AoS 3 - Nighthaunt Discussion

[Evil Bob]

17 hours ago, EnixLHQ said:

Then you missed out on the ending. All in all it did well to highlight our new strengths even though they (admittedly) didn't know all the rules or what to focus on when filming. I think it's pretty valuable, especially from a new-to-the-army point of view.

Fair enough since that is not my position having played WFB in the 90s and most of AoS. If someone new they really should watch the Warhammer Weekly covering the new book. That and reading the posts here and everything is covered.

Although there are ‘interesting’ things to be found on FB and Redit.

[The_Dudemeister]

GoS as general with Master of Magic to reroll his cast is high on my to-try list. 

As his relic I'll try Wychlight Lantern though. Once per battle an additional spell that can be any one from the spell lore.

 

The flexibility that gives for our very good spell lore is definitely worth a relic. Even more so when that cast can be potentially rerolled. Arcane Tome for me always goes on another hero to spread out our casts

 

Btw. shoutout to this battletome. I don't know how weak or strong it will turn out to be in the long run as other armies have strong tools too. But I tried out several very different builds now and haven't encountered a single stinker so far. I can look at any given hero and theorycraft a funky combination of what I'll give them or which units they'll support and how and in-game they always deliver. For now I don't even know what the untouchable core of my lists should be that I then build around. Everything is fair game, is fun to play and does what I want them to do 💜

[Evil Bob]

21 hours ago, Neck-Romantic said:

I plan on running Torments without Chainghasts. They are extremely expensive and horrendously fragile in groups of 2.

 

I keep mine (Chainghasts) lurking back for shooting (which they do so much better now) unless the situation calls for everyone to pile in. Haven’t tried running four in one group yet. Two groups of two along with two Spirits of Torment are interesting if going elite heavy. I’ve had opponents target the Chainghasts first instead of the Spirit Torment, which is funny as I’m returning over 60 points of models on the table every End Combat Pase.

What keeps them out of a list over here is if the character points start bumping against them. I won’t count them as part of the rank-n-file or battle-line.

Having played Orlynder in the last book, Myrmourn Banshees, or our current 160+ units, the expensive and fragile theme seems to be a thing. I haven’t done the 20x Grimghast Reaper yet but I certainly can respect the reasoning behind it (and intend on doing it myself at some point).

Edited June 3, 2022 by Evil Bob

[Neck-Romantic]

My take on fragility is the enemy has to deal about 8 or 9 wounds on average (4 with my dice) to wipe a pair of Chainghasts and poof they're gone with no chance for rez.

Myrmourns, GGRs, BGRs, Hosts (kinda) Hexes, anything but rasps needs to take an average of around 23 or so wounds (or, yaknow, just 10) to wipe a minimum unit before I lose the chance to rez.

Edited June 3, 2022 by Neck-Romantic

[The_Dudemeister]

A Scarlet Doom list came in 7th in a 47-player tournament with a great 4win-1loss showing. Unfortunately I didn't find the list just yet. 

But it begins! 

Edited June 3, 2022 by The_Dudemeister

[Dogmantra]

Had my chance to play my first game today with the new Nighthaunt. Went vs Soulblight Gravelords.

Main take away was wow! The ghosties really don't like it when they get double turned, which happened twice! I was forced to go first, then got doubled into turn 2, lost priority and went second on turn 3, doubled my opponent into turn 4, and then got doubled into turn 5. Very back and forth!

Block of 30 Chainrasps with a Spirit Torment and 5+ ward CA meant my opponent went for a conquer on turn 1 expecting to clear them or at least thin the horde enough, ended up killing 6 guys with a mega gargant, and Mannfred did 0 damage. Put me in the lead but unfortunately I just got attritioned a bit too hard and ended up losing.

My list was:
- Kurdoss
- Reikenor
- KoS on horsie (general, soulfire ring, spiteful spirit)
- 2x Spirit Torments (one with the arcane tome)
- Guardian of Souls (beacon of nagashizzar)

- 6x Spirit Hosts
- 3x Spirit Hosts
- 30x Chainrasps
- 2x Chainghasts
- 10x Harridans
- 4x Banshees

I went with two warlord batallions to overload on artefacts and JUST NOW realise that I totally forgot my two extra command points from Magnificent. Oh well it wouldn't have made much of a difference! I'd honestly be ok playing this same list again, I was pretty happy with it. One thing is it is lacking a bit in bodies, but I do also really not want to play a big hordey army. Might see if I can shuffle some stuff around to get an Executioner in there, maybe instead of one spirit torment?

Kurdoss is definitely my favourite model in this list, hits like a Celestant Prime for 100 points less, what's not to love?

[Evil Bob]

5 hours ago, The_Dudemeister said:

A Scarlet Doom list came in 7th in a 47-player tournament 

6th place was OBR.. maybe the bonus VP system works.

Good hunting on finding that list. I’m dying to know if it was 10x or 20x BG units? Or more importantly how the general felt they performed at the size played.

[Tinniez]

Had my first game with Nighthaunt today against some Lumineth!
Here are the lists and a quick battle report for anyone interested:
__________________________________________________________

The plan we played was First Blood.

Before R1, the Loreseeker dropped down on the right objective and I pulled my unit of 10 Grimghast into reserve. I only managed to hit two units with the Emerald Curse, so I chose Eltharion and Avalenor. In hindsight, it may have been a better choice to target the Cathallar and the Lord Regent, as they both have quite potent abilities.

