AoS 2 - Soulblight Discussion

[Macarian]

Some great ideas here, I' ve been playing Legion of Blood, but with Vargheists finally becoming battleline again I am looking to retool my new army into a Soulblight force.

What are you guys'  thoughts about the new mercenary companies. I was thinking adding the Rampagers to my list for some cheap bodies to complement the elite Vampires. I also like how their ability basically "extends" the normal deployment zone.

I was thinking about something like this:

Soulblight Allegiance (Necromantic Bloodline)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Leaders
Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (General) ---- 440pts
Mist Form / Doppelganger Cloak / Chalice / Sword / Shield / Amaranthine Orb

Vampire Lord on Nightmare Steed ---- 140pts
Chalice / Vile Transference

Battleline
10x Bloodknights ---- 400pts

3x Vargheists ---- 150pts

3x Vargheists ---- 150pts

Units
2x Bat Swarms ---- 80pts

Allies: Rampagers Mercenary Company
40x Chaos Marauders ---- 200pts
Axes / Shields / Damned Icon

40x Chaos Marauders ---- 200pts
Axes / Shields / Damned Icon

Endless Spelss
Shards of Valagharr ---- 40pts

TOT 1800pts / 4 CP

Edited June 22, 2019 by Macarian

[Raptor_Jesues]

17 hours ago, Macarian said:

Stuff

 i dont really care about mercs at tihis moment but i suppose that having some cannon fire with the dawi fire squad along with the knights and vargheists could be interesting.  Although i find it very mutch not chivalrous it could be effective against hero/monster dependent factions like fyreslayers etc. On the other hand i dont know how usefull can marauders be since we are already quite fast
As for your list,  the CP are quite a lot, are you sure you need them?

Edited June 23, 2019 by Raptor_Jesues

[angrycontra]

Furthermore, new rules only allow buying max 1 cp with 50p

Edited June 23, 2019 by angrycontra

[Honk]

1 hour ago, angrycontra said:

Furthermore, new rules only allow buying max 1 cp with 50p

So another squat of vargheist!!!

[Charlo]

I feel like if you're playing Soulblight and taking Mercs for bodies... Just play legion of blood and take Skeletons / Zombies/ Chainrasps. They have loads more synergy.

[Macarian]

8 hours ago, Raptor_Jesues said:

As for your list,  the CP are quite a lot, are you sure you need them?

Well, re-roll charges, extra attacks and re-rolls on hits & Saves are amazing in my opinion  Still, it's probably overkill and with the restriction I'll just buy the one I can and be more selective in their usage. Question now becomes what to add. obviously another group of Vargheist would be good though I'm also thinking about dropping the Bat Swarms for another Vampire Lord and the Emerald Lifeswarm for some solid Healing.

3 hours ago, Charlo said:

I feel like if you're playing Soulblight and taking Mercs for bodies... Just play legion of blood and take Skeletons / Zombies/ Chainrasps. They have loads more synergy.

Good point and Chainrasps in Legion of Blood make for a compelling alternative, However I do have some thoughts regarding the comparison:

Marauders are quite a bit cheaper per wound at 5 points vs. 7 point Chainrasps for units of 40. Offensively they are comparable, with the Chainrasps bringing more attacks but the Marauders having built in buffs. Defensively the Chainrasps are better with the 6++ but mostly they're better against weapons with rend. The cheapness of the marauders means you would effectively need to heal or save 16 more wounds on the Chainrasps during a match to make up the difference in cost. Not impossible for this force but certainly not what my force aims to do.  The ability to bring back the whole unit I feel is not very realistic as your opponent can easily block the gravesite when looking for the space to bring back such a large unit. Reducing the unit size to compensate would increase the wounds to heal to make up the difference in cost. Lastly and most importantly for me, I like how the Mercenary Company brings a unique rule which cannot be found elsewhere. By moving the Marauders out of the deployment zone, the Blood Knights can deploy on the edge while still being screened by another unit. This gives them maximum movement while still keeping them screened.

