AoS 2 - Sylvaneth Discussion

[Gitzdee]

17 hours ago, Arzalyn said:

We finally getting some info on our release! On May 5th we shall know what the future hold for us!

From the WarCom article:

Warhammer Age of Sigmar gets the treatment on the 5th of May, with new units, new battletomes, and new characters.

Are the symbols on the banners existing Sylvaneth symbols? I dont own the battletome yet because i'm waiting for the new one to get released. The one on the right looks like a bow and gets me carefully hyped for an archer unit. I dont want to get on the Kurnothi hypetrain yet, i need to see some evidence first.

Edited April 26, 2022 by Iksdee

[Painbringer]

Personally, I am waiting for the Kurnoth Hunter hero. I really think that something like that is missing (our only melee focused heroes are Spirit of Durthu and Arch-Revenant, with nothing in between). 

[Baz]

3 hours ago, Iksdee said:

Are the symbols on the banners existing Sylvaneth symbols? I dont own the battletome yet because i'm waiting for the new one to get released. The one on the right looks like a bow and gets me carefully hyped for an archer unit. I dont want to get on the Kurnothi hypetrain yet, i need to see some evidence first.

One on the right appears on the arch revenant shield and is the free spirits symbol i believe..

[Popisdead]

On 4/21/2022 at 11:07 AM, Landohammer said:

How this will impact us: I'm betting Treelords become more expensive, but a lot tougher. 

I've long wished for the Treelord to be what it was in 6th edition.  Impossible to break as a stalwart defensive point.  Such as -1 dmg or a -1 to Wound.  Just some mechanic that it becomes harder to take down a treelord.

On 4/25/2022 at 5:56 AM, Landohammer said:

I am 100% on board with Treelords becoming  300-400pts monstrosities that people fear. We don't need discount 180pt monsters (Hunters are always going to be better) and we have way too many ~300pt heroes. We need roster diversity.

One of the biggest things is it changes the entry-level for the game.  Since prices are going up, reducing the cost of having to buy into an army is helpful.  From GWs view if someone with enough casual hobby money to spend sees Sylvaneth as a buy-in with a Getting-Started or two gets a realistic buy-in, they will sell more armies.  If with the cost increase you still have to buy a lot of stuff,... people won't jump at that.

 

I still stand by that Sylvaneth are getting the long awaited Elf release akin to how Slaanesh got a significant Mortal release for their book.  Kurnous as a large kit (akin to Glutos), then a cavalry kit (those centaur spear guys), and a bow/CC infantry kit.  Possibly a Huntsmaster in some form (thinking of the Lion in the Shadespire release).  Maybe a caster and infantry hero as well.  

If i had to bet Montgomery Burns for a coke, I would wager what I've said as the release.  

[Landohammer]

17 hours ago, Popisdead said:

I've long wished for the Treelord to be what it was in 6th edition.  Impossible to break as a stalwart defensive point.  Such as -1 dmg or a -1 to Wound.  Just some mechanic that it becomes harder to take down a treelord.

One of the biggest things is it changes the entry-level for the game.  Since prices are going up, reducing the cost of having to buy into an army is helpful.  From GWs view if someone with enough casual hobby money to spend sees Sylvaneth as a buy-in with a Getting-Started or two gets a realistic buy-in, they will sell more armies.  If with the cost increase you still have to buy a lot of stuff,... people won't jump at that.

 

I still stand by that Sylvaneth are getting the long awaited Elf release akin to how Slaanesh got a significant Mortal release for their book.  Kurnous as a large kit (akin to Glutos), then a cavalry kit (those centaur spear guys), and a bow/CC infantry kit.  Possibly a Huntsmaster in some form (thinking of the Lion in the Shadespire release).  Maybe a caster and infantry hero as well.  

If i had to bet Montgomery Burns for a coke, I would wager what I've said as the release.  

At this point I am long past being concerned about barrier of entry prices. The forest spamming and spite revenant cost per model put us easily into the top 3 most expensive armies to start. Lets face it, most of us already have the entire range anyway. Selling Sylvaneth to new players is GW's problem, not mine. 

I hope you are right about Kurnothi but I am doubtful. However the two sylvaneth flags displayed in the teaser does give me some hope that our release may be a bit more substantial than previously expected. Current expectations are the battletome and a boxset that includes a new hero. Perhaps a new unit in that boxset like nighthaunt got. 

GW releasing a fully Kurnothi half of the box would be simply amazing. Your example of Slaanesh mortals does give me hope! 

