Getting Starting - Advice Request

[Rob P]

I've been eager to start Age of Sigmar and at the same time keep aborting.

 

I'm finally getting the starter set as my son (10) has shown an interest in the Stormcast Eternals (SE) after the wonderful (crafty ******) store manager game him a free liberator spure.

 

I've bought many miniatures since I got interested in Warhammer in the mid-90s but have not played many games or painted many miniatures because of, frankly, doing a ****** paint job. I'm trying to get over this and the next hurdle is the entry level cost on buying paints - this is again tied to my worry about doing a ****** paint job - don't want to splash out pounds and then find out it was a lot of money to paint terribly. However ...

 

I've looked at the cost of getting the GW paints for doing the SE's in the GW recommended style (gold/blue) and it looks like the entry cost is over 60 pound at GW prices for paints or just under 50 pound at online store prices. This is based on doing most bits with base, shade, layer and highlight. On top there is the cost of tools, glues, brushes and primer cans.

 

I've seen the 'Build & Paint Set and 'note that the pots are not very varied and are only 3ml so thinking of sidestepping them.

 

I have all the tools you could need, a couple of fine detail brushes and a large dry brush.

 

I'm going to grab:

 

- Large base, medium base, medium shade and texture brushes/tools (can the medium base double as a medium layer?) - Cheaper to buy other brands? If so, which?

- Plastic glue - Revell better? Certainly better value!

- Paints - Ideally going to go bronze and red as main colours as can use for the Khorne Bloodbound later. I would still use GW's system of base, shade, etc as i'm not familiar with other techniques.

 

Have I missed anything obvious? And are there any ways to lower the overall costs without harming the quality too much?

 

Thanks in advance - first world problems, I know!

[Ratamaplata]

Hey dude... I've just recently started back after 20 years. Previously the last time I'd painted I was 16 and had no info on painting properly.

Thanks to YouTube and forums I picked up the following essential tips for getting good results...

- use a wet palette

- thin your paints (water is fine) and use multiple coats

- you don't need lots of brushes nor particularly small ones, just get good ones with good tips. Most recommend Windsor & Newton series 7

Also watch plenty of tutorial videos (Painting Buddha has really helped me) and pay attention to how people use the brush to apply the paint and the stuff they do outside of applying paint. Personally I don't see the point in tutorials which basically just tell you which colours to use. 

Just go for it and don't stress if you make mistakes... you'll be learning all the time

[Ratamaplata]

And as far as paints go check out the Army Painter mega set. You get a lot of paints at a bargain price.

[Vissah]

Washes are your best friend.

Just paint the whole model in the base colour you want, trims, details everything and then slap some black or brown wash on the whole model and it will look great for the table. 

Give it some highlights and your done. Will it win a Golden Deamon? No but if your aim is to get good looking models on the board this is min advice for it.

[Sadysaneto]

The download section at armypainter page has a lot of free guides.

 

They are really, really good for beginners.

 

The most important things are - care for your brushes, have patience and thin your paints.

[Iain]

Just my opinion, but: stick models with any super glue, spray everything with chaos black, then leadbelcher spray, then a wash of nuln oil. You're now good to start playing the game. Paint some of the details in your own time and pace, picking up a couple of pots of paint when you visit a game store. Getting the base coats and 1st wash in right away is great as there is nothing more dispiriting than having loads of grey plastic models of shame hanging around!

[Mirbeau]

Honestly don't think you need that many for the stormcast, if you are ok with mixing paints. If you mix silver with gold, you'll get increasingly brighter golds, and you can use an off white or white with practically any colour (red being an exception - it'll turn pink) to get progressively lighter. As long as you keep a written log of your mix balances (say writing 1 part blue, 2 parts white for a final blue edge highlight for example) you should be able to keep the results consistent without forking out for different shades of each colour.

[KhaosZand3r]

You don't necessarily need a lot of paints, just a good enough variety that you can mix into what you need. Citadel paints are overpriced in general, but that is partly due to how concentrated they are. Don't use too much water thinning them though as you can end up getting a lot of bubbles.

[Supasnake]

As someone who started a year ago, I feel your pain. Key thing to remember is these are paints with very fine pigments. You can mix paint easily. So if you are on a right budget get some basic colors. Most starter sets are cheap (minus GW). I would recommend getting GW red though as they cover really well. 

However you should look at some of the different color schemes as there are some easy ones for Khorne (Iron Horde).  

[MidasKiss]

4 hours ago, KhaosZand3r said:

Don't use too much water thinning them though as you can end up getting a lot of bubbles.

I've found I get to this stage really easily. Is it really just a small amount of water used to thin down paints. I understand the lots of thin coats rule but I struggle with it.

