Rune

Mind sharing your list? :). Sounds like fun!

Even though the intention of the post was of a fun one I just disagree with how you are looking at this. It's okay to not be a fan of it, but being reliant on synergies doesn't make a list bad. This has a huge upside to get off, and isn't required for all the buffs to get through to make an impact. And besides it's not crazy to have a section of your army costing 1000points. While nearly half of those points still benefit your shooting or whatever you use alongside. It might not work though, just because of the lack of mobility that dwarves have, and because the unit dealing damage is only 30 wounds on a 4+ with no aftersave. It's too squishy and will die to a counter charge or mortal wounds. TE helps a bit though. Perhaps you'd need to run another unit of Hammerers. But anyway, it was just a fun way to pump up some stats Now we just need to write a list..

Add aura of glory to that as well!

Warden King, Runelord and 30 Hammerers added to the basket. That is nuts.

Awesome conversation mate!

Can also run with an Emerald Lifeswarm for the 1D6 healing. Probably a decent thing to do. Won't help him get one shot though, or two if the opponent gets the double turn

I've played just one game with the following list. Inspired by Dankboss above. The Demigryphs does insane damage on the charge. They are at 3 attacks hit on 2, wound on 3, 2 rend and 2 damage. Re-rolling both 1 to hit and 1 to wound. Once they are in combat they are pretty bad though. Played scorched earth, so the Handgunners held an objective each with the Sorceress, Black Guard and Freeguild General on one flank. The Batallion, Luminark and Azyros on the other. Worked out wonderfully and won the game. I think the Hand gunners are definitively best split up as the extra command points are absolutely worth it. Command points are critical to fight twice, and more importantly reroll charges.

Played my new Hallowheart list yesterday. Even though I got terrible rolls (+1 spell cast from Arcane Channeling). Failed casting tons of crucial spells. The list won. I think it is critical to have two heroes that can use Arcane Channeling. I also really like the small sorceress detachment. Flexible since she can get +2 to cast even if I set her up without range from the Arcane Channeling. On many battleplans she will defend the objective behind with the 10 Bleakswords. The list is only 100 wounds. But the Luminark adds a 6+ FNP which adds wounds to the most important characters. It also makes it less likely that the Mortek Crawlers (and similar effects) will one shot my Battlemage/Knight Incantor. If going second, Comet does on average 3.5 MWs, add Word of Pain (29" range), Roaming Wildfire (29" range), Luminark shot (30" range), and 2 Long Rifles from the handgunners. That all averages roughly 12 damage on any target within 30". Some of that also spreads to nearby units. The spellportal can add Chain Lightning to that, but I will probably most often use it with Elemental Cyclone. Bridge is used to get away rather than to get in. Re-position and shoot on whatever is close. Geminids is thrown out on turn 1 even if they don't hit anything. Use them tactically so the opponent has to run through them to get to where you bridge.

I've got a similar list I wanted to run. Excited yours is working out. How'd you deploy?

3 battlerounds is 6 combat phases. That can't be right. I think you mean 3 turns.

Save happens before. It says "Roll a dice before you allocate wounds". Allocating wounds is when you have done your save roll.

Not going to argue that the suggestion for him, if they are to protect a sorceress and no Hurricanum is in range, that the Executioners are better. But that is purely due to the +1 hit. Assuming both gets +1 hit Blackguard is better across all saves except for 6+. The difference then is only their range and a point of bravery (I think?). In the chart, you can also see that MW (with attack sequence ending) is better than -1 rend. Assuming https://aos-statshammer.herokuapp.com/ works.

Handgunners for a general you keep in the back. They loose less from going under 10 models. Guards for close combat.

Depends on the scenario. Most cases though you play on the wide side of the table. The length of the short side is 48 inches. Armies can usually set up within 12 inches of the back. So the minimum range will be 24 inches between each other if both armies set up units on the front row. If you place a Sorceress or Battlemage as close as you can and cast a Balewind you will get 6" range + the size of the Balewind base which is 4" (as you measure spell range from the Balewind base) and + 0.99inch (as it has to be cast within 1"). So your threat range will be 18" + 6" + 4" + 1". So your spell range goes from 18" to 29". Basically from definitely out of range to a healthy chunk into the enemy's deployment zone. If the enemy deploys so deep into their zone that they are not in range turn 1, then they will be very slow to get to objectives. If you have the opportunity you should give them the initiative to go first. The Battlemage or sorceress will very likely survive due to being so far back. The rest of your units will run up or Bridge up. It's only countered by deep strike or long range warmachines. Usually there is also an objective in your own deployment zone, so having the Sorc/Battlemage near that, with a unit of eternal guard is not a bad idea. That adds to the protection.

It'll die quick. 30 Crossbowmen with +2 hit & +1 wound will deal 17 damage to your dragon even with Prism. It's a good point about your lack of spells turn 1. You'll have the most drops in a lot of games, so your opponent can decide that you go first. You have just 5 spells to use turn 1 if you are forced to go first (as you have no Balewind, Geminids, Portal of any Battlemage specific buffs). I'd probably not run 4 units of SotT. Perhaps just 3. Then you can have a Battlemage with Balewind which can throw out a chainlightning plus a roaming wildfire turn one. Or a sorceress with word of pain and Roaming Wildfire.

Argh, 1d4chan wrongly states wholly within. The book does just say within, so you won't have any issues with the bubble. Only issue is that the sorceress on black dragon will be the only one doing the channeling. It can't get to close combat since then it'll die. I think you'd want a back-up Hero for the channeling. I'd love to hear a battlereport once you've got a game under the belt!

