AoS3 - Soulblight Gravelord Discussion

[Ravinsild]

Army Faction: Soulblight Gravelords
    - Army Type: Vyrkos Dynasty
    - Grand Strategy: Hold the Line

LEADER

Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (435)*
    - General
    - Command Traits: Pack Alpha
    - Deathlance
    - Artefacts: Sangsyron
    - Mount Traits: Foetid Miasma
    - Spells: Invigorating Aura, Flaming Weapon

Vampire Lord (140)**
    - Spells: Invigorating Aura, Amethystine Pinions

Necromancer (125)**
    - Artefacts: Arcane Tome
    - Spells: Decrepify, Invigorating Aura

Wight King (115)**

BATTLELINE

2 x Deathrattle Skeletons (255)*

2 x Deathrattle Skeletons (255)*

Dire Wolves (135)*

OTHER

Blood Knights (195)*

Blood Knights (195)*

Grave Guard (140)**
    - Great Wight Blade

CORE BATTALIONS:

*Battle Regiment

**Warlord

TOTAL POINTS: (1990/2000)

Created with Warhammer Age of Sigmar: The App

 

Do y’all think this list has any potential to be good in any kind of way? I wanted a strong vampire presence but also to lean into Death’s strength of just hordes of bodies and the dead underlines under the vampires doing the work and protecting their masters while the vampires get the glory of the kills and taking offensive objectives. 

[Honk]

On 5/28/2022 at 9:24 AM, Ravinsild said:

Do y’all think this list has any potential

Not playing competitively, but the list looks pretty good.

I’m not sure about the amount of skellis… maybe more guards 🤔

[Ravinsild]

19 hours ago, Honk said:

Not playing competitively, but the list looks pretty good.

I’m not sure about the amount of skellis… maybe more guards 🤔

I figured you needed as many skellies as possible to keep the units alive since they’re so killable. I tried LoN back in AoS 1.0 or maybe early 2.0 and the strategy then was as many skeletons or zombies as possible to flood the board and death couldn’t function without it because I kept trying MSU (3 sets of 10) skeletons because I didn’t want a horde army at the time. 
 

My idea is also based off my Ironjawz experience with a tough tarpit/anvil of ArdBoyz, so that would be my skeletons being constantly revived via their combat resurrection, deathly invocations and the invigorating aura spell. The Blood Knights do the same damage as Gore-Gruntas on the charge. Graveguard do as much or way more damage than Brutes. Then the hammer hero like MBMK (VLOZD) and last the support pieces like the Warchanter (Necromancer let’s GG fight twice, Wight King rr1, VL gives +1 attack to GG)

I am having trouble picking a Dynasty as well. 

 Legion of Blood:

D3 more run from bravery

+1 attack to 1 VLOZD, +2 cast 1 footlord

Deathrattle (1 Wight King, 2 units of 30 Skeletons, 1 unit of 10-20 Graveguard) don’t take negative modifiers to hit/wound

Artefacts:

+1 to save 

Command trait:

-1 to be hit 

Re-roll charge rolls 

 

Vrykos Dynasty:

Re-roll casting rolls for vampires (1 VLOZD, 1 Footlord) 

+1 to hit/wound for Deathrattle ( 

1 Wight king, 2 units of 30 Skeletons, 1 unit of 10-20 Graveguard) 

Artefacts:

D3 Extra attacks 

Command Trait:

Re-roll Charge rolls

Free command point once per turn 

 

Kastelei Dynasty:

Deepstrike Vampires on board edge

+1 damage, +1 wound, +2 speed for 1 VLOZD, 2 units of 5 Bloodknights, 1 Vampire Lord on Foot, 1 unit of Vargheists 

Artefacts:

-1 to wound rolls

Command Trait:

Re-roll charge rolls

I have also reworked my list to be either:

 

Army Faction: Soulblight Gravelords
    - Army Type: Kastelai Dynasty
    - Grand Strategy: Hold the Line

LEADER

Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (435)*
    - General
    - Command Traits: Swift and Deadly
    - Deathlance
    - Artefacts: Fragment of the Keep
    - Mount Traits: Foetid Miasma
    - Spells: Flaming Weapon, Invigorating Aura