Despite that the Chainrasps are clearly the better tarpit option and I expect the Marauders to drop like flies. But I feel my force benefits from a cheaper screen more than a tarpit unit. Plus, I wouldn't be a Lord of the Night if I wouldn't smile at the thought of all those pawns sacrificing themselves for my glory. Mortal blood does shine so much brighter than Ectoplasm after all...

Edited June 23, 2019 by Macarian

[Charlo]

22 hours ago, Macarian said:

Lastly and most importantly for me, I like how the Mercenary Company brings a unique rule which cannot be found elsewhere. By moving the Marauders out of the deployment zone, the Blood Knights can deploy on the edge while still being screened by another unit. This gives them maximum movement while still keeping them screened.

Fair point about this. Deploy them early and have the knights right behind them. Can units move over friendlies without fly though?

[Macarian]

1 hour ago, Charlo said:

Fair point about this. Deploy them early and have the knights right behind them. Can units move over friendlies without fly though?

They can't, though I think something along these lines would probably work:

[Honk]

4 hours ago, Charlo said:

Can units move over friendlies without fly though?

No, but that is what’s neffi spell for...

[Raptor_Jesues]

I still dont know... to be honest i would just prefere some allied direwolves or skellies to screen my knights

[Phil D]

Hi

New to Soulblight, came to it via seeing Neferata model and falling in love, reading some books to reinforce that love, then adding Adehma and the Sisterhood of Szandor blood knights to my love list. Have assembled a themed (and totally illegal) death army around the final battle in the Undying King book, and now looking to start a Soulblight army. I have the LoN battletome but can't find the Soulblight abilities, battle traits etc. Can you tell me where they are please?

Thanks in advance.

[Charlo]

They're with the rest of the allegiance stuff!

[Phil D]

Thanks for the replies, complete brain ******!!

That's the problem of cherrypicking the book with limited time. If only they put a list of what's in the book at the front, like a table of contents, that would be useful. They could call it an In-decks.

[Raptor_Jesues]

So, i've finally tried my list against 5 different armies and here is my 2 pennies:

Swift death confirms itself as the best bloodline, charging over chaff and running off to take far objectives is too useful not to have in an army like this. I would consider necromantic if i take vhordrai with mannfred or some endless spells. Dragon warriors is just meh and masters of night is mostly useless. 

The knights are just right. They dont feel overcosted or undercosted and make their dirty work, and although they can be a bit swingy with d3 damage, putting more in a unit can soft-counter the problem. I will change the 2 units of 5 and the one of 10 in two units of 10 and roll around at the speed of sound. You HAVE to get the charge, this is also why i like swift death.

Vargheists are really good but dont expect them to last long. Weirdly i found them better at objectives than BKs since being faster and being better in general against hordes is apparently more valuable than tankyness. I really wish BK had 2 damage attacks too...

The bat swarms are reeeeeally useful against order and skaven, holy dudu.  Super annoying against shooty units and that -1 to hit with bows is just mmmmmm. 

I find that Fell bats are still mostly useless

Ye olde vampire lords are still nice, no changes here (the two CA of the foot and dragon VL are mostly the same in regard of damage increase when put on BK and Vargheists so go nuts). Same goes for the coven throne, a nice middle point (but you can argue that its CA is better since it even gives you mistic shield)

Mannfred is now nicer. His CA is still amazing and gives basically the same damage increase of the lords one except to everyone at the same time. A full 20 knights, mannfred and dragon charge with this slapped on can wipe half an army if not more in one turn.

Neferata is still overcosted and defensive style is not what comes to mind with soulblight, so i will still not take her.