I gave my opponent T1 and he got most of his spells off. He moved his Dawriders up the flank to support his Loreseeker on the rightmost objective and set up a counter-charge. His small unit of Wardens only just tagged the left objective and the rest of his crew castled up and advanced toward the centre objective. His Sentinels did a small amount of damage to my Bladegheists, which I was mostly able to recover through my Spirit Torment. He achieved his battle tactic (Ferocious Advance) and scored 5 points.

In my T2, I failed to get most of my spells off or they were unbound. Solar Flare was a massive pain in the ass. I did manage to cast the Mortalis Terminexus, but it did marginal damage. I ran my Chainrasps and Reikenor to the left objective, advanced Olynder, the Guardian of Souls and two units of Spirit Hosts down the middle, while my Spirit Torment, Bladegheists, Knight of Shrouds and a unit of Spirit Hosts headed for the right objective. I dropped my Grimghast behind his lines near the left objective and succeeded on the charge, wiping most of the 10 man Warden unit. My Bladegheists were further replenished by the Spirit Torment. I achieved my battle tactic (Conquer), but failed to kill the Loreseeker, so I only scored 3 points.

I lost the roll-off for Round 2 and my opponent chose to take the turn to prevent me from doubling down. I managed to unbind a few spells in his hero phase but unfortunately the Mortalis Terminexus was also dispelled. He charged Eltharion into my Chainrasps on the left, killing six. Then he used Avalenor to wipe out my Grimghasts. His Dawnriders and Sentinels did some damage against my Bladegheists, but it was nothing that the Spirit Torment couldn't mostly fix. My Knight of Shrouds finished off his Loreseeker on the right flank which meant I was able to capture the objective. At the end of his turn, he scored 3 points for holding the centre objective and completing his battle tactic (Broken Ranks) with a monster.

On my turn I replenished my units with Lady Olynder. Reikenor managed to cast the Mortalis Terminexus again and sent it right into the middle of his army. It did a lot of chip damage and knocked some wounds off his support heroes. Olynder lifted the veil, rolled a 6 and killed the Lord Regent. I rolled hot on my charges here and managed to apply the fight last effect to every fight, excluding the one with the Dawnriders on the right objective. My Guardian of Souls headed over to help the Chainrasp on the left, who charged into Eltharion. Reikenor charged into the middle of his army to try and bully the Windmage. Olynder and the two units of Spirit Hosts charged the 20 block of Wardens and everything on the right objective charged the Dawnriders. Eltharion died, the Windmage died, the Dawnriders were wiped out and Olynder and the Spirit Hosts did a tiny bit of damage to his big unit of Wardens. 5 points for me, as I achieved my battle tactic (Aggressive Expansion) and held both the left and right objectives.

My opponent won the roll-off for Round 3 and chose to take the turn. I removed the objective in the centre of the board. He didn't have much casting left at this point and banked heavily on killing Reikenor and wiping the Chainrasp off the left objective with Avalenor. Reikenor survived this tun, thanks to the nearby Spirit Hosts and the Chainrasp managed to make their saves against Avalenor, who has a low number of attacks, but high damage. My opponent couldn't see a way to win from this point, so he conceded the game.
 

 

 

 

Edited June 4, 2022 by Tinniez

[EnixLHQ]

14 minutes ago, Tinniez said:

Had my first game with Nighthaunt today against some Lumineth!
Here are the lists and a quick battle report for anyone interested:
__________________________________________________________

The plan we played was First Blood.

Before R1, the Loreseeker dropped down on the right objective and I pulled my unit of 10 Grimghast into reserve. I only managed to hit two units with the Emerald Curse, so I chose Eltharion and Avalenor. In hindsight, it may have been a better choice to target the Cathallar and the Lord Regent, as they both have quite potent abilities.

I gave my opponent T1 and he got most of his spells off. He moved his Dawriders up the flank to support his Loreseeker on the rightmost objective and set up a counter-charge. His small unit of Wardens only just tagged the left objective and the rest of his crew castled up and advanced toward the centre objective. His Sentinels did a small amount of damage to my Bladegheists, which I was mostly able to recover through my Spirit Torment. He achieved his battle tactic (Ferocious Advance) and scored 5 points.

In my T2, I failed to get most of my spells off or they were unbound. Solar Flare was a massive pain in the ass. I did manage to cast the Mortalis Terminexus, but it did marginal damage. I ran my Chainrasps and Reikenor to the left objective, advanced Olynder, the Guardian of Souls and two units of Spirit Hosts down the middle, while my Spirit Torment, Bladegheists, Knight of Shrouds and a unit of Spirit Hosts headed for the right objective. I dropped my Grimghast behind his lines near the left objective and succeeded on the charge, wiping most of the 10 man Warden unit. My Bladegheists were further replenished by the Spirit Torment. I achieved my battle tactic (Conquer), but failed to kill the Loreseeker, so I only scored 3 points.

I lost the roll-off for Round 2 and my opponent chose to take the turn to prevent me from doubling down. I managed to unbind a few spells in his hero phase but unfortunately the Mortalis Terminexus was also dispelled. He charged Eltharion into my Chainrasps on the left, killing six. Then he used Avalenor to wipe out my Grimghasts. His Dawnriders and Sentinels did some damage against my Bladegheists, but it was nothing that the Spirit Torment couldn't mostly fix. My Knight of Shrouds finished off his Loreseeker on the right flank which meant I was able to capture the objective. At the end of his turn, he scored 3 points for holding the centre objective and completing his battle tactic (Broken Ranks) with a monster.

