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If you guys aren't playing AoS on Tabletop Simulator, you really should. Once my friends and I figured it out we haven't skipped a weekend yet. I've got a new winning list against a very shooty Cities that I wanted to share with you guys. I don't have a fancy name for it yet, but the feedback was something along the lines of "f*cking Olynder" and "devastating combo." Sorry for the following wall of text, but I'm posting this on mobile... It plays by putting Lady Olynder and the Dolorous Guard (represented by Death Stalkers in the PDF) in Underworlds for the now classic Olynderbomb. Everything else starts on the table, though you can opt to put the Chainrasps into the Underworlds if that's a better play for an objective. Since range will enjoy some nice comfortable distance and target choice, you are going to force their hand. Your "throw away" units are actually Olynder and her guard, and the Black Coach, both acting as distractions and cover. The Olynderbomb should be dropped as soon as possible as close to their ranged as you can. If they properly screened then you're doing to eat through their defence since her movement is limited (relatively quickly, though, it's Lady O after all) and she's going to take some hits, but if they didn't then she can feast on some of the biggest threat very early. Her goal is to draw fire. A quick aside: I don't subscribe to Nighthaunt being a "hammer and anvil" kind of army. This has never worked for me. In terms of tactics, Envelopment works best for me. It's a military and police tactic developed to make use of elite training with less bodies, making a distraction seem like the real purpose while specialized reinforcement goes in for the capture or kill. In this case, Olynder and her guard are the distraction; she'll kill them if left unchecked so she must be answered, but in doing so you're opening them up for the kill. The Black Coach, Spirit Torment, and Bladegheists are your SWAT team. They aren't in any particular hurry, and should stay back and out of firing range, moving up the board slowly, and maybe taking objectives, until Lady O has the ranged's undivided attention. Then, this trio charges in. Lead with the Black Coach. It's your second distraction, and is also your screen. Use it to keep the following ST and Bladegheists from getting wrapped around when they finally make contact. Clearly, the Chainrasps are meant to camp if they need to, but if the battleplan allows it they should roam a bit if only to allow the GoS that's with them to cast useful support or healing spells. Let me know what you guys think. I used this list to win in turn 2, and I went last both turns. W - OB+Black Coach.PDF

Charneral Spectralists 😉 Considering base sizes and the amount of units you'd have as NH, let's see: Looks like most units have a direct equivalent. The biggest issues would be the total lack of a Katakros or Shrieker proxy. Bringing both a Soulmason and Vokmortian in a list would be hard since we only have one model that fits for both. And, you have to measure both Kavaloses from their longest side +5.

*grumble* All these new events this month, and not a list among them to pick at... If The Honest Wargamer's stats are accurate, then Nighthaunt has been hovering around 42.9% with no top 3 placements. This is from a slight jump to 48.1% right after our WD update, but then a decline back to baseline as players are just choosing to play other factions instead of NH. This coincides with a representation of about 2.97% of all games played to less than 1.91%. LoG had one 3rd place win in the Netherlands, but that's about it. Right now, if anyone's playing Death, they're playing OBR or FEC... I wonder which army is easier to play with NH proxy models? 🤔

Quoted for truth. MSUs usually mean support threat units, Bladegheists for example. Or Reapers if they weren't your main threat force. And even then if you are building your list around getting Wave of Terror off, you are balancing that over losing the units you send in on the eventual counter attack. Moreso if you never land WoT. Personally, I run both. If I have an enemy with a lot of units I'll lean more on MSU. If they are more elite-ish, big blobs. And no matter what I go with my workhorse units are usually full.

Exactly that. Why not? Olynder and her Guard, with the Never-King in tow. It would be quite scary seeing that murderball coming my way. I would try to focus down Kurdoss just to stop the bleeding, though, but I think you'd accomplish your goal.

There's no benefit from having both the Chainghasts and Spirit Torment in range of the Bladegheists unless you mean one buffer unit each for a couple of units of 'gheists. Yeah, Reikenor can take a seat if you want to take GoS instead and spend the points on something else. Just be sure to give him the Wychlight so whatever he casts for you you'll get that +1. But if you don't need a caster, or just don't want either of these wizards, you could always throw a Midnight Tome on any of the other heroes. I think a real good counter to some Nurgle blight might be the Dolorous Guard, if you could swing it. Since Nurgle will do some mortals pretty certainly and regularly, being able to shift some to the Hexwraiths and then returning the dead ones via Ruler or Olynder would give you some staying power on your general. Worth thinking about.

