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Grimrock

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Everything posted by Grimrock

  1. Grimrock
    Well I'd hope that nurglings drop too haha. 60 points seems about right for them, maybe 50 if GW wants to get aggressive.
  2. Grimrock
    Just to check, are you just short-handing in the reroll into the odds for bronzed flesh? Just because the warshrine's base prayer goes off on a 3+ definitely doesn't mean that bronzed flesh also goes off on a 3+, it still uses the value from the book. I will say having tried Archaon in both factions, (and both are extremely fun for their own reasons by the way), that he can definitely hit harder in Khorne but the army in slaves is generally better because it doesn't dump as many points into making Archaon a monster. No need for a Slaughterpriest, Bloodsecrator, or the Gore Pilgrims battalion to make sure that you can keep him in Bloodsecrator range while he zooms around the table. Instead those points get you access to a unit of 6th circle Varanguard which hit like absolute freight trains too. Not to mention the army is immune to battleshock, the 18" buff aura around Archaon himself, and access to the excellent command ability that lets you know turn order.
  3. Grimrock
    Next major story arc: the Great Maw returns to the mortal realms and re-claims its ogre children!
  4. Grimrock
    Well it's not like the Lord of Blights is only there for the plaguebearers, he's there for the Blight Cyst. It's like I said, it depends if your opponent has a counter to it or not. When my opponent doesn't have a counter the plaguebearers can tie up far more than one unit. In one game I've had them tie up almost an entire army for 2 full rounds by charging the front line units first turn and forcing the slower units to work their way around the blob. That's really rare these days though, usually armies either have access to enough magic to burn them down below 20 models in one phase or enough buffs/mortal wounds to not care about the -2 to hit. The frequency of the counters have become high enough that I wouldn't really bother with them anymore, but they definitely had a place at one point. Maybe if the universal locus in the new book gives all daemons rend -1 or something they might be more viable? If it stays the same as the wrath of the everchosen book (reduce enemy rend by 1) they're definitely going to need a few buffs or a huge price decrease to be viable.
  5. Grimrock
    This is the one that I've been playing with: Allegiance: Slaves to Darkness- Damned Legion: Host of the Everchosen (Sixth Circle)Mortal Realm: AqshyLeadersArchaon the Everchosen (800)- General- Aura of Chaos: Khorne- Spell: Mask of DarknessChaos Lord (110)- Reaperblade & Daemonbound Steel- Artefact: Thermalrider Cloak- Mark of Chaos: KhorneChaos Sorcerer Lord (110)- Mark of Chaos: Nurgle- Spell: Spite-tongue CurseBattleline40 x Chaos Marauders (300)- Axes & Shields- Mark of Chaos: Khorne3 x Varanguard (300)- 3x Ensorcelled Weapons- Mark of Chaos: Khorne5 x Chaos Marauder Horsemen (90)- Javelin & Shield- Mark of Chaos: Khorne5 x Chaos Marauder Horsemen (90)- Javelin & Shield- Mark of Chaos: KhorneBehemothsChaos Warshrine (170)- Mark of Chaos: KhorneTotal: 1970 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 118 Of course this'll change in a few weeks. The likely loss of the thermal rider cloak might mean that the chaos lord won't exist in the list anymore (not much point for him to be there if he can't keep up with Archaon anyway), and potential point changes might add/remove some models. I'd be pretty happy to put an allied Bloodstoker in actually.
  6. Grimrock
    Well, could be a chicken/egg scenario. The keeper was always going to be redone, but maybe GW also wanted a faction that was primarily focused on heroes. So after the keeper was finished they put their energy into making more heroes rather than a new unit or two and figured that the upcoming slaves tome would eventually fill in the gaps. Hero-centric is certainly a unique concept for the tome and definitely has a valid place in the game. On the other hand I wouldn't be surprised at all if the overtuned nature of the summoning was due to a business decision rather than playtesting, but we don't really know one way or the other. As far as the optimal bit... well this is a rumor thread so probably not worth digging too deep into. I will say however that from my experience keepers are incredibly unreliable. They're just as likely to do 2-3 damage as they are to nuke a monster in one swing (although people seem to only ever remember the time they were nuked and not the whiffs). Can't tell you how many times my keeper has activated twice and barely did anything. The summoning evened them out because even if you whiffed horribly and lost two keepers for nothing you'd be able to summon one right back and try again. With the increased summoning costs you can't really do that anymore, so it might be smarter to start looking at more consistent options.
