Sadysaneto Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Gotta say im really disapointed with moonclan Grots went up 10 pts, and get discount at 60 models. thing is - Almost nobody fielded many 40 grots units, i don´t see how we´ll be able to field 60 now. Oh, and Mind you, the discounted cost for 60 grots now is the same as the full costo for 60 grots in ghb16, So, yeah... grot wartboss (on/off squig) went up 40 points 4o points!!!! . Eeesh... shaman went up 20. Fanatics went from 30 each for units of 30, with an increase of 10 points in total. all in all, i hate to be that guy, but i really can´t see any improvement on moonclan. Actually, imo, it got even harder to field a good list of moonclan. Really disapointed. And sorry for the rant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheriff Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 I would love to have a unit of 40 grots but would only afford that if I was using Moonclan allegiance with a hopper-heavy list, allowing just one big unit of grots. My plan for the army hasn't really changed as a result of this stuff, as I like including way more than 200/400 points of allies, in fact I would need about 1000 points of allies Trolls are cheaper which is nice, but the list price still goes up overall. I'm happy to pay the fanatic tax as they are just so great. I get the feeling that every army price is going up across the main tournament factions, so not bothered really as its not an increase relatively. It just means that the factions never seen until now get a boost in price efficiency, which can only be a good thing. I'm going to go Spiderfang general and arachnarok for the buff-stacking which seems allowed still, getting all my damage focused from the spider riders (about 800 points of Spiderfang in total). Then the standard 3 units of Moonclan grots with 3 fanatics are my defensive line. 3 Rockgut trolls positioned by the netters for tanky pukey fun. Leaves me with enough remaining points for a shaman plus small unit of hoppers for objective ninjaring, OR a mangler. As much as I would love to go full Moonclan with a carnival of squigs, I just MUST have spiders and trolls because I like the look of them too much. Plus, the absense of allegiance abilities makes the decision to not have Moonclan allegiance very easy. I'm hoping we see more squig-hopper warboss generals now, with that cool mobility and attack buff for hoppers that was underrated imho. In theory its on par with the other options available, and superior if you bring a large number of hoppers to the table. Will have to wait and see what other general command traits become available in the book... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadysaneto Posted August 21, 2017 Author Share Posted August 21, 2017 12 minutes ago, Sheriff said: I would love to have a unit of 40 grots but would only afford that if I was using Moonclan allegiance with a hopper-heavy list, allowing just one big unit of grots. My plan for the army hasn't really changed as a result of this stuff, as I like including way more than 200/400 points of allies, in fact I would need about 1000 points of allies Trolls are cheaper which is nice, but the list still goes up overall. I'm happy to pay the fanatic tax as they are just so great. I'm going to go Spiderfang general and arachnarok for the buff-stacking which seems allowed still, getting all my damage focused from the spider riders (about 800 points of Spiderfang in total). Then the standard 3 units of Moonclan grots with 3 fanatics are my defensive line. 3 Rockgut trolls positioned by the netters for tanky pukey fun. Leaves me with enough remaining points for a shaman plus small unit of hoppers for objective ninjaring, OR a mangler. As much as I would love to go full Moonclan with a carnival of squigs, I just MUST have spiders and trolls because I like the look of them too much. Plus, the absense of allegiance abilities makes the decision to not have Moonclan allegiance very easy. yeah, i (used) to run a pure moonclan list. It was already hard to optimise it, and i hate to be all gloom and doom, but i just gave up on the little buggers for the time being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyCultist Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 We got two new Battleline options thou. Thats a Big up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadysaneto Posted August 21, 2017 Author Share Posted August 21, 2017 5 minutes ago, HappyCultist said: We got two new Battleline options thou. Thats a Big up! thats even more points to add to an overpriced army. But, well, lets see thoe batallions. Maybe there´s somethin worth on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stato Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 I think your looking at this way too focussed. We know there is a scenario now where unit size is the parameter for holding the objective. 60 moonclan will be tough to shift! Your general went up because he is now general of a faction with abilities. Squigs as battleline! (deserves its own sentence). Im sure there will be more once everything gets revealed, dont bring the sour now when you dont know everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadysaneto Posted August 21, 2017 Author Share Posted August 21, 2017 19 minutes ago, stato said: I think your looking at this way too focussed. We know there is a scenario now where unit size is the parameter for holding the objective. 