AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion

[Grungnisson]

2 hours ago, Beliman said:

Not sure. Let's see how people abuse this rules and what it works. But there are some world teams that are already training with some Army of Renown lists.

Btw, Truggs with just one 5 on Malfunctioning Leystone and Fortified Cities of Sigmar builds are a direct counter to this army, but time will tell how good it is.

No amount of GW effort will prevent toxic competitive lists. But that's less than 1% of people in the hobby. Grand, and I mean GRAND majority of people play funhammer, with minis they already have, against friends with the same roster of armies. Personally, I blame THW Rob for blowing these issues waaaay out of proportion.

BUT! Let's wait and see how it actually pans out.

[Tizianolol]

Guys about new army of renown rules i think it seems very solid and competitive. We can still add khemist or admiral in our army and thats very very good , we lose fly hight and transport but we can move our thunderers more then 15" without portals or command abilities. I m theorycrafting a list with adimiral, 2 khemist , 2x15 thunderers , 4 little ships and its sound very good on paper.Remember we got an easy new grand strat and potentially 3 good battle tactics , i think overall we have a competitve choice when we are gonna building  a KO list!!😀

Edited September 23, 2023 by Tizianolol

[Beliman]

5 hours ago, Tizianolol said:

Guys about new army of renown rules i think it seems very solid and competitive. We can still add khemist or admiral in our army and thats very very good , we lose fly hight and transport but we can move our thunderers more then 15" without portals or command abilities. I m theorycrafting a list with adimiral, 2 khemist , 2x15 thunderers , 4 little ships and its sound very good on paper.Remember we got an easy new grand strat and potentially 3 good battle tactics , i think overall we have a competitve choice when we are gonna building  a KO list!!😀

That's exactly the same list that everybody is playing. My main issue about that list is that if it turns to be really good, we are going to see more points increase for units that are not that good unless you play exactly THAT list.

Gunhaulers are not that good unless you use them to move 15 gunhaulers. Thunderers are not that good unless you stack -2 rend or double-shot. Khemists are not that good if they don't have a blob of thunderers.

Let's see what happens, but I'm not a fan of this stuff.

Edited September 23, 2023 by Beliman

[Grungnisson]

Basically, in an ideal scenario, this would be a high flavour, low impact kind of list. Perfect for building narratives in your friendhammer games, useless in tournaments. 

[Beliman]

The Expedition Force is kicking the competitive scene. I've seen a bunch of top1 and a few top 2  and 3. It seems that the thunderers blob is scary enough to scratch the top tournaments.

I still think that our Army of Renown is horrible: meh lore, meh (but competitive) rules, and meh units to play.
That book was the perfect oportunity to remake Gunhauler's Warscroll and/or allow the Expedition Force to take a frigate or an Ironclad (we had one in the book). And the perfect timming to release a Grundstock captain hero if we are not going to have any new miniatures until 4.0.

[Tittliewinks22]

I know it's wishlisting, but I really hope whenever KO range expands we get a melee focused arkanaut company style unit.  Maybe riot shields and a one handed sky pike or something.

[Grungnisson]

Some feedback from FB:

[Beliman]

A top 3 KO without expedition force in a 24p tournament. Full melee with double ironclad+riggers+Brokk.

[Grungnisson]

2 hours ago, Beliman said:

A top 3 KO without expedition force in a 24p tournament. Full melee with double ironclad+riggers+Brokk.

We should say goodbye to all our friends again.

 

[Beliman]

On 10/22/2023 at 3:17 PM, Grungnisson said:

We should say goodbye to all our friends again.

 

61% winrate, but someone said that the Grundstock Expedition Force is over 80% winrate... fake!!

Imho, Thunderers shouldn't be able to go past 10 models. I'm not a fan of the Gunhauler taxi too, we already have Ironclads and Frigattes to move around troops and even the Dawnbringers book said that the Expedition Force had an Ironclad so..., and stop Special Weapons to do their damage without the Combat Landing. Another thing that shoudn't happen is the combination of special weapons + Khemist rend + double shoot.

As a wishlist, I still think it would be good if we follow Lumineth Temples: 1 Hero, 1 unit and 1 ship for each chartered company. The first one being the Grundstock Corps, we just need one hero to be ready to go: Grundstock Commander, Grundstock Thunderers and Grundstock Gunhaulers.

Edited October 24, 2023 by Beliman

[Grungnisson]

1 hour ago, Beliman said:

61% winrate, but someone said that the Grundstock Expedition Force is over 80% winrate... fake!!

Imho, Thunderers shouldn't be able to go past 10 models. I'm not a fan of the Gunhauler taxi too, we already have Ironclads and Frigattes to move around troops and even the Dawnbringers book said that the Expedition Force had an Ironclad so..., and stop Special Weapons to do their damage without the Combat Landing. Another thing that shoudn't happen is the combination of special weapons + Khemist rend + double shoot.

As a wishlist, I still think it would be good if we follow Lumineth Temples: 1 Hero, 1 unit and 1 ship for each chartered company. The first one being the Grundstock Corps, we just need one hero to be ready to go: Grundstock Commander, Grundstock Thunderers and Grundstock Gunhaulers.

I don't know... Maybe the issue here is maths. Just up the double shooting to the roll of 5+ and see what happens? _Could_ bring it down just enough.

[Beliman]

2 hours ago, Grungnisson said:

I don't know... Maybe the issue here is maths. Just up the double shooting to the roll of 5+ and see what happens? _Could_ bring it down just enough.

Yeah, maths are the main issue, followed by 4 easy tactics to accomplish. But to me, the main problem is the whole concept, it feels meh overall (even if it's really strong).