On my turn I replenished my units with Lady Olynder. Reikenor managed to cast the Mortalis Terminexus again and sent it right into the middle of his army. It did a lot of chip damage and knocked some wounds off his support heroes. Olynder lifted the veil, rolled a 6 and killed the Lord Regent. I rolled hot on my charges here and managed to apply the fight last effect to every fight, excluding the one with the Dawnriders on the right objective. My Guardian of Souls headed over to help the Chainrasp on the left, who charged into Eltharion. Reikenor charged into the middle of his army to try and bully the Windmage. Olynder and the two units of Spirit Hosts charged the 20 block of Wardens and everything on the right objective charged the Dawnriders. Eltharion died, the Windmage died, the Dawnriders were wiped out and Olynder and the Spirit Hosts did a tiny bit of damage to his big unit of Wardens. 5 points for me, as I achieved my battle tactic (Aggressive Expansion) and held both the left and right objectives.

My opponent won the roll-off for Round 3 and chose to take the turn. I removed the objective in the centre of the board. He didn't have much casting left at this point and banked heavily on killing Reikenor and wiping the Chainrasp off the left objective with Avalenor. Reikenor survived this tun, thanks to the nearby Spirit Hosts and the Chainrasp managed to make their saves against Avalenor, who has a low number of attacks, but high damage. My opponent couldn't see a way to win from this point, so he conceded the game.

Wow, very detailed report, thank you. And also a great game by the sounds of it.

How did you feel about how we play? And also, what were some things to keep an eye on with the LRL?

[Tinniez]

@EnixLHQ Thanks! I was really stoked with how the new book plays!

Some general thoughts I had about the game:

• My opponent didn't have much fun on my turn, as retreating and charging your whole army can take a fair bit of time.
• My opponent also made some fairly large errors between his positioning, combat choices and the way his battle tactic decisions forced him to maneuver.

Some thoughts I had about my NH list:

• Our units are deceptively tanky with Discorporate and protecting heroes via Spirit Hosts is easy to achieve.
• I can see myself including at least one Spirit Torment in most lists I write for the guaranteed recursion.
• I leaned quite hard into casting. Our spell lore is great but Reikenor was the only consistent wizard in my army.
• Unfortunately I didn't get to use Spiteful Spirit on my KoSoES at all, but he did get to 8 wounds without much effort.
• I'd like to experiment with replacing a unit of Spirit Hosts with a unit of Myrmourn Banshees.

Some thoughts I had about my opponent's LRL list:

• The Callathar (especially when she is garrisoned in the LRL terrain piece) is massively annoying. I would say that overall LRL is well positioned to minimise our battleshock shenanigans.
• The Loreseeker is a great piece, but without adequate support he isn't particularly worrisome.
• Units like Avalenor, who have a low number of attacks with high damage, really get shut down by our saves.
• My opponent's list was fairly "soft" compared to what could have been Teclis and Sentinel spam.

Edited June 4, 2022 by Tinniez

[Selpharia]

So I really love the vibe of the new Nighthaunt book, but as a potential new player, really struggle to pick the alright battleline units. I like Quicksilver as a procession, but I’m not sure how hard to go in on their unique battleline options

[EnixLHQ]

1 hour ago, Selpharia said:

So I really love the vibe of the new Nighthaunt book, but as a potential new player, really struggle to pick the alright battleline units. I like Quicksilver as a procession, but I’m not sure how hard to go in on their unique battleline options

Nighthaunt does well with a little sprinkling of various battlelines because they perform different functions.

Chainrasp and Reapers play very well together and are a very solid base to build any army list around. Chainrasps are on bases smaller than 1" with a weapon reach of 1", meaning you can line them up in two rows and all of them can still attack. Cohesion is simple with them for the same reason. Reapers are generally anti-horde units, but with their 2" reach they can swing over the top of the Chainrasps even when they are two rows deep. This combo packs a surprising amount of damage and wounds into a space that you can shape as you need.

Spirit Hosts now shine as a hero's extended wound pool, and being battleline is really an excellent quality for them, effectively letting you decide just how many extra wounds you want on the table.

Nothing will be able to match a Hexwraith on speed alone, bar none. Not even the Black Coach. You need teleporting shenanigans to even get close with anything else, but Hexwraiths don't need the tax of other units to cover all that ground. This makes distant objective hunting trivial, or you can use them to lock your opponent in their deployment zone by forcing them to deal with the screen you just zoomed into their face.

Bladegheists in a Scarlet Doom list is probably the only time I'd ever advocate for packing as many as you can at the detriment of other battleline options. This is just because of the pure damage potential packed in the charge and is dependent on a hyper-aggressive play style.

And, lastly, the Harridans of the Quicksilver Dead will bypass enemy ward rolls and come with a built-in Shademist effect. -1 to wound rolls is a deceptively powerful debuff, making these guys a good bulwark, screen, or anvil, and provide that protection to any units that enemies within 3"could target. You have to charge to get this, of course, but we're always charging now. The ward bypass is a slightly different bag. This can either be really powerful against certain armies (like ourselves), but can also fall flat hard against others. By no means a bad choice, but unless you're fairly certain to face warded armies I'd not take Quicksilver just to get these guys as battleline. You can still take them as non-battleline.

