AoS 2 - Skaventide Discussion

[Lord Krungharr]

I picked up a big lot with an old Corrupting Swarm box, box of Plague Monks, endless spells, 40 assembled rats of some sort and a Plague Censer and Lightning Cannon, plus the older tome (thought it was the current one but oh well).   GW still has the metal Warlocks on there, same price as eBay, so I'll get those and Archie from there. 

I'm gonna make my own gnawholes I think, just about a centimeter more diameter than a Balewind Vortex aren't they?  Saw a picture on an old TGA post.

[fishwaffle2232]

11 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

Looks like Gnawholes are improved.  I'm a bit confused on them however, it says you can teleport 1 unit per feature...does that mean up to 3 units per feature because the feature "can include 3 terrain features instead" ?

Then one could chuck lightning cannons across the table for better firing lines....and unload on Teclis!

I'm also liking the Doombell for the anti-battleshock....until/unless it explodes that is.💥

Yes you can use each gnawhole once per turn, which makes them a lot better, but they are much easier for your opponent to block now, as the opponent only needs to be within 3 inches to completely shut that gnawhole down. 

Throwing your cannons through a gnawhole is probably not the best idea, as you won't be able to overcharge them with the engineer, also you leave them very exposed. Doomwheels are a decent option to put through gnawholes, as they can work pretty independently. 

Bell of Doom is decent, but it's very unreliable and most opponents will be able to dispell it pretty easily, due to it's low casting requirement. The furnace is our best option for battleshock immunity bubble now.

[Lord Krungharr]

Furnace?!  Sorry, tome is on order.  I'll have to hunt down a Doomwheel or two eventually.  They don't look super great on paper but I remember them being a good crazy shock unit which on occasion really does some work.

[fishwaffle2232]

11 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

Furnace?!  Sorry, tome is on order.  I'll have to hunt down a Doomwheel or two eventually.  They don't look super great on paper but I remember them being a good crazy shock unit which on occasion really does some work.

Sorry, the plague furnace. For some reason GW decided to remove battleshock immunity from the screaming bell, but the plague furnace got to keep it. 

Doomwheels are still unreliable, but thanks to the masterclan special rule they can potentially dish out a decent amount of mortal wounds. 

If you take 3 masterclan units or warpseer (counts as masterclan) and 1 other masterclan, then you get a rule which allows all of your eligible units to make an extra pile in move, after the first unit has piled in. This is GREAT for doomwheels, because a pile in move is still a move, which would allow you to trigger the mortal wound damage for finishing within 1 inch of an enemy. This means that you can do mortal wounds from your movement, charge, 1st pile in and 2nd pile in. Thats potentially 4d3 mortals per doomwheel, on top of whatever they can do in shooting and combat. 

Not overpowered, but a lot of fun and its a good excuse to run multiple doomwheels. 

[Skreech Verminking]

5 hours ago, fishwaffle2232 said:

Sorry, the plague furnace. For some reason GW decided to remove battleshock immunity from the screaming bell, but the plague furnace got to keep it. 

Doomwheels are still unreliable, but thanks to the masterclan special rule they can potentially dish out a decent amount of mortal wounds. 

If you take 3 masterclan units or warpseer (counts as masterclan) and 1 other masterclan, then you get a rule which allows all of your eligible units to make an extra pile in move, after the first unit has piled in. This is GREAT for doomwheels, because a pile in move is still a move, which would allow you to trigger the mortal wound damage for finishing within 1 inch of an enemy. This means that you can do mortal wounds from your movement, charge, 1st pile in and 2nd pile in. Thats potentially 4d3 mortals per doomwheel, on top of whatever they can do in shooting and combat. 

Not overpowered, but a lot of fun and its a good excuse to run multiple doomwheels. 

I’ve been thinking a lot about this strategy, yet I don’t think it is worth using, well I might be wrong though.

personally you’ll be spending a lot of points into grey seers or the verminlord warpseer, for what ever reason you have, points which could be used into more wheels of doom or other toys that should or could deal more damage.

secondly, yes it is fun, to have a single doomwheel deal 5d3 mortal wounds to all units in range, yet the chance of doing 4d3 mortal wounds and having some more toys left, is also somewhat great, if not often better. And since the buffs the three clawsteps gives has been nerfed and nerfed again, I’m not certain it has really any reason to be taken, well in theory I would say the same thing for all of the three hero stuff 

[Lord Krungharr]

I'll have to do a lot of thinking.  My plan-scheme was to sell off the Verminlord and Bell/Furnaces to help pay for other things.  (just bought bunches of old Chaos Dwarves....they are costly).

