The "mortals redesign" Discussion

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

1 hour ago, EntMan said:

I'm not a big lore expert, but I get the impression that timescales in the narrative of the Mortal Realms are long and don't match well with the lifespan of mortal humans.

Which if I'm right would be a problem for named human heroes. 

They used to be, but I think we are past that era of the game. Dawnbringer Crusades seem to be happening just a few years after Broken Realms. Plus, they can always come up with some magical plot device that makes some humans have exceptionally long life spans.

[Asbestress]

13 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

They used to be, but I think we are past that era of the game. Dawnbringer Crusades seem to be happening just a few years after Broken Realms. Plus, they can always come up with some magical plot device that makes some humans have exceptionally long life spans.

Perhaps we may see some Soulbound (untethered from binding) as big name characters?
Or some other blessing from their gods? Or just really expensive Ghyranite life elixir?

[Freemeta]

instead of a living character it could be an Artifact, Godbeast, a named endles spsell, a named cog golem/fort, a special faction terrain etc.

[CommissarRotke]

4 hours ago, EntMan said:

I'm not a big lore expert, but I get the impression that timescales in the narrative of the Mortal Realms are long and don't match well with the lifespan of mortal humans.

Which if I'm right would be a problem for named human heroes. 

There were more than a few WHF heroes that weren't "alive" during the "present day" of that setting IIRC.

[CommissarRotke]

That is to say: this is a tabletop wargame first and foremost. Models are in a flux state of both alive and dead since anything represented with a model can technically "be killed" on the tabletop 😜 Lifespans don't necessarily need to get in the way of giving us named characters.

[Freemeta]

with this little sentence at the end:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/01/40-years-of-warhammer-gotrek-and-felix-make-a-scene/

"Not that Gotrek has stopped looking…"

what if Felix come back in Dawnbringer crusade?

[Baron Klatz]

Whitefang dropped this in rumors.

that helmet has me thinking of similar ones we’ve seen before.

Especially of the War of the Sky Portals 2018 artwork which would’ve fully gone from concept to production by now…

 

 

Also thoughts on the bombards stuff, I wonder if all the cannon-like guns will act as launchers for realm-items. Like Jelsen from Cursed City has a stake launcher on his gun that shoots Aqshy wood which explodes upon contact with the undead(the Glymmsforge freeguilds make palisades of of the Aqshy trees to ward off the undead for this reason for explosive defenses)

just for fun I can imagine three types of ammo you could give your Freeguild gunners, pistoliers and bombards before battle.

Aqshy wood stakes, “common use ammunition by the Freeguilds in Shyish and Order of Azyr to dispense with the worst of eldritch horrors”: D3 mortal wounds to Death, Daemon and Wizard keywords on a 4+ roll after damage calculation

Ghyran lashing seeds, “coined by Cogsmiths who proved their word of Anything can be a Gun by turning plants into guns, their vines inhibit the foe”: on a 3+ the enemy unit suffers -1 to hit for melee and ranged until the next turn

Azyr lightning fragments, “blessed pieces of charged material from either the realm of heaven or in the wake of a Stormhost’s thunderous arrival, they prove useful for weakening foul armor”: after damage on a roll of 3+ 1 mortal wound and -1 Save on the enemy until the next turn. If rolled a 6 then 1 mortal wound & -1 Save on enemy units within 6” of the targeted unit.

 

[CommissarRotke]

12 minutes ago, Baron Klatz said:

Whitefang dropped this in rumors.

and Liked a post that reiterated Whitefang doubting the Conquistadore look

[Baron Klatz]

Yeah I’m confident that’s not a thing beyond placeholders. AoS has kinda been pretty heavy on avoiding straight-up historical looks or mixing so many cultures together it makes it’s own flavor instead(such as Lumineth taking the old Asur Greek flavor and chimera kitbashing it in Mediterranean-Wuxia-Tibetan-Japanese flavors)

Freeguild are very likely on that tract to At Least get Germanic-Franco-Roman vibes if not more exotic stuff + Realm influences.

Like if Spain conquistadors are there you can bet they’re gonna throw something wacky into the mix like Greek, Norse and Byzantine stuff too.

Edited March 16, 2023 by Baron Klatz

[Snorri Nelriksson]

2 hours ago, Baron Klatz said:

Freeguild are very likely on that tract to At Least get Germanic-Franco-Roman vibes if not more exotic stuff + Realm influences.