Vampire Lord (140)**
    - Spells: Invigorating Aura, Amethystine Pinions

Necromancer (125)**
    - Artefacts: Arcane Tome
    - Spells: Decrepify, Invigorating Aura

Wight King (115)**

BATTLELINE

1 x Deathrattle Skeletons (170)*

1 x Deathrattle Skeletons (170)*

Blood Knights (195)*

Blood Knights (195)*

1 x Deathrattle Skeletons (170)*

OTHER

1 x Grave Guard (280)**
    - Great Wight Blade

CORE BATTALIONS:

*Battle Regiment

**Warlord

TOTAL POINTS: (1995/2000)

Created with Warhammer Age of Sigmar: The App

Or this:

Army Faction: Soulblight Gravelords
    - Army Type: Legion of Blood
    - Grand Strategy: Hold the Line

LEADER

Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (435)
    - General
    - Command Traits: Aristocracy of Blood
    - Deathlance
    - Artefacts: Soulbound Garments
    - Mount Traits: Foetid Miasma
    - Spells: Flaming Weapon, Invigorating Aura

Neferata (365)*
    - Spells: Vile Transference

Vampire Lord (140)*
    - Spells: Amethystine Pinions, Invigorating Aura

BATTLELINE

2 x Deathrattle Skeletons (255)*

2 x Deathrattle Skeletons (255)*

Dire Wolves (135)*

OTHER

Blood Knights (195)*

Blood Knights (195)*

CORE BATTALIONS:

*Battle Regiment

TOTAL POINTS: (1975/2000)

Created with Warhammer Age of Sigmar: The App

The truth about what got me into vampires and death is the Card Game they had for Warhammer. Im used to elite armies though so I resisted the horde back then. Now I guess I’m ready to embrace it with contrast paint existing. I’ve just always always wanted to use Neferata and have a bunch of vampires but I see now the use of giant blobs of skeletons or zombies to take objectives and hopefully never die. I want a defensive attrition army that can play the grinding game. 5 battle rounds of slow and brutal slaughter that isn’t Nurgle. 

[Tizianolol]

Guys I have a question about gorlslav command ability. I can use that ability on a unit only one time. If the same unit was resurrected  because of " endless legion " battletrait, can I use gorslav CA on the same unit? Thx a lot!:)

[Honk]

On 6/1/2022 at 5:34 PM, Ravinsild said:

take objectives and hopefully never die

That was true early AoS 2.0… I had fun with 2x40 skellis and 60 zombies corpse cart Necromancers and vampires and a coven throne flooding the board with goodness and regeneration.

then came the power creep and 40 skellis are not an unmovable object anymore (and don’t kill stuff either)

belladamma (200) and a unit of puppies (135) would give you solid spellcasting and a mobile objective grabber. Or a venga lord (280) for the knights, ignore one rend makes knights very durable.

but I would suggest you just pitch your list against your meta and see what happens.

[Leshoyadut]

Personally, I've had good experiences with a unit of 30 skellies and a necromancer. It's about 400 points to hold an objective, but they've done well at that job. They're not invulnerable, especially if you run into shooting, but they do just fine at scoring a few easy points, and have baited a couple opponents into not getting battle tactics as the bones hold together better than they expected.

[Ravinsild]

21 hours ago, Leshoyadut said:

Personally, I've had good experiences with a unit of 30 skellies and a necromancer. It's about 400 points to hold an objective, but they've done well at that job. They're not invulnerable, especially if you run into shooting, but they do just fine at scoring a few easy points, and have baited a couple opponents into not getting battle tactics as the bones hold together better than they expected.

I was personally going to run 2 blocks of 30 or 3 blocks of 20 in order to fulfill battleline requirements for, for instance, Legion of Blood. I could do 2 sets of 20 a block of Direwolves or something, but if I double reinforce then I can't reinforce the Grave Guard to be at 20. These stupid reinforcement rules really hurt trying to run hordes.

[Leshoyadut]

28 minutes ago, Ravinsild said:

I was personally going to run 2 blocks of 30 or 3 blocks of 20 in order to fulfill battleline requirements for, for instance, Legion of Blood. I could do 2 sets of 20 a block of Direwolves or something, but if I double reinforce then I can't reinforce the Grave Guard to be at 20. These stupid reinforcement rules really hurt trying to run hordes.