[fishwaffle2232]

16 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

I’ve been thinking a lot about this strategy, yet I don’t think it is worth using, well I might be wrong though.

personally you’ll be spending a lot of points into grey seers or the verminlord warpseer, for what ever reason you have, points which could be used into more wheels of doom or other toys that should or could deal more damage.

secondly, yes it is fun, to have a single doomwheel deal 5d3 mortal wounds to all units in range, yet the chance of doing 4d3 mortal wounds and having some more toys left, is also somewhat great, if not often better. And since the buffs the three clawsteps gives has been nerfed and nerfed again, I’m not certain it has really any reason to be taken, well in theory I would say the same thing for all of the three hero stuff 

Well I don't think it is a huge downside spending points on the warpseer, as I think he isn't too bad with his leadership aura and his casting. He is probabaly on the expensive side, even after the small discount, but as I have mentioned in a previous post, I think dreaded warpgale is still a fantastic spell, and with master of magic, the warpseer has a better chance of getting it off. I definitely can't justify taking 3 greyseers on foot, as I think they end up not doing much for their points, whereas the warpseer is hitty enough to still get some work done.

As far as I understand, three clawsteps ahead hasn't been nerfed, its just been clarified, as I think people were getting the rule wrong. I personally never played it where you were able to use the first charge roll with modifiers. As is though, being able to guarantee a charge a roll value for your entire army, is pretty good if you get a good first roll and if you don't roll well, you still can still roll for the rest of your army if you charge value won't be high enough. 

When I get home from work i'll post the list i'm thinking of. But basically I will be taking 20 stormvermin with a clawlord, in addition to the 3 doomwheels and the eshin underworlds warband. This still gives me a relatively effective hammer with the SV, who can also receive deathfrenzy. The eshin warband should work nicely to support the doomwheels or to just go off hunting low wound heroes or artillery.

Don't get me wrong, i'm not promoting this as a world beater, but I certainly think it could do well in some mid and bottom table matchups. It would definitely be fine for non competitive games. But lets face it, we all just want excuses to run our doomwheels, and I think the three clawsteps ahead rule gives a buff to doomwheels and the efficiency of the buff increases as the number of doomwheels increases. 

Unfortunately my only test game was against beastclaw, which is a terrible matchup, given that we can't roll over things, except for the the levitating doomwheel cracking into skulls. I did like the way the army played though, and the three clawsteps rule wasn't as janky as I thought it would be.  

 

EDIT: Rules correction on three clawsteps. 

Edited December 2, 2022 by fishwaffle2232

[Lord Krungharr]

Doomwheels really are among the coolest models EVER.  I support, endorse, and applaud anything making them useful.

My tome is in the PO Box, I'll be enjoying the lore-tales in it this weekend.  

[Skreech Verminking]

2 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

Doomwheels really are among the coolest models EVER.  I support, endorse, and applaud anything making them useful.

My tome is in the PO Box, I'll be enjoying the lore-tales in it this weekend.  

You do that

[Skreech Verminking]

11 hours ago, fishwaffle2232 said:

Well I don't think it is a huge downside spending points on the warpseer, as I think he isn't too bad with his leadership aura and his casting. He is probabaly on the expensive side, even after the small discount, but as I have mentioned in a previous post, I think dreaded warpgale is still a fantastic spell, and with master of magic, the warpseer has a better chance of getting it off. I definitely can't justify taking 3 greyseers on foot, as I think they end up not doing much for their points, whereas the warpseer is hitty enough to still get some work done.

As far as I understand, three clawsteps ahead hasn't been nerfed, its just been clarified, as I think people were getting the rule wrong. I personally never played it where you were able to use the first charge roll with modifiers. As is though, being able to guarantee a charge a roll value for your entire army, is pretty good if you get a good first roll and if you don't roll well, you still can still roll for the rest of your army if you charge value won't be high enough. 

