AoS 2 - Skaventide Discussion

[Cosmicsheep]

@greg19190 that section of the Kragnos book has been removed from the app though. Now I know the app is not the source of truth, but it’s unclear whether we can still do mutations. Hopefully the FAQ will clear things up

[Skreech Verminking]

18 minutes ago, Cosmicsheep said:

@greg19190 that section of the Kragnos book has been removed from the app though. Now I know the app is not the source of truth, but it’s unclear whether we can still do mutations. Hopefully the FAQ will clear things up

I think intend is that we probably shouldn’t be able to use them.

but from a raw understanding, rat ogors can still take the mutations.

 

[greg19190]

23 minutes ago, Cosmicsheep said:

@greg19190 that section of the Kragnos book has been removed from the app though. Now I know the app is not the source of truth, but it’s unclear whether we can still do mutations. Hopefully the FAQ will clear things up

Let's hope so in the generals handbook it says the kragnose book still counts so until there is a faq I think it is fair game. Other books still have the broken stuff so think it is only fair

[Skreech Verminking]

4 minutes ago, greg19190 said:

Let's hope so in the generals handbook it says the kragnose book still counts so until there is a faq I think it is fair game. Other books still have the broken stuff so think it is only fair

That’s basically what I would do

[Moogypies]

Nah I ran them as Skaven book only, as I don't think it's RAI to still be getting the kragnos book buffs. But I did have the same thought.

Edited July 15, 2022 by Moogypies

[greg19190]

31 minutes ago, Moogypies said:

Nah I ran them as Skaven book only, as I don't think it's RAI to still be getting the kragnos book buffs. But I did have the same thought.

Fair one, I think a rat swarm are good as well. I have played a reinforced unit of them and they are annoy as it is hard to get rid of them for the equivalent points... And they come back

[Riff_Raff_Rascal]

@Causalis In a vacuum, the hardest hitting thing in our book is the warbringer. He has the uber rare reroll wounds ability that sends his damage to the moon. Dont be fooled though, he can be taken off board quite easily if you dont get the hit in first. A 4+ save isnt much against something that is huntin him.

weapon teams are in! go ham. Against a super aggro list like orruks, you can even opt to not hide them as cheap speed bumps if you truly think round 1 is gonna be ruff. That or just area denial. This is less fun and more tactical but its an option.

Dont sleep on MSU melee stormfiends. They are solid objective grabbers. Drill, flayer and flamer has been my go to for a one off commando squad. They can be battline while avoiding the extra damage from bounty hunters. Shooting is till viable for sure, but your looking at a reinforced unit to make it worth i think. 

Clawlord: Skreech knows whats up.

[Skreech Verminking]

5 minutes ago, Riff_Raff_Rascal said:

Clawlord: Skreech knows whats up.

Of course I’ve been plot-scheming a plan together, 2 weeks before the book even dropped.😈

yes-yes and I often opt. To take the less seen combinations 

[DocKeule]

2 hours ago, greg19190 said:

Let's hope so in the generals handbook it says the kragnose book still counts so until there is a faq I think it is fair game. Other books still have the broken stuff so think it is only fair

The Broken Realms books only count unless they are overwritten. The new Skaven battletome overwrites the Skaven rules from Kragnos unless they made it into the new book like the mutations for Hellpits has.

[greg19190]

17 minutes ago, DocKeule said:

The Broken Realms books only count unless they are overwritten. The new Skaven battletome overwrites the Skaven rules from Kragnos unless they made it into the new book like the mutations for Hellpits has.

Were is that from? 

[Skreech Verminking]

27 minutes ago, DocKeule said:

The Broken Realms books only count unless they are overwritten. The new Skaven battletome overwrites the Skaven rules from Kragnos unless they made it into the new book like the mutations for Hellpits has.

Well that would be true, but gw confirming that the broken realms can still be used, currently also means that the rules for the skaven would be valid.

which would currently mean that Rat ogors could still get a mutation.

personally I haven’t used those rules for such a purpose and I might not either.

I’m pretty certain the next faq will surely clarify our problems with the book

[Riff_Raff_Rascal]

12 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

which would currently mean that Rat ogors could still get a mutation.

Which is super peculiar seeing as they effectively got a mutation rolled into their new warscroll. Fortunately it was one of the most commonly picked ones. Its also inconsistent with the fact that HPA kept their mutation list. This is another bit of evidence that a good chunk of our new book was half-baked, they ported over half the Kragnos rules for Moulder but ultimately made moulder battle traits pretty boring. Their units got the tune-up they needed for sure, but much to be desired for a thematic all-Moulder list. 