The army overall is way better. I would not call it competitive since im not a competitive player and actually quite the noob but still, it feels really cool to rock the red on those metal riff inducing fullplate armored vampire knights with 10 foots lances. I wonder why...
Not being able to give deathlords death lore spells, still really pisses me off

Again, this is my opinion grown in not many games, so there is room to change my perspective
 

Edited July 1, 2019 by Raptor_Jesues

[TMS]

I think that's a good assessment, @Raptor_Jesues.

The biggest thing I see with Neferata right now is in a necromantic list together with a VLoZD and Vhordrai for double ethereal dragons. Before the points changes you could not fit these things into a 2k list, so that is an entirely new option opened up.

And yeah, if only the two mortarchs could choose spells from the deathmage lore that'd give them some identity in list building.

[Charlo]

1 hour ago, TMS said:

I think that's a good assessment, @Raptor_Jesues.

The biggest thing I see with Neferata right now is in a necromantic list together with a VLoZD and Vhordrai for double ethereal dragons. Before the points changes you could not fit these things into a 2k list, so that is an entirely new option opened up.

And yeah, if only the two mortarchs could choose spells from the deathmage lore that'd give them some identity in list building.

Yup this is what I'm half building towards now. It's totally unique within Soulblight so worth abusing IMO. I think even a dreaded Terrorgheist would struggle taking out two 3++ Dragonlords before they smash him back into the dirt.

I also have something in my head around using the Mercenary Archreagents (as they aren't allies, right?) for additional casts/ unbinds and free chaff in ghouls to shore up our elite nature. Plus it's all in the Vampire theme. Buying the additional CP may be mandatory here though.

Also wondering if Crimson Keep has some legs now it got 120pts cheaper at minimum.

[EMMachine]

51 minutes ago, Charlo said:

Also wondering if Crimson Keep has some legs now it got 120pts cheaper at minimum.

Crimson Keep has still the problem that it is a "Death" battalion, not a "Soulblight" Battalion, which means all units inside the battalion become Allies if used in a Soulblight Army. You can use it with the Legions, because the Legions give there Keyword to this battalion, but Soulblight doesn't.

Quote

Q: The rules say that a warscroll battalion can include allies
and that they don’t count against the number of allies in the
army. Does this rule only apply to battalions that share the
same allegiance as the army, but that have units from two
different factions (a battalion in a Daughters of Khaine army
that has Daughters of Khaine and Stormcast Eternals units,
for example)?
A: Yes. The faction a warscroll battalion belongs to is
shown on its warscroll, above the title of the battalion.
In addition, the battalion is assumed to belong to the
Grand Alliance that its faction is a part of. Warscroll
battalions that share the same allegiance as an army
can always be taken as part of the army, and if they
include any allied units, these units do not count against
the limits on the number of allies the army can have
(or against the points limit that can be spent on allies
in a Pitched Battle). An army can include a warscroll
battalion of a different allegiance to the rest of the
army, but if it does so the units in it do count against the
limits on the number of allies the army can have (and
the points for the battalion and the units in it count
against the points limit that can be spent on allies in a
Pitched Battle).

 

[Charlo]

It appears under Soulblight in the warscroll builder. I think it's more a relic of an older book and uncertain rather than forbidden.

[Death1942]

17 hours ago, TMS said:

I think that's a good assessment, @Raptor_Jesues.

The biggest thing I see with Neferata right now is in a necromantic list together with a VLoZD and Vhordrai for double ethereal dragons. Before the points changes you could not fit these things into a 2k list, so that is an entirely new option opened up.

And yeah, if only the two mortarchs could choose spells from the deathmage lore that'd give them some identity in list building.

How do you get the double ethereal dragons?  New to the book so trying to gather up all the combos available to the army.

[TMS]

Just now, Death1942 said:

How do you get the double ethereal dragons?  New to the book so trying to gather up all the combos available to the army.

The VLoZD takes the ethereal amulet and Neferata casts her Dark Mist spell on Vhordrai. Here's where the necromantic bloodline becomes a good pick, making it more likely for you to get that spell off successfully.

