AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion

[stato]

8 hours ago, High Overlord Xenu said:

That's what the formation is for - to allow me to control opening initiative. I'm pretty sure I took top of 1 every time, though I fought a lot of fast armies. If I could deploy in such a way as to keep my assets out of the enemy threat radius, I would give them top of 1 in a bid to gain a double turn.

With Mhornar you can play the opponent a bit to let you take second turn, you just need to remind them of your potential threat range and how much damage your skyhooks could do.  Drop your first unit in the center and they then panic deploy on the back line to keep out of range turn one... then you give them the turn ?.  Its a great way to keep magic out your face for a few turns as all their casters are out of range.  As you say though, if the opponent is fast it can be risky as they can possibly still get to you or at least take objectives and it can be hard to take them back.  Playing KO different ways is good fun though.   Well done on your tournament results.

[stratigo]

The funny thing about Luc, he literally changed his army a week before NOVA, bought a nighthaunt army and painted it in a week. Until that he was practicing with Dreadwood alpha strike list. I still don’t know what he was thinking, but he is a great player who probably would have done better had he more time to practice

[High Overlord Xenu]

1 hour ago, stratigo said:

The funny thing about Luc, he literally changed his army a week before NOVA, bought a nighthaunt army and painted it in a week. Until that he was practicing with Dreadwood alpha strike list. I still don’t know what he was thinking, but he is a great player who probably would have done better had he more time to practice

Oh undoubtedly. Was probably the most strategically intense games I played at the tournament. Like I said, I feel I mostly got lucky, and felt like dogshit when I saw how disappointed he was. 

[Stevinacan]

Sorry to keep barraging you with questions on how your list works but I'm starting my first AOS army  and am going KO and am going to mirror your list with a few minor changes to keep that fluff flavor.

 

But if I understand the general theory right you are basically just dropping 1 Frigate and that your only set up drop until you Last Word the 2nd frigate basically guaranteeing you turn 1? The only question I have is how do you fit 30 arkanaunts into 2 frigates? Can you split the squad 5 into one and 5 into the other? 

 

Thank you again for the help

Edited September 4, 2018 by Stevinacan

[wanderingrogue]

16 hours ago, Hannibal said:

Thanks for your thoughts and insights. Highly appreciate it. 

 

But what does "clown car" mean?

clown car is the jargon name for the ko list that was actually really good untill the 3rd attempted fix via faq FINALY gutted the faction in to oblivion.

i coined it early days cos your shoved as many models as you could in a single ironclad and then ziflin  moved and dumped a bazillion endrins in the enemys lines all getting out the same transport. much like a circus clown car

[High Overlord Xenu]

2 hours ago, Stevinacan said:

Sorry to keep barraging you with questions on how your list works but I'm starting my first AOS army  and am going KO and am going to mirror your list with a few minor changes to keep that fluff flavor.

 

But if I understand the general theory right you are basically just dropping 1 Frigate and that your only set up drop until you Last Word the 2nd frigate basically guaranteeing you turn 1? The only question I have is how do you fit 30 arkanaunts into 2 frigates? Can you split the squad 5 into one and 5 into the other? 

 

Thank you again for the help

The Iron Sky Squadron warscroll battalion consists of 2-9 Arkanaut Companies and 2-9 Frigates. The Arkanauts and Frigates are all part of the same battalion, so they can be dropped at the same time if desired. Due to transport rules, you can opt to deploy units inside the frigates. These also count as one drop. So if I were going to do a one-drop (again, space out your drops if possible while still guaranteeing 1st turn initiative), it would usually go like this.

 

Declare deployment of the Iron Sky Squadron.

Frigate 1 carries Company 1, Khemist, Navigator

Frigate 2 carries Company 2, Brokk, Endrinriggers (Brokk and Endrinriggers also do not count against transport capacity due to Hitchers rule)

Company 3 deployed for maximum effect, either to claim an objective or maneuver into sniping position. 

 

Because the three units physically on the board at the start of turn 1 are all part of the battalion, this can be done as a single drop.

[Nicholunch]

@High Overlord Xenuand and others, how many drops are you seeing with other tournament armies?

Edited September 5, 2018 by Nicholunch

[stratigo]

2 hours ago, Nicholunch said:

@High Overlord Xenuand and others, how many drops are you seeing with other tournament armies?

fairly low. 1 to 4 usually. Battalions are often too good not to take

[BWG Cannonball]

I was typically seeing 1 or 2 drop at the tournament or, forgoing that, huge lots of multi-drop with the expectation they were probably going to go second.

[Dherin]

Hey, 

Been lurking about a bit, reading many thoughts through this thread and have to agree. KO are in a bad spot.

 

When I look at the buffs and rerolls and extra wounds and all of the happy horse ****** GW gave armies like Fish boys, and we are worried about what a Khemist does that might unbalance our army, KO need a serious overhaul, a new battletome, some new units and the existing units need to be seriously tweaked to at least be on par with many of the new armies in AoS.

 

There, that is my first post and while it was a bit of a rant, I can now move on to more constructive conversations.

