Tempest Eye Discussion

[dekay]

7 minutes ago, SwampHeart said:

Prosecutors without the ability to deepstrike in to take advantage of their charge rule and target choices don't seem worth it to me. They're not battle line, and are cheaper but at the cost of wounds (for minimum or maximum units). They don't see a lot of play in SCE and I don't think they really bring anything to the table that we don't have better access to in CoS. That said they're probably close enough in efficacy that if you wanted to use them for fluff reasons over Outriders you wouldn't feel bad for doing so. 

But we, compared to Stormcast tome, offer them additional movement and save in the first turn, shooting after running and most importantly, easily accessible +1 to hit *and* wound. They become 2+/2+ in tempest's eye. This seems arguably better than using them with SCE tome. I'll probably try them at some point but yeah, it's in large part flavour motivated decision.

Edited November 18, 2019 by dekay

[zilberfrid]

3 hours ago, dekay said:

Arright, I have another subject for consideration:

Large unit of Javelin Prosecutors as, more or less, alternative to Outriders. They have similar range, more mobility, better armour and, with full buffs, a bit smaller damage output than mobile outriders, albeit less swingy. They are also 40 points cheaper for full unit (but, with 12 vs 20, they have significantly fewer wounds)

Outriders gain large damage advantage when static, so this must by taken into account too.  On the other hand, Prosecutors are less reliant on buffs and get ahead when they're removed (which, with all possibilities of hero sniping, has to be planned for)

Has anyone else thought of using  those?

I wouldn't. Can't buff them the same way, they don't fit the batallion, and (most importantly) I don't like their looks.

[SwampHeart]

6 minutes ago, dekay said:

But we, compared to Stormcast tome, offer them additional movement and save in the first turn, shooting after running and most importantly, easily accessible +1 to hit *and* wound. They become 2+/2+ in tempest's eye. This seems arguably better than using them with SCE tome. I'll probably try them at some point but yeah, it's in large part flavour motivated decision.

The issue is keeping them in range of said buffs, we lack a mobile shooting general unfortunately. 

[Eaglsphan]

On 11/18/2019 at 8:37 AM, dekay said:

But we, compared to Stormcast tome, offer them additional movement and save in the first turn, shooting after running and most importantly, easily accessible +1 to hit *and* wound. They become 2+/2+ in tempest's eye. This seems arguably better than using them with SCE tome. I'll probably try them at some point but yeah, it's in large part flavour motivated decision.

Which buffs are giving out the +1 hit (aside from the Hurricanum?)/wound? I know of the Freeguild General and the Hallowheart spell Ignite Weapons, but nothing else comes to mind? What am I missing?

Edited November 19, 2019 by Eaglsphan

[dekay]

9 minutes ago, Eaglsphan said:

Which buffs are giving out the +1 hit (aside from the Hurricanum?)/wound? I know of the Freeguild General and the Hallowheart spell Ignite Weapons, but nothing else comes to mind? What am I missing?

Hawk Eyed trait gives them +1 to wound aura. And hurricanum serves as said +1 to hit, especially if it's flying version with thermalrider cloak to make it keep up easily with mobile shooting units. Even if it isn't, while running it's pretty mobile and we can make it shoot after running. If we want to go full buffs, we can also add Azyros for adding re-roll 1's to their 2+ to hit, but, as said, they don't need all those buffs as desperately as outriders would.

[Eaglsphan]

No wonder I missed it, it was right in front of me (the command trait). Thanks!

And the cloak on the Hurricanum is absolutely brilliant.

[Arkhanist]

When I dent the backlog a bit, I'm really tempted to steal an idea for a flying hurricanum with thermalrider cloak that's particularly fitting for Tempest's Eye.

Edited November 20, 2019 by Arkhanist

[zilberfrid]

2 hours ago, Arkhanist said:

When I dent the backlog a bit, I'm really tempted to steal an idea for a flying hurricanum with thermalrider cloak that's particularly fitting for Tempest's Eye.

It will also free up the rest of the model for a luminarch in a Hallowheart list.

[dekay]

1 minute ago, zilberfrid said:

It will also free up the rest of the model for a luminarch in a Hallowheart list.

Speaking of - what do yall think of luminarch in Tempest's Eye? Does it make sense to make out units ever tankier with its aura?

[zilberfrid]

14 minutes ago, dekay said:

Speaking of - what do yall think of luminarch in Tempest's Eye? Does it make sense to make out units ever tankier with its aura?

I myself do not think it's worth it. The +1 to unbind is better used elsewhere, and I think the points can better be spent on something that can hold objectives.