I wouldn't go for a 20 block of dire wolves, anyways. MSU dire wolves still give you 20 highly mobile wounds for 135 points, which is pretty solid. Plus, while I'm not as worried about the coherency issues as some people are (dire wolves aren't really there for damage, so not getting all of them in to attack isn't a big deal), 20 of them can still be really difficult to maneuver around terrain. A couple of my favorite battlelines in my lists are either 1) 1x30 skellies, 2x10 dire wolves, or 2) 1x30 skellies, 1x30 grave guard, 1x20 zombies, both of which give plenty of room for GG. Dire wolves make for chunky screens, which has its pros and cons, but they're excellent for zipping around and grabbing objectives or taking a big charge from something you don't want hitting your GG.

I also typically go Legion of Blood, so I'm right there with you.

[Ravinsild]

1 hour ago, Leshoyadut said:

I wouldn't go for a 20 block of dire wolves, anyways. MSU dire wolves still give you 20 highly mobile wounds for 135 points, which is pretty solid. Plus, while I'm not as worried about the coherency issues as some people are (dire wolves aren't really there for damage, so not getting all of them in to attack isn't a big deal), 20 of them can still be really difficult to maneuver around terrain. A couple of my favorite battlelines in my lists are either 1) 1x30 skellies, 2x10 dire wolves, or 2) 1x30 skellies, 1x30 grave guard, 1x20 zombies, both of which give plenty of room for GG. Dire wolves make for chunky screens, which has its pros and cons, but they're excellent for zipping around and grabbing objectives or taking a big charge from something you don't want hitting your GG.

I also typically go Legion of Blood, so I'm right there with you.

I think there was a tiny misunderstanding. I meant 60 skeletons total and 10 dire wolves, as in 30 Skeletons, 30 Skeletons and 10 direwolves, or 20 skeletons, 20 skeletons, 20 skeletons, or 20 skeletons, 20 skeletons, 10 dire wolves. If I do 30 skeletons, 30 skeletons, 10 dire wolves though that's 4 "reinforcement points" so I cannot reinforce a unit of Grave Guard. I'd have to bring 2 units of 10 Grave Guard.

[Leshoyadut]

34 minutes ago, Ravinsild said:

I think there was a tiny misunderstanding. I meant 60 skeletons total and 10 dire wolves, as in 30 Skeletons, 30 Skeletons and 10 direwolves, or 20 skeletons, 20 skeletons, 20 skeletons, or 20 skeletons, 20 skeletons, 10 dire wolves. If I do 30 skeletons, 30 skeletons, 10 dire wolves though that's 4 "reinforcement points" so I cannot reinforce a unit of Grave Guard. I'd have to bring 2 units of 10 Grave Guard.

There was, indeed, a misunderstanding! I shouldn't reply when tired, I suppose, haha. I don't think you need two blocks of 30 skeletons, either, though. That, in my opinion, quickly leads to having your army be too passive. Having 20-25% of your army solely devoted to holding an objective all game (such as, say, a 30 block of skeletons, a necromancer and a corpse cart) is certainly worth it. However, I'd be wary of devoting more than that to such a passive, defensive play, since you really can't guarantee being able to sit on more than one objective like that. Having done multiple blocks of 30 skeletons, I found my army lacking in offense when I did so.

On the other hand, I will say that if you really do want big blocks of skeletons, having MSUs of GG is often enough because of just how killy they are with greatweapons. Give them AOA or a CA from a vampire lord, and they absolutely shred.

[Ravinsild]

8 minutes ago, Leshoyadut said:

There was, indeed, a misunderstanding! I shouldn't reply when tired, I suppose, haha. I don't think you need two blocks of 30 skeletons, either, though. That, in my opinion, quickly leads to having your army be too passive. Having 20-25% of your army solely devoted to holding an objective all game (such as, say, a 30 block of skeletons, a necromancer and a corpse cart) is certainly worth it. However, I'd be wary of devoting more than that to such a passive, defensive play, since you really can't guarantee being able to sit on more than one objective like that. Having done multiple blocks of 30 skeletons, I found my army lacking in offense when I did so.

On the other hand, I will say that if you really do want big blocks of skeletons, having MSUs of GG is often enough because of just how killy they are with greatweapons. Give them AOA or a CA from a vampire lord, and they absolutely shred.