[Grungnisson]

That's not there to stay though, is it? The natural sequence of events now will be: KO has a one, single, bent build > KO gets nerfed into oblivion with army-wide changes > KO falls into disrepair > The following battletome still can't get things right...

[Beliman]

The last FAQ just removed any inconvenience from The Grundstock Expedition Force.

Trugg's army has a unique variable from the main leader. Pig-Jawz are meh but at least they have a unique mechanic that helps with Momentum+Flying charge. SCE has an improved interaction with dragons and a new character. Sylvaneth and Mawtribes have unique and really interesting mechanics.

But, both Duardin Armies of Renown are horrible. Our whole army is a spam-fest of Gunhaulers/Thunderers, without any fluffy mechanic appart from pew-pew-pew that we already have. And Fyreslayers just trades our double-tap for a bit more synergies with their droths/monsters.

 

[Rangeltoft]

Question: If you use "Command the Skies" and run & charge with a frigate, how does that work with the assault boat rule, can embarked units disembark and attack as normal?

 

/cheers Rangeltoft

[Beliman]

The frigatte can charge after run, and everything embarked on the frigatte "count" as they charged too, even if they didn't throw any charge roll. 

They still can't make a normal charge by themself because they "run" with the boat, so you can't disembark with the command and charge, but that's why you use the assault boat ability.

Btw, take in mind that they can't shoot after the boat run with them embarked.

[Rangeltoft]

8 minutes ago, Beliman said:

The frigatte can charge after run, and everything embarked on the frigatte "count" as they charged too, even if they didn't throw any charge roll. 

They still can't make a normal charge by themself because they "run" with the boat, so you can't disembark with the command and charge, but that's why you use the assault boat ability.

Btw, take in mind that they can't shoot after the boat run with them embarked.

Thanks, it was as i thought then.

The shooting part i do know, but was thinking about alpha strike with the 2d6 run amendent, Command the Skies and no reward without risk, the rest of the army can shoot away the screens.

[Beliman]

20 minutes ago, Rangeltoft said:

Thanks, it was as i thought then.

The shooting part i do know, but was thinking about alpha strike with the 2d6 run amendent, Command the Skies and no reward without risk, the rest of the army can shoot away the screens.

Yep. That's a good plan for an alpha strike. Good luck with your games!

[Rangeltoft]

3 hours ago, Beliman said:

Yep. That's a good plan for an alpha strike. Good luck with your games!

Thanks

But if my history with KO is any evidence, the game will be over one way or another at turn 2

[Beliman]

So, a friend asked for a list using the new Stormbringer collection. That means he will have:

• Grundstock Gunhauler
• Navigator
• 3 Skywardens/Endrinriggers
• 5 Grundstock Thunderers
• Admiral
• Endrimaster with Dirigible suit
• Bjorgen warband

He will not buy any Ironclad, but he is fine with the frigate. I'm not sure what to say, but I think that doubling the skyriggers and thunderers, and 2 frigates could be enough?

Something like:

• Frigate + Admiral + 10 thunderers
• Frigate + Endrinmaster with Dirigilbe suit + 6 Endringgers
• Navigator + 10 Vindictors

It's a 2 drop list (double Battle Regiment) with a bit of pew-pew and melee, and Battlelines can be easly filled by Ex-grundstock/ Barak-Zilfin. The list can use any artifact (Voidstone/ Bomblets/ Celestium Grenade) and can be played with Navigator/Stormcaller combo with Barak-Zilfin.

I would like to put Bjorgen as a generic Khemist, but not sure how. I think that the special weapons + Khemist is a basic key to understand Kharadrons.

What do you think? Is it a good starting point for Stormbringer collectors?

Edited December 23, 2023 by Beliman

[Beliman]

The last Battlescroll for AoS 3.0. Nice "additions" to our KOs...

I don't know what to say, our main problem is our Battle Tactics and Grand Strategies, not our points. At least a double Ironclad is -40p LOL

[libr4rian]

Why there is no Kharadron subforum (Or only I can't see it)

[Lord Krungharr]

On 2/16/2024 at 1:20 AM, Beliman said:

The last Battlescroll for AoS 3.0. Nice "additions" to our KOs...

I don't know what to say, our main problem is our Battle Tactics and Grand Strategies, not our points. At least a double Ironclad is -40p LOL

Do KO have a problem?  I see them winning games quite a bit, and the Woehammer stats have them at very high win rates (I know everytime I play them I get spanked).  They can go really far and then shoot like nobody else, or they can do that AND hop outta the boats and chop people up with their saws amazingly well too.  

[Satyrical Sophist]

18 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:

Do KO have a problem?  I see them winning games quite a bit, and the Woehammer stats have them at very high win rates (I know everytime I play them I get spanked).  They can go really far and then shoot like nobody else, or they can do that AND hop outta the boats and chop people up with their saws amazingly well too.  

Looking at Woehammer, the lists I see were changed a bit, but not much. One was 1990 and jumps to 2030, another goes from 1970 to 2030, another 1990 to 2050. A few get hit a bit more, 2000 on the nose to 2100, Most of them look like running the list is just dropping a unit of arkanauts or a character. In return they get what looks like a relatively easy to score battle tactic. I thought KO battle tactics and GS were already very solid? Rule the skies seems very good.

[Beliman]

1 hour ago, Lord Krungharr said:

Do KO have a problem?  I see them winning games quite a bit, and the Woehammer stats have them at very high win rates (I know everytime I play them I get spanked).  They can go really far and then shoot like nobody else, or they can do that AND hop outta the boats and chop people up with their saws amazingly well too.  

Not sure if it should be called "problem", but our BT and GS are easy enough that they carry most of our games. Btw, our shooting is not that great (points for output), appart from that one time when we use an artifact, footnote, CP,  ammunition and khemist (most of them are once-per-game buff).