 

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

18 hours ago, Popisdead said:

I still stand by that Sylvaneth are getting the long awaited Elf release akin to how Slaanesh got a significant Mortal release for their book.  Kurnous as a large kit (akin to Glutos), then a cavalry kit (those centaur spear guys), and a bow/CC infantry kit.  Possibly a Huntsmaster in some form (thinking of the Lion in the Shadespire release).  Maybe a caster and infantry hero as well.  

If i had to bet Montgomery Burns for a coke, I would wager what I've said as the release.  

Mortal Slaanesh models had a number of Rumour Engines prior to their release. How many hints of any kind have we had for new Sylvaneth things? All I can think of is a bug leg that may not even be a Sylvaneth model.

I'd be shocked if we got more than a hero model in a dual box. Pleasantly shocked to be sure, but that's the way the Wyldwood crumbles.

Edit: I hope I'm wrong, of course!

Edited April 27, 2022 by Thalassic Monstrosity

[Popisdead]

47 minutes ago, Landohammer said:

At this point I am long past being concerned about barrier of entry prices. The forest spamming and spite revenant cost per model put us easily into the top 3 most expensive armies to start. Lets face it, most of us already have the entire range anyway. Selling Sylvaneth to new players is GW's problem, not mine. 

In a sense this is exactly my point.  You are talking about barriers to entry for tournament players.  Likely you're an established long time player of this army.  Are you going to generate a lot of revenue for GW if they fix the books with the current range?  

If they make the army appealing to new players is that going to generate sales?  

I don't think anyone every implied selling Sylvaneth to new players was your problem. 

It is hard to remove ones vested interest at their level with what to expect.  People wish list like crazy in these forums when the spark of a new army is hinted.  Other than generating a lot of digital traffic it really doesn't do or mean anything.  

3 minutes ago, Thalassic Monstrosity said:

Mortal Slaanesh models had a number of Rumour Engines prior to their release. How many hints of any kind have we had for new Sylvaneth things? All I can think of is a bug leg that may not even be a Sylvaneth model.

I'd be shocked if we got more than a hero model in a dual box. Pleasantly shocked to be sure, but that's the way the Wyldwood crumbles.

Edit: I hope I'm wrong, of course!

I thought the bug leg was Necromuda or at least leaning towards a Jabberslythe.

I wouldn't compare rumour engines of one army to another.  That's a sure fire way of being misled.

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

I suppose we'll see soon enough what we'll get.

Edited April 27, 2022 by Thalassic Monstrosity

[Landohammer]

5 minutes ago, Popisdead said:

In a sense this is exactly my point.  You are talking about barriers to entry for tournament players.  Likely you're an established long time player of this army.  Are you going to generate a lot of revenue for GW if they fix the books with the current range?  

If they make the army appealing to new players is that going to generate sales?  

I don't think anyone every implied selling Sylvaneth to new players was your problem. 

It is hard to remove ones vested interest at their level with what to expect.  People wish list like crazy in these forums when the spark of a new army is hinted.  Other than generating a lot of digital traffic it really doesn't do or mean anything.  

 

My central point is that I want the book to be balanced regardless of how that impacts the appeal of the army to new players. Maybe we are on the same page?

 

 

[Aezeal]

On 4/25/2022 at 10:54 PM, Lord Krungharr said:

The Spite-revenants should definitely be 2 wounds at least.  Considering you only get 5 per box for $50, they need to be on par with Hearthguard Berzerkers.

I'd say the T-revs should be the 2 wound guys and spite revs should be more glass cannon skulkers.

[Aezeal]

On 4/26/2022 at 11:14 PM, Popisdead said:

I've long wished for the Treelord to be what it was in 6th edition.  Impossible to break as a stalwart defensive point.  Such as -1 dmg or a -1 to Wound.  Just some mechanic that it becomes harder to take down a treelord.

One of the biggest things is it changes the entry-level for the game.  Since prices are going up, reducing the cost of having to buy into an army is helpful.  From GWs view if someone with enough casual hobby money to spend sees Sylvaneth as a buy-in with a Getting-Started or two gets a realistic buy-in, they will sell more armies.  If with the cost increase you still have to buy a lot of stuff,... people won't jump at that.

 

I still stand by that Sylvaneth are getting the long awaited Elf release akin to how Slaanesh got a significant Mortal release for their book.  Kurnous as a large kit (akin to Glutos), then a cavalry kit (those centaur spear guys), and a bow/CC infantry kit.  Possibly a Huntsmaster in some form (thinking of the Lion in the Shadespire release).  Maybe a caster and infantry hero as well.  