Well for hammers I was planning on bringing 20 graveguard, 10 blood knights and a vampire lord on zombie dragon, and to buff out the graveguard I was bringing a Necromancer for fight twice and a Vampire Lord for +1 attack. Is that enough offensive power do you think?

[Leshoyadut]

1 hour ago, Ravinsild said:

Well for hammers I was planning on bringing 20 graveguard, 10 blood knights and a vampire lord on zombie dragon, and to buff out the graveguard I was bringing a Necromancer for fight twice and a Vampire Lord for +1 attack. Is that enough offensive power do you think?

That does seem like a good amount. I will warn that the blood knights are not nearly as much of a hammer as you may expect; they're great at wearing an enemy down, staying in the fight, and retreat+charging to keep their damage up, but they won't delete enemies. They do good damage still, but not as much as you may hope; just keep your expectations of them realistic. The GG and VLoZD are great hammers, though, and the VL is great for buffing.

I'd keep the Necromancer more for the skeletons than the GG, myself, but mostly because the GG will either kill their target or take significant losses before their second activation (they only have a 5+/6++, after all). Vanhel's is hardly worthless on GG, but if your skeletons are in combat with something deadly, I'd generally (but not always; specific circumstances can always change things) prioritize them first.

[Honk]

2 hours ago, Leshoyadut said:

I will warn that the blood knights are not nearly as much of a hammer as you may expect

This… 

knights feel more like a hyper mobile anvil 🤣 but it hurts when it crashes into things…

With the GGs, overkill or stumbling is the trouble. They are so slow, getting them into position is tricky and crucial. Personally I rather have them mincing something suboptimal into a fine bloodsmoothy, than going for the big play and messing it up, which kinda is my signature move 🙈

 

[Leshoyadut]

35 minutes ago, Honk said:

This… 

knights feel more like a hyper mobile anvil 🤣 but it hurts when it crashes into things…

Yeah. They can definitely do some good damage, but they kinda almost feel like a hybrid between anvil and hammer. They're durable, but not super tanky; they're damaging, but won't delete things. They're just kinda...always good, regardless of what you need more of in your army. I love them for that. If you have the points left over after the core units for your army, throwing a unit or two of Blood Knights never feels like a bad idea.

41 minutes ago, Honk said:

With the GGs, overkill or stumbling is the trouble. They are so slow, getting them into position is tricky and crucial. Personally I rather have them mincing something suboptimal into a fine bloodsmoothy, than going for the big play and messing it up, which kinda is my signature move 🙈

I feel that hard. 😂 I was playing DoK against a friend recently, and piled in a buffed 30 block of Witch Aelves (got 22 in) against their Black Coach. Landed 41 of my attacks into a 4+/4++ and did 5 damage, literally half of the average I should have gotten out of that. It hurts every time.

[Ravinsild]

If the Blood Knights took down a hero in Kastelai with 3 damage on the charge would they be a proper hammer? I’m surprised to find that the horde mentality is gone. Used to be like minimum 60 skeletons or you lose. 
 

i thought you had to embrace the horde to do well

[Ravinsild]

Army Faction: Soulblight Gravelords
    - Army Type: Kastelai Dynasty
    - Grand Strategy: Dominating Presence

LEADER

Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (435)
    - General
    - Command Traits: A Craving for Massacre
    - Deathlance
    - Artefacts: Fragment of the Keep
    - Mount Traits: Foetid Miasma
    - Spells: Flaming Weapon, Invigorating Aura

Vampire Lord (140)
    - Spells: Invigorating Aura, Amethystine Pinions

Necromancer (125)
    - Spells: Decrepify, Invigorating Aura

Wight King On Skeletal Steed (130)

BATTLELINE

Dire Wolves (135)
    - Doom Wolf

Dire Wolves (135)
    - Doom Wolf

Blood Knights (195)
    - Kastellan
    - Standard Bearer

Blood Knights (195)
    - Kastellan
    - Standard Bearer

1 x Deadwalker Zombies (230)

OTHER

1 x Grave Guard (280)
    - Seneschal
    - 2 x Standard Bearer
    - 2 x Hornblower
    - Great Wight Blade

TOTAL POINTS: (2000/2000)

Created with Warhammer Age of Sigmar: The App

Is this a good list? For Kastelai that is 

[Leshoyadut]

