Warhammer: The Old World News and Rumours Thread

[Sarouan]

Sad news for bretonnians : the true knights that are their mounts don't benefit from their rider's virtue.

It was clearly the intent, but you know...as rules were previously written, I had to see my giant killed by a killing blow from a duke's royal pegasus hoof attack.

Fanatics are still awesome, on the other hand. Yes they only hit the units they go through and yes you can release them even if you're engaged in combat, if you have the room to place them. My evil tactic to play bowling with bretonnian lances can still work ! *goblin nasal laugh*

Edited April 9 by Sarouan

[Ejecutor]

TOW got the O&G Arcanel Journal rules in the download section for Frech speakers:

The Old World Downloads - Warhammer Community (warhammer-community.com)

 

[Sarouan]

More good news : all arcane journals are available to download on Warhammer Community site in both deutsch and french languages. Germans and frenchs, rejoice !

Sorry, still no free english in sight.

[Tonhel]

Just watched the latest youtube video from Square Based / Honest wargamer about the new FAQ and their Rob says that with all the info he has from GW employees and etc.. That TOW have blown away sales expectations. 🙂

I love it! I am still amazed by it, as imo not all those old kits aged well. 😄.

Just nice info to hear 😄 

[GhostShark]

8 hours ago, Tonhel said:

Just watched the latest youtube video from Square Based / Honest wargamer about the new FAQ and their Rob says that with all the info he has from GW employees and etc.. That TOW have blown away sales expectations. 🙂

I love it! I am still amazed by it, as imo not all those old kits aged well. 😄.

Just nice info to hear 😄 

"Aged well" is kind of subjective. For some people those kits are perfect bits of nostalgia. For other people, those kits are the peak of miniature design and sculpting in a style they love. 

I personally think that a lot of older kits have a more interesting style than many modern kits, as well as some really lovely and characterful sculpting. And of course,  some are just ******. But its really subjective!

I'm really excited for miniatures in absolutely every army coming back. Not ALL of them, but a lot of them!

[Skreech Verminking]

9 hours ago, GhostShark said:

"Aged well" is kind of subjective. For some people those kits are perfect bits of nostalgia. For other people, those kits are the peak of miniature design and sculpting in a style they love. 

I personally think that a lot of older kits have a more interesting style than many modern kits, as well as some really lovely and characterful sculpting. And of course,  some are just ******. But its really subjective!

I'm really excited for miniatures in absolutely every army coming back. Not ALL of them, but a lot of them!

Definitely.

and don’t forget there are some big sellers in there.

kits like the snake riders, tomb guard, sphinx, are a pretty much up there with the aos model range when it comes down to details and look

[cyrus]

As far as I heard from my local store Tow sales already slowed down with O&G release.

No new plastic models, the battalion contains only ( very) old miniatures and only some kits were sold out along with AJ.

[Tonhel]

1 hour ago, cyrus said:

As far as I heard from my local store Tow sales already slowed down with O&G release.

No new plastic models, the battalion contains only ( very) old miniatures and only some kits were sold out along with AJ.

That could certainly be the case as the O&G doesn't have a great battalion, compared to the two before and the one that the dwarfes will get.

Still of the 27 kits available online, 12 kits are still out of stock and to be fair for most of the O&G kits there are much better AoS kits available. Just put square bases on it. If I hadn't a 3d printer I would try to use as many AoS kits I could. They are imo better.

I already decided on a 1000 point O&G armylist. I want to make for each faction atleast at 1000 point army. But I only bought the Arcane journal and Black Orc big boss. The rest of the army is filled with STLs from Avatars of War and Highland miniatures, as those are imo better than the old plastics/metals.

Anyway, don't want to praise to hard Rob from the Honest Wargamer, but when he says that TOW blown away sales expectation I believe him. Or atleast I want to believe him. 😉

 

 

 

Edited April 13 by Tonhel

[Sarouan]

TOW started with Bretonnians and Tomb Kings, 2 miniature ranges that were abruptly removed from sales when AoS started after the death of Battle while the others kept going for a longer while. So far I saw and heard, TOW's success is mainly because old veterans are coming back / take the opportunity to "complete" their old collection with the miniatures they couldn't have at the time.

Orcs and goblins, they're not really in the same situation. Their old miniatures were still available in AoS and most of the battalion's content are miniatures that can easily be found in any army already.

Plus the core they have are common goblins and orcs, and they're not exactly the most popular to start an effective Orcs and goblins army...

I honestly relativise rumors talking about TOW "selling really well". I barely see new players coming to the game, be it on youtube or local club / stores. So far I'm concerned, it's all veterans and people who already have everything to play...or who write "3D printer goes brrrr".

[Ejecutor]

2 hours ago, cyrus said:

As far as I heard from my local store Tow sales already slowed down with O&G release.

No new plastic models, the battalion contains only ( very) old miniatures and only some kits were sold out along with AJ.