When I get home from work i'll post the list i'm thinking of. But basically I will be taking 20 stormvermin with a clawlord, in addition to the 3 doomwheels and the eshin underworlds warband. This still gives me a relatively effective hammer with the SV, who can also receive deathfrenzy. The eshin warband should work nicely to support the doomwheels or to just go off hunting low wound heroes or artillery.

Don't get me wrong, i'm not promoting this as a world beater, but I certainly think it could do well in some mid and bottom table matchups. It would definitely be fine for non competitive games. But lets face it, we all just want excuses to run our doomwheels, and I think the three clawsteps ahead rule gives a buff to doomwheels and the efficiency of the buff increases as the number of doomwheels increases. 

Unfortunately my only test game was against beastclaw, which is a terrible matchup, given that we can't roll over things, except for the the levitating doomwheel cracking into skulls. I did like the way the army played though, and the three clawsteps rule wasn't as janky as I thought it would be.  

 

EDIT: Rules correction on three clawsteps. 

Remember, even if you din’t get levitate of, you can still do some good amount of damage against units with more then 3wounds.

afterall they can end a movement within 1 inch of them, dealing d3 mortals on any pile in and charge move agains the bigger wound kind of units

 

 

[SevenXes]

Good evening @ll!

This year I have exclusively played the Kruleboyz - including tournaments - but due to them being rather weak and also quite one-dimensional I am looking for a second army to collect and play until my Boyz get a proper tome. Which brings me to the Skaven.

I plan on diving into the faction with the Battlebox, which appears to be a rather good deal especially when starting Clan Pestilens (which is what I am aiming for, for now). There are however a couple of questions and hopefully you can help me out:

1. The Battlebox contains a Plague Priest on Plague Furnace. The Bell (alternative model) is built with a Rag Ogor holding the chain. Can this Rat Ogor also be used for the Plague Furnace, instead of the three monks?

2. I like the Verminlord Corruptor, judging by his Warscroll he appears to be a finde addition to Clan Pestilens. What is your opinion on his performance? Is this model worth it?

3. I also love the Hell Pit Abomination, though I have rarely seen it in any Battlereports. Is this unit usable in a Pestilens list? I could not find any restrictions online, wanted to make sure though.

4. Plague Censer Bearers: These dudes are way too expensive to buy them via GW/Vendors.I have read multiple times that it is recommended to convert Plague Monks. Is this doable without much effort? Im not keen on converting things unless its really easy.

5. Last but not least: Do Stromfiends make sense in a pestilens list?

 

Thank you very much in advance  

[DocKeule]

10 hours ago, SevenXes said:

This year I have exclusively played the Kruleboyz - including tournaments - but due to them being rather weak and also quite one-dimensional I am looking for a second army to collect and play until my Boyz get a proper tome. Which brings me to the Skaven.

If you want to play tournaments I don't know if Skaven are the way to go. They are extremely swingy and (according to the current statistics from the honest wargamer) their winrate is exactly as bad as the Kruelboyz.

Non the less..
 

11 hours ago, SevenXes said:

I plan on diving into the faction with the Battlebox, which appears to be a rather good deal especially when starting Clan Pestilens (which is what I am aiming for, for now). There are however a couple of questions and hopefully you can help me out:

1. The Battlebox contains a Plague Priest on Plague Furnace. The Bell (alternative model) is built with a Rag Ogor holding the chain. Can this Rat Ogor also be used for the Plague Furnace, instead of the three monks?

If you want to concentrate on Clan Pestilenz the battlebox is not the best way to start. It would be much better to look for at least two of the old start collecting kits. You should still be able to find some online or at local shops (maybe even with a nice dicount now that got phased out). 

If you also want Stormfiends and Clanrats this box is alright. But appart from the Furnace there is nothing for Pestilenz in here.

Also the three monks are not really good to be played as single models. As war as I remember theiy are one or two pieces on the sprew.
 

11 hours ago, SevenXes said:

2. I like the Verminlord Corruptor, judging by his Warscroll he appears to be a finde addition to Clan Pestilens. What is your opinion on his performance? Is this model worth it?