3 hours ago, Ravinsild said:

If the Blood Knights took down a hero in Kastelai with 3 damage on the charge would they be a proper hammer? I’m surprised to find that the horde mentality is gone. Used to be like minimum 60 skeletons or you lose. 
 

i thought you had to embrace the horde to do well

I rather enjoy my horde lists, personally, they're just not quite as horde-y as they were in the past. Amusingly, I think Daughters of Khaine are the top horde army with the free reinforcements out of Draichi Ganeth letting you plop 110 elves onto the board (plus heroes). But I've done a couple horde lists in SBG with 30 skellies and 30 Grave Guard. This one is probably my favorite from testing, though I have a couple of similar lists.

Spoiler

Allegiance: Soulblight Gravelords
- Lineage: Legion of Blood
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs:

Leaders
Necromancer (125)**
- Lore of the Deathmages: Fading Vigour
Neferata, Mortarch of Blood (365)*
- Lore of the Deathmages: Overwhelming Dread
Vampire Lord (140)**
- Artefact: Soulbound Garments
- Expertise: Arcane
- Lore of the Vampires: Amethystine Pinions
Wight King on Skeletal Steed (130)**
- General
- Command Trait: Sanguine Blur
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Universal Spell Lore: Ghost-mist

Battleline
10 x Dire Wolves (135)*
30 x Deathrattle Skeletons (255)*
- Reinforced x 2
30 x Grave Guard (420)
- Great Wight Blades
- Reinforced x 2

Units
5 x Blood Knights (195)*
5 x Blood Knights (195)*

Core Battalions
*Battle Regiment
**Command Entourage - Magnificent

Total: 1960 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 139
Drops: 5

Has 94 bodies and 139 wounds. Very grindy playstyle, and has even done pretty well into a couple of shooting lists I've played into with the sheer mass of bones I can throw at them. The Skeletons+Necromancer combo has ground down a Megaboss on Mawcrusha a couple times just because they don't die, which is nicely points positive for me. The GG with a Vampire Lord for support can even reasonably one-shot a gargant now that they only have a 6++ ward. Have to get all 30 of them in to make it more consistent, but that's a lot more doable with the 6" pile-in from the Wight King's CT. Against anything short of that, they just absolutely delete enemy units.

Outside of that, Neferata provides great mobile support, you have lots of healing for your various summonable units with everything being a wizard for any Invigorating Auras you want, plenty of other wizardly buffs and debuffs, some mobility and staying power from the Blood Knights, a nice mobile wall out of the grave with the wolves, etc. It just has a lot of options while playing a grindy game that I enjoy a lot.

I think SBG is, these days, a mixed hammer and anvil list. You want some horde and some semi-elite stuff. But you can lean more into one or the other depending on your preference and subfaction. The army definitely has a fair bit of variety, though, so neither horde nor elite are entirely required to do well.

As for your example Kastelai list, I think it looks fine, but I'm not super familiar with the nuances of Kastelai as I mostly brew and play Legion of Blood (Neferata for un-life). Kastelai can definitely make Blood Knights more of a hammer. I've even seen a few folks go all in on Oops, All Blood Knights with 5 or 6 units of them in Kastelai given the bonuses they can get, though I'm not sure how those turned out (especially post-nerfs on Nagash).

[Ravinsild]

In that regard I think the best possible list for me follows the Ironjawz Recipe:

2 units of ArdBoyz as my grinders, the damage sponges, objective holders and general anvils.

2-3 units of Gore-Gruntas to support the Megaboss on Maw-Krusha. They’re my flex unit that can peel back in case of deep strikes, be held back and charge when needed or split to the flanks for far flung objectives then come back in. They’re fast enough to be able to move around and tag what’s needed.

Then there’s the brutes which are the slow backfield hammer incase of deep strikes or enemy alpha strike charges or whatever. They can also be deployed via Hand of Gork upfield.

After that you have the main hammer Megaboss on Maw-Krusha who is your mobile point and click to delete a unit, main offense and general. He can move up to 30” in one turn so I usually sit back and wait for the right opportunity hovering as far back as possible before my opponent exposes their general or other important piece and pouncing like a cat.

All rhis accompanied by the support which is typically 2 Warchanters for +1 to hit and +1 to damage and a Weirdnob maybe to counter spell or Hand of Gork.