60 moonclan will be tough to shift! Your general went up because he is now general of a faction with abilities. Squigs as battleline! (deserves its own sentence). Im sure there will be more once everything gets revealed, dont bring the sour now when you dont know everything. number of models was the case in most of the matchep play battleplans. to shift 40 was already hard, and it was just 240 pts. and moonclan got no traits, they just have access to general destruction traits. the thing is -if you are playing points, you´ll be paying 10 more for each 20 grots, unless in a 60 rots unit, 40(!!!!) more pts for each warboss, 20 more points for each shaman and 10 more points for each 3 fanatics. And you get no improvement back for the hike. Nada. Seriously, it is a really strange choice gw made here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Grots and the shaman had to go up. Maybe now would be a good time to tryout that 60 grot unit? Fill the rest with squigs! This change makes for a much more thematic army that three Ogors on monsters surrounded by Moonclan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadysaneto Posted August 21, 2017 Author Share Posted August 21, 2017 7 minutes ago, Furious said: Grots and the shaman had to go up. Maybe now would be a good time to tryout that 60 grot unit? Fill the rest with squigs! This change makes for a much more thematic army that three Ogors on monsters surrounded by Moonclan. i never mixed my moonclan with any other faction. that said, yeah, seems the only way now is a 60 models unit and a ton of squigs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Tomlin Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Hey, There are multiple battleplans where a single unit of 20+ model is the primary requirement for scoring an objective! Moonclan will be just fine. Well said @stato and @Furious. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadysaneto Posted August 21, 2017 Author Share Posted August 21, 2017 27 minutes ago, Chris Tomlin said: Hey, There are multiple battleplans where a single unit of 20+ model is the primary requirement for scoring an objective! Moonclan will be just fine. Well said @stato and @Furious. Chris Well, thats my point exactly. Of you run units of 20, you are paying 10 more points for each. If you running units of 40, thats 20 more points each. If you re running 60, they still the same cost as ghb16. But then, you put so many points in on unit that it gets really difficult to run another one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Tomlin Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Yeah...you're right...those 10/20 points have crippled Moonclan Come on man! I bet @Dangermouse425 is frothing at the potential of Battleline Squigs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeekrit Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 As someone who did run units of 60 grots (moonclan and common) at tournis over the last 24 months, I can't see myself changing, or being disappointed at this. By all accounts a lot of other things are going up in price, and an additional scenario where my large unit is useful. It'll definitely change the Meta and get me thinking again. Can't wait until I get my book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelust Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 43 minutes ago, Chris Tomlin said: Hey, There are multiple battleplans where a single unit of 20+ model is the primary requirement for scoring an objective! Moonclan will be just fine. Well said @stato and @Furious. Chris So I guess tough luck BCR and any army not using massive regiments? Eeesh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Tomlin Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 2 minutes ago, angelust said: So I guess tough luck BCR and any army not using massive regiments? Eeesh Primary Requirement. You could smash them all off and claim it with a handful of models if there wasn't a unit of 20+ models there already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelust Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Sorry, haven't been too familiar with batteplans...so if one player has 20+ models near an objective by end of stated turns, that person wins. If no one does, then the one with any models near objectives wins. That's still really hard on anyone with elite armies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadysaneto Posted August 21, 2017 Author Share Posted August 21, 2017 28 minutes ago, Chris Tomlin said: Yeah...you're right...those 10/20 points have crippled Moonclan Come on man! I bet @Dangermouse425 is frothing at the potential of Battleline Squigs. Well in my list: 20 points in 3 units of 40 is 60 points. 40 points on 2 warboss is 80. 