[Gwendar]

With the potential upcoming bridge nerf (only allowing 1 unit to cross and not multiple) does anyone still think that running a dwarf heavy list is as feasible? I was considering building one in the future and using 1x20 Irondrakes to sling across it along with grumbling Longbeards (RR1's to wound), a Hawk-eyed general and running up a Hurricanum which will get them down to 38 shots of 2\2\-1\1. Combining that with the +1 Rend and the 2 Torpedo shots and you're looking at ~30 damage on average (assuming d6 damage on the Torpedo, otherwise slightly less). Could potentially use Hammerers as well with a Ghur Battlemage to get them charging on a 6 as an alternative... but in that scenario I would also want to send a Warden King across to get the +1 attacks CA in range.

However, if you only can only throw one unit across it then you're probably only going to get the Hurricanum in range, putting the total damage closer to ~20 for the Irondrakes and Hammers potentially miss their +1 attack. This is of course assuming you put the Bridge at it's max 24" range and even in TE a stubby legged 7" + run movement on T1 won't get things into their wholly within ranges for the buffs.

Perhaps the nerf would just mean you have to be less reliant on maxing it out, which I think would still be worth it.. but it's likely that most people will make you go first and deploy farther back to where you would need the max deployment to punish. Although... that could mean the death of the Irondrakes\Hammerers on their turn if you overextend them with no screening support from Longbeards. Just curious on others thoughts 😉

[Satyrical Sophist]

33 minutes ago, Gwendar said:

With the potential upcoming bridge nerf (only allowing 1 unit to cross and not multiple) 
😉

Is there any confirmation that that's what the nerf is? I assumed it would be nerfed to stop you using it to escape combat.

[Gwendar]

1 hour ago, Satyrical Sophist said:

Is there any confirmation that that's what the nerf is? I assumed it would be nerfed to stop you using it to escape combat.

As far as I know, no. I think the assumption for the change is only 1 unit crosses which could make sense. I'm not sure why using it to escape combat would be something to change; plenty of other teleports exist in the game that allow the exact same thing.

Edited November 20, 2019 by Gwendar

[Duke of Gisoreux]

In a local tournament I attended the following army ranked 5th of 26 participants scoring 2 wins against Sylvaneth and Skaven and 1 loss against Hedonites of Slaanesh.

Please note that realm artefacts were not allowed.

Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar
- City: Tempest's Eye

Leaders
Anointed of Asuryan on Flamespyre Phoenix (300)
Anointed of Asuryan on Flamespyre Phoenix (300)
Battlemage (90)
- Spell: Lore of Eagles - Celestial Visions (Tempest's Eye Wizard)
- City Role: General's Adjutant (Must be 6 wounds or less)
- Mortal Realm: Hysh
Celestial Hurricanum With Celestial Battlemage (280)
- Spell: Lore of Eagles - Strike of Eagles (Tempest's Eye Wizard)
Aether-Khemist (140)
- General
- Trait: Hawk-eyed
- Artefact: Patrician's Helm

Battleline
10 x Freeguild Guard (80)
- Swords and Shields
- City Role: Honoured Retinue (Must be 5-20 models)
5 x Freeguild Pistoliers (100)
40 x Arkanaut Company (480)
- 12x Light Skyhooks

Units
10 x Shadow Warriors (110)
10 x Shadow Warriors (110)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 125
 

[zilberfrid]

On 11/27/2019 at 2:32 PM, Duke of Gisoreux said:

In a local tournament I attended the following army ranked 5th of 26 participants scoring 2 wins against Sylvaneth and Skaven and 1 loss against Hedonites of Slaanesh.

Please note that realm artefacts were not allowed.

Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar
- City: Tempest's Eye

Leaders
Anointed of Asuryan on Flamespyre Phoenix (300)
Anointed of Asuryan on Flamespyre Phoenix (300)
Battlemage (90)
- Spell: Lore of Eagles - Celestial Visions (Tempest's Eye Wizard)
- City Role: General's Adjutant (Must be 6 wounds or less)
- Mortal Realm: Hysh
Celestial Hurricanum With Celestial Battlemage (280)
- Spell: Lore of Eagles - Strike of Eagles (Tempest's Eye Wizard)
Aether-Khemist (140)
- General
- Trait: Hawk-eyed
- Artefact: Patrician's Helm

Battleline
10 x Freeguild Guard (80)
- Swords and Shields
- City Role: Honoured Retinue (Must be 5-20 models)
5 x Freeguild Pistoliers (100)
40 x Arkanaut Company (480)
- 12x Light Skyhooks

Units
10 x Shadow Warriors (110)
10 x Shadow Warriors (110)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 125

You can't really lose to Slaanesh, they can only break even (if they win) because it has not been fixed yet, so just wins, it seems. Skaven can be quite challenging as well!

