AoS 2 - Beasts of Chaos Discussion

[Oak7603]

I'll be interested to see the replies here. 

My initial beginner to BoC view would be that 200 points is a lot to protect a unit that melts anyway and soon loses it bonuses (With the Raiders thats 520 pts just there) .

I've been using mine as merely an annoyance that the enemy have to either take on then get tied up for a few turns or risk getting picked off slowly.

4 and 4 with no rend isn't a great stat which is why I've been running the Desolating Beastherd to get those extra hits. Rerolling 1s and 2s and 6s an extra hit can be good while it lasts. 

[TheArborealWalrus]

4 hours ago, Kazimer said:

either running 10 warriors or 30 gors,

I'd say that warriors are better except that they lose a point of armor if they're touching the herdstone aura. Effectively they'd have 5+ saves  most of the time which makes them worse than gors for the job., even if they don't hit as hard. Plus side for the gors would be your ability to block more area with them, but if you expect casualties you'll need a hero for battleshock immunity until later in the game. I've haven't tried a big blob of raiders yet, so I can't speak to their value or lack thereof. You'll have to tell us of your results.

@Oak7603, I'd say our entire army is based around shielding, so assigning someone to protect a potentially valuable shooting unit seems reasonable. I'd personally just assign the mandatory gor unit from desolating beastherd to block for them. Send replacement meatshields as necessary. But I've been known to do weird things. Unless you get a match up with cities, karadron, the reaper catapults, or some shootcast,  most armies don't have significant shooting presence, so the big raider blob should be safe enough. Usually. I just generally don't expect my units to kill things, so the raiders at least let me try for my choice of targets.

Something I've been wondering since I joined the beasts of chaos forum is why I always see 30 man raider units and not 40s. Is 40 too unwieldy? Is it always a points thing? Is there some rule interaction I'm unaware of? What's the rationale?

Edited June 16, 2020 by TheArborealWalrus

[Oak7603]

I think its because painting another 10 Raiders is a killer! 

40 has to be better because with 30 as soon as you lose one model you've lost the rerolling 2's by being less than 30 models. I've only got 20 at the moment but I will be doubling them.

As for shielding them with the 10 Gors tax - that makes sense. I didn't really have a use for them. I do now 😁

Edited June 16, 2020 by Oak7603
Speelin' ain't gud

[Maddpainting]

11 hours ago, Kazimer said:

I plan on running a block of 40 ungor raiders for bowmen, and im looking for a shield wall in front of them. Should I go with Chaos Warriors or Gors with shields? The gors provide more bodies and wounds while the warriors have the ability to shrug mortal wounds, so its really a toss up to me. Im either running 10 warriors or 30 gors, both 200 points either way.

I play 40mans a lot, and you don't need much in front of them b.c they have large movements. Just put w/e you have in your list, ungors, gors, centigors, chariots, w/e you already are taking for that purpose. 

For me Raiders never live to long anyways. Maybe 3 turns. I use them as a high threat unit to heroes and put them in places that they have to deal with or they will shoot you all game. They are great for their movements, for harassing etc.. But don't be scared to use them as a trap and decoy to win the game.

Edited June 16, 2020 by Maddpainting

[TheArborealWalrus]

https://rgdgaming.com/

So I got the fawns from the above site to use as ungors (specifically raiders) and thought I'd leave a little review for those who might be interested. Also note, I'm in no way a professional reviewer. 

Pros: Cheap. Lots of extra parts. Characterful posing possibilities. Came with centaurs (not pictured). Both genders included (for those who care). 

Cons: Tiny twig like arms. No bases. Might be too fey for some beasts of chaos players. Number of bows doesn't fit for a raider unit. Delicate. 

Review: They come with 4 each of two different sprues and a command sprue that has two centaur on it. The female arms are very delicate, I snapped a couple while first working with them, fortunately there are more than enough repeats that it didn't matter. The neck joints on the female heads are precarious as they're a tiny flat area with another tiny, flat connector. It confused me since the male heads have a divot to rest on the peg of the neck on. I drilled the necks of the few that I had trouble with. The hands are too small to easily drill into and the kit doesn't naturally come with any banners, so generally you'll go with GW parts for that. Speaking of, the female torsos had smaller arm connections, making only the smallest of arms possible to use with them. Daughters of Khaine and daemonette parts work (basically, without cutting, you'd have to use Gw female human sized arms). The males have more options for arms that fit them, but smaller is still better. I extensively raided my elf parts for the conversions. I feel that you could make some wicked slaangors or slaanungors out of these guys. The daemonette claws fit perfectly. I built my makeshift bases out of foamboard. Annoying, but I didn't have many spare bases. Overall, if you're willing to work at it a bit, I'd say these are more than worth the asking price. With no conversion work? You might wish to pass. Up to you.