 

Cheers!

[Stevinacan]

1 hour ago, Dherin said:

Hey, 

Been lurking about a bit, reading many thoughts through this thread and have to agree. KO are in a bad spot.

 

When I look at the buffs and rerolls and extra wounds and all of the happy horse ****** GW gave armies like Fish boys, and we are worried about what a Khemist does that might unbalance our army, KO need a serious overhaul, a new battletome, some new units and the existing units need to be seriously tweaked to at least be on par with many of the new armies in AoS.

 

There, that is my first post and while it was a bit of a rant, I can now move on to more constructive conversations.

 

Cheers!

here here

[Nick907]

Some things could be done better but I don't think it's all doom and gloom. The force is appealing in playstyle and appearance and can at least put up a fight in most cases. 

Edited September 9, 2018 by Nick907

[GlanceOnASix]

Ill be breaking my KO out for a small event in a couple weeks till I can get my other army projects painting going (darn World of Warcraft being a time vampire).  Wanted to share, as I feel its a decent list (Sylvaneth are gonna give me nightmares, but they did that with any KO list once they got LOS blocking woods).

Bringing the Boys:
Urbaz - No Trading with Some People
Life Realm

Kemist
General - Stickler for the Code
Aethersight Loupe

Kemist
Verdant Mantle

Auric Runesmiter

40x Arkanaut Company
10x Arkanaut Company
10x Arkanaut Company
20x Vulkite Berzerkers

9x Endrinriggers - 3x Drillcannons
3xSkywardens - 1x Drillcannon, 1xVolly
3xSkywardens - 1x Drillcannon, 1xVolly

2k on the nose

[Lossen]

SkyPort: Barak-Urbaz

There's no trading with some people

Realm : Ulgyr

LEADERS :

Endrinmaster (120) - General , Artf: Hammer of aethermatic might

Aether-Khemist (160) Artf: Rockjaws

Knight-Incantor (140)

UNITS :

10 x Arkanaut Company (120) -3 x Skypikes

10 x Arkanaut Company (120) - 3 x Light Skyhooks

10 x Arkanaut Company (120) - 3 x Aethermatic Volley Guns

9 x Endrinriggers (360)  - 3 x Drill Cannon 

20 x Grundstok Thunderers (400) - All Rifles

WAR MACHINES:

Arkanaut Ironclad (420) Endrinwork: Breath of Morgrim 

ENDLESS SPELLS

Celestian Vortex (40)

TOTAL: 2000/2000

 

With this list i manage to grap my self a 3'rd place in a small tournement (18 people) in Norway. King in the North (Kitn).

i even managed to down Nagash in my finale game^^ really close call.

I believe KO can be strong, if played right, but i really lack a stronger frontline. used my Ironclad as a wall, but it wont last forever.

Edited September 12, 2018 by Lossen

[Storm]

As someone who is new to KO, what upgrades are good on endrinriggers and skywardens? 

[Nick907]

6 hours ago, Storm said:

As someone who is new to KO, what upgrades are good on endrinriggers and skywardens? 

Depends on what you want them to do. Most people equip Riggers with saws and use the Khemist ability to augment them. A Lot of people also mix in Grapnels in order to move around the board faster. I like the Riggers mainly for their Repair ability, so I'm running units of three equipped with a saw on the Missenmaster, volleygun and Drill cannon. My Endrinriggers hangout by the Ironclad to repair damage and shoot support-fire into enemy units. 

I wouldn't recommend Skywardens, but I think they do a little better in melee if you don't intend to use any augmentations from the Khemist. The Khemists ability is a huge deal for KO, most units have options that are better with an augmentation or better without an augmentation.  A unit of Company with Volleyguns will do more damage then a unit with Light Skyhooks, unless you augment, then the skyhooks are much better. Since you'll likely have more units then you can augment per turn, it is good to pick some units to have the 'better without augmentation' equipment. 

[Badlander86]

On 9/12/2018 at 7:04 PM, Lossen said:

SkyPort: Barak-Urbaz

There's no trading with some people

Realm : Ulgyr

LEADERS :

Endrinmaster (120) - General , Artf: Hammer of aethermatic might

Aether-Khemist (160) Artf: Rockjaws

Knight-Incantor (140)

UNITS :

10 x Arkanaut Company (120) -3 x Skypikes

10 x Arkanaut Company (120) - 3 x Light Skyhooks

10 x Arkanaut Company (120) - 3 x Aethermatic Volley Guns

9 x Endrinriggers (360)  - 3 x Drill Cannon 

20 x Grundstok Thunderers (400) - All Rifles

WAR MACHINES:

Arkanaut Ironclad (420) Endrinwork: Breath of Morgrim 

ENDLESS SPELLS

Celestian Vortex (40)

TOTAL: 2000/2000

 

With this list i manage to grap my self a 3'rd place in a small tournement (18 people) in Norway. King in the North (Kitn).

i even managed to down Nagash in my finale game^^ really close call.

I believe KO can be strong, if played right, but i really lack a stronger frontline. used my Ironclad as a wall, but it wont last forever.