I do like this list, but have 0 Arkanaut company, and these are so expensive!

But then, I haven't finished my current TE list, so getting new units will have to wait.

[Ashman]

Hello all,

So I have some questions regarding what is a legal competitive list for matched play with Cities of Sigmar in regards to Tempest Eye (much of this would apply to Living City as well).  I apologise if this has been answered previously.  As I read the battletome it would appear to me that it is legal to essentially have a Tempest Eye list in which half the list would be a 50/50 split between CoS with KO and SCE - basically because it doesn't say that 1 in 4 unit can be KO "or" SCE (key word missing being OR).  What I see the rules saying is simply 1 in 4 unit can be KO as a simple statement on its own with a seperate statement saying that 1 in 4 can be SCE.  This because more confusing when you start adding in allies.  With that in mind is is possible to something like the following?

List 1
Leaders
Warden King - General. 110pts
Runelord - General Adjudant 90pts
Aether Khemist 140pts
Knight Azyros 100pts

Battleline
20 Arkanaut Company. 240pts
5 Liberators 100pts
20 Irondrakes 300pts

Other
Gyrobomber 80pts
Gyrobomber 80pts
Gyrobomber 80pts
9 Endrinriggers 360pts

Allies
10 Vulkite Berzerkers 160pts
Auric Runesmiter 120pts

1960pts total

 

[Arkhanist]

Given it's not been corrected in the FAQ, and that everyone else I've seen comment concurs, yes, the 1 in 4 unit rules applies separately to each type. The legal extreme is thus 1/4 CoS, 1/4 SCE, 1/4 KO and 1/4 allies. So from that perspective, a quick count of your units says that that's a legal list. Only allies have the points limit in addition, and you're just below that; with 2/13 stormcast, 3/13 KO and 2/13 allies, each is below 1/4.

[Ashman]

Wow!!!  I just had to check - it seemed too good to be true.  Thanks for the response.

[Kramer]

Just a small thing I just noticed and might help others (and to check if I’m missing anything).

irondrakes are battleline if the general is DUARDIN. So in the list I was making I wanted to have a khemist as general for the +1 to wound trait. 
And suddenly noticed that opened up irondrakes as battleline as well. Which helped me a lot. 
 

EDIT: While further listbuilding noticed I didn't need it as I decided to go for a second Longbeard screening unit. But still 😂
The list in question I might be playing against next week (mate wants to use some 'cool' stuff)
140/Khemist Trait: Hawk Eyed, Seerstone Amulet (castling with the Arkanauts for 12x 3+ 2+ -2 d3 Hero Hunting while gaining extra CP)
220/ Lord Arcanum: Aura of Glory (Preferably casting on the Hammerers and Sequitors as second choice)
220/ 2x10 Longbeards (screening Arkanauts/zoning)
300/ 20 Irondrakes (anti unit ranged threat)
240/ 20 Arkanauts (hero ranged threat)
260/ 20 Hammerers (Hammer 😏)
260/ 10 Sequitors (Anvil)
Allies: 
120/ Runesmiter (getting the Bezerkers up in the grill for early points and delaying tactics)
240/ 10 Hearthguard Bezerkers
2K on the dot.

Edited December 6, 2019 by Kramer
Added list

[Kramer]

Okay, in the new year i'm actually painting up my Stormcast and replacing some old Dwarven models. So I thought to combine those projects into a working Tempest list to build them up both and keep me switching between painting different units.  

I have two lists I'm thinking about. But it's basically a variation on the same theme. 10 sequitors with a lord Arcanum as an anvil. Arkanauts with an Khemist for demanteling an opponents army. And Duardin as the main force. 

Lists in the Spoiler thing. But the main questions I'm wondering about:

Will 2x10 Hammerers be enough (supported by warden king and Aura of Glory for +2 attacks) for the punch? Or Do I need to combine them and get a second hammer. 

I also like the Hearthguard and runesmiter allies to grab objectives early and delay. OR would 20 darkshards with a sorceress to get that important spell off and added shooting. 

Lastly I'm looking at both lists and thinking I'm going to need more screens. 

Whats your thought on the following lists:

Quote

List 1:
Lord Arcanum - Aura of Glory
10 Sequitors
Khemist - General - Hawkeyed - Seerstone Amulet
20 Arkanauts - Battleline
2x10 Hammerers
20 Irondrakes - Battleline
10 IronBreakers - Battleline
Warden King
Allies:
Runesmiter
10 HearthGuard Bezerkers

Quote

List 2:
Lord Arcanum
10 Sequitors
Khemist - General - Hawkeyed - Seerstone Amulet
20 Arkanauts - Battleline
2x10 Hammerers
Sorceress - Aura of Glory
20 Darkshards - Battleline
20 Irondrakes - Battleline
Warden King
Comet
This list has 120 points over. Maybe 10 Longbeards for screening? 10 more Arkanauts would probably be best but I don't want to convert 3 more Skyhooks. Open to suggestions on this one.