 

Spoiler

 

Edited June 16, 2020 by TheArborealWalrus
Can't upload pictures from my computer

[Popisdead]

4 hours ago, Maddpainting said:

I play 40mans a lot, and you don't need much in front of them b.c they have large movements. Just put w/e you have in your list, ungors, gors, centigors, chariots, w/e you already are taking for that purpose. 

For me Raiders never live to long anyways. Maybe 3 turns. I use them as a high threat unit to heroes and put them in places that they have to deal with or they will shoot you all game. They are great for their movements, for harassing etc.. But don't be scared to use them as a trap and decoy to win the game.

Nothing lives long.  I think that's the point of Ungors.  I'm sloooowly learning to stop trying to max combat efficacy and go for just "you have to do 180 wounds to wipe me out." style of play.  (I was playing a lot of Warherd in AoS 1).

If anyone heard Joel McGrath's interview on a couple podcasts recently (Honest Wargamer and AoS Coach I think?) he echoes the same sentiments as @Maddpainting.  Bestigors, Gavespawn, Ungors.  Ungors are there to score objectives and die as slow as you can make them.  

If no one heard them (I do recommend them) a couple points I took away was "If playing a friendly game and want to learn BoC more, don't charge with BoC unless you are charging to get onto an objective."  This forces you to play in the movement phase and strictly look at objective scoring and table control.  Last game I played my opponent pointed out I should have just used my crappy 10-man ungors to wrap his heroes (it was the hero objective mission) and force him to kill them off for a turn or two instead of charge them at the heroes (I had mistakenly thought at the time his ghoul infantry heroes could fly).  Another neat tactic was ambush a spawn and Bestigor unit and try to max the command points to dump attacks on a disruption that will die in a turn anyway.  See what they can take down.  I'm pretty keen to get back at BoC once games around here start up again.

[Salyx]

I have watched this as well. It is from Doom and Darkness and can be found on Youtube. 

The Video you are refering to is named: Unlocking Age of Sigmar: Beasts of Chaos. 

I like that throwaway playstyle, however, he plays 3 fighty units as well (2*30 Bestigor as bullet magnets and 6 bullgors) and I don't like the deaolating brayherd, because it does Not included Centigor Love them, they are the most cost-effektive unit in BoC

[Oak7603]

1 hour ago, Popisdead said:

If anyone heard Joel McGrath's interview on a couple podcasts recently (Honest Wargamer and AoS Coach I think?) he echoes the same sentiments as @Maddpainting.  Bestigors, Gavespawn, Ungors.  Ungors are there to score objectives and die as slow as you can make them. 

He was on Aos Coach with Ryan Kirby for the BoC Faction Focus video and he was also on his own on 2+ Tough talking about the same stuff (I didn't rate this interview. The AoS Coach was much better). 

The AoS Coach interview was what made me pick BoC and I built my wish list on the Desolating Beastherd and his list 👌

No regrets so far. Just need to be allowed to be within sneezing distance of someone to actually get a game 😂😂

[Maddpainting]

I'll have to watch that video, which ever one it is, he sounds like a smart guy lol. Its the channel Doom and Darkness? Or thats what the episode is called?

[Oak7603]

The interview is on YouTube - AoS Coach, Beasts of Chaos Faction Focus. 

I don't know what the Doom and Darkness one is. 

 

 

[Salyx]

1 hour ago, Maddpainting said:

I'll have to watch that video, which ever one it is, he sounds like a smart guy lol. Its the channel Doom and Darkness? Or thats what the episode is called?

 

The Youtube-channel's Name is Doom and Darkness, like the Warhammer Fantasy - braver-spell

[Popisdead]

Ugh yeah sorry.  I have 2 young kids so my brain is mush regarding details for channel names, etc.  the other was Honest Wargamer.

 

@Maddpainting I tried a spam unit list with the Nurgle Battalion before lockdown (lacked mages which was dumb),.. I think it was double all herd desolating?  I was thinking of trying your style list (spam MSU Ungors, Bestigors) in the Nurgle Battalion.  Is there a different reason for using Depraved Drove other than it's just cheap and can get all the heroes into the one drop?

