themortalgod

Perhaps I'm looking at it wrong? - We get some aura abilities that are really lackluster and are the sort of auras that other armies get baseline, not as their main allegiance mechanic or if it is, it is baseline static, not hero dependent. - We get a ridiculously random and situational Eye of the Gods table which is going to be irrelevant 90% of the time. (just as it has always been in 40k as well) thats it for main faction allegiance abilities... Then for sub faction we get the following choices: - Low volume summoning with heavy restriction. - The ability to make terrain LOS blocking and tougher Daemon Princes. (Against some armies, on some tables, awesome, the rest of the time completely irrelevant) - A much worse version of Hallowheart magical boost. - Archaon Nothing above even remotely stands out to me as on the same level of what armies like Cities, Hedonites, Deepking, Daughters, Fyreslayers, etc get and that is before even considering that we are paying premium prices for slow units with relatively low impact.

Is anyone else pretty bummed about the Slaves stuff? I've been looking really hard to see a silver lining. I put my cities list on hold when I heard the StD book was coming, but no matter how I look at it, it feels like this isn't a ton of improvement over what we have now. Yeah we get some allegiance abilities, but they aren't nearly as powerful as allegiance abilities of other armies. Sure some of our units got a small buff to their warscroll, but also came with pts hikes and loss of max unit discounts so it feels like side-grade on units that were already at the bottom of the power curve. Not to mention being the only army that now doesn't get max unit discounts.. I just don't see anything this army is actually good at? It doesn't hit hard. Its magic is pretty weak. It has virtually no shooting. It is pretty slow. It is a bit tanky, but relative to the cost per wound, it isn't impressively tanky either. Be'Lakor certainly is good. Sorcerers are awesome for their cost. (looking like really good candidates as allies in other Chaos armies) But other than that, I just don't see much opportunity here to climb to a better position.

My biggest wish is for a Chaos Knight charge to be terrifying, as it should be. Right now my opponents look at Chaos Knights as just a mediocre anvil that poses very little threat. A big unit of Chaos Knights should slam into their foe with tremendous force. Their charge should be just as powerful, if not more so, than a unit like Morrsarr Guard. These are mighty elite cavalry and should reflect that.

Personally, I mainly value the battalion for the +1 to unbind. Hallowheart is loaded with cast bonuses so an extra +1 is trivial, but having all your wizards at +1 to unbind is a huge jump in anti magic proficiency.

If this is your experience then it is a problem with your scenery. 40k is balanced around the presumption that there is plenty of LoS blocking terrain. If the field is mostly clear, shooting armies have a tremendous advantage over close combat ones.

By the logic of that FAQ any new battletome that is printed after GHB2019 cannot be used in a pitched battle because it is neither printed in GHB2019 or the Errata. The trump to that, however, is that the most recent publication is always the authority. The FAQ only has authority over stuff published before it, not after it.

I don't intend to be sacrificing 4 black guard per turn to the daggers. Taking D6 MW divided by 2 then healing D6 is far more appealing. Also the Battery buffs the 2 casts from the Sisters as well.

Fair, though, that is pretty situational. You both need to have a valid target to send it at and also for that target to be in a position where the sun can make contact.

The black dragon is there to be the cast battery. (aka take D6 MWs from the command ability and not have a chance of just insta dying). Also Bladewind is incredible. With spell portal it is really high odds chance at 1 shotting a huge variety of on heroes on foot. (9 dice, each is a mw if you roll less than their save. Toss it at a 5+ save hero and they take 6 wounds on avg) I thought about bigger units of Black guard, but it makes them more unwieldy. I'd also have to more or less drop the Eternal guard to accomodate. Lately I find massive units to be more of vulnerability as it just gives my opponent a good target for their super alpha strike. Whether it is Eels, or a GKonT, or Keeper. If it slams into my guard, the whole unit will be dead before it gets to fight, regardless of if it is 20 or 30. Thus I've been starting to lean towards more units with smaller counts unless the big unit bonus is really tasty as it means the super alpha strike is more wasteful since it overkills a smaller target. The geminids is a fair point though, I'd like to think their long summon range will keep them away from my troops fairly well, but I could be wrong.

The combo is interesting but I feel like it requires a lot of things to go right and personally I'm not a fan of the Purple Sun, in general, because of how swingy it is. Most of the time it does nothing, sometimes it wins games. In most cases I'd rather just dump Geminids into their line than a purple sun.

