The Rumour Thread

[Ejecutor]

1 hour ago, Hawke said:

I understand this point, and while I'd still play with a beastmen army in ToW and buy the new models, it would seem strange to me for them not to also support them in AoS. Even if the only AoS-exclusive thing for them is a rulebook.

It just seems more effort to remove them than leave them in at this point.

I guess they would end up being in the 'use them as a proxy, but you cannot use them in official tournament' bucket of minis once the rework is finished.

[Snarff]

13 minutes ago, Luperci said:

Hot take but I really don't think AoS needs "standard dwarfs" the mechanical stuff is already covered by kharadron and the traditional dwarf fortress hold stuff is covered by fyreslayers, both just need a release wave to round out their rosters

Agreed. I think standard Duardin and Aelves do have a place though, but it's in CoS, working together with the standard humans as equals. The next wave needs focus on the cosmopolitan aspect of the races standing together against the dangers ans the hardships od the realms.

[Vasshpit]

1 hour ago, Thalassic Monstrosity said:

Kruleboyz

 

1 hour ago, Thalassic Monstrosity said:

They don't even have horns. Losers.

Well at least we're not getting squatted. 

Ouch! Too soon?...

Annnnd we'll take some of your tasty ambush rules while we're at it. 🤘😜😁

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

16 minutes ago, Vasshpit said:

 

Well at least we're not getting squatted. 

Ouch! Too soon?...

Annnnd we'll take some of your tasty ambush rules while we're at it. 🤘😜😁

WASTED

[Pizzaprez]

44 minutes ago, Snarff said:

I think people are way overestimating the influence TOW is going to have on AoS. It's a smaller specialist game, it's not going to be driving decisions for their flagship fantasy game. 30K is also not leading to entire 40K armies or model ranges being cut for the benefit of 30K, or suddenly changing the design language of 40K because it had a succesful launch.

 

No, but 30k had the advantage of people buying space marine stuff for 40k. Initially that's all there was to buy! If the biggest selling faction is Space Marines and you make a game that's primarily Space Marines vs Space Marines I'm not surprised that GW successfully moved some space marines!

It would be as if 30k didn't focus on the Xenos races much at all and had its own special and unique version of imperial guard with its own aesthetic and design cues instead of just using the 40k one... which they do. 

If Games Workshop wants each of their two fantasy games to look entirely different at a glance, going so far as to only photograph old not-aos models for their books, then there are absolutely discussions happening behind the scenes about what is WHF and what is AoS at a glance.

40k was/is in a slightly different situation: they just whipped up "old" versions of a lot of stuff that could very well still exist 10k years later. Bc both games don't share much outside of Space Marines they're different at a glance. 

AoS was a sequel where, by default, everyone initially made it into the game. They've been culling things since 1.0; if they woke up and decided "Beasts are more iconic to TOW than AoS" it's just another cut on the pile at this point. Still hoping Beasts get a reboot instead of a chop, though.

[Vasshpit]

One small thing that stands out to me is when the trailer for that last new beastlord was released it really was presented as kind of a joke. Like even Geedubs didnt take it seriously either. I did kinda feel bad fo BoC fans after watching that. I felt it was kinda disrespectful to them.

Eh? Whatcha goin do... 

Edited February 1 by Vasshpit

[Hollow]

1 hour ago, Snarff said:

I think people are way overestimating the influence TOW is going to have on AoS. It's a smaller specialist game, it's not going to be driving decisions for their flagship fantasy game. 30K is also not leading to entire 40K armies or model ranges being cut for the benefit of 30K, or suddenly changing the design language of 40K because it had a succesful launch.

 

I have read similar takes several times and think you have it backwards. AoS is the driving decision for ToW. The core factions in ToW are made up of the factions not present in AoS. The legacy factions in the ToW are the factions that are in AoS. Regarding BoC, I don't think it is the case of ToW studio saying to the AoS studio, "Hey, we want BoC in ToW, drop the faction from your roaster so we can have them in our setting" I think it is much more the case that the AoS studio said "Hey, we are going to remove, re-do or completely redesign this faction (we don't know which it will be yet) you can have this "old" one for your setting" 

It's not that the ToW is dictating where AoS goes and what it will have in its roaster. It's the other way around.

Edited February 1 by Hollow

[Whitefang back me up]

1 hour ago, Snarff said:

I think people are way overestimating the influence TOW is going to have on AoS. It's a smaller specialist game, it's not going to be driving decisions for their flagship fantasy game. 30K is also not leading to entire 40K armies or model ranges being cut for the benefit of 30K, or suddenly changing the design language of 40K because it had a succesful launch.