  7. Grimrock
    I think the big thing about the plaguebearers is the -1 to hit in combat and -2 to hit for shooting that could be doubled up with the Lord of Blights command ability. It made a pretty significant difference for the first few months of the battletome and was particularly difficult for most armies to deal with. After that however a number of armies started getting rerolls to hit and bonuses started triggering on unmodified 6's, which pretty much killed the plaguebearers on site. The modifiers are still good in the right matchup, but they're very polarizing. Either your opponent has no answer to the plaguebearers and they gum up the lines for 2-3 turns guaranteeing a win on scenario, or they do have an answer and then you might as well not even put them on the table. Plus they can be a pretty negative play experience, having your opponent rolling dice for half their army and hitting on 6's for 4 rounds of combat until they break below 20 models is super lame.
  8. Grimrock
    Oof, yeah that's tough. Still not impossible but much less likely. Here's hoping for the best I guess.
  9. Grimrock
    Not sure what you mean? From reading the leaked image the paragraphs for picking which realm you're fighting in and which realm your army is from are separate just like they are currently. Also it specifically says the ghb artifacts are instead of the ones in Malign Sorcery, you can't use MS for artifacts at all as far as I can tell.
  10. Grimrock
    Well limited doesn't necessarily mean removed, it is possible that the artifact for one of the realms is still -3 or -2 rend but... Yeah it does feel unlikely. Without that artifact or something similar I can't imagine ever taking him outside of mayyybe a khorne allegiance army in Goretide. I'm expecting some point drops but nothing super significant honestly. They usually seem pretty hesitant to make big cuts.
  11. Grimrock
    Looks like it from the previewed page at least. Might not be so bad though, I think most people ignored them because they were a little too extreme. A shooting army in Ulgu could pretty much just pack it in and call it a day, while in Aqshy they might be unbeatable. Since it looks like everything has been reworked it'll hopefully be a lot more balanced so people won't just avoid it. I'm still a little concerned though. They need to make the realm rules strong enough that it makes an impact on the game otherwise it'll just end up as more unnecessary paperwork, especially now that they're mandatory, but they can't make them so strong as to tilt the game right from the start. Honestly I'm not really sure how they can find that balance.
  12. Grimrock
    Hmm, you know honestly I haven't tried both before and it's a little tricky. They're pretty pricy units and fitting them in makes the list pretty tight on points. If I had to do both I'd start with something like this: LeadersArchaon the Everchosen (800)- Lore of Fate: Infusion ArcanumChaos Sorcerer Lord (110)- Lore of Fate: Arcane SuggestionThe Blue Scribes (120)- Lore of Change: Bolt of TzeentchBattleline40 x Chaos Marauders (300)- Axes & Shields10 x Kairic Acolytes (100)10 x Kairic Acolytes (100)10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (200)3 x Flamers of Tzeentch (120)3 x Flamers of Tzeentch (120)Total: 1970 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 112 I'm not sure if it's worth it running both at the same time, but they certainly do combo well with eachother. I'll have to give it a shot sometime.
  13. Grimrock
    Actually the marauders fit really well into tzeentch. Sure they don't have a great save, but their damage output is unreal and they're excellent choices for the 9" charge agenda. Plus we can make the Daemonic Power spell go off very reliably on a chaos sorcerer which is huge for marauders. The only downside is they obviously don't fit into any usable tzeentch battalions, but they add a really potent kick so it might be worth the trade offs. For that matter Archaon is a good choice too, and combining him with marauders can be particularly efficient.