[KhaosZand3r]

To be fair I rarely thin mine, instead using fewer heavy coats. Works just fine for the most part, with the exceptions of gradients and highlights.

[Rob P]

Great tips - thanks all

 

I'll grap a few GW paints to start with a go from there.

 

Is it possible to mix metallics to get lighter metallic colours? Presumably it would be dark metallic with lighter metallic rather than white?

[Ratamaplata]

Not sure why you guys get bubbles... I've used up to around 10:1 water to paint and don't get any bubbles.

 

Seems all the other advice here has focused on getting an army painted to super basic standard. Nothing wrong with that but I'd prefer to spend more time painting them well. Patience is a good thing

[Ratamaplata]

@Rob P you can do both. If you mix metallic with metallic it's just like mixing standard paints. If you mix metallic with non-metallic then you end up with a less metallic mix. So if doing that just use a small amount of non-metallic and thin it to use as a glaze.

[Durant]

Most important rule patience, and if you think you can go to step two, first look if you made step one properly. Then look one more time

Becoming a decent painter is not that hard if you have patience, also know your limits do what you are good at not what you wish you could do, master one technic then move to a second one, with time you will learn.

Ooo and one more thing drybrushing is nothing to be asheme of, it is great and easy technic for fur, wood and metal!

[Darthbeerder]

I have found if you just buy paints as you need them rather than getting all the paints at once it spreads the cost out a bit better and isnt so much of a blow to the wallet. For example you could basecoat all your models before buting washes and wash everything before buying layers. If you take your time this should help spread the cost 

[fartsocks]

You can probably get by with the following:

 

black

white

gold

silver

brown

flesh

a brown or black wash

one or two primary colours that you've picked for your army's colour scheme.

 

This'll allow you to paint them to a pretty decent standard. Then you can add colours as you go along when needed.

 

[Rob P]

Thanks for the further replies.

 

I've bought the starter set and a range of reds and metallics. I've also grabbed what looked like the darkest natural flesh colour and some other paints. Also grabbed some extra brushes, glue etc. Just need to get a spray can of chaos black or whatever it's now called.

 

Is the GW standard black spray can good? Also, I'm slightly worried i'll apply it wrong and ****** the models at stage 1. Any tips in this regard?

[HadrielCaine]

@Rob P welcome to the community and GOOD LUCK. Painting used to be my absolute favourite thing, in recent years I've got into competitive gaming too. What a joy to have your child involved too. I remember building airfix with my old man. Really good times.

Regarding painting. Listening to other hobbyists (especially when they have gripes with products so you know what to avoid) and trial and error is the best thing. Don't be afraid to 'ruin' a couple of models. You can always strip them down or leave them in a box. Learning from mistakes is the best learning in all creative endeavours. Especially painting. I make mistakes all the time and always try to just do better next time.

With my old WHFB Chaos army I used to point out the early models compared to the later models to people, not a great idea when going for painting prizes at events... but I was proud of the progress.

I hope talking through painting and gaming with your son is super rewarding, and there's a wealth of good ideas in this thread already.

The biggest change I've made in recent years is to STOP undercoating in black. I now tend towards either white or brown. This is because the new colours have great pigmentation and coverage. White gives a bright finish and brown and more earthy natural tone. THe reason I made this change is because of how good the washes are (as someone mentioned earlier) I almost never basecoat in black now, unless I'm doing metallics. So you may be more than fine for SCE! But good to bear in mind if you branch out within order! I always found that my warriors of chaos got lost and were hard to spot on a table full of terrain because they were so dark... so I did Bretonnians next! 

A

 

p.s. REGARDING SPRAY CANS: just saw your last post. Test cans always on a bit of scrap card or wood to check the nozzle is flowing properly, spray upside down for a few seconds when finished to clear the tube of paint too.

Other than that; well ventilated area, hold can 15cm+ away from the miniature (some would say maybe even 30) and try to have the model higher up than the can somehow, I always get annoyed when I haven't effectively primed the underside of a model.

If I'm doing single miniatures I tend to put a plastic bag (only 5p!) over my left hand and hold the base of the miniature through that so that I have direct control manipulating the miniature and the spray. Short bursts will reduce build up of paint and dripping.

For units try blutac-ing models to a long bit of wood or even double sided tape. Try to position miniatures on narrow pieces of wood for undercoating, although it is tempting to do a whole unit on the lid of a shoe box, the second and third rows will not be undercoated underneath and the front row will probably have to much paint on them!

[Mirbeau]

Oh yeah, don't  focus on getting everything super neat and perfect - you can always neaten up after. Sounds basic but it took me ages to come to grips with that and speed up. Especially worth keeping in mind when you edge highlight or on the base layers of colour.