We won't be able to measure it until all the core factions are out. Dawis got a better treatment than the O&G, so it could be just O&G getting less renewed stuff.

[Trokair]

2 hours ago, Sarouan said:

I barely see new players coming to the game, be it on youtube or local club / stores. So far I'm concerned, it's all veterans and people who already have everything to play...or who write "3D printer goes brrrr".

In terms of players, localy at least I know several people are intrested, but we are all still building our arimes or waiting for stuff to come back into stock or be released. 

I can see it beeing a while yet before most of us have an army to play regularly with. 

[JerekKruger]

3 hours ago, Tonhel said:

That could certainly be the case as the O&G doesn't have a great battalion, compared to the two before and the one that the dwarfes will get.

Yeah, that's my first thought. All the kits in the O&G Battalion are old even by TOW standards (all are from early 6th edition). Meanwhile the Dwarf on its a mix of later 6th edition sculpts (the Dwarf Warriors and the Quarrellers) and 8th (the two Gyrocopter/bombers).

I couldn't see myself ever using those old O&G sculpts, but the Dwarfs are fine by me, especially when I can also be taking the (also 8th edition?) Ironbreaker and Hammerer kits in my army and the new plastic Shield Bearer kit. So I expect the Dwarf release to sell better.

[Sarouan]

32 minutes ago, Trokair said:

In terms of players, localy at least I know several people are intrested, but we are all still building our arimes or waiting for stuff to come back into stock or be released. 

I can see it beeing a while yet before most of us have an army to play regularly with. 

Completely fair. Here at my club, we're still playing 1000 points armies so that we can already play gradually while learning the rules properly. One new player tested with the Tomb King starter box.

Still...I see many similarities with Horus Heresy's launch : at first, there's hype because well it's new and veterans are delighted to see their old game coming back with a few rule tinkering. And then interest is lost gradually as releases are spaced out more and more - and the main issues of such old game systems are cruelly shown in the difficulty to recruit true new blood on long term. Bigger difference with Horus Heresy though is that GW released a lot more of new plastic miniatures, so there was that. They just didn't content themselves with re-releasing old plastic kits and a couple of FW resin kits.

Reason why Warhammer Fantasy Battle had such a hard time in that field compared to 40k and was mostly composed of veteran players is not due just to GW's "lack of releases" over the years or fantasy being less popular than SF. It was also the rules, and The Old World is really not making things simpler on that matter.

TBH, I'm not optimist on how the game will perform on long term.

Edited April 13 by Sarouan

[Tonhel]

7 hours ago, Sarouan said:

TBH, I'm not optimist on how the game will perform on long term.

It depends on what and when new miniatures/books are released. As long as everything new is sold out in the pre-order window, I think everything will be fine.

The first three months blown away sales expectations. The start couldn't have been better. It's the best edition of Warhammer they've ever made. If it flops it is because of their bungling and if the rumors are true the infighting between studios. It's madness that they have decided to be competitors instead of working together.

[Ejecutor]

1 minute ago, Tonhel said:

The start couldn't have been better. It's the best edition of Warhammer they've ever made. If it flops it is because of their bungling and if the rumors are true the infighting between studios. It's madness that they have decided to be competitors instead of working together.

Even with that, wouldn't have been better to release all armies at once? Even if it means delaying the game for a year or a year and a half?

Sales would have been even better, and everyone would have been able to join once the hype was at its peak.

[Tonhel]

4 minutes ago, Ejecutor said:

Even with that, wouldn't have been better to release all armies at once? Even if it means delaying the game for a year or a year and a half?

Sales would have been even better, and everyone would have been able to join once the hype was at its peak.

That would indeed be perfect, but logistically unfeasible. It concerns hundreds of sets. Metal, resin and plastics.
Age of Sigmar will soon be 10 years old and it's only now that almost everything is truly new. No more old figures.

I think SDS is at its limits in what they could release.

Besides the fact that it is not logistically feasible, the financial risk would be too great. As usual, GW misjudged the demand for their product, but no one could have imagined that the hype would be so great.

[Ejecutor]

51 minutes ago, Tonhel said:

That would indeed be perfect, but logistically unfeasible. It concerns hundreds of sets. Metal, resin and plastics.
Age of Sigmar will soon be 10 years old and it's only now that almost everything is truly new. No more old figures.

I think SDS is at its limits in what they could release.

Besides the fact that it is not logistically feasible, the financial risk would be too great. As usual, GW misjudged the demand for their product, but no one could have imagined that the hype would be so great.

I wouldn't say infeasible, just less profitable. If you have to produce and stock products for a year and a half in order to make a better launch and you don't do it just speaks about how low faith you have in the product. Wouldn't surprise me that they updated the scope of the project considering that.

[Sarouan]

1 hour ago, Ejecutor said:

I wouldn't say infeasible, just less profitable. If you have to produce and stock products for a year and a half in order to make a better launch and you don't do it just speaks about how low faith you have in the product. Wouldn't surprise me that they updated the scope of the project considering that.

