Chikout Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 The solution to the Duardin problem is to buff their magic resistance. Give every Duardin hero the Barack Nar ability which let's them unbind, and change Barack Nar to give +1 to unbinds and +2 to navigators. Khorne could get a 6+ ward save against magic attacks. This would be fluffy and minimise the imbalances created by improved magic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karol Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 1 hour ago, kozokus said: Consider the fact that stormcasts are having sorcerers. As everyone is friend with SCE, Order has magic. Basically, every faction has access to magic, at least in allies. I don't know, but why play those magicless factions at all, if the edition focus is so skewed to magic users. . A single mage will not be efficient enough to counter or cast stuff. So people will be forced to buy more, and at some point it is just better to ditch the magicless faction and buy in to the one that works. It feels like some of those free mobile games that give you a free hero at 1*, but you actually want him at 6*, and you have to buy his or her upgrade pack with rea l money. And the fact that everyone is going to have to buy extra units to summon makes it feel even more so Am also not sure what people who plays army X for eshetic are suppose to do. It would be like playing a khorn army with a LoC in it seems wrong to me. Quote Khorne could get a 6+ ward save against magic attac Isn't the problem with the big spells that after the initial cast, the only ones who can unbind or use it are those with the wizard trait? You would really have to have either a much higher bonus to always stop the big spell, or 4-5 unbinds from one guy for this to work. And I don't think GW wants people to not buy those spell models, so the auto unbind won't happen, I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralZero Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 If you don't have magic, you have more killing stuff elsewhere! We'll see the imbalance soon with the GH2018. BTW, I'll also try my SCE with no magic (maybe with heavy hitter and/or shooters like the new balista!) against my death with magic. Challenging and fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karol Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 But you can say that about all armies, at least the good ones. All of them have killy stuff. The difference is that armies with magic now can summon units for free, and get to cast more spells, use realm traits etc. Fun is a subjective thing, and each person can find different things fun. But it seems like armies with magic to have a very big advantage on their side, and we haven't seen any mechanics that would effectivlly limit those advantages. This is specially strong for smaller games. I don't have a 2000pts army yet, and if my opponent will suddenly get a free treeman every game, I do not know how I could balance it. Specially as blades of Khorn army focus didn't show any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xasz Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 21 minutes ago, Chikout said: Khorne could get a 6+ ward save against magic attacks. This would be fluffy and minimise the imbalances created by improved magic. Way too weak, considering Khorne's current magic defense is about on par with the rest. (Bloodsecrator is the only one special, but doesn't help against medium or strong wizards and has anti-synergy with allied wizards) While still sacrificing magic of their own, shooting and defensive options. (Blood Tithe is too situational, Brazen Rune is not unique and so on) A faction wide ability to deny debuff/damage on a roll (similar to Skullcrushers but not on a 4+ and encompassing debuffs) would be great. Or dispel attempts from any friendly source are buffed by + 1 to 3 if the target has the Khorne keyword. (this could also be tied to the amount of Khorne units in range x) Overall, the potential anti-magic faction, doesn't feel anti-magic at all, which is frustrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageBoss Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 45 minutes ago, Sigwarus said: Oh, I have seen the change and recognized the impact for nagash. But now one endless spell makes it possible for rerolls to all saves. Rerollable 3+ (or 4+ if rend) will save him. But sure I've seen it and it is something. You will really have to kill nagash in this edition. Rerolls happen before modifiers, so even with rend he only rerolls 1s and 2s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJetski Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 55 minutes ago, Imperial said: 15 faction focus and only 1 about desctruction Why does this matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infeston Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 8 minutes ago, PJetski said: Why does this matter It matters for Destruction players a lot. At least for every Destruction player who is not playing Ironjawz. Because we are scared that GW as always will forget about us. It's not like it hasn't happened before. We Destruction players fear that we will be forgot wihin the faction focus, which would mean that GW did no signifant adjustments to BCR for example (which I was hoping for, because they are in a bad position right now). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralZero Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 KO now https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/28/28th-may-faction-focus-kharadron-overlordsgw-homepage-post-3/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayple Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, Infeston said: Because we are scared that GW as always will forget about us. It's not like it hasn't happened before. We Destruction players fear that we will be forgot with the faction focus, which would mean that GW did no signifant adjustments to BCR for example (which I was hoping for, because they are in a bad position right now). Let's not forget that Death was in a similar (or worse) position. Look at them now I don't think destruction will be forgotten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperial Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 19 minutes ago, PJetski said: Why does this matter Because grand alliance of destruction have only one competitive army now! Many destruction players wait at least SOME information about future changes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infeston Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, GeneralZero said: KO now https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/28/28th-may-faction-focus-kharadron-overlordsgw-homepage-post-3/ Cool. The Grundstok Gunhauler is now reduced to 160 points. And all the other ships "received similar point drops". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Lyons Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 14 minutes ago, GeneralZero said: KO now https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/28/28th-may-faction-focus-kharadron-overlordsgw-homepage-post-3/ Article showed: KO still only have 1 battleline unit. They need allies or realm items to deal with magic . Ships have gone down some in cost (not surprising considering the previously 220 point, now 160 point gunhauler, does 1.6 wounds on average per shooting phase). Someone can't do math. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperial Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 14 minutes ago, Mayple said: Let's not forget that Death was in a similar (or worse) position. Realy? In my club death wipe out ALL armies what we have w/o any problem now. Before we can play 3-4 turn and now 1-2.