  14. Grimrock
    To be honest I don't think there are a ton of daemons that work well in slaves to darkness. The allegiance itself only has a few and most of those are individual models. Daemon princes are solid but most people only run one, maybe two with belakor. Archaon is of course amazing but he's only a daemon because of the mount. Furies have some neat rules but I don't think you'd ever want to run more than one unit. The gaunt summoner is great if you're summoning pink horrors. After that you're pretty much stuck looking at allies from the god specific books which do have limited potential. A great unclean one with bell could speed up nurgle StD but he's pretty pricy. You could take a big unit of any of the god marked basic daemons, but without their faction buffs they won't achieve much. I think the best bet would be to ally a unit 10 of pink horrors as a tarpit and the blue scribes to buff a tzeentch marked cabalists sub faction. You could take a gaunt summoner to bring on another unit of 10 pinks as well. It's not really high damage but the pinks are pretty resilient for their points, and the scribes and cabalist sub faction combo make the excellent StD spells much more reliable. Edit: on second thought, if you haven't bought the battletome yet and you aren't totally sold on running the StD allegiance, you could consider running one of the god specific tomes and just marking your slaves models for that allegiance. In that case you could run pretty much any daemon heavy army with mortal support. Really it depends more on which faction you like the idea of more. I'm currently tinkering with marauders providing combat support for a primarily ranged tzeentch daemon list.
  15. Grimrock
    Depends what you want out of them. I run dark feast quite often, but mostly as a way to bring lots of MSU reavers with a single drop. It's a great battalion to provide screening to your more important units while also making sure your opponent can't just totally ignore the screening units themselves. That being said I've almost never gotten much use out of the reavers besides the screen, objective holding, and blood tithe. There always seems to be something that can use the potential buffs better.
  16. Grimrock
    More like a counter to tzeentch I think. Trivial debuff against shooting, reduction of rend to neutralize their strongest subfaction, and a plethora of dispels and unbinds.
  17. Grimrock
    This is the first time that GW has kicked off a brand new AoS faction with a limited release box set right? The only other time I remember them doing something similar was with sisters of battle and it ended up taking like... a month or two to get the whole range out afterwards didn't it? Or am I forgetting something?
  18. Grimrock
    Here's the thing though, if the Drowned Men catch my eye and they inspire me to start up a new nurgle army then I need to buy a $60 book for a half page blurb of rules on top of all the usual introductory costs to the army. I also need to carry that book around with me for every game. If they release a new supplement for nurgle that gives more lore and abilities for the daemons, and hey I've always wanted to include a few more daemons in my list, then boom I've got another $60 book to buy and lug around. Another book that explains how clan pestilens works with nurgle armies and expands on that alliance? You know where this is going. Having to buy multiple books just so I can make the army I want is an unnecessary tax on the game that really doesn't need to exist. Keep the rules for the army in the army book and leave it at that. Also, this isn't just some dastardly scheme of the powergamer. GW has constructed the 3 ways to play specifically, if these were intended to be purely Narrative rules then they would be listed as such. I'd actually be extremely happy to see these books as purely Narrative/Open Play. They'd make so much more sense in that regard and it wouldn't muddy up Matched Play at all.
  19. Grimrock
    Honestly I don't think they're trying to change people's table sizes. They only brought this in so the transition from something like kill team is easier, the minimum sizes are all multiples of those boards. People can still use their 6x4 tables but now it's official that they can use their kill team (or warcry) boards pushed together too. I wouldn't be surprised at all if they did the same thing for age of Sigmar. Also remember that the 90" board is for 3000 points games, not something that's going to come up often.
  20. Grimrock
    Remember you don't always have to drop the whole battalion at once. The rules say you can set some or all of the battalion at the same time. This allows you to tailor your drop count to just below your opponent so you have more information while deploying.
  21. Grimrock
    Looks like a lot of fun for a beer & pretzel game! Just two suggestions from me. First, as a thought I'd actually consider the Khorne prayer from the shrine. I know reroll hits might be a bit redundant, but getting reroll charges might just save your bacon (especially if they get too far away from a general with their run). Plus it synergizes well with the stoker and you won't need to overextend your general to keep them under the khorne buff. Second, I'd agree with you and skip paragon of ruin. Your chariots can already threaten most of the board, the extra move just doesn't seem worth it. I think I'd probably go with Radiance or Bolstered if I were you. I'd love to hear how the game goes!
