main force of my opponent was a unit of 40 ghouls with many bonuses (rerolling hits of 1, rerolling wounds, reviving, etc). This unit charged to 30 daemonettes in the early turn 2, which continued to the end of game. His dragon charged my Shalaxi, but locus'd, and then killed - he later said it was the biggest mistake in this game. Meanwhile, my keeper flied over the ghoul mobs (thanks to the thermalrider cloak) and then sniped at the ghoul king in the backyard. At the end of turn 3, he lost most units, except for the ghoul mob. However, that ghoul mob kept scoring with more numbers of models than mine. We tied 9:9 at the moment, and decided to cease the game as it was too late. I think the game would have been easier if I had sniped at his heroes earlier (I didn't know the FEC mechanism at that time).

 

All in all, I'm glad HoS finally became strong. I and my opponents all agreed that the locus of diversion was the biggest threat. The opponents hesitated to charge my units as they were afraid of being locus'd. Shalaxi was a real monster against enemy heroes as I expected first. I'm also very satisfied with the contorted epitome, espeically with its second opportunity of giving locus. I completely forgot to use the retreat-and-charge ability for all these games  Unless, both games would have been much easier.

 

If you are interested in more pics, please check the link in my signature. Thanks for your reading!

Edited June 9, 2019 by Dr.E

[Kramer]

On 6/8/2019 at 7:10 AM, Rock Lobster said:

Finally got my keeper done, super happy with it, I have never tried blending colours before so I gave it a crack for the cloak to blend the red\pink blue and purple of my colour scheme together. I don’t know how people get it to look 100% smooth, but it’s the best I can do.

 

A. Don’t sell yourself short, if that’s your first attempt you are halfway there. It looks amazing.

B. It’s practice, so good on you for starting 

[CB42]

On 6/8/2019 at 9:16 AM, Saiken said:

@CB42 and @SwampHeart, would you guys mind sharing a picture of your armies ? Especially because I'm super interested in Slaanesh BoC, and I'd love to see how you guys integrated those units in your armies

 

 

[swarmofseals]

Have any of you tried a list similar to this shell? It seems fairly obvious, so I'd be surprised if it hasn't been tried:

2x Keeper of Secrets

1x Soulfeaster Keeper of Secrets

1x Infernal Enrapturess

3x5 Hellstriders

Supreme Sybarites

 

That's 1640 points, leaving a couple of options for the last points:

• Fourth Keeper
• Contorted Epitome + Seeker Cavalcade
• Contorted Epitome + various endless spells

 

This would either be 2 or 4 drops depending on the configuration. Pretenders is obviously not an option, but either Invaders or Seekers could work. With Invaders you would pretty much not be bothering with the whole "3 generals" thing as you are planning to keep your characters mostly together, with the exception of the enrapturess who can sit further back with the fane. Playtesting would be needed in order to sort out if the enrapturess should be a general or not. IIRC the rules says you can select "up to 3" generals, so most of the time you will be picking 1 or 2 only.  The main advantages of Invaders is that it should be easier to trigger the DP gain and the list of artefacts and command traits is perhaps juicier. For command traits Best of the Best, Glory Hog and Skintaker all seem very solid. On the artefact side the Rod of Misrule and Icon of Infinite Excess are both very enticing. 

Seekers is fine too, with +1 charge always being nice. The problem here though is that the command traits are largely focused on making the general faster, which you don't necessarily want as you are trying to keep your characters relatively close together. The Threnedy Voicebox seems nice though, so it might be worth considering.

The basic idea behind the list is to mimic what the FEC Gristlegore lists do, to a certain extent. The power is less centered on a single model, though. Clearly no piece here is as strong as the AGKoTG. Beyond that though you have a core of very powerful heroes that can very often strike first in combat and deal a lot of damage. A single KOS with reroll 1's hits about half as hard as the AGKoTG benefitting from the archregent's +d3 attack spell. The regular Terrorgheists, however, are a lot worse than this list's behemoths. 

Beyond that, both lists benefit from summoning. The FEC list has the advantage of being able to do all of it's summoning right away while the Hedonites are generally going to be able to summon later on. That said, the ceiling on what the Hedonites can summon is also a lot higher than FEC, and there is no risk of having your summoning shut down on turn 1 by an opponent that can kill your archregents. 

Perhaps FEC just does what this list does but better, but this list certainly has some strengths that the FEC list doesn't have. It's more resilient against an alpha strike, it has a lot more magic and a lot more unbinding but it's also a lot less dependent on resolving key buff spells. You also have a very high quantity of very tough wizards that you aren't afraid to push forward for scenarios that rely on wizards/artefact holders for objectives.