 

A large majority of 30k models that had been regularly updated for 40k have been placed firmly in the legends category. 

[Snarff]

4 minutes ago, Whitefang back me up said:

A large majority of 30k models that had been regularly updated for 40k have been placed firmly in the legends category. 

That's still a very different situation from taking a 40K army and moving it fully to 30K.

[Kronos]

1 hour ago, Luperci said:

Hot take but I really don't think AoS needs "standard dwarfs" the mechanical stuff is already covered by kharadron and the traditional dwarf fortress hold stuff is covered by fyreslayers, both just need a release wave to round out their rosters

Respectfully, I’m very much missing the Norse inspired Dwarfs. AoS does something very well and that is crank up the High Fantasy. 
 

I want to see what done with that Archetype, Whether it’s Dwarf Shieldmaidens from Valaya Riding Flying Goats (everyone gets a goat except BoC) or if they lean further into the  Wandering dwarf Side of things and we have more of a Ranger force similar to Bugmans rangers, with Grombrindal as a Special Character.

I think there’s A lot of Dwarf Design which the Khradron and the Slayers just aren’t quite tapping into for me. It doesn’t have to look like Old World Dwarfs, it should be What Lumineth is to High Elves. There are suggestions of influence, but it’s become it’s own thing, 

[Pizzaprez]

17 minutes ago, Snarff said:

That's still a very different situation from taking a 40K army and moving it fully to 30K.

RIP to the firstborn marines; I'd wager that's partially why we wound up getting primaris instead of a new wave of sculpts for firstborn. At this point, OG space marines are 30k exclusives; they just went about it differently.

Im sure that Space Marines v Space Marines being so successful is why we got anything else for 30k: TOW doesn't have an equivalent for that outside of people thirsty for old models. TOW is not in a position where Empire vs Empire is enough to fund the rest of the game.

It also doesn't need all-new sculpts: people are excited for the old stuff! Myself included! Once I circle back to my Free City and Soulblights, Bretonnia is going to be where I source a ton of my stuff. 

Just now, Kronos said:

Respectfully, I’m very much missing the Norse inspired Dwarfs. AoS does something very well and that is crank up the High Fantasy. 
 

I want to see what done with that Archetype, Whether it’s Dwarf Shieldmaidens from Valaya Riding Flying Goats (everyone gets a goat except BoC) or if they lean further into the  Wandering dwarf Side of things and we have more of a Ranger force similar to Bugmans rangers, with Grombrindal as a Special Character.

I think there’s A lot of Dwarf Design which the Khradron and the Slayers just aren’t quite tapping into for me. It doesn’t have to look like Old World Dwarfs, it should be What Lumineth is to High Elves. There are suggestions of influence, but it’s become it’s own thing, 

I'm with you: if Cities are becoming primarily humans, I'd love to see what would happen with a Grombrindal/Grungi "repossesed" army!!

Edited February 1 by Pizzaprez

[pitzok]

This negativity around beasts is tiring, especially because it was caused by another non-rumour like 6 pagez back. Let's switch it up by talking about new design possibilities for beasts. Personally I wouldn't deviate too much from the established goat look, as for a fantasy beastmen race it is pretty unique for the core of the Warhammer beastman to be a goat. However there is space for adding other elements to the beastmen in other parts of their bodies (look at centigors for example). For example, new minotaurs could get muscular bear arms. I am also a big fan of the jabberslythe and in my opinion it is the epitome of a beast of chaos, so more lizard and insect elements do also fit in. Imagine ungor raiders with dog legs for better running around in a skirmish, bestigors with pangolin scales for extra armor etc. 

[BarakUrbaz]

2 minutes ago, pitzok said:

This negativity around beasts is tiring, especially because it was caused by another non-rumour like 6 pagez back. Let's switch it up by talking about new design possibilities for beasts. Personally I wouldn't deviate too much from the established goat look, as for a fantasy beastmen race it is pretty unique for the core of the Warhammer beastman to be a goat. However there is space for adding other elements to the beastmen in other parts of their bodies (look at centigors for example). For example, new minotaurs could get muscular bear arms. I am also a big fan of the jabberslythe and in my opinion it is the epitome of a beast of chaos, so more lizard and insect elements do also fit in. Imagine ungor raiders with dog legs for better running around in a skirmish, bestigors with pangolin scales for extra armor etc. 

Honestly if I was going to revamp Beastmen I'd make them several different species mixed into a single unit. Kind of like the really old stuff where you got weird things like Camelmen in there. 