[The_Dudemeister]

5 hours ago, EnixLHQ said:

The ward bypass is a slightly different bag. This can either be really powerful against certain armies (like ourselves), but can also fall flat hard against others. By no means a bad choice, but unless you're fairly certain to face warded armies I'd not take Quicksilver just to get these guys as battleline. You can still take them as non-battleline.

I agree in principle. But on the other hand, I also think that ward saves are handed out way too liberally nowadays. Once a staple of mainly Death armies, there are now several other armies who have a 6+ ward as their generic allegiance ability.

 

But more importantly many individual units whose whole shtick is to be tanky either do it via innate wards or they get beefed up with wards. Denying wards isn't all that niche anymore and with retreating and charging + good movement, we can easily pinpoint those units with Harridans.

 

So we don't even have to look for those few extreme units like Lady Olynder and Gotrek to... hmm, wait a second. I think it's mathhammer time!

 

Ah yes, it takes 8 (eight!) Kurdosses to simultaneously strike to have a little over 50% chance to kill Gotrek. A 10-lady unit of Harridans with their buffed profile has an over 80% chance of slaying him outright. Cute 😵

[EnixLHQ]

6 hours ago, The_Dudemeister said:

I agree in principle. But on the other hand, I also think that ward saves are handed out way too liberally nowadays. Once a staple of mainly Death armies, there are now several other armies who have a 6+ ward as their generic allegiance ability.

 

But more importantly many individual units whose whole shtick is to be tanky either do it via innate wards or they get beefed up with wards. Denying wards isn't all that niche anymore and with retreating and charging + good movement, we can easily pinpoint those units with Harridans.

 

So we don't even have to look for those few extreme units like Lady Olynder and Gotrek to... hmm, wait a second. I think it's mathhammer time!

 

Ah yes, it takes 8 (eight!) Kurdosses to simultaneously strike to have a little over 50% chance to kill Gotrek. A 10-lady unit of Harridans with their buffed profile has an over 80% chance of slaying him outright. Cute 😵

I agree, the meta is shifting and wards are increasing in prevalence. I'm not quite at assuming it's universal yet when you're just building a list and showing up somewhere. But, I fully endorse building Quicksilver against armies you are pretty sure will have wards.

There's a certain Cities of Sigmar list I'm dying to use Quicksilver against.

[Neck-Romantic]

Its probably already been answered; but do we know about when we'll get the monster update book for the Mourngul?

[dmorley21]

16 hours ago, EnixLHQ said:

I agree, the meta is shifting and wards are increasing in prevalence. I'm not quite at assuming it's universal yet when you're just building a list and showing up somewhere. But, I fully endorse building Quicksilver against armies you are pretty sure will have wards.

There's a certain Cities of Sigmar list I'm dying to use Quicksilver against.

Was at an RTT yesterday and every army I faced pretty much had army wide wards: Beastclaw Raiders, Nighthaunt, and Daughters of Khaine. My opponent before that was Fyreslayers, who also have wards. 

Add in Lumineth, Nurgle, Soulblight, OBR, Flesh-Eaters, Stormcast (Gardus, Bastian, Hammers of Sigmar)…

Quicksilver seems good. 

[Ser_namron]

Can I get some clarification on one of nighthaunts artifacts. 

 

Reaper of sorrows artifact- my opponent was trying to say the way it is written means that as long as the unit is terrified it gets the -4 rend, without rolling the bravery check. He bases this off the last sentence "that character rend is -4 instead of -3 if the target is terrified. .

I disagree completely. The last sentence states -4 INSTEAD of -3, which means you need to have made the bravery check in the first place to get the -3 which will then become -4 if the target is terrified. 

 

Is anyone else interpreting as constant -4 rend without a roll? That being said we both agreed to not use it like that and had a good game. And it's not like AoS doesn't have terrible rules writing that can be left to interpretation. But I don't even think that's the case here, the rule makes sense to me, but I would love some clarification to put this to bed. 

 

Also I was playing rats so they had -4 the whole time regardless lol. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by Ser_namron

[lare2]

47 minutes ago, Ser_namron said:

Reaper of sorrows artifact- my opponent was trying to say the way it is written means that as long as the unit is terrified it gets the -4 rend, without rolling the bravery check.

You need to make the bravery check no matter what. 

[The_Dudemeister]

The confusion comes from the relic being future-proof. It's easy to see how units can potentially be buffed to not become terrified, like maybe Orruks during a WAAAGH (which in lore is the biggest counter to Nighthaunt) or a rewrite of inspiring terrain etc. That's why it's written a little clunky and wordy

 

Currently the relic only does -4 rend if you beat the bravery or nothing at all. Technically -3 rend against Nighthaunt as they're the only ones not getting terrified for now. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by The_Dudemeister

[Liquidsteel]

I can't imagine there ever being a case where a core rule specifically counters a battle trait like that.