Still waiting for that Flesh Golem Verminlord kit. That would be dope. 

[DocKeule]

16 hours ago, greg19190 said:

Were is that from? 

Is is stated in the comments from the core rules at several points like 20.0, 25.0, 26.0

 

16 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Well that would be true, but gw confirming that the broken realms can still be used, currently also means that the rules for the skaven would be valid.

which would currently mean that Rat ogors could still get a mutation.

personally I haven’t used those rules for such a purpose and I might not either.

I’m pretty certain the next faq will surely clarify our problems with the book

But only unless the rules have been overwritten by newer publications. We don't still use the warscrolls or point values from BR when there have been any updates.

The mutations were an addition to the Moulder allegiance. With the new battletome the allegiance has been updated again and the mutations for Rat Ogors have been cut.

[greg19190]

i had a game last night against beast claw riders, by turn 2 it looed grim for my opponent. see list below. 

played head on collision p36, i got the middle objective turn one and after popping out all the gutter runners out i killed off a thunder tusk rider and mornfang pack unit with just shooting. also summoned the boat boy 

turn 1 his turn he charged and killed my night runners (that were in his face) reaviling the assassins, one wiffed but the other one took 5 wounds off his frostlord on stone horn. 

he took turn 2  (i didn't win any of the role offs always a 1) he was stuck in combat and killed 1 assassin (the good one) and the other one scurried away, he has another frostlord and he charged the warpgnaw verminlord which took some mortals on the charge but scurried away in combat.

my turn 2 i moved the warpgnaw verminlord closer to his mawnfang pack on his back objective tail wipped them and charged in. i charged the now isolated frostlord that went in to the  warpgnaw verminlord with buffed up deciver (flaming weapons and arcane bolt) and Slynk Skittershank and his mates, some of his mates got stomped but he attacked first with the deciver and the the warpgnaw verminlord went against his mawnfang pack at this back objective. the deciver killed him (he had taken some damage from shooting) and that left my opponent with his genral and 2 mawnfang packs with me being 6 points ahead allrady. the rest of the game spiraled out of his control.

i didn't think the 6 to hit do mortals would be that good but on the gutter runners with 3 range attacks each it was averaging 2-3 per unit one got 6 in a turn... the deceiver with the devious advisory is very reliable damage wise and is probably worth his points. the warpgnaw verminlord is deffo under costed and is a grate pick and so are the gutter runners. i think the night runners are a very useful delivery service for the assassins and they are a bit more hit and miss but they has there uses as well. boat boy is worth a pick as blocking or for getting the warpgnaw verminlord across the table. 

overall nice to see eshin working, they felt thematic on the board and dare i say it powerful when used correctly, so many movement shenanigan's 

thank you for reading

 

eshin3.3.pdf

[greg19190]

20 minutes ago, DocKeule said:

25 minutes ago, DocKeule said:

Is is stated in the comments from the core rules at several points like 20.0, 25.0, 26.0

 

But only unless the rules have been overwritten by newer publications. We don't still use the warscrolls or point values from BR when there have been any updates.

The mutations were an addition to the Moulder allegiance. With the new battletome the allegiance has been updated again and the mutations for Rat Ogors have been cut.

 

i think @Riff_Raff_Rascal point is probably the most true they half baked the book without really thinking about it. but 20.0 is about priests 25.0 refences pitched battle profiles and 26.0 references battalions. the "upgrades" are just part of the kragnos book which is still in play as stated in on page 46, and done not come in to the category's of 20.0, 25.0 or 26.0 since the upgrades are not a pitched battle profile or battalion, i would say that they just didn't do a good job at getting consistency and so would argue that they are still applicable to our current book given the fact they dont brake the core rules. an faq/erata would solve the problem though.

respectfully i disagree with your interpretation with the rules as above. i love skaven and dont want to have rules taken away if i can help it given the fact GW will probably change loads of the rules in the next faq for us (plague monks) for the worse leaving other battle tomes with all there broken stuff, to be honest i just want to play extra big-big and scary rat ogers since i have just today finished painting a unit of 6. photo below

[DocKeule]

Sorry but that is just wishful thinking and it doesn't make any sense.

The same page 46 also includes a couple of publications that are even older that the Broken Realms books but are generally still in effect. By your logic anybody could just chose which rules to use or maybe even piece together rules from different points in time that most suits them.