Taking this to Soulblight Gravelords I make the following analogy:

Skeletons are ArdBoyz, only 1 worse save, but every single one of them has 6+ ward instead of only 2 per 5. Only 1 wound but they also come back in combat on a 4+. With Invigorating Aura and Deathly Invocations I feel they’re the king of attrition. They’re the perfect anvil and tarpit and objectives holders. Plus from the graveyard gives excellent mobility that’s guaranteed over a 8 cast hand of Gork.

Blood Knights are self sufficient and need almost no support and do more damage than Gore-Gruntas. They would be the exact same role and use as Gore-Gruntas and with Kastelei they can be brought in on the edges to protect from being shot off the board.

Graveguard are brutes but can be brought back, get a 6+ ward save and do wayyy more damage, plus the option to be deployed from the grave again a guaranteed deepstrike instead of a risky cast.

Then the support heroes, Wight King gives Graveguard reroll 1s, Vampire Lord +1 attack to Graveguard, and with the Necromancer we have Vanhel’s Fight Again.

With Kastelei Dynasty my independent Blood Knights and VLOZD snowball, and the VLOZD can move 20” and still charge giving a huge threat range via using the run and still charge command trait, plus the auto run command ability, which is perfect for the pounce and strike. Which could be up to 26” if I run Amythystine Pistons instead of Flaming Sword.


Army Faction: Soulblight Gravelords
- Army Type: Kastelai Dynasty

LEADER

Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (435)*
- General
- Command Traits: A Craving for Massacre
- Deathlance
- Artefacts: Fragment of the Keep
- Mount Traits: Foetid Miasma
- Spells: Invigorating Aura, Flaming Weapon

Vampire Lord (140)**
- Spells: Invigorating Aura, Soulpike

Necromancer (125)**
- Artefacts: Arcane Tome
- Spells: Invigorating Aura, Decrepify

Wight King (115)**

BATTLELINE

Blood Knights (195)*

Blood Knights (195)*

2 x Deathrattle Skeletons (255)*

2 x Deathrattle Skeletons (255)*

OTHER

1 x Grave Guard (280)**
- Great Wight Blade

CORE BATTALIONS:

*Battle Regiment

**Warlord

TOTAL POINTS: (1995/2000)

 

although since reinforcement rules I would probably do 3 blocks of 20 skeletons and a block of 20 grave guard 

What I have really found out is that my playstyle is pretty defensive. I have tried all alpha strike armies in the past even with Death and Ironjawz and other armies and it’s never worked. However I refined my playstyle on the Ironjawz into a slow game meat grinder of outlasting my opponent and striking their most powerful pieces with my MBMK at the perfect time. They hold back thinking they’re safe and next turn they can walk forward into combat but oops I happen to move 30” in a round and charge and deleted 800 points of your army and almost all of your hammers in like round 4 after holding objectives all game.

I’m looking for a defensive slow grinding attrition playstyle to outlast my opponent and hit them when they’re weakest or most confident underestimating my speed and hitting power. With Kastelei I can easily run 20-26” with the run and charge command trait and Amythystine pistons or not. 
 

I am also not married to Skeletons. 40 zombies and 20 dire wolves. I don’t really care. 80 zombies and 10 dire wolves. I’m just committed to the grind and having flexibility to have fast units tag far away objectives then join the fight or whatever. I’d even use Fell Bats just for like super far away objective grabbers on the maps with the objectives all the way spaced out. I just want a defensive style where I can strike when I need to where I need with what I need to. I think graveyard deployment, run and charge in the same turn, etc can add a lot to that. 

Edited June 11, 2022 by Ravinsild

[Skreech Verminking]

So I was helping with the location and organization of a small fun tournament .

and got as thanks this model:

So considering that this is a awesome, horrific looking model, that apparently for some reason has the same base size as the vengorian lord, I was thinking of exactly using it as one.

It looks so much cooler then the actual model, and the rules for being a terrufing being, actually really works with it’s looks😜

[Leshoyadut]

11 hours ago, Ravinsild said:

I am also not married to Skeletons. 40 zombies and 20 dire wolves. I don’t really care. 80 zombies and 10 dire wolves. I’m just committed to the grind and having flexibility to have fast units tag far away objectives then join the fight or whatever. I’d even use Fell Bats just for like super far away objective grabbers on the maps with the objectives all the way spaced out. I just want a defensive style where I can strike when I need to where I need with what I need to. I think graveyard deployment, run and charge in the same turn, etc can add a lot to that. 