Like if Spain conquistadors are there you can bet they’re gonna throw something wacky into the mix like Greek, Norse and Byzantine stuff too.

The Burgundian man at arms seems a century before the "old empire look"(based on 16th century HRE),still i could see some more epic mix mash like some classical antiquity vibes or something like that.
Conquistadors are more in line with the old empire than these Burgundians(i'd hope a look even older like 14th\13th century with some high fantasy elements).

[NinthMusketeer]

On the topic of timeline, it is often vague and grain-of-salty, but there ARE some references to timeframes scattered around. The Age of Chaos seems to be pretty firmly established as ~400 years, with a tentative timeline for the Age of Sigmar being ~100 after that. Soul Wars seems to have been (much) shorter and Broken Realms series starts during Soul Wars then ends during Era of the Beast.

In regard to characters... [spoiler altert for City of Secrets novel]

The events of the City of Secrets are still recent enough that there is a whole district of Excelsius yet to have been rebuilt at the start of the Era of the Beast (see BR Kragnos). Meanwhile, in the events of the Thondia campaign book (introduced Incarnate rules) surviving characters from the starter box events are referencing those as being quite recent.

TLDR is that we are looking at perhaps decades at most for the period starting second edition until now. And that's before even getting into localized timeflow differences; some sources reference different Realms traveling at different rates through time, and Chaos influence can explicitly ****** with time* in all sorts of ways.

*for example, in the Timelost Peninsula one could potentially encounter and kill their younger self, ceasing to exist.

[Asbestress]

11 hours ago, CommissarRotke said:

and Liked a post that reiterated Whitefang doubting the Conquistadore look

Whitefang also liked my post about us most likely just getting an Underworlds Warband and/or a single AoS mini

[Asbestress]

Double post

Edited March 17, 2023 by Asbestress

[Baron Klatz]

Just now, Asbestress said:

Whitefang also liked my post about us most likely just getting an Underworlds Warband and/or a single AoS mini

That does up the odds of Tzeentch vs Freeguild Underworlds starter box for a confrontation close to the ship(I imagine under it as it appears the warbands are fighting in the Roothalls of the forest where the meat tree roots have created an digestive underworld)

Could be a way to give an early tease of the faction reboot.

2 hours ago, NinthMusketeer said:

*for example, in the Timelost Peninsula one could potentially encounter and kill their younger self, ceasing to exist.

Yeah there’s also places near the center of Shyish that got time stasis’d with some still stuck in the Age of Chaos.

I can’t imagine it’s purely coincidental we started getting named human character models after Soulbound established itself a way for humans to become ageless like the one from the “Monsters” novel who Yndraste recently met but was a warrior agent of Sigmar’s & Grungni’s since the Age of Myth(his soul bound to his axe)

Could be the next wave of human leaders go that route to become superhuman in the process while it gives Galen an out for his old age(and coincidentally has a action-daughter who would likely be willing to Soulbound with him to keep her father alive. Like Morathi-Khaine & Shadow Queen could get a Warscroll change down the line to make the two inseparable)

[EntMan]

5 hours ago, Baron Klatz said:

That does up the odds of Tzeentch vs Freeguild Underworlds starter box for a confrontation close to the ship(I imagine under it as it appears the warbands are fighting in the Roothalls of the forest where the meat tree roots have created an digestive underworld)

Could be a way to give an early tease of the faction reboot.

Yeah there’s also places near the center of Shyish that got time stasis’d with some still stuck in the Age of Chaos.

I can’t imagine it’s purely coincidental we started getting named human character models after Soulbound established itself a way for humans to become ageless like the one from the “Monsters” novel who Yndraste recently met but was a warrior agent of Sigmar’s & Grungni’s since the Age of Myth(his soul bound to his axe)

Could be the next wave of human leaders go that route to become superhuman in the process while it gives Galen an out for his old age(and coincidentally has a action-daughter who would likely be willing to Soulbound with him to keep her father alive. Like Morathi-Khaine & Shadow Queen could get a Warscroll change down the line to make the two inseparable)

"Mortals redesign" so they are no longer mortals 😂

[NinthMusketeer]

Don't even have to go that far; the realmstone of Life can reverse aging and extend one's lifespan.

[Baron Klatz]

True, that would fit into their reliance of Aqua Ghyranis currency and I won’t be surprised if one of the units all those decorations go on is a Hogshead armored wagon to inspire and heal nearby troops.