If i had to bet Montgomery Burns for a coke, I would wager what I've said as the release.  

I think the Aelves are a good possibility... but I just don't like the look of that warband so not to hyped about it

[Popisdead]

On 4/27/2022 at 9:32 AM, Landohammer said:

My central point is that I want the book to be balanced regardless of how that impacts the appeal of the army to new players. Maybe we are on the same page?

Oh of course I want that.  

[King Dust]

I'm excited for the new tome. I've seen a lot of wishlists for balance changes, and we obviously need a bit of a bump. I do want to talk about one thing that I hope doesn't change much or at all: Tree Revenants.

They are really well balanced in that they are super useful (and are taken in most sylvaneth lists) but not spammable. Their teleport and charge re-rolls make them really reliable utility tools, and I think the balance is exactly right as is. Make them too killy and that glass hammer can get tossed around wherever which is part of why the living cities/fulminators combo is such an issue right now. Make them too resilient and then you can effectively spam Scinari Loreseekers and muck up your enemies shooting and/or movement as much as you want. So yeah, hats off to the Tree Revenant, one of the most interestingly balanced units in the game imo.

[Landohammer]

14 hours ago, King Dust said:

I'm excited for the new tome. I've seen a lot of wishlists for balance changes, and we obviously need a bit of a bump. I do want to talk about one thing that I hope doesn't change much or at all: Tree Revenants.

They are really well balanced in that they are super useful (and are taken in most sylvaneth lists) but not spammable. Their teleport and charge re-rolls make them really reliable utility tools, and I think the balance is exactly right as is. Make them too killy and that glass hammer can get tossed around wherever which is part of why the living cities/fulminators combo is such an issue right now. Make them too resilient and then you can effectively spam Scinari Loreseekers and muck up your enemies shooting and/or movement as much as you want. So yeah, hats off to the Tree Revenant, one of the most interestingly balanced units in the game imo.

I agree. I think our battleline options are fundamentally broken, but the Tree Revenants have remained a solid take for the last two books. However if we get battleline unlocks (like literally every book in 3rd so far) then its possible they will become less of an auto-include. 

But if we have to lose the super-useful teleport of tree-revs to get more effective battleline options I won't complain. A well balanced book means all of the options will have equal appeal, even if some units have to take a step down in capability. 

 I am tired of taking minimum battleline vs armies made entirely of battleline. We shouldn't be limited to 5+ save 16pt per wound units IMHO. 

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

That's a spite on top, yeah? Maybe one on the side?

I wonder if Verdant Blessing won't become a Rampage ability?

[Arzalyn]

19 minutes ago, Thalassic Monstrosity said:

That's a spite on top, yeah? Maybe one on the side?

I wonder if Verdant Blessing won't become a Rampage ability?

Really hope we this points toward a Calvary unit (rather than just a mounted hero).

A 3 wound, good move (8 above) and around 140~180 points would fit perfectly with our actual range.

[Gitzdee]

Please make them battleline with Alarielle or something, that would be awesome.

Please make them a multipart kit where i can build different kind of bugs.

[Landohammer]

Looks like the internet is split 50/50 on if this is a Snotling or a Spite riding the bug. I am leaning toward Spite but the underwear is throwing me off lol. 

[Arzalyn]

A Revenant archer is coming! Tomorrow we shall  see if it is a ranged arch or a unit...

[Baz]

im thinking a new arch revenant hero.

[Arzalyn]

Just now, Baz said:

im thinking a new arch revenant hero.

The wings make me think the same. I wonder if it will a completely new warscroll or just a upgrade to the actual arch-revenant to give her a ranged option.

[Popisdead]

6 minutes ago, Baz said:

im thinking a new arch revenant hero.

Unless it has Waywatcher hero level machine gun like abilities/weapons it will prove to be dismal akin to the Cursed City Kurnothi/Sylvaneth hero.  

[Baz]

Saw this on Facebook from the old wood elves armybook. Could we be seeing larger versions???

[acr0ssth3p0nd]

22 hours ago, Baz said:

Saw this on Facebook from the old wood elves armybook. Could we be seeing larger versions???

NAILED IT

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

Me: "Okay, GW. All I want is Tree-Revenant archers. That's all I'm asking for."

GW: "Best I can do is Tree-Revenant archers, but with those bug jetpacks you love so much."

Me: "I- what?"

GW: "Plus dragonfly cavalry. And the Lady of Vines gets a model."

 

Seriously though, this was an amazing reveal and I'm so thrilled!