[dmorley21]

Attended a small RTT yesterday. I hadn't gotten in any practice games (apart from half a game in TTS) with the new book and I ended up running a less than optimized list as I'm in the process of redoing my army and this is what I primarily had in a relatively still complete state. My list was:

Emerald Host 

Olynder (Spectral Tether) / Krulghast (General, Arcane Tome, Shademist) / Spirit Torment (Lightshard of the Harvest Moon)

30 Reapers / 5 Hexwraiths / 5 Hexwraiths / 3 Spirit Hosts / Black Coach (Soulreach Grasp) 

Terminexus

The Reapers and Hexwraiths were in Hunters of the Heartland, while I also took Warlord. You had to use a different Grand Strategy every time, which is tough for the list I ran but I did manage to get each one. I ended up going 1-2 and don't remember enough for a turn-by-turn report, but here is a summary:

Game 1 (Feral Foray)

I played a Beastclaw Raiders monster trucks version of Ogor Mawtribes. I chose the NH specific Grand Strategy of A Soul to Claim, knowing his general would likely end up in combat with my blob of Reapers. He out dropped me and surprised me by taking the first turn. I had been expecting to be given the first turn and had put both units of my Hexwraiths in deep strike. He put all of his shooting into the Spirit Torment and lifted it - I had put the Spirit Hosts in range of Olynder elsewhere on the board. He crashed into the Black Coach with his general and put a good thumping on it and then crashed two monsters into my Reapers and thumped them. On my turn I teleported the Black Coach to grab one of his objectives and used that battle tactic and then sent everything into his general as that was my grand strategy. It was a mistake as Olynder died, though I did lift the general. I got the double and raided an objective and put some hurt on another monster, but it wasn't enough. We ended with 3 turns complete and talked out the rest, but he had at that point almost tabled me (I think I had a unit of 5 Hexwraiths and the Krulghast left). 

Mistakes were made on my part for sure and it was a bad matchup for my list. 

Game 2 (Veins of Ghur)

Played another Emerald Host Nighthaunt list. This player had a less optimized list than me (Olynder/GoS/Spirt Torment/Kurdoss/Scriptor Mortis general/KoSoES/10 Bladegheists/10 Reapers/5 Craventhrone/5 Craventhrone/5 Hexwraiths/3 Spirit Hosts/3 Spirit Hosts). The Black Coach with support from Olynder and the Krulghast to level up just ended up laying waste to him. I kind of did a pincer from both flanks and just crushed him. I had him tabled by turn 3 and all three objectives fell on one side of the board. I had deepstruck my blob of 30 Reapers and all they did was lift a unit of Craventhrone Guard and camp on objectives. 

Game 3 (First Blood)

Due to how badly I ran up the score in Game 2, I was actually 3rd at this point (it was only a 9 person tournament). Drew Morathi and the Bowsnakes. And the melee snakes. Yeesh, that book seems good is what I'll say. He gave me the first turn and I set up a unit of Hexwraiths to screen the center objective that I grabbed with my Reapers, and took the side objectives with a unit of Hexwraiths and the Black Coach. I actually had wanted to flank the Black Coach around a terrain piece and into his lines, but I failed a charge into his Witch Aelf screen. The bowsnakes double tapped into the Reapers, who actually held strong while the melee snakes got mind razored and charged into the Black Coach, who was out of range of my Krulghast. That thing got lifted so easily, I was shocked. Seeking vengeance, I sent my blob of 30 Reapers and Lady O into the melee snakes and lifted them in return. Both units of Hexwraiths had been cut down at this point by the Morathis and they started moving towards my Reapers while the bowsnakes double tapped them again and then charged. The Reapers held strong, but their output had been dropped and then they got charged by big Morathi, the snake hero, and little Morathi, while still fighting the bowsnakes and getting a double tap shot into them. Olynder got lifted at this point, but I had 3(6 thanks to the Spirit Torment) Reapers left that were able to retreat out and get me some points for an objective. I was in essence tabled by turn 4 apart from my Krulghast who had fled to the other side of the board (keeping a wizard alive was my GS this game) and we called it. 

 

Final Thoughts

Like I said, I had a less than optimized list. But still, I have some thoughts:

The Good:

The Spirit Torment was great when it was used correctly. 

The 30 Reapers were just a powerful tool. It took a ton of damage and focus from my opponents to get through them. 

Lady Olynder did some work every game - even when she got deleted early, she had sniped a support ogor hero by Lifting the Veil. 

I didn't mention The Emerald Curse, but I rolled well for it and it did some work. I was impressed by it. 

Spirit Hosts annoyed me with how often they failed to bodyguard, but they were still great. 

The Bad:

The Terminexus was great the one time I got it cast. I'd leave it at home in the future unless I had a better way of casting it. 

The Ugly:

The Black Coach was the MVP of Game 2, and did nothing in the other games. I'm afraid that's typically how it will go. Just not a consistent, reliable piece. 

The Hexwraiths I misused but they were still always helpful. Their output is definitely not great anymore though. 

The Krulghast lands here. I thought he was an auto-take, but he does nothing in the mirror match and really did next to nothing against Daughters of Khaine. He helped in the first game, but not enough to change the outcome of anything. I definitely wouldn't take him without an arcane tome, as that at least gave him use every game. 

 

A lot was learned, and a lot of fun was had. I can't wait to get in some more games with the new ghosts. 

[Boggler]

I don't get to play much. Maybe a 3 game tournament every other month. Today was my first opportunity to try out the new book. Played vs Kruleboyz, Fyreslayers, and Living Cities.

Lots of positives. Lots of learning.

Overall. I didn't roll many 8+ charges and was sick when I'd get -3/4 to hit on a Monster and then have the Monster make its saves... That is dice for ya. Still, WoT felt good, despite this. In fact, I got more 2/3's than 10+'s The table is supposed to be a game changer and it can be, I'll just have to pull the lever a bit more.