If any of you have tried something like this I'd love to know how it went.

 

 

 

[zegan]

So just playing around with list building. I haven't done artifacts or spells yet, but list seems pretty nasty to me. What do you all think:

Archaon - general

KOS

KOS

Infernal enrapturess

Hellstriders x5

Hellstriders x5

Hellstriders x5

Supreme Sybarites

Points: 1940/2000

Edited June 10, 2019 by zegan

[Enoby]

4 hours ago, zegan said:

So just playing around with list building. I haven't done artifacts or spells yet, but list seems pretty nasty to me. What do you all think:

Archaon - general

KOS

KOS

Infernal enrapturess

Hellstriders x5

Hellstriders x5

Hellstriders x5

Supreme Sybarites

Points: 1940/2000

I don't think Archaon works too well for us; he's not a hedonite, so no locus, and his command ability does not work with our Keepers (nor can they affect him with their CA). Unfortunately he's not a great hero for us anymore. 

[Saiken]

@CB42 Thanks a lot ! Fantastic Army you have there ! 

Also, can you walk me through your choice of weapon for Ungors ? Why don't you use the shortspears ? 
Also, what do you think about the exalted chariot with herald in the context of this army ? 

[Magnus The Blue]

1 hour ago, Enoby said:

I don't think Archaon works too well for us; he's not a hedonite, so no locus, and his command ability does not work with our Keepers (nor can they affect him with their CA). Unfortunately he's not a great hero for us anymore. 

Yeah, I think you'd do better with 4 Keepers if you want to do a monster mash, 4 2+ loci mean you'll have great control of combat order and the combination of the Battalion, Invaders 'Gloy Seeker', Aetherquarts broach etc., you'll be able to do a lot of double activation.

[CB42]

3 hours ago, Saiken said:

@CB42 Thanks a lot ! Fantastic Army you have there ! 

Also, can you walk me through your choice of weapon for Ungors ? Why don't you use the shortspears ? 
Also, what do you think about the exalted chariot with herald in the context of this army ? 

The way I use Ungors, they have one of three purposes:

* Screening half the board against deep strike (ex: stringing them behind my lines for 72 inches to prevent FEC or stormcast from summoning behind me onto my objectives or to then charge Evocators into my forces from behind). The choice of sword or spears is irrelevant here.

* Screening against a charge and fighting back if they survive. Enough will die that any survivors can fight in two ranks, so the sword is better than the spear.

* I charge them across the board with Chronomantic Cogs up and a Great Bray Shaman boosting their movement to slam into a screening unit that is spread wide. Unless I double 1 the charge, I will be able to spread them out to fight in 2 ranks - enough that the sword is better than the spear.

 

As for a Bladebringer on Exalted Chariot, I’m considering adding one if I can free up the points, but I really love my 20 Seekers and I don’t want to drop them down to 30 Daemonettes.

 

Edited June 10, 2019 by CB42

[SwampHeart]

On 6/8/2019 at 8:16 AM, Saiken said:

@CB42 and @SwampHeart, would you guys mind sharing a picture of your armies ? Especially because I'm super interested in Slaanesh BoC, and I'd love to see how you guys integrated those units in your armies

 

Mine's a mishmash right now, I own a full BoC army painted like regular BoC (so lots of browns, grays, etc). However I've got a new collection of BoC specifically for my HoS that I'll be doing up with the new Contrast line so I can match my HoS models. 

 

3 hours ago, Saiken said:

Also, can you walk me through your choice of weapon for Ungors ? Why don't you use the shortspears ? 

@CB42 hit the nail on the head, clubs are better than spears. Spears are theoretically good but the 25mm base effectively cancels out the need for extra range on them. 

I started building some (more) Seekers this weekend, going to give the big unit of 20 a go sometime and see how they work out for me. 

Edited June 10, 2019 by SwampHeart

[Saiken]

Thanks guys, I got very inspired by both of your lists and stuff this weekend. 

And I finally started painting, hopefully the start of my Slaanesh army 

 

[Rock Lobster]

5 hours ago, Enoby said:

I don't think Archaon works too well for us; he's not a hedonite, so no locus, and his command ability does not work with our Keepers (nor can they affect him with their CA). Unfortunately he's not a great hero for us anymore. 

Agreed, for just a few points more you can get 2 Keepers. They have so much utility.