Fluff-wise it is a nice addition and in a pure Pestilenz list he gives you some magic. (He cannot chose any spells from the Skaven lores so meh).

I have one Verminlord and did not build it to fit any specific type. I just use him as whichever kind I want.
 

11 hours ago, SevenXes said:

3. I also love the Hell Pit Abomination, though I have rarely seen it in any Battlereports. Is this unit usable in a Pestilens list? I could not find any restrictions online, wanted to make sure though.

In the current meta with more smaller elite units crazy good saves and high rend it has a harder time to find it's role than it used to.

It is strong against hordes but you don't see too many of those in the current edition.

 

11 hours ago, SevenXes said:

4. Plague Censer Bearers: These dudes are way too expensive to buy them via GW/Vendors.I have read multiple times that it is recommended to convert Plague Monks. Is this doable without much effort? Im not keen on converting things unless its really easy.

The Plangue Monks sprew has one arm with a flail that looks similar to the cencer bearers. You get for of those arms in each package of 20 monks.

Not sure if I would go that heavy on Pestilenz to be honest. Monks are a good hammer if the are buffed and if they hit first. But they also crumble quickly once they take damage. 
 

11 hours ago, SevenXes said:

5. Last but not least: Do Stromfiends make sense in a pestilens list?

Well you want shooting and Stormfiends are one of the best options you have for Skaven. But you need a Skryre Hero to go with them. The only shooting Pestilenz has is the catapult which is very unreliable (just one shot) and works best against hordes also.
 

[Skreech Verminking]

11 hours ago, SevenXes said:

Good evening @ll!

This year I have exclusively played the Kruleboyz - including tournaments - but due to them being rather weak and also quite one-dimensional I am looking for a second army to collect and play until my Boyz get a proper tome. Which brings me to the Skaven.

I plan on diving into the faction with the Battlebox, which appears to be a rather good deal especially when starting Clan Pestilens (which is what I am aiming for, for now). There are however a couple of questions and hopefully you can help me out:

1. The Battlebox contains a Plague Priest on Plague Furnace. The Bell (alternative model) is built with a Rag Ogor holding the chain. Can this Rat Ogor also be used for the Plague Furnace, instead of the three monks?

2. I like the Verminlord Corruptor, judging by his Warscroll he appears to be a finde addition to Clan Pestilens. What is your opinion on his performance? Is this model worth it?

3. I also love the Hell Pit Abomination, though I have rarely seen it in any Battlereports. Is this unit usable in a Pestilens list? I could not find any restrictions online, wanted to make sure though.

4. Plague Censer Bearers: These dudes are way too expensive to buy them via GW/Vendors.I have read multiple times that it is recommended to convert Plague Monks. Is this doable without much effort? Im not keen on converting things unless its really easy.

5. Last but not least: Do Stromfiends make sense in a pestilens list?

 

Thank you very much in advance  

1.yes, the rat ogre shouldn’t really matter too much. Just call it a conversion, if somebody complains. So go for it😉.

2.well he has the I must be the warlord syndrome and really wants that one artefact that boost his melee damage, yet it isn’t really much different with the other verminlord.

Personally he is fine, so if you want to use him, that shouldn’t be a problem.

3.i personally think that the hell pit is currently suffering.

he has high rend and some good damage potential, but his 5+ save makes him extremely vulnerable to almost everything.

he also has a horde killer ability, but with no hordes having been seem on the tables, he doesn’t really get to use it to often efficiently. 
 

4. has been answered by dear backstabbing @DocKeule  incredible well.

5. In a lorefriendly sense and gameplay wise both work. Pretty well.

Stormfiends are often seen being used by many different kind of clans, after all they are just a faulty production sold by clan skryre to other clans.

still I consider the stormfiends one of the most boring units in the book that can be played, even though they are probably more reliable then most of the other stuff.

ps: now I should mention, I’ve answered your question more out of a fluff/fun context and I haven’t really gone extremely into the competitive worth of the skaven.

I do admit that I am very competitive, but I dislike telling people to play stormfiends and only stormfiends to win games, when I personally dislike playing them on my own.

thankfully @DocKeule gave a good competitive guide to you, I hope you can see both of those side and choose by that.