Here is my list:

Spoiler

Allegiance: Nighthaunt
- Procession: Scarlet Doom
- Mortal Realm: Ghyran
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Bloodthirsty

Leaders
Lady Olynder, Mortarch of Grief (340)*
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist
- Lore of the Underworlds: Seal of Shyish
Kurdoss Valentian, the Craven King (210)*
Guardian of Souls (150)*
- General
- Command Trait: Master of Magic
- Lore of the Underworlds: Seal of Shyish
- Lore of the Underworlds: Spirit Drain
Dreadblade Harrow (145)
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Universal Spell Lore: Flaming Weapon
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist

Battleline
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (350)**
- Reinforced x 1
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (350)**
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Spirit Hosts (250)**
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Hexwraiths (160)*

Endless Spells & Invocations
The Burning Head (20)

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Hunters of the Heartlands

Additional Enhancements
Spell

Total: 1975 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 3 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 92
Drops: 8
 

I went with Scarlet Doom because I wanted to have the BGR as Battleline. This will probably be the last time I use this Procession. The mortals on 5's is great, but it didn't do anything and I felt that my style of play didn't make having the BGR in 20's very useful. Don't get me wrong, they are strong and if I had managed to win more than 2 out of 10 priorities they would have wiped my opponent but I felt that MSU/Herohammer overall was a way more efficient way to play. I'll take Emerald Host next time.

Hold the Line was great, especially with the Hex who could break away and avoid being killed late game.

Bloodthirsty for those essential charges.

When I came back to NH in late December I knew I wanted to run Olynder. Her and Kurdoss will be an auto include for me for my next few games. Oly did work, and while it took me a game and a half to remember her 12" 5+ CP negate aura, she was fantastic.  Her model regen was great and it makes me seriously going double Warlord to take the Lightshard and a Beacon.

I'm never taking Spell Enhance. It was useless. Same with the Burning Head. I'll take another Artefact along with the mandatory Arcane Tome.

Actually, I was really impressed with my four Heroes, Oly, Kurdoss, and a GoS moved in a pack with the SH's. The Dreadblade was there to try and be in a bubble of other stuff to echo Discorporate. This was probably the MVP play, the amount of 5+ wards I made really paid back the cost of the Dreadblade. He could tele around is required and giving him Lightshard next time will make him better.

The GoS with Master of Magic was great but when I'd cast Spectral Lure I'd roll a 1-2. Seal and Shademist were great. Spirit Drain did nothing in the only situation it was worth using.

Not having a ST was a concern going in to the game and while it doesn't heal heroes it probably would have been amazing if paired with either of the units of 20 BGR's. I didn't take one and I don't regret it but its a great value at only 115 pts and helps get closer to that double Warlord battalion.

The 2 units of 20 BGR's were a huge threat to my opponents and took a beating. The 4+ 5++ can't be praised enough but its way better value to get the same defense from 20 GGR's. Plus with the GGR you save your sanity because you're not trying to honeycomb BGR's that outgrew their base size long ago. And if you play Nighthaunt you already know the Barrel of Monkeys MEME everytime you try and remove one of you models from anything in tight quarters. The GGR 2" reach and 30 pt discount is enough for me to make the switch. The BGR only did about 10 bonus MW's in 3 games. Emerald Host will hopefully be more consistent.

6 SH's are a pain to move with coherency. I'll take 2 units of 3 next time. The SH's got targeted a few times and lost some models so I don't think it's too risky to keep them in 3's. If I Bodyguard stuff I'll hopefully get plays where I can use the Beacons to bring back one model in each unit. Plus whatever other units. Solid unit. 125 pts is great value and the 18 attacks does more work than you'd think. Also, maybe Herohammer want to go their separate ways midgame?

Hexwraiths. I'll always find a way to take at least one unit of 5. Everytime I think about Dreadscythe at the same pts I stick with Hex and they make many plays in this objective based game with their 24" retreat moves.

Ya. So that's it. I played 3 games and lost all 3. I learned a lot. Two of the games were super close and could have gone either way. The game vs Kruleboys was tough because of the mortals they do. I gave him first go and he did so much damage. I didn't get a double and Kurdoss whiffed a 2+/2+ sequence but the damage was too much. He had 6 units of Boltboyz all spread out.

Fyreslayers wasn't even close. Failed some 9" charges to get his support heroes and he used Fierce Counter Attack to strike first and do many damages... lol

Living Cities he made me go first so I castled up in the middle to avoid a Fulm deepstrike bomb and then got doubled and the Fulms hit me pretty hard. I fought back to only lose the game by 1pt while killing 4 Fulms and Krondy's in a couple turns. The heroes did work here and the BGR's only rolled one 6 when they rally'd with 31 dice... first time with 14 models lost and then again with 17 models gone. lol! to GoS and Oly also rolled 1's for the regen... I was still super happy with the game because retreat and charge when you want.

Anyways. that probably made no sense but here is what I'm thinking for my next list.