[Rock Lobster]

On 6/9/2019 at 7:40 AM, Kramer said:

A. Don’t sell yourself short, if that’s your first attempt you are halfway there. It looks amazing.

B. It’s practice, so good on you for starting 

Any tips on how do make that smoother, do people just do multiple additional layers to transition in, or do I need to look at wet palette and wet blending or something. I have heard this kind of thing is much easier with an airbrush but its difficult for me to conveniently set that  to work in my place with fumes etc.

[zegan]

5 hours ago, Enoby said:

I don't think Archaon works too well for us; he's not a hedonite, so no locus, and his command ability does not work with our Keepers (nor can they affect him with their CA). Unfortunately he's not a great hero for us anymore. 

 

3 hours ago, Magnus The Blue said:

Yeah, I think you'd do better with 4 Keepers if you want to do a monster mash, 4 2+ loci mean you'll have great control of combat order and the combination of the Battalion, Invaders 'Gloy Seeker', Aetherquarts broach etc., you'll be able to do a lot of double activation.

Thanks! I was thinking since he still had the Slaanesh and Hero keywords he would be able to drop a locus. And with 20 wounds and a decent save, he could generate a lot of depravity. But if he doesn't get that locus then I'd only be paying for the wounds. And you're right, better to just do two KOS at that point.

[Magnus The Blue]

Just now, zegan said:

Thanks! I was thinking since he still had the Slaanesh and Hero keywords he would be able to drop a locus. And with 20 wounds and a decent save, he could generate a lot of depravity. But if he doesn't get that locus then I'd only be paying for the wounds. And you're right, better to just do two KOS at that point.

Then the problem is converting up the keepers so you don't have 4 mono-pose models. Not an easy task, it's a great model but those legs are not easy to re-position. Thinking for converting up Marathi for my second Keeper (with Thermal-rider cloak) for this very reason.

[zegan]

1 minute ago, Magnus The Blue said:

Then the problem is converting up the keepers so you don't have 4 mono-pose models. Not an easy task, it's a great model but those legs are not easy to re-position. Thinking for converting up Marathi for my second Keeper (with Thermal-rider cloak) for this very reason.

Right? But some skill and green stuff can go a long way

[Rock Lobster]

11 minutes ago, Magnus The Blue said:

Then the problem is converting up the keepers so you don't have 4 mono-pose models. Not an easy task, it's a great model but those legs are not easy to re-position. Thinking for converting up Marathi for my second Keeper (with Thermal-rider cloak) for this very reason.

Have you considered alternate minis? The avatar of Shah from raging heroes is a really clear keeper of secrets and armed the same way - below is one of mine:

 

[Magnus The Blue]

1 minute ago, Rock Lobster said:

Have you considered alternate minis? The avatar of Shah from raging heroes is a really clear keeper of secrets and armed the same way - below is one of mine:

 

That is a sweet alternative, but not for me.  Warhammer World is my local gaming store, which is generally great, but I ain't going to rock up with alternative models when they provide such amazing free gaming facilities.

[Saiken]

24 minutes ago, Rock Lobster said:

Any tips on how do make that smoother, do people just do multiple additional layers to transition in, or do I need to look at wet palette and wet blending or something. I have heard this kind of thing is much easier with an airbrush but its difficult for me to conveniently set that  to work in my place with fumes etc.

To be fair, it's more a question of "what time are you wanting to put into this". Most minis with super smooth transition and blends are display pieces or painted for competition. It takes a long time, unless you're using an airbrush. 

Though , to get super smooth blend it's basically a mix of techniques such as wet blending, void blending, and again a lot of time and layers.
Vince Venturella explains it very well in this video.  Also It can be interesting to check his minis for inspiration because he plays slaanesh.

[CB42]

27 minutes ago, Magnus The Blue said:

Then the problem is converting up the keepers so you don't have 4 mono-pose models. Not an easy task, it's a great model but those legs are not easy to re-position. Thinking for converting up Marathi for my second Keeper (with Thermal-rider cloak) for this very reason.

My WIP Fulgrim that will be a Keeper of Secrets proxy. I used the new Abaddon model’s upper half (with the back of the helm cut off) with baby Morathi’s hair. Arms are Drachnyen and the Talon of Horus from Abaddon, Morathi’s spear, and a claw from a Fiend. Lots of green stuff was necessary to close gaps to get the back of the model to fit.

[Rock Lobster]

14 minutes ago, Magnus The Blue said:

That is a sweet alternative, but not for me.  Warhammer World is my local gaming store, which is generally great, but I ain't going to rock up with alternative models when they provide such amazing free gaming facilities.

Ah yes, I can see why that is an issue