Gotcha. Yes, I stand by my Chainrasp remark. Unless you batallion them up, or sit the Spirit Torment near them in the very least, they aren't doing you any favors. One thing you could do is instead of creating another batch of 6 Spirit Hosts you could max out a unit of them to 12, pair them with either the Knight of Shrouds on Ethereal Steed or Spirit Torment, and use either of those buffs to make them swing for more mortal wounds. Since you're fishing for 6s both are good buffs, either 84 attacks or 72 with reroll 1's net the same MW potential -about 15, so the ST would be the better way to go since it won't cost any CP. The ST can both heal them and return missing models, as well. Give whichever hero that is going with them Pendant of the Fell Winds so they can move 9" and you might have something. Just mind whichever hero you use "wholly within" range. Not sure what your options are beyond that without knowing what you have to select from, but a fast Spirit Host wave is plenty scary. Especially if you hit Wave of Terror.

Depends on your goals with the list. What's your goal, who do you expect to go up against?

I mean, run what you love and/or want to run. I love Olynder, and with the Dolorous Guard she's damn formidable. Just mind your Command Points because you'll need them to restore her retinue. That also means knowing when to spend them. Kurdoss can be fun, too, but you have to be aware of what he's for. His CP steal ability only steals the CP your opponent gets at the top of the round and nothing else (though he doesn't need to be the general to try), so you have a very narrow opportunity to benefit from it. If you're lucky, you'll net 2+, but if you're not, none. That means he becomes a very expensive model who's only other purpose is to hunt the enemy general and show it your beatstick all close and personal. Kurdoss is great for that, but is he worth the points in that role (especially since you'd not likely send him alone)? Up to you. I've done it, it was fun, not to mention being a conversation starter when my opponent asked me why I sent the flying chair to beat his general up. I'm guessing the Spirit Hosts are your objective holders? Elite hunters? As a list it can work, but if feels a bit too slow for me. It depends on what you expect to run up against. Those 20 Chainrasp Horde, unless supported by a buffing hero or a battalion, are just 20 5+ saves that will disappear on you and those points might be better somewhere else. Each Black Coach gets 3 dice at the top of each battleround to determine their level. The wording is weird, makes it seem like you had 2 Black Coaches you would grab 6 dice in total, and whatever the result is both Black Coaches are that level (possibly maxed out in turn 1), but that's not how it works here.

I haven't actually seen the list that took 3-0 at Sheffield, but it was enough to raise Nighthaunt from 47.3% winrate to 60%. Well, at least at Sheffield. The first number is the meta average overall last year while the second is how we did in a single event. It remains to be seen if that ends up being a trend or not. Without seeing the list we don't know if the new battalions made the difference or if the player took advantage of the meta those games with a more traditional list. I think the Emerald Host battalions are a huge boost to our competitive strength, and I think it can put us at 50%+ in the meta, which is competitive. I also think they are a bit too pricey, at least Forgotten Scions, so it may take a while before we see a lot of players willing to take chances with them. But, it's clear the new Tzeentch armies, even after the FAQs, are a bane to LoG and any other army that lacks movement tricks. They can resurrect a whole unit, but what does that matter if they're all locked down and do nothing to grab objectives? Movement is key, and Nighthaunt naturally counter a lot of things that stop other armies. In a way, we can thank Tzeentch for opening up a spot in the meta for us. 🍻 Here's to a competitive year!

No, LoG is it's own thing, at least for now. No allies, no battalions.