It has nothing to do to be "less profitable". Reason why you don't launch all 10 core factions on the same day is really a production and logistic question.

[Ejecutor]

29 minutes ago, Sarouan said:

It has nothing to do to be "less profitable". Reason why you don't launch all 10 core factions on the same day is really a production and logistic question.

Ok, then not the same day, but you cannot delay them that much, even if a possible large player base already have armies.

[GhostShark]

18 hours ago, Sarouan said:

TOW started with Bretonnians and Tomb Kings, 2 miniature ranges that were abruptly removed from sales when AoS started after the death of Battle while the others kept going for a longer while. So far I saw and heard, TOW's success is mainly because old veterans are coming back / take the opportunity to "complete" their old collection with the miniatures they couldn't have at the time.

Orcs and goblins, they're not really in the same situation. Their old miniatures were still available in AoS and most of the battalion's content are miniatures that can easily be found in any army already.

Plus the core they have are common goblins and orcs, and they're not exactly the most popular to start an effective Orcs and goblins army...

I honestly relativise rumors talking about TOW "selling really well". I barely see new players coming to the game, be it on youtube or local club / stores. So far I'm concerned, it's all veterans and people who already have everything to play...or who write "3D printer goes brrrr".

I mean, my entire group is brand new players. And online Im seeing a  lot of new players.

[GhostShark]

7 hours ago, Ejecutor said:

Even with that, wouldn't have been better to release all armies at once? Even if it means delaying the game for a year or a year and a half?

Sales would have been even better, and everyone would have been able to join once the hype was at its peak.

They did release all armies at once. Every army had  a playable list at launch. 

They didn't release miniatures for all armies at once. That would have been impossible. That would have been, by far, the biggest miniature release of all time. During a year where GW is struggling with production capacity, releasing hundreds of models and kits all at once would just be impossible. Even in a good year it would have brought every other product line screeching to a halt. Its ridiculous to think this was even an option.

I think so far their release plan has bene fine. we already have 3 full model lines released, with a 4th coming very soon. Its not very hard at all to get models for most other armies, even without resorting to 3d printing or proxying. I pretty easily put together a full Dark Elf army with a trip to my local shop and  a few ebay purchases. My group has full Dwarf, Empire, Lizardmen, Beasts, High Elves and Skaven armies, in addition to people who bought the already available Tomb Kings, Brets and Orcs& Goblins. No one had much trouble getting what the needed, except for the guys trying to do original Chaos Dwarves. And even he's up to 1000 points.

[GhostShark]

4 hours ago, Ejecutor said:

Ok, then not the same day, but you cannot delay them that much, even if a possible large player base already have armies.

They're not delaying them that much. They'll all be out in the first year.

Have you ever played another game from launch? Almost no game has every faction available right away. It took new Necromunda a year to do its 6 gangs, and that was just a  box each.

You don't want to launch everything at the same time. Its a bad idea for so many reasons.  

[Ejecutor]

4 hours ago, GhostShark said:

They did release all armies at once. Every army had  a playable list at launch. 

They didn't release miniatures for all armies at once. That would have been impossible. That would have been, by far, the biggest miniature release of all time. During a year where GW is struggling with production capacity, releasing hundreds of models and kits all at once would just be impossible. Even in a good year it would have brought every other product line screeching to a halt. Its ridiculous to think this was even an option.

I think so far their release plan has bene fine. we already have 3 full model lines released, with a 4th coming very soon. Its not very hard at all to get models for most other armies, even without resorting to 3d printing or proxying. I pretty easily put together a full Dark Elf army with a trip to my local shop and  a few ebay purchases. My group has full Dwarf, Empire, Lizardmen, Beasts, High Elves and Skaven armies, in addition to people who bought the already available Tomb Kings, Brets and Orcs& Goblins. No one had much trouble getting what the needed, except for the guys trying to do original Chaos Dwarves. And even he's up to 1000 points.

I don't think it is ridiculous. I said this would imply delaying the game for a year and a half. The same production slots would be taken, just that you stock it rather than sending it to the customers.

[Ejecutor]

5 hours ago, GhostShark said:

They're not delaying them that much. They'll all be out in the first year.

Have you ever played another game from launch? Almost no game has every faction available right away. It took new Necromunda a year to do its 6 gangs, and that was just a  box each.

You don't want to launch everything at the same time. Its a bad idea for so many reasons.  

Thinking they would all be released this year is ridiculous. With AoS 4 on its way, Dawis could be delayed to July or even later. With the 3 months gap between armies it would imply 5, max 6, armies for this year.

The same logic to my post about not being able to release all at once applies to the armies not being able to be released during a year.

Also, TOW is not comparable. 85% of the work minis wise is already done. It is all about production capacity, but we know it is completely messed up.

Edited April 14 by Ejecutor

[Ejecutor]