[pitzok]

Just now, BarakUrbaz said:

Honestly if I was going to revamp Beastmen I'd make them several different species mixed into a single unit. Kind of like the really old stuff where you got weird things like Camelmen in there. 

Actually, camelmen would be great and really unique. For example a mid sized tank monster unit that could also carry a squad of 10.

[Ogregut]

48 minutes ago, Hollow said:

I have read similar takes several times and think you have it backwards. AoS is the driving decision for ToW. The core factions in ToW are made up of the factions not present in AoS. 

Apart from orc & goblins and chaos warriors. 

 

16 minutes ago, pitzok said:

This negativity around beasts is tiring, especially because it was caused by another non-rumour like 6 pagez back. Let's switch it up by talking about new design possibilities for beasts. Personally I wouldn't deviate too much from the established goat look, as for a fantasy beastmen race it is pretty unique for the core of the Warhammer beastman to be a goat. However there is space for adding other elements to the beastmen in other parts of their bodies (look at centigors for example). For example, new minotaurs could get muscular bear arms. I am also a big fan of the jabberslythe and in my opinion it is the epitome of a beast of chaos, so more lizard and insect elements do also fit in. Imagine ungor raiders with dog legs for better running around in a skirmish, bestigors with pangolin scales for extra armor etc. 

The new beastlord and the underworld warband are excellent models and I hope they do lean into more animals than just goats. 

I look forward to the revamp, the AoS design team is the best going at the moment and I'm sure they will come up with something to delight yet horrify us with the Dark Kin. 

[Hollow]

21 minutes ago, pitzok said:

Let's switch it up by talking about new design possibilities for beasts

Eldritch Horror, terrifying bestial monstrosities. Something along the lines of these little dudes I just whipped up on Image Creator. 

Edited February 1 by Hollow

[Tonhel]

1 hour ago, Snarff said:

I think people are way overestimating the influence TOW is going to have on AoS. It's a smaller specialist game, it's not going to be driving decisions for their flagship fantasy game. 30K is also not leading to entire 40K armies or model ranges being cut for the benefit of 30K, or suddenly changing the design language of 40K because it had a succesful launch.

 

You can't really compare the 40K/30K situation. Firstly it's about Space Marines and Space Marines have their own marketing laws. It pays almost for everything.

Secondly AoS replaced Warhammer. This is a different situation. This means that there will always be some competition between both systems. For the next years AoS will without a doubt be the main fantasy game, but I do think GW has to deliver with AoS 4th edition. They have to do the rules right, if they want AoS to be a more easy / streamlined game.

It's perfect possible that at the end of AoS 4th edition TOW is increasing in importancy for GW and AoS stalled or is decreasing. Lol, ofcourse it could also mean that there is no TOW in 5 years. But with GW anything is possible and one thing that uppermanagement has noticed is that "nostalgy" sells. 

AoS is not a simple game to play. TOW has more special rules, equipment and etc, but once you know the rules it's easy. When you see the special rule "hatred" you know what the unit has as extra ability (it doesn't matter which army). With AoS, they have for the same rule, different names and sometimes a tiny change in the wording. It's a mess imo.

[Hollow]

11 minutes ago, Ogregut said:

Apart from orc & goblins and chaos warriors. 

Oh, come on. That's like saying there are Dwarfs in each setting which means they are the same! These are iconic Warhammer design "races" seen in every Warhammer setting and two of the most popular, it's completely different. It is just not the same thing. We have also seen through photography and the literal O+G model line that there is a there is ToW Orc and Goblin type and an AoS Orruk type. 

It's like saying because there are AoS Orks and 40k Orks that the same faction is in each game. It's not. There are Orks in both, like there are humans in both. 

Also, I don't think there are factions in AoS called Orc & Goblins or Chaos Warriors... are there? Nope. 

Edited February 1 by Hollow

[DD-Lord]

I am absolutely not a fan of the idea of BoC getting squated. If GeeDubs really think that their looks are too old and don't fit, they can try revamping them with more non-bovine features while at the same time keeping the bovines since they already feature to some degree in the god-specific forces with Slaanesh and Tzeentch.

Although at the same time, I can sort of see the reason behind trying to distance AoS and TOW.

[EonChao]

26 minutes ago, Hollow said:

Oh, come on. That's like saying there are Dwarfs in each setting which means they are the same! These are iconic Warhammer design "races" seen in every Warhammer setting and two of the most popular, it's completely different. It is just not the same thing. We have also seen through photography and the literal O+G model line that there is a there is ToW Orc and Goblin type and an AoS Orruk type. 