[KhaosZand3r]

^this. Be rough with the larger areas. The great thing about paint is you can clean up the details later with a little more paint.

[RuneBrush]

Welcome (back) to the hobby and to the painting side of things.

My first suggestion would be to watch the painting tutorials on the YouTube Warhammer TV channel - there are half a dozen that cover the various Stormcast models you get in the main "game" boxed set and it's a good way to learn things like thinning paints, applying layers, highlights etc.  It also shows how Games Workshops painting system works i.e. base, wash, highlight.  You really do pick up a lot and can produce a pretty good result.

Once you've got to grips with a few models and know you enjoy the painting side of the hobby, then you can start branching into things like other paint ranges, different brushes and such like.  There isn't a "right" way to paint miniatures and different people want different results out of their painting.  The Bloodbound I've painted for AoS are to a decent tabletop standard, but I have painted various display level pieces over the time and have amassed a rediculous number of paints!

Regarding your comment on Chaos Black spray.  With all miniatures that you intend to game with, I would recommend you apply an undercoat of some kind.  Chaos Black is a pretty good undercoat within the hobby - it has an excellent finish (superior to brush on undercoat), reasonable adherence and very reliable.  It is however quite expensive (£10.40 a can).  An alternative is black (or grey) primer from Halfords (assuming you're in the UK as you're using pounds), I tend to stick to Chaos Black because I like the finish and am able to pick it up locally.

[Rob P]

Really appreciate the further replies. The bits and pieces won't arrive until next week so apologies if I don't have a lot to say until then.

 

I've already looked at some of the Warhammer TV videos (it's where I started!).

 

Will look at some painting technique and other YT videos whilst i'm waiting.

 

I really like the Iron Horde paint scheme - might do that for the Khorne guys so they don't look too similar to my (to be) red and bronze SE.

[Cordova]

Personally, I'd recommend getting your models all painted to a reasonable standard, with just a basecoat and shade, before returning to the to do highlights and fine detailing.  This has a few advantages:

• Once blocked in with a basecoat, the models will look pretty decent, especially when fielded in en-masse 
• You'll only need a few paints, so your initial start-up cost will be less
• It'll give you some practice and time to get used to painting again.  Hopefully when you come back to do the highlighting, you'll be a bit better.

To have some good-looking gaming models, you only really need 1-2 shades of shading and highlight.

For brushes, I'd recommend getting some reasonable sable ones - Pro Arte Renaissance are quite cheap, and are a good quality kolinsky sable.  I'd say you'll probably want a size 00 (fine detail), 1 (detail), and 3 (basecoat) - you can get these from Grantham's Art Discount (who don't charge p&p), and should come to a little less than £10, if memory serves.  You'll also want some of "The Master's Brush Cleaner" too look after them and keep them in good condition (about £5 for a "cake").  GW's drybrushes are pretty reasonable for the job they do.

With regard to undercoating, it's a necessity to help the paint bond (you should also wash the models in fairy liquid first, to get any releasing agent off).  Whilst the sprays are quick and easy, I hand-undercoat, as it doesn't take long.  I use Vallejo's Acrylic Polyurethane Primer, either in white, neutral grey, or black - it's designed to be applied with an airbrush, so it's really thin, and applies very easily when using a brush.  You can get it for around £5 for a 60ml bottle, or £10 for a 200ml bottle - I'd recommend SnM Stuff or Element Games (I've not used Element, but their prices are pretty good).

General advice: (1) keep your paint thin - thick paint obscures detail, and shows brush marks, and (2) take your time.  Oh, and "brown formula" Dettol can be used as a safe paint-stripper on plastic models.

If you're looking at saving a few £s, SnM Stuff do 25% off (15% on paints), and Firestorm Games do 10% off - both are excellent in my experience, and do free postage if the order comes to £50 or £30 respectively.  Element Games are about the cheapest I've found for paints (variably 15-25% off, but tending to 25% off, so £2/pot), although p&p is £2.95 or free if over £80(!) - note: I've not used them.

Don't know if this helps..?

[Rob P]

Thanks @Cordova I somehow missed your post.

 

I'm now a little further along as the AOS starter set and my paints have arrived.

 

I've got a couple more questions.

 

Firstly, how much plastic cement should I be using. I'm bring fairly conservative (thin sliver along one of the surfaces i'm sticking to another unglued surface.

 

Secondly, the Liberator shield arm on the body piece has what looks like an elbow. I can't get the shield piece to fit on this in any way whatsover. Does the elbow need cutting off flush to the shoulder pad?

 

Thanks in advance!