Spoiler

Allegiance: Nighthaunt
- Procession: Emerald Host
- Mortal Realm: Ghyran
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Bloodthirsty

Leaders
Lady Olynder, Mortarch of Grief (340)*
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist
Kurdoss Valentian, the Craven King (210)*
Guardian of Souls (150)*
- General
- Command Trait: Master of Magic
- Artefact: Beacon of Nagashizzar
- Lore of the Underworlds: Seal of Shyish
Dreadblade Harrow (145)***
- Artefact: Lightshard of the Harvest Moon
Lord Executioner (140)***
Spirit Torment (115)***
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist

Battleline
3 x Spirit Hosts (125)**
5 x Hexwraiths (160)*
20 x Grimghast Reapers (320)**
- Reinforced x 1

Units
10 x Bladegheist Revenants (175)**
2 x Chainghasts (95)***

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Hunters of the Heartlands
***Warlord

Total: 1975 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 87
Drops: 11
 

 

[EnixLHQ]

1 hour ago, Boggler said:

I don't get to play much. Maybe a 3 game tournament every other month. Today was my first opportunity to try out the new book. Played vs Kruleboyz, Fyreslayers, and Living Cities.

Lots of positives. Lots of learning.

Overall. I didn't roll many 8+ charges and was sick when I'd get -3/4 to hit on a Monster and then have the Monster make its saves... That is dice for ya. Still, WoT felt good, despite this. In fact, I got more 2/3's than 10+'s The table is supposed to be a game changer and it can be, I'll just have to pull the lever a bit more.

Here is my list:

  Reveal hidden contents

Allegiance: Nighthaunt
- Procession: Scarlet Doom
- Mortal Realm: Ghyran
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Bloodthirsty

Leaders
Lady Olynder, Mortarch of Grief (340)*
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist
- Lore of the Underworlds: Seal of Shyish
Kurdoss Valentian, the Craven King (210)*
Guardian of Souls (150)*
- General
- Command Trait: Master of Magic
- Lore of the Underworlds: Seal of Shyish
- Lore of the Underworlds: Spirit Drain
Dreadblade Harrow (145)
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Universal Spell Lore: Flaming Weapon
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist

Battleline
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (350)**
- Reinforced x 1
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (350)**
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Spirit Hosts (250)**
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Hexwraiths (160)*

Endless Spells & Invocations
The Burning Head (20)

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Hunters of the Heartlands

Additional Enhancements
Spell

Total: 1975 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 3 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 92
Drops: 8
 

I went with Scarlet Doom because I wanted to have the BGR as Battleline. This will probably be the last time I use this Procession. The mortals on 5's is great, but it didn't do anything and I felt that my style of play didn't make having the BGR in 20's very useful. Don't get me wrong, they are strong and if I had managed to win more than 2 out of 10 priorities they would have wiped my opponent but I felt that MSU/Herohammer overall was a way more efficient way to play. I'll take Emerald Host next time.

Hold the Line was great, especially with the Hex who could break away and avoid being killed late game.

Bloodthirsty for those essential charges.

When I came back to NH in late December I knew I wanted to run Olynder. Her and Kurdoss will be an auto include for me for my next few games. Oly did work, and while it took me a game and a half to remember her 12" 5+ CP negate aura, she was fantastic.  Her model regen was great and it makes me seriously going double Warlord to take the Lightshard and a Beacon.

I'm never taking Spell Enhance. It was useless. Same with the Burning Head. I'll take another Artefact along with the mandatory Arcane Tome.

Actually, I was really impressed with my four Heroes, Oly, Kurdoss, and a GoS moved in a pack with the SH's. The Dreadblade was there to try and be in a bubble of other stuff to echo Discorporate. This was probably the MVP play, the amount of 5+ wards I made really paid back the cost of the Dreadblade. He could tele around is required and giving him Lightshard next time will make him better.

The GoS with Master of Magic was great but when I'd cast Spectral Lure I'd roll a 1-2. Seal and Shademist were great. Spirit Drain did nothing in the only situation it was worth using.

Not having a ST was a concern going in to the game and while it doesn't heal heroes it probably would have been amazing if paired with either of the units of 20 BGR's. I didn't take one and I don't regret it but its a great value at only 115 pts and helps get closer to that double Warlord battalion.

The 2 units of 20 BGR's were a huge threat to my opponents and took a beating. The 4+ 5++ can't be praised enough but its way better value to get the same defense from 20 GGR's. Plus with the GGR you save your sanity because you're not trying to honeycomb BGR's that outgrew their base size long ago. And if you play Nighthaunt you already know the Barrel of Monkeys MEME everytime you try and remove one of you models from anything in tight quarters. The GGR 2" reach and 30 pt discount is enough for me to make the switch. The BGR only did about 10 bonus MW's in 3 games. Emerald Host will hopefully be more consistent.

6 SH's are a pain to move with coherency. I'll take 2 units of 3 next time. The SH's got targeted a few times and lost some models so I don't think it's too risky to keep them in 3's. If I Bodyguard stuff I'll hopefully get plays where I can use the Beacons to bring back one model in each unit. Plus whatever other units. Solid unit. 125 pts is great value and the 18 attacks does more work than you'd think. Also, maybe Herohammer want to go their separate ways midgame?

Hexwraiths. I'll always find a way to take at least one unit of 5. Everytime I think about Dreadscythe at the same pts I stick with Hex and they make many plays in this objective based game with their 24" retreat moves.

Ya. So that's it. I played 3 games and lost all 3. I learned a lot. Two of the games were super close and could have gone either way. The game vs Kruleboys was tough because of the mortals they do. I gave him first go and he did so much damage. I didn't get a double and Kurdoss whiffed a 2+/2+ sequence but the damage was too much. He had 6 units of Boltboyz all spread out.