Update to my list, any feedback would be further ver much appreciated: Sorceress on Dragon - 300 - Ignax Scales, Crystal Aegis, Sear Wounds Sorceress - 90 - General, Warden of the Flame, Agloraxi Prism, Sear Wounds, Warding Band Sorceress - 90 - Warding Band, Ignite Weapons Battle Mage - 90 - Azyr, Roaming Wildfire, Elemental Cyclone 20x Black Guard - 280 20x Black guard - 280 20x Eternal Guard - 260 10x Eternal Guard - 130 5x Sisters of the Thorn - 130 - Roaming Wildfire, Elemental Cyclone Whitefire Retinue - 140 Spellportal - 70 Quicksilver Swords - 30 Geminids - 60 Balewind Vortex - 50 Total: 2000pts The changed list is basically looking to introduce a lot of long range spellpower so that on turn one I can be causing havoc in the enemy lines. I also feel that the focus on long range allows me to keep all my wizards in a clump while not having to worry about their threat being limited to only an 18" bubble. - Spellportal will let me either dump a Cyclone or a Bladewind on any target I want depending on the situation. (It also lets me position the casting wizards outside 30" to deny unbinding) - I can put the Battlemage up on the Vortex to cast both Chain Lightning AND Roaming Wildfire at 24" range. - Geminids and Swords have great range baseline.

Oh I see your confusion now. No, the battalion does not include the units listed within it. Those are requirements for the battalion. The 140pts is the cost to unlock the special rules of the battalion and it also includes an additional artifact and command point. You still must include the battalion’s requirements (in this case 3-6 hero wizards) in your list and pay for them as normal.

The list only has 5 hero models. The Nomad and the 4 Sorcs. The 4 Sorcs make up the requirements of the battalion (3-6 hero wizards). There is no discount though? I'm not sure what you are suggesting with that?

I have 5 leaders total, thats it. 4 of which are in the retinue.

It isn't AOE, you only get to heal 1 unit it moved over and I will never be able to cast it and then unbind it before there is a chance my opponent has a chance to make use of it as there will always be a battleround shift before the start of my next hero phase when I can unbind. I doubt I will need to cut myself much for better spellcasting since I will be at +d6+1 to cast already. I mean I can see there is value but it is expensive at 50pts, esp given how easily it can be turned against me.

As a way to bring back guard models? I'm concerned about that being turned against me since it will be so close to enemy units as well.

I've been wanting to make an AoS Dark Elf themed army since the start of AoS but never really liked Daughters so Hallowheart is finally my opportunity. The theme of the list obviously wizards but more specifically elf wizards protected by their elite guard. I know that the sheer power isn't as high as if I introduced non elf wizards but I quite like the theme and am excited about painting it up. Nomad Prince - 120 - General - Warden of the Flame, Whitefire Tomb, Warding Brand Sorceress on Dragon - 300 - Ignax Scales, Crystal Aegis, Sear Wounds Sorceress - 90 - Warding Brand, Ignite Weapons Sorceress - 90 - Roaming Wildfire, Elemental Cyclone Sorceress - 90 - Roaming Wildfire, Sear Wounds 20x Black Guard - 280 20x Black guard - 280 20x Eternal Guard - 260 10x Eternal Guard - 130 5x Sisters of the Thorn - 130 - Roaming Wildfire, Elemental Cyclone Whitefire Retinue - 140 Gnashing Jaws - 30 Quicksilver Swords - 30 Burning Head - 30 Total: 2000pts - The casting is pretty standard Hallowheart, by using the dragon as a battery to make for a crazy good magic phase. - Ignite Weapons comboed with a sorceress near a black guard unit makes for a really nasty unit. 2" range at 2+/2+ and -1 rend is really spicy. - Sisters of the Thorn bringing up an immobile eternal guard unit to a 2+ save while guarding an important objective will make for a spectacularly tough anvil. Esp if I add in mystic shield. - The combo of having 4 elite combat units, 2 offensive, 2 defensive means the army isn't "all-in" on the magic phase. - The Nomad prince makes a fantastic general his passive -1 to hit, cast, unbind, and dispel is wonderful in a meta teeming with KoS and GKoT. I'm also quite fond of his command ability and he is useful behind the lines as an extra wizard that doesn't mind getting a little closer to the fighting. - I'm not 100% sure based on the wording, but I'm pretty sure that Ignax Scales can stop wounds caused by the +d6 to cast command ability? - I'm pretty sure the Nomad Prince cannot be included in the Whitefire Retinue battalion as even though he can cast spells, he does not have the wizard keyword? I'd love to be wrong though. I'd be super grateful of any feedback and don't hesitate to let me know of any mistakes I've made as I have no doubt that I've missed or messed up at least something along the way.