It's like saying because there are AoS Orks and 40k Orks that the same faction is in each game. It's not. There are Orks in both, like there are humans in both. 

Also, I don't think there are factions in AoS called Orc & Goblins or Chaos Warriors... are there? Nope. 

The faction in AoS is Beasts of Chaos, the faction in TOW is Beastmen. So that ticks the box for what you're talking about with orc or dwarf factions not having the same names then. Also they added rules for armoured squig hoppers with lances in TOW to incorporate options within the newer AoS kit so we know they don't mind kits crossing over. They also didn't mention things like Fanatics and Wolf Riders getting older models re-released but we know they have rules so again they must be fine with the AoS kits being used.

Plus they've released multiple plastic kits for Beasts of Chaos, the new Beastlord, the endless spells and the faction terrain, plus the Underworlds warbands. Remember not every faction got endless spells and/or terrain so that shows they have an idea for stuff to do with BoC. There's also the Blackstone Fortress and Kill Team Beastmen, both of which come from the main studio. So we know there are people there who have been working on Beastmen stuff for AoS and 40k in the last few years.

 

In general can we just put this nonsense to rest now, it's all based off a post from a random new member with no more rumour accuracy than getting a half guess about what would be revealed at TOW launch event right, which puts them on the same level of accuracy as Dana Howl's youtube video speculation. At least until we start getting 4th edition news from GW themselves.

Edited February 1 by EonChao

[Luperci]

1 hour ago, Kronos said:

Respectfully, I’m very much missing the Norse inspired Dwarfs. AoS does something very well and that is crank up the High Fantasy. 
 

I want to see what done with that Archetype, Whether it’s Dwarf Shieldmaidens from Valaya Riding Flying Goats (everyone gets a goat except BoC) or if they lean further into the  Wandering dwarf Side of things and we have more of a Ranger force similar to Bugmans rangers, with Grombrindal as a Special Character.

I think there’s A lot of Dwarf Design which the Khradron and the Slayers just aren’t quite tapping into for me. It doesn’t have to look like Old World Dwarfs, it should be What Lumineth is to High Elves. There are suggestions of influence, but it’s become it’s own thing, 

I definitely think there's design space for a norse inspired faction but I'd prefer that as something for the more neglected GAs like destruction or death

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

6 minutes ago, EonChao said:

In general can we just put this nonsense to rest now, it's all based off a post from a random new member with no more rumour accuracy than getting a half guess about what would be revealed at TOW launch event right, which puts them on the same level of accuracy as Dana Howl's youtube video speculation. At least until we start getting 4th edition news from GW themselves.

If you mean me, I've been very open about how I have exactly no evidence. I even said a little while back that I don't even consider it a rumor, just an idea that's been floating around in my head.

Even if it isn't directed at me, I'd hardly call it nonsense. I mean it's generating discussion. We all seem to be of an accord that no one would like the idea of Beasts dropping from the game.

But back to the topic at hand: someone on Facebook (where no one lies) said that the Beasts Question was brought up at a Q&A at LVO, where it was answered that Beasts are definitely remaining in AoS.

That's a lot of acronyms. 

But can anyone confirm this rumor? 

[Hollow]

13 minutes ago, EonChao said:

In general can we just put this nonsense to rest now,

Indeed. The BoC model range is being squatted from AoS and being ported over to ToW. What remains to be seen is if BoC as a faction will remain in AoS under a new thematic identity, be removed entirely or be folded into other existing Chaos factions. That's my bet. That is the writing I see written on the wall and time will tell. 

[Nuriel]

1 hour ago, Snarff said:

That's still a very different situation from taking a 40K army and moving it fully to 30K.

From the point of view of someone that have bought Horus Heresy starter box for 40k "because GW would never squat Space Marines, don't be ridiculous" it isn't exactly true, you know.

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

7 minutes ago, Hollow said:

The BoC model range is being squatted from AoS and being ported over to ToW. What remains to be seen is if BoC as a faction will remain in AoS under a new thematic identity, be removed entirely or be folded into other existing Chaos factions.

I'd absolutely hate that. I love my goatmen and I love AoS. I'm pretty open-minded about range updates but I guess the current design is just special to me.

Truthfully, I'd love to keep the current Gor (and friends) design in the main, but make them more feral.  These are savage, wild creatures that stalk through the woods with the ease of a man on an open road. 

I just realized I just kinda supported your idea, in a way. Haha!

Edited February 1 by Thalassic Monstrosity