 

Nice. Did the Drill Cannons manage to inflict Mortal Wounds on anyone? You buffed them along with the Rifles? I'd drop Breath of Morgrim for The Last Word though since as you say, the Ironclad is going to be your wall at will inevitably draw a lot of hate and charges. 8 shots on each charge (re-rolling 1s if you use Make Every Shot Count) would certainly help to thin out the swarms or mobs coming at you.

[Lossen]

58 minutes ago, Badlander86 said:

 

Nice. Did the Drill Cannons manage to inflict Mortal Wounds on anyone? You buffed them along with the Rifles? I'd drop Breath of Morgrim for The Last Word though since as you say, the Ironclad is going to be your wall at will inevitably draw a lot of hate and charges. 8 shots on each charge (re-rolling 1s if you use Make Every Shot Count) would certainly help to thin out the swarms or mobs coming at you.

Ye i used the Endringgers as flanking, to do some MW with Drill cannons.

When the frontline  got stalled into my Ironclad, i used Endringgers for Objective taking ,Or pew pew from afar for run and gun.

They also function as Finish killer, at hero's that was out of reach. assuming they will survive the charge.

 

PS: really good point on the "Last Word", thought of it, but i some how forgot ;(

 

Edited September 17, 2018 by Lossen

[Storm]

Before i start building the ships how reliable are the flying stands? Would i need to support them with additional things?

[Lossen]

51 minutes ago, Storm said:

Before i start building the ships how reliable are the flying stands? Would i need to support them with additional things?

My frigate stands nicely on the Standy, even without clue.

But my Ironclad , i used a extra Pillar for the shattered dominion bases, and the anker in front as extra support.

[Enoby]

My brother plays Kharadron, and he's feeling pretty dissapointed with them and their battletome. He loves the models and doesn't want to start a new army, but would like to not get beaten every time he plays. He often plays against Moonclan, Slaanesh, Stormcast, and Nighthaunt/LoN.

Does anyone have advice for a Kharadron list that's good enough to successfully use in a casual setting and not lose all the time? 

[stato]

27 minutes ago, Enoby said:

My brother plays Kharadron, and he's feeling pretty dissapointed with them and their battletome. He loves the models and doesn't want to start a new army, but would like to not get beaten every time he plays. He often plays against Moonclan, Slaanesh, Stormcast, and Nighthaunt/LoN.

Does anyone have advice for a Kharadron list that's good enough to successfully use in a casual setting and not lose all the time? 

Be a good idea to show an example of what he would normally run or any suggestions might be lists that would need loads of new models.

[Enoby]

32 minutes ago, stato said:

Be a good idea to show an example of what he would normally run or any suggestions might be lists that would need loads of new models.

Afaik, he has at least one copy of every model. He tends to run:

-3 units of the regular battleline (each unit has 3 of a unique weapon - one with skypikes, one with sky hooks, one with the rapid fire guns)

-1 units of 3 skywardens

-1 unit of 3 endrinriggers 

-Brokk (the named character)

-1 ironclad

-1 frigate 

-2 gun haulers

-1 chemist 

-1 endrinmaster 

Though he switches units around, and sometimes uses thunderers and a navigator. 

[Lossen]

22 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Afaik, he has at least one copy of every model. He tends to run:

-3 units of the regular battleline (each unit has 3 of a unique weapon - one with skypikes, one with sky hooks, one with the rapid fire guns)

-1 units of 3 skywardens

-1 unit of 3 endrinriggers 

-Brokk (the named character)

-1 ironclad

-1 frigate 

-2 gun haulers

-1 chemist 

-1 endrinmaster 

Though he switches units around, and sometimes uses thunderers and a navigator. 

as i see it, hes still need to run bigger unites. so he get bigger hits with the khemist buff. could be a good start

[Lord Veshnakar]

1 hour ago, Enoby said:

Afaik, he has at least one copy of every model. He tends to run:

-3 units of the regular battleline (each unit has 3 of a unique weapon - one with skypikes, one with sky hooks, one with the rapid fire guns)

-1 units of 3 skywardens

-1 unit of 3 endrinriggers 

-Brokk (the named character)

-1 ironclad

-1 frigate 

-2 gun haulers

-1 chemist 

-1 endrinmaster 

Though he switches units around, and sometimes uses thunderers and a navigator. 

At this point I would personally recommend dropping the boats and spending more points on Endrinriggers, Thunderers, or Skywardens (though most KO players will tell you not to use Skywardens, I like them).  I am sure he likes the boats from an aesthetics standpoint (we all do  )  but in most of my lists they struggle to make their points back. The one thing the boats should be good at is as a firing platform (but with usually 4+ to hit they are unreliable at best), and to give mobility and to help capture objectives but Endrinriggers/Skywardens are equally as good at capturing objectives too with the grappling launchers.  The only thing my Ironclad is usually good at is drawing all of the opponents attention. Less experienced players spend way too much time worrying about bringing it down leaving you open to focus controlling the rest of the board. Lossen's list above is a great compromise though.

Edited September 17, 2018 by Lord Veshnakar