The biggest problem is that his command ability is generally not worthwhile at 2k. People above have outlined how it can combo, but that combo is so expensive at 2k that you end up in a situation where you can dominate one objective but be utterly unable to contest any others. Having almost 1000pt investment (Archaon + 2-3 other buff heroes) to buff one super unit just doesn't work in a meta that usually has 3-6 objectives on the board. He is bad for the same reason that Nagash was bad before the LoN book. He is an expensive tool that is utterly dependent on bringing a bunch of other heroes to make optimal use of his toolkit and the cost of him + the other heroes is too heavy at 2k. Nagash was fixed by introducing Magic Lores and Endless spells which gives him stuff to cast. Archaon has experienced no such change. He still has to bring along an entourage and him + entourage simply isn't worth it.

I've considered them and they are a potential but my sculpting skill isn't great so I'm concerned about having to do the conversion from stag to centaur torso.

I'm working on a new Depraved Drove Concept and am looking for feedback: The idea is pretty standard to leverage the ridiculous power of Slaanesh Bestigor but with the added diversity of lots of centigor to get in the way and grab objectives. On a side note, does anyone know of any third party fig makers that make a similar centaur model to the one in the new Beastgrave box? I would love to use something like that as a "basis" to convert Slaanesh Centigor but given that there is only one in beast grave it isn't really an option unless I was 20 Centigor that all look exactly the same. Thanks for any help!

A simple solution there is: 1. Don't let battalions be a source of 1 drop. (Why were they ever? It makes no sense) 2. Finishing first should give you +1 to a roll to go first, not guarantee go first. Being able to deploy knowing whether you are going first or second while your opponent doesn't is a ridiculous advantage.

This. A billion times this. I hate so much that artifacts are tied to battalions. Artifacts should just get matched play profiles and cost points. Not only would that mean every army has equal access to them but it also gives purpose to all the weaker ones because they will be cheaper. As it stands 95% of all the artifacts are "never take" because we are incentivized to only take the strongest ones.

I thought it was so laughable when they upped the pts cost of the the Nulamia one in GHB2019. It was like: "No one runs this because it is so bad, but sure, nerf it!"

I usually put master of the black arts on my TKoEC so if I need to unbind I have him. The auto unbind is cool but I still do not find the Liche ever feels like he brings his value. Many armies pay 80pts for a similar level caster making him roughly 50% overpriced. 6 Knights (480pts) + TKoEC (460pts) + Liche Priest (120pts) is 1,060pts to buff out a single mega unit. Yeah its powerful but it sets up a situation where your opponent just needs to feed your knights chaffe or blow the knights off the table and they are neutering your army. Stacking buffs on Knights makes for an impressive output value but it also makes for a very predictable and one dimensional army. 6 Knights buffed by the TKoEC does about 27 damage to a 5+ save target. If you add in smiting that number goes up to about 34. Most of the time that will just contribute to overkill. A unit of 3 TKoEC buffed Ushabti is always going to bring more additional real world output than smiting will ever provide at the same pts cost. Remember, each time you take a buff hero instead of more fighting units when a TKoEC is present you are lowering the value of his aura (because he is buffing less stuff) in order to bring in some other buff. I also would love to make a Khalida list work. It has potential but some matches will just be impossible imo. If she buffed catapults and bowshabti as well it would be more practical. The fact that you need to be "Tomb Kings" allegiance though really hurts the army since you lose deathless minions and command traits. (or you have to pay battleline tax in addition to your archers)

Yeah, that is fairly similar to lists I run. Though I tend to either go heavy on Ushabti or Knights, usually not both. I prefer to spend the points on bigger units of chariots because I find 15 wounds is just too easy to obliterate in a single turn and deny me recovering them. The latest build I'm planning to run is: TKoEC Tomb Prince Herald Herald Herald 9 Chariots 5 Horsemen 10 Skeletons 6 Knights. Not sure how the herald spam will play out but I'm curious to see how it will work. Bringing back 4 Knights per turn could be crazy powerful. The other list I run a lot is TKoEC Tomb Prince Necrotect 6 Chariots 3 Chariots 5 Horsemen 6 Ushabti 6 Ushabti 6 Ushabti 3 Ushabti That list does quite well. Most armies can't deal with all the Ushabti. I also have experimented with a 27 Ushabti list that doesn't bring a TKoEC. It has done ok as well. I never run Liche Priest anymore, they just don't bring much value. Statistically smiting doesn't actually increase output enough to be worth paying 120pts for. Especially when you consider that it likely will only be cast (and not unbound) about half of the time. And you are correct. Settra only nerfs other command abilities if he is present on the field. Though, I feel that TKs now are too CP starved to really stack many command abilities anyway.