Also, if I were you have a look at the meta presentation of the honest wargamer.

It is much more reliable than what gw is currently giving to us.

Now I’m not saying that gw is lying to their own customers, but they will very likely only look at the gw represented tournaments, gw organized  tournaments and so on.

While the honest wargamer truly has a look at literally almost all grand tournaments 

 

3 minutes ago, DocKeule said:

Well you want shooting and Stormfiends are one of the best options you have for Skaven. But you need a Skryre Hero to go with them. The only shooting Pestilenz has is the catapult which is very unreliable (just one shot) and works best against hordes also.

They are also one of the most boring options in a skaven list.

[DocKeule]

1 hour ago, Skreech Verminking said:

1 hour ago, DocKeule said:

Well you want shooting and Stormfiends are one of the best options you have for Skaven. But you need a Skryre Hero to go with them. The only shooting Pestilenz has is the catapult which is very unreliable (just one shot) and works best against hordes also.

They are also one of the most boring options in a skaven list.

 I like them lore-wise. Showering your enemy with hazardous trash is so Skaven.  And when the old warscroll battalions where still legit they brought decent results especially against larger units. 

 

1 hour ago, Skreech Verminking said:

I do admit that I am very competitive, but I dislike telling people to play stormfiends and only stormfiends to win games, when I personally dislike playing them on my own.

I think competitively it is one of the best units we have. If they are fully buffed they are a threat to most important targets (where the cannon often is out of range and not mobile enough. 

I wouldn't use Skaven in tournaments. (Frankly I have stopped going to tournaments any way.) They are much more fun against opponents that won't max out their lists still leave you some breezing room for everybody to have fun.

I don't quite understand why GW doesn't give them more attention since they are one of few real original GW IPs. But I guess just like Night Goblins they just don't really fit the aesthetics that GW is going for in AoS.

[Skreech Verminking]

33 minutes ago, DocKeule said:

I don't quite understand why GW doesn't give them more attention since they are one of few real original GW IPs. But I guess just like Night Goblins they just don't really fit the aesthetics that GW is going for in AoS.

No apparently fantasy späss marines are😂

[Tizianolol]

Hi guys, i have a question aboou "pestilence-pestilence" prayer from furnace. If I hit a skaven pestilence unit i can bring back for exemple models of plague monk from death? Or I can just heal a model? Thx a lot

[SevenXes]

11 hours ago, DocKeule said:

If you want to play tournaments I don't know if Skaven are the way to go. They are extremely swingy and (according to the current statistics from the honest wargamer) their winrate is exactly as bad as the Kruelboyz.

Non the less..

Oh no, its not about playing tournaments for - although the option is nice - its mostly about having a more diverse army that has more to offer than just fishing for 6s.

11 hours ago, DocKeule said:

If you want to concentrate on Clan Pestilenz the battlebox is not the best way to start. It would be much better to look for at least two of the old start collecting kits. You should still be able to find some online or at local shops (maybe even with a nice dicount now that got phased out). 

If you also want Stormfiends and Clanrats this box is alright. But appart from the Furnace there is nothing for Pestilenz in here.

Also the three monks are not really good to be played as single models. As war as I remember theiy are one or two pieces on the sprew.
 

I should have been more specific; I was not talking about playing the monks as single models, my question was aiming towards building the furnace with an ogor instead of the rats. Because - as mentioned - the Ogor is part of the model with the bell. So my idea was to use him at the back of the furnace instead of the rats.

 

11 hours ago, DocKeule said:

Fluff-wise it is a nice addition and in a pure Pestilenz list he gives you some magic. (He cannot chose any spells from the Skaven lores so meh).

I have one Verminlord and did not build it to fit any specific type. I just use him as whichever kind I want.

Okay, that is good to know. I was just thinking by looking at his profile that he would be a good fit.

 

11 hours ago, DocKeule said:

In the current meta with more smaller elite units crazy good saves and high rend it has a harder time to find it's role than it used to.

It is strong against hordes but you don't see too many of those in the current edition.

Again I should have been more specific: my question was not regarding the viability but the general possibility to use the model. Are there any restriction in using this fine creature?