I think your list looks like a good place to start for that, though it looks like you have five reinforcements there. You could honestly break the GG into two units of 10 and still be fine. They won't have as much alpha strike, of course, but 10 is still enough to do some real damage and you could split them up in combats if you wanted. You even have room for one more troop unit in your Battle Regiment, so it wouldn't increase your drops to do so.

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

The new points are out:

Skeletons 80 (-5)

Zombies 120 (+5)

Torgillius 100 (-15)

Deintalos and the Exiled Dead 270 (+50)

No other changes.

 

Overall, minor adjustments. Which seems fair, Gravelords are in a good place. Torgillius seems kinda attractive now if you want access to the Deathmages lore for cheap. Deintalos looks like a misprint, that underworlds warband was already probably not worth it before and is definitely not worth it now.

[Ravinsild]

On 6/18/2022 at 6:57 AM, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

The new points are out:

Skeletons 80 (-5)

Zombies 120 (+5)

Torgillius 100 (-15)

Deintalos and the Exiled Dead 270 (+50)

No other changes.

 

Overall, minor adjustments. Which seems fair, Gravelords are in a good place. Torgillius seems kinda attractive now if you want access to the Deathmages lore for cheap. Deintalos looks like a misprint, that underworlds warband was already probably not worth it before and is definitely not worth it now.

What even is the “meta” for Soulblight Gravelords? I’ve heard they’re in a good place but I can’t really find any lists that are winning anything or any clear concept of the usual things people are running. 

[Kaizennus]

On 6/12/2022 at 12:37 AM, Ravinsild said:

If the Blood Knights took down a hero in Kastelai with 3 damage on the charge would they be a proper hammer? I’m surprised to find that the horde mentality is gone. Used to be like minimum 60 skeletons or you lose. 
 

i thought you had to embrace the horde to do well

So the problem with hordes in 3rd edition was that the GHB2021 really encouraged killing things. Lots of battle tactics were based around killing targets and the meta shifted to high damage output armies that could cut through typical hordes (there was still some horde play though). Garagants were also really big last season and hordes didn’t play well into them either.

Hard to say how the new season will go. I think the rules support elite infantry much more than mass units but we will have to wait and see how people build their lists.

Maybe mass zombies will be really good, maybe it will be worse than ever. I’m leaning a bit towards the later because I think our horde pieces are going to get shredded by bounty hunters, but there may be ways around that too (I’ve been toying with the idea of lots of minimum sized units to just endlessly screen and overwhelm objectives with numbers).

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

1 minute ago, Kaizennus said:

So the problem with hordes in 3rd edition was that the GHB2021 really encouraged killing things. Lots of battle tactics were based around killing targets and the meta shifted to high damage output armies that could cut through typical hordes (there was still some horde play though). Garagants were also really big last season and hordes didn’t play well into them either.

Hard to say how the new season will go. I think the rules support elite infantry much more than mass units but we will have to wait and see how people build their lists.

Maybe mass zombies will be really good, maybe it will be worse than ever. I’m leaning a bit towards the later because I think our horde pieces are going to get shredded by bounty hunters, but there may be ways around that too (I’ve been toying with the idea of lots of minimum sized units to just endlessly screen and overwhelm objectives with numbers).

For my money, Direwolves and Zombies seem good in the capturing battalion. Skeletons are probably nonviable for the time being, and Grave Guard should probably avoid being battleline if they can.

Also worth noting, even though hordes were bad last season, Gravelords was one of the few armies that actually made them work competitively.

[Leshoyadut]

Yeah. Even as a big skeleton lover, I am genuinely struggling to see them work well in this. The potential for opponents to get an extra damage per swing into them absolutely demolishes their main way of tanking: sheer wound count. Obviously zombies got you more wounds per point out of the base count, but skeletons were a bit more healable between their ability and actually having a save. Enemy units doing easily 50-100% more damage against them kinda...sucks. A lot.

Deathrattle kingdoms are in shambles right now, and given that was my favorite way to play SBG, I may just be playing DoK for the next six months.