Fyreslayers wasn't even close. Failed some 9" charges to get his support heroes and he used Fierce Counter Attack to strike first and do many damages... lol

Living Cities he made me go first so I castled up in the middle to avoid a Fulm deepstrike bomb and then got doubled and the Fulms hit me pretty hard. I fought back to only lose the game by 1pt while killing 4 Fulms and Krondy's in a couple turns. The heroes did work here and the BGR's only rolled one 6 when they rally'd with 31 dice... first time with 14 models lost and then again with 17 models gone. lol! to GoS and Oly also rolled 1's for the regen... I was still super happy with the game because retreat and charge when you want.

Anyways. that probably made no sense but here is what I'm thinking for my next list.

  Reveal hidden contents

Allegiance: Nighthaunt
- Procession: Emerald Host
- Mortal Realm: Ghyran
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Bloodthirsty

Leaders
Lady Olynder, Mortarch of Grief (340)*
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist
Kurdoss Valentian, the Craven King (210)*
Guardian of Souls (150)*
- General
- Command Trait: Master of Magic
- Artefact: Beacon of Nagashizzar
- Lore of the Underworlds: Seal of Shyish
Dreadblade Harrow (145)***
- Artefact: Lightshard of the Harvest Moon
Lord Executioner (140)***
Spirit Torment (115)***
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Lore of the Underworlds: Shademist

Battleline
3 x Spirit Hosts (125)**
5 x Hexwraiths (160)*
20 x Grimghast Reapers (320)**
- Reinforced x 1

Units
10 x Bladegheist Revenants (175)**
2 x Chainghasts (95)***

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Hunters of the Heartlands
***Warlord

Total: 1975 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 87
Drops: 11
 

 

This is good data, thank you. It's unfortunate you didn't win any, but seeing what happens when the dice are not in our favor is really important.

So, with that in mind, what do you think you could have done either with the list or with artefact/spell selection to hold up better when it wasn't your turn or got double-turned?

[The_Dudemeister]

Between your BGs doing little mortal wounds, Kurdoss whiffing 2+/2+s, opponent saving despite -3/4 to save, your rallies going to waste etc... you had some good reminders that we're still playing a dice game. I feel you 😂

6 hours ago, Boggler said:

The BGR only did about 10 bonus MW's in 3 games. Emerald Host will hopefully be more consistent.

I'm still on edge which one I prefer. Bladegheists really up the damage of the army... if you don't whiff lol

 

On the other hand, Emerald Host is a solid extra shooting attack. If you think about it, that's pretty much how this subfaction works. Just like a shooting unit it deals damage once per round, not per turn like melee. Think of free, additional units of Craventhrone Guard outside the battlefield, armed with crossbows that still hit without needing line of sight but not with insulting 12" range. And hitting on 2+ instead to boot.

 

While it deals much less damage than Scarlet Doom BGs, it deals pinpoint damage to units that we might not even reach at all times with our conventional means, precisely because we don't really participate in a whole phase of the game. And mathhammer only ever gets you that far, because sometimes you charge your BGs into a unit that they would've easily killed even without the extra mortal wounds. Adding all the MWs up per game can be quite misleading to ourselves. Meanwhile "shooting" attacks don't even need to kill to already be worth it. From bracketing big beasties to softening up melee heroes that the opponent then becomes more wary of engaging for the high chance that they now die before activating etc

 

So if that sounds enticing to you, give Emerald Host a spin.

[Liquidsteel]

I finally managed to get my first games in, went with the Scarlet Doom.

Spoiler

Allegiance: Nighthaunt
- Procession: Scarlet Doom
- Mortal Realm: Shyish
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Bloodthirsty

Leaders
Lady Olynder, Mortarch of Grief (340)*
- Lore of the Underworlds: Seal of Shyish
Knight of Shrouds on Ethereal Steed (155)*
- General
- Command Trait: Spiteful Spirit
- Artefact: Soulfire Ring
Krulghast Cruciator (150)*

Battleline
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (350)*
- Reinforced x 1
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (350)*
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Bladegheist Revenants (175)*
5 x Hexwraiths (160)*
6 x Spirit Hosts (250)*
- Reinforced x 1

Endless Spells & Invocations
Chronomantic Cogs (45)

Core Battalions
*Battle Regiment

Total: 1975 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 3 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 97
Drops: 1
 

Played vs Gloomspite Troggs and Idoneth in Ionrach.

Bladegheists pulled their weight, the impact mortals being on 5s is obviously swingy, I had 20 do 2 in one turn then 10 the next.

Krulghast is insane vs the right targets, Akhelian King and Eels very much neutered.

Spirit Hosts are fantastic, I had my Krulghast and Knight of Shrouds in the thick of it getting attacked from all angles and shrugging off huge damage.

Lady Olynder is fun - 7 mortals to an Akhelian King from her stare was hilarious.

I'll be trying out Kurdoss instead of the KoSoES + Cogs I think. Spiteful Spirit + Soulfire is decent but opponents can play around it and it feels bad when he fails to kill something and thus no heals or level up. Will free up Krulghast to become a Wizard with Arcane Tome or go with Lightshard to get +1 attacks on the Blades and Kurdoss.

Terrified is also amazing - luring troggs out of range of the loonshrine then seeing them flee after only a few casualties.