10.point.more for each unit of 3 fanatics is 40 20 on 2 shaman, makes 40. So, in the end 220 pts more, and we dont even got faction traits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheriff Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 26 minutes ago, Sadysaneto said: Well in my list: 20 points in 3 units of 40 is 60 points. 40 points on 2 warboss is 80. 10.point.more for each unit of 3 fanatics is 40 20 on 2 shaman, makes 40. So, in the end 220 pts more, and we dont even got faction traits. My point I made earlier was that your opponent will likely be in the same situation though, he will also be fielding less models due to price increases. The net change is zero, unless your opponent fields a previously under-powered army with no points changes, which is also not a bad thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadysaneto Posted August 21, 2017 Author Share Posted August 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, Sheriff said: My point I made earlier was that your opponent will likely be in the same situation though, he will also be fielding less models due to price increases. The net change is zero, unless your opponent fields a previously under-powered army with no points changes, which is also not a bad thing. well, besides moonclan, i play ironjawz and dispossessed. if i face any one of those, they had no price increase. if i play against seraphon, and i wil, same deal. Bloodbound? mostly the same, cos they had some increase, but they have a lot of options for replacement. not everyone got increases, and most of those who got them, got traits and decreases also. moonclan got nothing - no decreases, no traits, nothing. just increases and battleline squigs. Im pretty sure its just a matter of addapting - runs a 60 model unit and squigs, but, like i said, im disappointed. Im not cursing gw, nor ragequitting, im just really disapointed to see grots got nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donal Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 60 MC grots are amazing and will be a great choice in the 20+ scenarios. Honestly, I think MC grots are great (compared to non-moonclan). There is a reason they were the default grot unit for moonclan lists, Im not saying I agree with all the changes, but I dont think having a point hike in MC grots is a surprise when gutbusters/gitmob stayed the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warboss Gorbolg Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Only thing that seems dubious to me right now is the big increase on the Warboss on foot. The foot Warboss isn't much better than a brute. I also wish the max size on the Grots had decreased to 40 models versus 60. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeekrit Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Warboss Gorbolg said: Only thing that seems dubious to me right now is the big increase on the Warboss on foot. The foot Warboss isn't much better than a brute. I also wish the max size on the Grots had decreased to 40 models versus 60. Interested to understand the logic on this one. You can still take 40 if you want, the max 60 just allows those of us who don't bring all the toys to go a little bigger. I grant you don't get the discount but does anyone get a discount for 2x min size units (I don't have book yet) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadysaneto Posted August 21, 2017 Author Share Posted August 21, 2017 4 minutes ago, Skeekrit said: Interested to understand the logic on this one. You can still take 40 if you want, the max 60 just allows those of us who don't bring all the toys to go a little bigger. I grant you don't get the discount but does anyone get a discount for 2x min size units (I don't have book yet) i cant disagree with that. but the fact is that you will be pying 20 pts more than before if you do take 40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomy Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Outside of points and all, I'd like to voice that if I really really really like a particular faction (Moonclan Goblins) and I love them to death and want to be a ****** and play purely with those, wouldn't it be fair to have that possible? If you like Sisters of Something, it would be lovely to have a chance to counter every possible unit type without hiring zombies for their mega ranged power or ironbreakers for their amazing mobility (yes, I know). Do you think this will take away from my ability to play pure MCG and feel on par with other armies? Is that what your concern is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoollyMammoth Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Popular armies lacking allegiance in the GH is likely a signal that they are getting something. For example, Nurgle has nothing, but is getting its own new box set a week later with a new hero and allegiance stuff. Grots as the horde of horde armies. Makes sense, you have to want 180 grots on the table if you want to play grots. There are lots of options now so you can easily get away with one unit of 60. Many armies have gotten increases. You have no idea what the new meta will be like. Grots can wreck face right now so I'm not sure where all the doom and gloom is coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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