I can understand the disappointment especially from players who have invested money and changed they armies in the light of the Broken Realms rules. But it has been more than a year since Kragnos. That is pretty long for GW to wait before revoking buffs compared to what they did to other factions.

GW is just an ****** company that wants to make us buy a often and fast as possible and nothing else. They don't care about balancing and they don't care about older factions being playable unless that involves buying a lot of new models. 

 

[GrimDork]

21 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

but gw confirming that the broken realms can still be used, currently also means that the rules for the skaven would be valid.

Have GW specifically said that the Skaven rules from Broken Realms can be used?

I would've thought that the BR books are in the approved list only for the armies that haven't had a new tome yet. Like KO, Lumineth, Cities etc. Surely once an army has a new tome you can't use an older version of the rules? 

[greg19190]

@GrimDork no they havent,

16 hours ago, GrimDork said:

Have GW specifically said that the Skaven rules from Broken Realms can be used?

I would've thought that the BR books are in the approved list only for the armies that haven't had a new tome yet. Like KO, Lumineth, Cities etc. Surely once an army has a new tome you can't use an older version of the rules? 

i think like you said it is probably just to help the older books out untill they get new ones, hopefully an faq will be out soon to clarify it all  has anyone else been able to get there rats out on the table over the weekend so far?

[Skreech Verminking]

16 hours ago, GrimDork said:

Have GW specifically said that the Skaven rules from Broken Realms can be used?

I would've thought that the BR books are in the approved list only for the armies that haven't had a new tome yet. Like KO, Lumineth, Cities etc. Surely once an army has a new tome you can't use an older version of the rules? 

 

12 minutes ago, greg19190 said:

@GrimDork no they havent,

i think like you said it is probably just to help the older books out untill they get new ones, hopefully an faq will be out soon to clarify it all  has anyone else been able to get there rats out on the table over the weekend so far?

I agree from a common sense, It would probably be correct to awesome that that book isn’t meant to keep our rules.

from a raw perspective, unless gw specifically says that the rules for the skaven can not be used, they are still useable 

[Causalis]

Has anyone tried running the new Screaming Bell? I know it's probably too expensive but I love the model and if there's a way to make it viable I would be interested. 

[Skreech Verminking]

42 minutes ago, Causalis said:

Has anyone tried running the new Screaming Bell? I know it's probably too expensive but I love the model and if there's a way to make it viable I would be interested. 

Yes.

it’s terrible

[Skreech Verminking]

On 7/16/2022 at 2:16 PM, greg19190 said:

i think @Riff_Raff_Rascal point is probably the most true they half baked the book without really thinking about it. but 20.0 is about priests 25.0 refences pitched battle profiles and 26.0 references battalions. the "upgrades" are just part of the kragnos book which is still in play as stated in on page 46, and done not come in to the category's of 20.0, 25.0 or 26.0 since the upgrades are not a pitched battle profile or battalion, i would say that they just didn't do a good job at getting consistency and so would argue that they are still applicable to our current book given the fact they dont brake the core rules. an faq/erata would solve the problem though.

respectfully i disagree with your interpretation with the rules as above. i love skaven and dont want to have rules taken away if i can help it given the fact GW will probably change loads of the rules in the next faq for us (plague monks) for the worse leaving other battle tomes with all there broken stuff, to be honest i just want to play extra big-big and scary rat ogers since i have just today finished painting a unit of 6. photo below

Are these basically the mod file for the skaven armored rat ogres, 3d printed?

[GrimDork]

On 7/17/2022 at 8:39 AM, Skreech Verminking said:

from a raw perspective, unless gw specifically says that the rules for the skaven can not be used, they are still useable 

I guess you're right RAW, good job GW 🤣

[DocKeule]

Seriously people...this is beyond stupid.

GW names the Broken Realms books because they include the most current versions of some profiles and allegiance abilities for some factions that haven't gotten an update since.

But if you look at the pages in Broken Realms this stuff is titled with "Battle Traits" and the opening lines talk about the "Clans Moulder allegiance ability which has been restructured with the new book so the older allegiance is voided. Plus the Broken Realms text opens with "If your army is a Skaventide army" and the new book doesn't use that keyword or allegiance any more.



So please stop fantasizing. 

[Tizianolol]

guys about "madness "tanquol spell. can i target as "enemy unit"  the enemy hero himself right?