Do you have the models in those armies? Then I suggest you play test it. It's so far from any Hallowheart list I have tried that I don't want to jump to any conclusions. A good chunk of why Hallowheart is good is the consistency in their magic. With a hyper mobile army i think you will have trouble fitting many of the SotT into the 12" inch wholly within +to cart bubble. Test it in a game or two if you got them.

Haha I agree absolutely. That's why I mentioned the swarm. If you are healing them in close combat, chances are your opponent could get some models back too though. Regardless PG and Emerald Lifeswarm is great. It comes with a price tag though.

I would like to try your list but I don't have the units. If I were to go bridge I'd probably use a shooting unit that benefits from standing still. Sorta feels wrong not to, even though the Darkshards are amazing. Alone, 40 freeguild guards with sheilds would soak up the same amount of wounds as 20 Phoenix Guard. Both units got the same save, FG is twice the number of units but PG ignore half the wounds. But with your Emerald Lifeswarm, and like you made me realise the easier possibility of standing in cover I can totally see them be more tanky. You'd have to evaluate if you do get those buffs/spells of though. I'm just loving the warding brand spell. The issue is more that you get another drop due to the prince I guess. So if you were to get Shadowwarriors you now have 6 drops :(.

Watch out with Ignax Scales. Since the FAQ Arcane Channeling is only wounds taken. If you channel on a unit with Ignax Scales you might not get any plusses at all.

I really like your list. I think there is a lot of really really good ideas in there. I'm running a completely different list myself. Yet quite the same. Played yesterday and have made some changes. Also running 5 mages like yourself now, though no Gryph-Charger. I've got 2 Battlemages a sorceress, Hurricanum and a Knight Incantor. I do run a bridge, and 40 Handgunners who benefit from the no-movement and the Hurricanums +1 hit. My screen is also a 40 man Freeeguild Guard as I can soak up a lot of wounds that way and return many from Warding Brand. A suggestion can be to include a Balewind Vortex to have a bigger threat range on turn 1 with a Battlemage. You can throw out both Chain Lightning and Roaming Wildfire for some pretty wild damage. Add the Comet and Elemental Cyclone through a portal. Perhaps even a Geminids. That's a lot of damage on turn one. If the opponent sets up far behind in deployment then you just let them go first. I've also added 10 Shadow warriors. Did you find yourself in need of something with deepstrike? I think it can really force your opponent to waste points defending deep.

Man didn't think of actually stacking +charge like that. How'd you get to 6"? Grif, Musician, Ghur and artifact is 5, still nuts. Mind sharing your dwarf list?

That's a good shout and totally agree with dekay that Darkshards should also be considered. There is honestly great balancing on the shooting units. Darkshards and Outriders for me both fall into the catagory of best units without a soulscream bridge/Lauchon. Darkshards is basically the same as Crossbowmen, but they can move but have shorter range. Outriders are compareable to Handgunners both damage wise and range wise. You get mobility, but you lose the overwatch. Another note is that they can be buffed further than the Handgunners though, as you also state (but I think you'd have a hard time fitting 25 horses into the range of the Hurricanum though, as Hurricanum buffs models not units). Didn't think about the batallion though. That's a really good point. If it's decied to go for Darkshards and Outriders, and you skip the bridge, you can get 80 points of stuff instead. Reading this, I would love to make a TE list with Darkshards actually.

I like this reply, I feel like the conversation sometimes goes towards that if you don't have Arkanaut, then you are losing out massively. I get that the Arkanaut can do something. I'm not saying they are a bad unit. They are a great unit. I'm just not fully understanding the hype. 30 Arkanaut with Hurricanum and Khemist costs 780 points. 50 Freeguild Handgunner or Crossbowmen and a Hurricanum costs 780 points. 30 SotW with a Hurricanum costs 760 points. Add a soulscream on top of that for all 3. Damage vs save 3: Arkanaut 9 Skyhook vs hero/monster with 24" = 17 Arkanaut 21 pistols vs hero/monster with 12" = 5 Arkanaut 9 Skyhook vs unit with 24"= 13 Arkanaut 21 pistols vs unit with 12"= 4 Crossbowmen 50 with 24"= 18.5 Handgunner 50 with 16"= 14 SotW 30 with 18"= 24 Damage vs save 6: Arkanaut 9 Skyhook vs hero/monster= 25 Arkanaut 21 pistols vs hero/monster= 12 Arkanaut 9 Skyhook vs unit= 20 Arkanaut 21 pistols vs unit= 10 Crossbowmen 50= 46 Handgunner 50= 28 SotW 30 with 18"= 45 There are a lot to consider except for these numbers. Khemist also does its own damage at 10" range, Arkanauts are not penalized by moving. But you'll have trouble getting all 30 Arkanaut in range for a hero/monster as 21 of them just got 12" range. So likely the pistols will be shooting on a unit unless engaged. Handgunners got overwatch and Crossbowmen deal a lot of damage against high save. Another bonus is that they can be mixed 30/20. But Crossbowmen are very penalised by moving, Handgunners slightly penalised by moving, Freeguild units are larger and specifically Handgunners risk being out of range, SotW deal top damage in all cases and has Overwatch. Devent range. But are heavily penalized when moving. Defensively, there are also things to consider. Freeguild has what's equivilant of 60 wounds and Arkanaut got 45. Freeguild is less vulnurable to mortal wounds than Arkanaut, but the big up for Arkanaut is that they can allocate the woudns to models who are using pistols. SotW are the most vulnurable. What I am trying to get at is that CoS shooting is super balanced. There are pros and cons for each, you just need to be aware of what you are good at when you play.

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