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuroyume Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 At this point I think we can be pretty sure point costs in general are going down. Pretty much every faction focus has entioned points reductions of some sort or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJetski Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 7 minutes ago, Infeston said: Because we are scared that GW as always will forget about us. It's not like it hasn't happened before. We Destruction players fear that we will be forgot with the faction focus, which would mean that GW did no signifant adjustments to BCR for example (which I was hoping for, because they are in a bad position right now). How did you manage to type all that and not realize that it was completely irrational? GW is not going to do anything that isn't in their best interest of making more money. It doesn't make sense to deliberately ignore a huge part of their model line and alienate their playerbase. The number of faction focus articles from each grand alliance is not indicative of anything except the number of factions from each grand alliance. You are creating a fictional villain from the result of market trends and internal production decisions made 2+ years ago, and pretending to be some kind of victim so you can... obtain pity from people on internet? You are only harming yourself with this line of thinking. This is more abrasive than my usual posting but it's not meant as a personal attack against you 4 minutes ago, Imperial said: Because grand alliance of destruction have only one competitive army now! Many destruction players wait at least SOME information about future changes... Why does the grand alliance matter...? I really don't understand this mentality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainNippon Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 "If your army hails from Chamon" - a good way to boost your anti-magic capabilities. This is the second time realm-specific armies are mentioned. It seems like we get to pick a realm indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJetski Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, Thomas Lyons said: Article showed: They need allies to deal with magic. The article specifically mentioned that navigators can still help you deal with magic... The most interesting thing from this article is this line:"the Alchemical Chain artefact – available to ANY army that hails from Chamon" This seems to imply that you can choose a realm for your army to hail from, and get those realm-specific bonuses. I hope that's the case! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralZero Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 "The Grundstok Gunhauler is now 160 points, 80 (!) less than its previous cost in 2017" Is it enough to make this tiny yet pretty ship efficient/good choice? Point reduction for frigate can be interesting because of the transport ability, but the lilly ship on the other hand...? I'm not good enough on KO to say. Can a KO player give some insight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infeston Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 10 minutes ago, PJetski said: How did you manage to type all that and not realize that it was completely irrational? GW is not going to do anything that isn't in their best interest of making more money. It doesn't make sense to deliberately ignore a huge part of their model line and alienate their playerbase. The number of faction focus articles from each grand alliance is not indicative of anything except the number of factions from each grand alliance. You are creating a fictional villain from the result of market trends and internal production decisions made 2+ years ago, and pretending to be some kind of victim so you can... obtain pity from people on internet? You are only harming yourself with this line of thinking. Wait. Okay. I never said that? ? Now you are making assumptions based on one sentence I wrote. I don't find this fear to be irrational. We are talking about a models which are underrepresented at events and have received no real update even before the GHB2017. Also GW did nothing to really fix some of the balance issues with these Destruction factions and most of the "updates" for Destruction factions (except Ironjawz) often felt kind of lazy. So I am only adding things up. I also don't see myself as a victim. I am just stating what I fear might happen. And I don't see me harming myself in any way. ? Maybe tomorrow we will get a BCR faction focus. But the fact that every other faction received more than one focus and Destruction received only one makes me sceptical. And we as Destruction players are used to these kind of changes. I can also ask this in a different way if you don't like the grand alliance mentality: Where is the Faction Focus: BCR? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigwarus Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 On 5/20/2018 at 8:10 PM, Sigwarus said: KO will be fine. We're looking at massive point reduction on the overpriced ships. And about shooting. Nothing really changes. Just focus on the units first. The army can still shoot the opposition to peaces in a few turns. Well, well, well. I think I was very right about the KOs in the coming edition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gecktron Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, GeneralZero said: "The Grundstok Gunhauler is now 160 points, 80 (!) less than its previous cost in 2017" Is it enough to make this tiny yet pretty ship efficient/good choice? Point reduction for frigate can be interesting because of the transport ability, but the lilly ship on the other hand...? I'm not good enough on KO to say. Can a KO player give some insight? 80 points drop on the Gunhauler looks good but I have to test it to say for sure. A point drop for the frigate may bring it from sub-par to great. The Ironclad has been great before and will now be even better! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chikout Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 The Ko article was a bit disappointing. A big drop to the gunhauler's price is one of the most obvious changes to make. I am surprised they haven't made thunderers battleline, it would make the start collecting set a much more worthwhile purchase. Regarding destruction, it seems likely that we will get their faction focuses alongside the combat rules previews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageBoss Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 6 minutes ago, PJetski said: How did you manage to type all that and not realize that it was completely irrational? GW is not going to do anything that isn't in their best interest of making more money. It doesn't make sense to deliberately ignore a huge part of their model line and alienate their playerbase. The number of faction focus articles from each grand alliance is not indicative of anything except the number of factions from each grand alliance. You are creating a fictional villain from the result of market trends and internal production decisions made 2+ years ago, and pretending to be some kind of victim so you can... obtain pity from people on internet? You are only harming yourself with this line of thinking. This is more abrasive than my usual posting but it's not meant as a personal attack against you Why does the grand alliance matter...? I really don't understand this mentality. Actually, that is exactly what GW has done repeatedly throughout their history. Look at how many releases Space Marines get over any given time frame. Now look at how many releases Dark Eldar, or Necrons, or really just about anything else gets. Much of their release scheduling has classically revolved around a self fulfilling cycle of more releases for a faction -> more sales for that faction -> more releases for that faction. And the inverse for less focused on factions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Lyons Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 4 minutes ago, GeneralZero said: "The Grundstok Gunhauler is now 160 points, 80 (!) less than its previous cost in 2017" Is it enough to make this tiny yet pretty ship efficient/good choice? Point reduction for frigate can be interesting because of the transport ability, but the lilly ship on the other hand...? I'm not good enough on KO to say. Can a KO player give some insight? No. They do an average of 1.6 wounds per shooting phase and have the melee capabilities of warmachine crew. And a 5+ save. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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