 

[frostfire]

The AOS Reminder stat shows that many people choose Living city over instead of TE. 

That makes me confused. Is Living city tankier than TE or does Living city have stronger firepower for a shooty army?

[dekay]

4 hours ago, frostfire said:

The AOS Reminder stat shows that many people choose Living city over instead of TE. 

That makes me confused. Is Living city tankier than TE or does Living city have stronger firepower for a shooty army?

Personal theory:

A lot of people work under false assumptions when choosing their city. Many  living city players don't really play CoS Living City. They play Firestorm Living City. Because that's where Waderers were in previous edition. And they do *that* because they in fact play Wanderers. And they play Wanderers because, in all reality, they're just trying to still play Wood Elves. Anvilgard-Dark Elves and Greywater-Dwarves have similar paths. Doesn't matter that said wood elves might be better played under a different city.

Tempest's Eye doesnt have this sort of legacy identity, especially because with removal od Swifthawks it's vastly different from its Firestorm version. So most people playing Tempest's Eye had to make a concious choice to play Tempest's Eye. No wonder there's fewer of them.

[Ashman]

5 hours ago, dekay said:

Personal theory:

A lot of people work under false assumptions when choosing their city. Many  living city players don't really play CoS Living City. They play Firestorm Living City. Because that's where Waderers were in previous edition. And they do *that* because they in fact play Wanderers. And they play Wanderers because, in all reality, they're just trying to still play Wood Elves. Anvilgard-Dark Elves and Greywater-Dwarves have similar paths. Doesn't matter that said wood elves might be better played under a different city.

Tempest's Eye doesnt have this sort of legacy identity, especially because with removal od Swifthawks it's vastly different from its Firestorm version. So most people playing Tempest's Eye had to make a concious choice to play Tempest's Eye. No wonder there's fewer of them.

Yeah I gotta agree with ya delay - I also think alot people played Sylvaneth in early days of AOS when they were more competitive and now have a reason to pull them out (they were quite well represented a couple years ago).

Lots of gas in the Tempest Eye tank despite what you might see with the stats though. +1 Saves with +3 movement something like Ironbreakers with an unmoded 3up save in first round is VERY TIGHT.  And it just gets better from there....

A spell that gives +1 attacks characteristics...

Those two things alone are dang amazing....  The rest isn't just fluff either.  

STRONG (in the right hands mind u)

[zilberfrid]

27 minutes ago, Ashman said:

Yeah I gotta agree with ya delay - I also think alot people played Sylvaneth in early days of AOS when they were more competitive and now have a reason to pull them out (they were quite well represented a couple years ago).

Lots of gas in the Tempest Eye tank despite what you might see with the stats though. +1 Saves with +3 movement something like Ironbreakers with an unmoded 3up save in first round is VERY TIGHT.  And it just gets better from there....

A spell that gives +1 attacks characteristics...

Those two things alone are dang amazing....  The rest isn't just fluff either.  

STRONG (in the right hands mind u)

The +1 save might keep Shadow Warriors/asassins alive a bit longer as well, which might be an interesting choice as a pseudo Living City mechanic.

[dekay]

1 hour ago, Ashman said:

Yeah I gotta agree with ya delay - I also think alot people played Sylvaneth in early days of AOS when they were more competitive and now have a reason to pull them out (they were quite well represented a couple years ago).

Lots of gas in the Tempest Eye tank despite what you might see with the stats though. +1 Saves with +3 movement something like Ironbreakers with an unmoded 3up save in first round is VERY TIGHT.  And it just gets better from there....

A spell that gives +1 attacks characteristics...

Those two things alone are dang amazing....  The rest isn't just fluff either.  

STRONG (in the right hands mind u)

Plus two separate methods of gaining extra CP, and all 3 warlord traits so good that it's an actual shame there's no method to take more than one (Hawk Eyed is so ridiculously good that losing it in game makes you feel like your shooters suddenly became underpowered and then you realise that you just got lowered to other cities' standard ;)). Yeah. we are a strong city. Just a less popular one ; )

Hell, with our movement bonus, charge re-roll banner and abundance of CP we are a city that can reliably make a 1st turn charge with infantry horde (black guard work the best here) and drop a +1 A aura on them in addition.