How dare you, sir! If I didn't get the reference I might just be offended. I said good day! 😡 Seriously though, it can be hard when the army you chose is the whipping boy of the game. You can literally hear the eye-rolling whenever we're brought up in podcasts and tournament coverage, and the snickering over our competitive standing can get annoying especially when they come from meta-chasers. But, as someone I might cyber-stalk (you can't prove it) has said recently, both AoS and 40k are shifting back toward the "play what you think is cool" mentality with GW's balancing and content updates. And I can agree; recent stats coming from tournaments are showing Nighthaunt beating both LoG and LoN! I grabbed onto Nighthaunt because I'm a spooky scary kind of guy, and the "rule of cool" is very real. You think painting thousands of points of an army you love is hard? Try doing it when you just don't really care about the aesthetic you're slathering primer on. Maybe all those souls I sent screaming to Nagash is starting to pay off. 🤔

Hey guys, back with an update about getting me rekt through your advice for my friend. Woo boy, did he ever tear it up. Here was the list the ended up running: We played a 2K game and he pulled out all the stops from all the data I gave him. By the luck of the dice we played the Magical Supremacy battleplan, which obviously favored him, but I also bought the best list I could think up to challenge him including my own spellcasting and the Prismatic Palisade and Balewind Vortex to potentially block his ranged and direct casting. Little did I know he'd be ready for that. He slowed me, hurt me, and exploited my rear by dropping Shadow Warriors on me as soon as he tarred me up, pining me between his lines. And then, just when I thought I had a chance, he focused down Reikenor and then on his next turn dispelled his own endless spells effectively eliminating me on points alone. The fact he was destroying me was just the distraction, the true savagery came from him just deciding he was going to win now and tripling his score through those dispels. Anyway, I'm proud of him and thankful to you all for giving him the edge he needed. Now... To kick his ass back, because I ain't playing no mo. Here are some pics from the game. Oh, and those aren't Beasts of Chaos he's fielding, they are the Freegors of Eastcity. It's a whole thing. Funny to us. I might tell you sometime.

Whenever I run a VL my shooty opponents trip over themselves to lodge 30 rend shots into his forehead. Necromancer gets the same treatment. Basically, if it isn't ethereal it has a high chance of being directly targeted, and I always felt like I needed to shove him up the field along with the units he's supporting, so I'm basically delivering him on a platter. Look Out, Sir! doesn't seem to help much. It becomes a choice of {if opponent ranged=true; then no VL}. Which is more and more likely these days. I'd love to hear some strategies on fielding and protecting both VLs and Necros so that they can be useful.

Forbidden Power included the above in the supplement. It allows you to field Deadwalkers, Deathlords, Deathmages, Deathrattle, and Nighthaunt units as allegiant. So you can take the entirety of the Nighthaunt line as LoG, if you want, but can also take Necromancers and things like a Corpse Cart. The biggest draw of LoG are the gravesites. Via Unquiet Dead you can place 4 of these on the board; 2 in your territory and 2 anywhere else on the field. If you are within range of these gravesites you can use them to store units (like From the Underworlds, but only units with the Summonable keyword can go in there and require a hero to pull them out), use Invigorating Aura to heal up Summonable units D3 once from each gravesite, and Endless Minions that allow you to resurrect an entire destroyed summonable unit for a Command Point, so long as your general is the one doing it. This alone is why LoG is considered "more competitive" than Nighthaunt. Your general can take the Vassal of the Craven King Command Trait to give you a CP each time you spend one and then roll a 5+, and if paired with the Aetherquartz Brooch you get two chances at those CP and, if you're lucky, net two-for-one occasionally. I had 9 CP at the end of a game, once. Use those to keep resurrecting units, All-Out Attack, All-Out Defense, At The Double, and Forward to Victory, and both of the KoS's CAs, then you can almost enjoy the fact there are no battalions, practically no spells, and an artifact list you'll never touch.

What are your guys' thoughts about The Sons of the Lichemaster mercenary group for us? I came across a list the player claims he went 3-0 in a small 16-person tournament. In this list he ran the following (built exactly as he has revealed so far): I'm not too concerned with the list itself, though a lot of people are now copying it with their own variations and raising some concerns with it. But I want to know if anyone has grabbed both the VL and Necro and think their Deathly Invocations and individual offerings are worth their lack of Ethereal and the Necro's lack of flying. I love the idea of more model-return. That's 5 units for D3 each between the both of them. Worth it?

Oof. 1k can be hard for NH. We like to shine at a bit higher than that. At that point level I would focus more on whatever utility you could bring with heroes and units than battalions, but our battalions are cheap enough that you could still fit one in.