“Grand Hogsheads are armoured barrels filled with Aqua Ghyranis. Such devices are carried by Freeguild regiments within heavily armoured wagons and kept under constant vigil.

A Grand Hogshead holds within it the Aqua Ghyranis used to both pay the soldiery of the Freeguild regiment that carries them and to heal those same soldiers if they are wounded in battle. As such these barrels are incredibly valuable to the regiments that carry them, so they are heavily armored and tightly secured inside equally armored wagons when their regiments are on the move.
Instruments are attached to the Hogshead which carefully measure out the Aqua Ghyranis within. A record book is also attached to the barrel and every drop of Aqua Ghyranis must be accounted for within it's pages.“

Edited March 17, 2023 by Baron Klatz

[NinthMusketeer]

I certainly imagine the wealthy are guzzling the stuff regularly to live longer... whether or not that actually works.

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

So, with that Whitefang revelation, what are you guys hoping for at Adepticon?

As I understand, Valrak has take back the prediction of a whole Cities box set. But if we end up getting it, I think it will probably be handgunners, guard, a Freeguild General and an elite or cavalry unit. It seems more likely that we will just see a single model from the new range, though. Seraphon are not even out yet, after all.

But I think there is a chance we will see a Cities underworlds warband. Again, I would imagine it would be made up of new Freeguild models. 4 to 6 guys. Potential characters: General, gunner, greatsword, battlemage, ogor mercenary, sword and shield/spearman filler. That's what I would expect given current models, at least. But of course, it would be a great time to surprise everyone with whatever cool new stuff they came up with.

[EntMan]

26 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

Potential characters: General, gunner, greatsword, battlemage, ogor mercenary, sword and shield/spearman filler.

That would be amazing! I'd love it.

But, especially if they were Dawnbringer style, it'd be a heck of a lot of reveal in one warband, I think GW will want to keep teasing us for longer about what the new Cities are going to be like.

[Asbestress]

1 hour ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

So, with that Whitefang revelation, what are you guys hoping for at Adepticon?

As I understand, Valrak has take back the prediction of a whole Cities box set. But if we end up getting it, I think it will probably be handgunners, guard, a Freeguild General and an elite or cavalry unit. It seems more likely that we will just see a single model from the new range, though. Seraphon are not even out yet, after all.

But I think there is a chance we will see a Cities underworlds warband. Again, I would imagine it would be made up of new Freeguild models. 4 to 6 guys. Potential characters: General, gunner, greatsword, battlemage, ogor mercenary, sword and shield/spearman filler. That's what I would expect given current models, at least. But of course, it would be a great time to surprise everyone with whatever cool new stuff they came up with.

I'm also looking forward to the BT roadmap update  as it could give us an idea about Cities coming pre-10th (if an Order BT shows up), or post (if there isn't a change apart from the Death BTs)

And if they don't just reveal a single mini, but an Underworlds Warband (probably together with the teased Tzeentch one for the new Season box), it would be an amazing look at the refresh's aesthetics (even if I do think it will mostly be just a Freeguild Sergeant/Captain leading assorted Freeguild Guard/Handgunners/new mascot animal, and that the ven Densts and Hexbane have already given us a bit of a peek)

[Draznak]

 

An argument in favor of a freeguild warband reveal, would be that it fits perfectly with the Gnarlwood's theme (we saw it with the artwork of the current starter ^^) : a warband that explores jungles, focused on taking objectives would give a perfect adequacy between theme and gameplay.

[Lich King]

Can someone post what Whitefang said ? Also is there a link confirming Valrak’s “take - back “? I can’t find that 

[Asbestress]

1 hour ago, Lich King said:

Can someone post what Whitefang said ? Also is there a link confirming Valrak’s “take - back “? I can’t find that 

Only thing they posted was that Seraphon are mostly done alongside this image for Adepticon

Spoiler

Whitefang also liked posts relating to the army not having a conquistador look, and my post about us either most likely getting a single "proper" AoS mini or an Underworlds Warband

[The Lost Sigmarite]

On 3/16/2023 at 7:46 PM, Baron Klatz said:

that helmet has me thinking of similar ones we’ve seen before.

Sigmar be like : "I need manpower for my dawnbringer crusades ! You know what ?  ****** you Belakor !" proceeds to unchaos your chaos legionnaire

And as a result, the CoS line aesthetic was born...

Edited March 19, 2023 by The Lost Sigmarite