[Death1942]

15 minutes ago, TMS said:

The VLoZD takes the ethereal amulet and Neferata casts her Dark Mist spell on Vhordrai. Here's where the necromantic bloodline becomes a good pick, making it more likely for you to get that spell off successfully.

Awesome, love that combo and it is mighty tempting to take Neferata but I am worried she still gets blown off the table early on.

I might be missing something but it seems like on the warscroll builder the Vargheists aren't listed as battleline in Soulblight?  Was that just a rumour or did it actually get released that way in the handbook?

[TMS]

17 minutes ago, Death1942 said:

Awesome, love that combo and it is mighty tempting to take Neferata but I am worried she still gets blown off the table early on.

I might be missing something but it seems like on the warscroll builder the Vargheists aren't listed as battleline in Soulblight?  Was that just a rumour or did it actually get released that way in the handbook?

It's a risk but if that happens they've atleast put less effort into hurting your dragons and drawing out their heals early on.

Vargheists are battleline for us now, it's just been missed on the warscroll builder. I've PM'd the creator and they'll add it in the next round of updates.

[EMMachine]

15 hours ago, Charlo said:

It appears under Soulblight in the warscroll builder. I think it's more a relic of an older book and uncertain rather than forbidden.

The Battletome has still the most recent rules and there isn't an Errata changing the warscrolls. Warscroll Builder isn't a valid rulesource compared to the actual Battletome + Errata.

Even if we ignore the Keyword on the Warscroll and would use the other FAQ-Point for Battalions released after 2.0, it wouldn't work

Quote

Q: Some warscroll battalions included in battletomes do not
have a faction listed above their title. How do I determine which
faction they belong to for the purposes of allegiance abilities?
A: The battalion belongs to the battletome’s faction.
For example, the warscroll battalions in Battletome:
Stormcast Eternals are part of the Stormcast
Eternals faction.

Because when we use this entry it would be a "Legions of Nagash" Battalion.

Without an Errata there is no way to play Crimson Keep in a Soulblight Allegiance.

[Honk]

On 7/2/2019 at 8:58 AM, EMMachine said:

Without an Errata there is no way to play Crimson Keep in a Soulblight Allegiance

I‘m not the best rules lawyer and happily roam in a very casual meta (with my Banshee from Rakham, my necromancer on his '93 square base leading scythe wielding skellis)

but... iirc... imho...

Deathmarch and Castellans have both the Death Alliance „Header“ which leads me to believe, that when your army has the Death alliance, you‘re entitled to try to field this. 

Well now, to have the „death alliance“, all your models need to have the death keyword... which is the first word on all our warscrolls, from skellis, to bloodknights to grimghasts.

Whatever you field, from FEC to Nighthaunt to LoN, you‘ll always have the DEATH Alliance as „Firmament“ and if you‘re able to fit the models into any list even through allying, you can use those battalions.

it does not work this way f.e. For nighthaunt battalions in an LoN list, because there the keywords are missing, when you’re not paying ALL the models from the Ally points...

[Iron Fist]

 

Hello, I started thinking about a list. No need to think too much, the list is not in lace:

Allegiance: Soulblight
- Bloodline: Swift Death
Mortal Realm: Shyish

Leaders
Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (440)
- General
- Deathlance & Shield & Chalice
- Trait: Mist Form 
- Artefact: Ethereal Amulet 
- Lore of the Vampires: Vile Transference
Prince Vhordrai (480)
- Lore of the Vampires: Amaranthine Orb

Battleline
5 x Dire Wolves (70)
10 x Blood Knights (400)
5 x Blood Knights (200)
5 x Blood Knights (200)
5 x Blood Knights (200)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 113
 

 VLOZD with amulet and form of mist allowing to fold and load each turn to benefit from the spear damager.

Vhordrai to engage and hit 2x with the VLOZD.

25 Blooknights with 12 '' move and fly because it's cool! with the new ground rules the flight will benefit.

5 wolves for the objectives control.

Opinions?