Thank you! The Mourngul is tricky for me. I'm in the same boat feeling he's pricey, but to be honest I just haven't used him in a while. But, I was also unsure if a Forge World model should go in the guide. Tell you what, I'll put him in more games and get a better feel for him and then add him in later. About your second point, I don't disagree. I have a pretty short list of changes to Nighthaunt I am really hoping to see when we get our second book or a substantial competitive update. Wave of Terror, for example, could be adjusted just a bit to overcome this huge discrepancy of modern power. Make it cost a CP so we can decide if and when it happens. Or leave it how it is, but also give it the ability to move units during the shooting phase in comparable distances that ranged units can shoot (or a bit less since ranged units tend to have poor melee profiles). Or go in the other direction and give us army-wide ranged attack protection, like all ranged attacks that target us get -1/-1 due to our ethereal nature. But all this is speculation. It's not our current reality. And right now, yes, we are outmatched in a firefight. But, with that said, even when I'm up against 40 2+/2+ ranged shots coming my way, from at least two sources, I have options to even the field. Prismatic Palisade is huge boon. The ranged units I tend to see lose significant buffs if they move, which they have to if the Palisade is in the right spot. Same with any magic you can get off at a further range, helped by a Balewind Vortex. I'll level with you; it takes a lot of effort and a bit of luck to get past an army who can deal 30+ wounds at 20" or more away from you, and it's exhausting trying to. And without house rules to balance that, and players willing to give up their OPness over you, then all you have left is either tricks and tactics, or another army.

Sure. There is probably a couple of ways to counter; healing and damage output. Nurgle are spongy, and seem to win their games through a combination of chipping away at armies through mortal wounds and through debuffs. At first blush I'd suggest doing what you could to reverse the chip damage they can reliably put out; if you can just as reliably return the models they can shave off, then you're already ahead when it comes to combat rounds. Beyond that focusing on damage output might help, too. Reroll buffs, KoS +to hit (though expensive against Nurgle), GoS +to wound. Don't forget All Out Attack on units that don't get the buff through other means. Definitely not mandatory. A strong optional at best. This is because of what he does, he's a wizard with an unbindable model-return spell and a +1 to wound bubble. If you need another caster with a Nighthaunt Spell Lore and already have Reikenor (or can't afford him), then certainly take him. If you plan on keeping him out of unbind range to cast Spectral Lure, even better. But, point per point, Reikenor is a better caster, and if you want unbinding you get more bang with Myrmourn Banshees. I use GoS, just not often. And he just doesn't appear in my stronger lists most of the time. No worries. Hopefully a mod will see it and delete them. I can't.

You're right. Fixed. That was from an earlier version of that list that didn't do so well.

No, but the White Dwarf ones are strong. I expect to see mixes as the tournament scene gets going.

Good news, everyone! My guide is updated with list building strategies and a few example lists! Go and tear it apart!

I have and it worked, but it can be tricky. The Knightbomb is an investment. You will want to build a list around what can support it so that it can be used effectively. In this case that means being able to put the bomb in the Underworlds so you can drop it in your opponent's weak spot without being too exposed until you are ready. A smaller front line of threat units that you could consider "temporary" should be next. Something that you push with at the start of the game that draws attention. With the rest of your points to try to build out the support needed, like heroes and objective holders, to supplement your on-field units and buy time. A list I used (and plan on including above when I can get the time to write the list building section) was the Dolorous Guard and Forgotten Scions for the bomb, The Commended for the objective holders and to steal the ST or Chainghasts for their true purpose, supporting a couple of 10-man Bladegheist units. With the last points I grabbed a Cairn Wraith and the Emerald Host. Deploy how you like. The trick will be to make what you don't put into the Underworlds able to pick up your objectives and hold them, pretty much as bait, until you drop the bomb.

Glaivewraiths are literally our only unit that has an icon bearer/banner carrier/musician mechanic. You could fix Glaivewraiths with just a single change to that Deathbeat Drummer: "...in addition, this unit may be selected to fight once more in the combat phase in which it charged." Boom. Fits their lore, puts their damage on par with Bladegheists, can be FAQed in and not necessarily need a new warscroll card, AND give us a way of still having some WoT-like abilities when our charge rolls suck. I don't think any signatures can appear on mobile. I'veadded every suggestion on my guide so far. Just need some time to work out the list-building section.

Well, certainly! ⬇️