11 hours ago, DocKeule said:

The Plangue Monks sprew has one arm with a flail that looks similar to the cencer bearers. You get for of those arms in each package of 20 monks.

Not sure if I would go that heavy on Pestilenz to be honest. Monks are a good hammer if the are buffed and if they hit first. But they also crumble quickly once they take damage. 

May I ask what would you recommend instead?

11 hours ago, DocKeule said:

Well you want shooting and Stormfiends are one of the best options you have for Skaven. But you need a Skryre Hero to go with them. The only shooting Pestilenz has is the catapult which is very unreliable (just one shot) and works best against hordes also.
 

Okay that explains it a bit better, Im still figuring out what heroes are necessary for which unit.

Thank you very much for your input! That is really helpful.

11 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

1.yes, the rat ogre shouldn’t really matter too much. Just call it a conversion, if somebody complains. So go for it😉.

So its possible to build the Furnace with the Ogor, thats great news

11 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

ps: now I should mention, I’ve answered your question more out of a fluff/fun context and I haven’t really gone extremely into the competitive worth of the skaven.

I do admit that I am very competitive, but I dislike telling people to play stormfiends and only stormfiends to win games, when I personally dislike playing them on my own.

thankfully @DocKeule gave a good competitive guide to you, I hope you can see both of those side and choose by that.

Also, if I were you have a look at the meta presentation of the honest wargamer.

It is much more reliable than what gw is currently giving to us.

Now I’m not saying that gw is lying to their own customers, but they will very likely only look at the gw represented tournaments, gw organized  tournaments and so on.

While the honest wargamer truly has a look at literally almost all grand tournaments 

 

They are also one of the most boring options in a skaven list.

I do play tournaments from time to time, so as mentioned above Id at least like to have the option to build something a bit stronger and also an army that has more variety than just fishing for the 6s.

Thank you too for your input, its really helpful!

 

 

[fishwaffle2232]

@SevenXes Skaven generally aren't the top when it comes to winning tournaments, but it really depends how you play them. I think there are some pretty strong lists that lean heavily into our most efficient and reliable models, which at the moment are stormfiends, Thanquol, plague censer bearers. Even playing with a super competitive list, you will probably find that other armies just do it better. 

On the whole win rate thing, when looking at the meta stats. I would be careful with how you interpret this. Skaven has always been an army where people tend to play them for what they like, and in general you will very rarely see two people running the exact same lists. I think for this reason there is a lot of variance in the type of players you see taking them to tournaments, which almost certainly has an impact on their win rate. 

If you arent particularly keen on winning tournaments but you would like an army where you might win say 2-3/5 games, then I think that is very doable with skaven, and you will have a fun time doing it. Particularly if you throw some of our fun high risk to reward stuff, like warplightning cannons, ratling guns, or doomwheels. 

As the others have said, Stormfiends are great, but they are pretty straight forward. keep them near a warlock for buffs, and go to town on shooting. If you are getting the starter boxes, they are a great unit to have. I personally think they look cool as hell, and they are only boring when you compare them to our other fun and quirky units that I mentioned above. 

I have been playing skaven for about 5 years now, and I still havent gotten bored with them. There are many different play styles that are afforded to us, due to the size of our book. I think they are a great pick if you want to play something that is fun to play with and against.  

[DocKeule]

10 hours ago, SevenXes said:

I should have been more specific; I was not talking about playing the monks as single models, my question was aiming towards building the furnace with an ogor instead of the rats. Because - as mentioned - the Ogor is part of the model with the bell. So my idea was to use him at the back of the furnace instead of the rats.

I think the chain for the ogor and the bell might be shorter that the one for the monks and the furnace. As far as I remember it is not the same piece. But that shouldn't be too hard to fix.
 

10 hours ago, SevenXes said:

May I ask what would you recommend instead?

One or two bigger units of monks as a hammer isn't bad. But for screens I would use Clanrats. They are cheaper and still have a better save.
 

10 hours ago, SevenXes said:

Okay that explains it a bit better, Im still figuring out what heroes are necessary for which unit.

Thank you very much for your input! That is really helpful.

Unfortunatly GW strayed a little away from this concept.