  22. Grimrock
    Personally I'd say it's because one round of attacks from a bloodthirster generally isn't enough to kill your target. Against a 4+ save a wrath or unfettered thirster will do about 8 damage unbuffed or 10ish damage buffed, which leaves most units or monsters alive, and bloodthirsters really aren't particularly tanky so the counter punch might just kill them. The double attack bumps the damage enough to pretty much guarantee they'll kill what they hit and survive through the combat phase. If the reaper thirsters can get one good round of combat they can kill 2-3 of the enemy heavy hitters and might just be able to ensure the opponent doesn't have anything strong enough to kill them later. Plus the strike first is only on the one bloodthirster. Doesn't matter much on the Khorne turn, but on the opponents turn they can just avoid or shoot that one bloodthirster and then fighting the others is much easier. In Reapers all of the bloodthirsters present the same threat regardless of whose turn it is. For slaughterpriests, honestly to me they're the crux of the army. Killing frenzy or bronzed flesh can nearly be as good as +1 attack from the bloodsecrator, but unlike the bloodsecrator they provide a lot more for the army than just the buffs. Their mortal wound output is fantastic and provides a substantial way to kill things at range. The utility from Blood Bind has won me numerous games when opponents think they're safe hovering just outside of threat range or screening their important pieces. They also give access to the judgements which are absolutely fantastic. I'll definitely take a bloodsecrator in the vast majority of armies, but slaughterpriests are always the first thing I grab.
  23. Grimrock
    There are definitely some excellent StD units for Khorne. For leaders, the Chaos Lord on Karkadrak is a beast in the army if you make him your general in Goretide and give him the dimensional blade. The +1 damage trait applies to both of his melee weapons, and the -3 rend on the halberd lets him blender pretty much everything. The Daemon Prince with mark of Khorne is also pretty excellent with a similar loadout and his command ability is really nasty when you're facing another combat army. Archaon is mind blowing in Khorne but still requires an army to be built around him. Otherwise the new rules for chaos marauders make them probably the best troop choice for any chaos mortal army period, and they're excellent in khorne with all the available buffs. The Chaos Warshrine is a great choice if you're taking any StD units as it also benefits from the Skull Altar prayer rerolls, and getting a re-roll when using the prayer of chaos undivided (3+, StD mortal unit gets full rerolls on attack and wound rolls) is amazing. Combine the shrine, marauders, and some other buff units like a bloodsecrator and/or bloodstoker and you'll have an incredibly consistent blender with an absurd threat range. The shrine itself is even a passable beatstick now and if it gets a few buffs it can do some real damage.
  24. Grimrock
    I believe a tyrants of blood battalion with 3-4 bloodthirsters in the reapers of vengeance sub faction is generally viewed as our most competitive option. One or two insensate, skarbrand, and either a wrath or unfettered depending on which you prefer. After that it's usually a small gore pilgrims for battleline and support, but I think you could run flesh hounds for battleline instead. Either way with skull altar at least one or two slaughter priests are pretty much mandatory and a bloodsecrator is always nice. The judgements are pretty solid as well. The main thrust of the list is to get all the thirsters into big targets and then attack like 6 times in a row without your opponent being able to respond, hopefully gutting them enough to make sure they can't fight back.
  25. Grimrock
    It can vary from unit to unit, but in Khorne usually it only means you'll have to do some extra work to build around the deficiencies and emphasize the strengths. Using your example, which as an aside I should say that skulleapers are actually quite good, you might want to make sure you have a bloodstoker to compensate for them being generally quite slow. Maybe a Slaughterborn battalion to help increase their resilience. That sort of thing. One of the things I love about the Khorne book is pretty much everything can be built around in one way or another and there are a lot of little buffs everywhere that can take a mediocre unit and make it a star. Some things might take ore work than others, but that's part of the fun of making the list.
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