With Skyre units (alt least if they are important to your strategy) you still should have an Engineer, Bombardier or Arch Warlock for support. Warstone sparks and the "More More Warppower" spell can really boost the efficiency. If you take a Skryre hero as your general the "Deranged Inventor" is also good.

The Clawlord also still buffs Verminus units with a special command ability but I would argue that Clanrats aren't worth the extra points. A large unit of Stormvermin maybe.

For the other clans GW took away most of the special buffs. Plague Priests for example don't really do anything special for Plague Monks or Cencer Bearers any more. The furnace is nice for the 13" battleshock bubble. That can help your screens to stick around a lot longer.

But for example Grey Seer with the "Death Frenzy" spell will probably do more to make your Monks a threat than a Plague Priest on foot or on Furnace.

[greg19190]

@SevenXes you will get a more diverse army, unless you want to fish for 6s with Eshin stuff  put the ogre on the back if that's what you want to do its not 40k were different guns on the marines means stuff most people probably won't notice.

the verminlord corrupter he gives pestilence stuff +1to hit and wound in combat so yer good fit.

you can but there are a lot of cool stuff coming out of 3d printers that arnt that expensive for plague censer bearers.

no restrictions on hellpit at all, you just wont get the upgrade from the master Molders army ability. the unit is quite ok by its self as there arnt to many buffs you can give it to make it better, the skaven pack stuff gets most out of buffs from the master molder and pack masters, there is way of making it better.

rat ogres would be a good wounds sponge and hammer if you have the reinforcement points and if you have the master molder you can bring them back on a 3+ when the unit dies with a cp and get your pet hellpit to have an upgrade. enjoy your games.

[Skreech Verminking]

33 minutes ago, greg19190 said:

@SevenXes you will get a more diverse army, unless you want to fish for 6s with Eshin stuff  put the ogre on the back if that's what you want to do its not 40k were different guns on the marines means stuff most people probably won't notice.

the verminlord corrupter he gives pestilence stuff +1to hit and wound in combat so yer good fit.

you can but there are a lot of cool stuff coming out of 3d printers that arnt that expensive for plague censer bearers.

no restrictions on hellpit at all, you just wont get the upgrade from the master Molders army ability. the unit is quite ok by its self as there arnt to many buffs you can give it to make it better, the skaven pack stuff gets most out of buffs from the master molder and pack masters, there is way of making it better.

rat ogres would be a good wounds sponge and hammer if you have the reinforcement points and if you have the master molder you can bring them back on a 3+ when the unit dies with a cp and get your pet hellpit to have an upgrade. enjoy your games.

I think if you truly want to buff hell pits you really have lean into the whole thing.

there is a moulder command trait that gives all clan moulder fighting beast, which the hell pit is, within 13 inches of him +1 to hit and wound.

but if you’re going this route you’ll really want 2-4hell pits, or the ct would be a waste.

While you need three master moulder to give all of your hell pits a mutation, the first one gets it free no matter if you have any master moulder.

so unless you’re packing a single hell pit, there really is no reason to take a master moulder, sonce the first mutation on a hell pit is a given  

[DocKeule]

3 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

While you need three master moulder to give all of your hell pits a mutation, the first one gets it free no matter if you have any master moulder.

Don't you need at least one hero from a clan to get the specific battle trait?

[greg19190]

10 minutes ago, DocKeule said:

Don't you need at least one hero from a clan to get the specific battle trait?

that is how I read it as well...

[Skreech Verminking]

16 minutes ago, DocKeule said:

Don't you need at least one hero from a clan to get the specific battle trait?

Not with moulder or with eshin.

 

Most of the abilities next to that often are in need of a hero from that specific clan to be on the board to use it.

an wxample would be the heroic action that can only be used by a clalwlord, or the abilityof a 3+++ save for your grey seer.

fun fact: clan skyre is the only clan that explicitly demands you to have a warlock engineer to even get warpstone sparks, not that it would matter too much since you couldn’t use it without a warlock anyways 

with eshin and clan moulder you get step one basicaly free of charge (no heroes needed) while the extra ability gets to be used after you take 3heroes of that clan  into your army

Edited December 6, 2022 by Skreech Verminking

[DocKeule]

I am pretty sure you need a hero to unlock any clan's battle trait but I only have the app in reach at work. I will check the book later at home.