[Salyx]

Depraved Drove is often used because of the heroes with Artefacts. They tend to be a keypiece of many armies and having Hit-re-rolls against them can Come quote in Handy. Fürther more, you get Charge re-rolls if you Pop up out of ambush near an Artefact hero. However, I don't like taking Centigor out of the same Pool as Ungora. I am a big Fan of Centigor and you need 5-6 Ungor units if you want to play the Spam game. 

[Maddpainting]

17 hours ago, Salyx said:

Depraved Drove is often used because of the heroes with Artefacts. They tend to be a keypiece of many armies and having Hit-re-rolls against them can Come quote in Handy. Fürther more, you get Charge re-rolls if you Pop up out of ambush near an Artefact hero. However, I don't like taking Centigor out of the same Pool as Ungora. I am a big Fan of Centigor and you need 5-6 Ungor units if you want to play the Spam game. 

Pretty much this. The more pressure you put on them them at the same time zoning them out really messes with their plans, just something like forcing them to keep their artifact heroes outside of ambushing turn 1 can change their plans.  Also against armies like HoS, FeC, killing their key terrorgyst and KoS easier can help you with key damage where and when you need it. We still need to deal damage, so any buffs we get is a plus.

Not saying Nurgle won't work. But IMO you take nurgle to play MoN or to bring in something that is Nurgle allegiance.

[Ukrador]

Hello guys! I'm just wondering if this army was expensive to collect (like fryeslayers or DoK). Really enjoy both the aesthetic of STD and Beast of Chaos. Any insight? I've checked out both armies on goonhammer and 1d4chan.

[Oak7603]

I guess that depends on how big you want it to be, what you want it to do and what you want it to look like.

Ive spent about £200 on about 1500pts worth but had a specific unit list. I've still got a bit more to spend to get it right. Then I'm going to want to add extra. Then I'll want to upgrade.

How long is a piece of string again? 😂😂

 

 

[TheArborealWalrus]

6 hours ago, Ukrador said:

Hello guys! I'm just wondering if this army was expensive to collect (like fryeslayers or DoK). Really enjoy both the aesthetic of STD and Beast of Chaos. Any insight? I've checked out both armies on goonhammer and 1d4chan.

It's certainly less expensive than daughters ($50 for 10 in a horde army, ouch).  Probably a B or C on the expense chart. Daughters would be an F or D depending.  That's just my opinion though. Do remember that BoC are a horde army . A small endeavor it won't be.

https://www.goonhammer.com/getting-started-beasts-of-chaos/

This article might help you out.  2-3 start collectings aren't the worst place to start. I wouldn't expect to win anything major with it, but its not terrible. For cheap ungors you could look at the review I left above of rgd gaming's  fauns.  Other 3rd party companies might be your best bet for less expensive monsters. Toy stores might actually have something suitable.

Otherwise, good luck and welcome aboard the goat bus! 

[Popisdead]

On 6/17/2020 at 9:51 AM, Salyx said:

. I am a big Fan of Centigor and you need 5-6 Ungor units if you want to play the Spam game. 

I'm a big fan too.  I ran mine in Slaanesh, not BoC.  how are you running yours?  I think they are good, and have merit.  

[Chaos Shepard]

Another thing worth noting its that they are  pretty easy to get second hand as well since they have been around for a while. I have also found that the older models still blend in with the new models pretty well, at least the older plastic models, the really old metal ones tend to stick out.

[Maddpainting]

This time normally the Generals Handbook comes out and with 9th uber hyped, AoS is kinda slow for my local.

I really hope the new GH brings down Dragon ogres, Shaggoth, and a few battalions, thats basically all i want for this round. I really just want some warscroll changes and a Monsters of Chaos book like the mercenary rules and let us use them without the cost of CP.

[Popisdead]

3 hours ago, Maddpainting said:

This time normally the Generals Handbook comes out and with 9th uber hyped, AoS is kinda slow for my local.

I really hope the new GH brings down Dragon ogres, Shaggoth, and a few battalions, thats basically all i want for this round. I really just want some warscroll changes and a Monsters of Chaos book like the mercenary rules and let us use them without the cost of CP.

There has been no word of GHB2020 which is worrisome.  Granted taking a bit of a pause on worrying is smart these days.  Be calm.  

On Measured Gaming Joel McGrath just ran Darkwalkers ( a army I've played in the past a bit and quite like(.

 and to give you a couple TL;DR Joel is a better player than his opponent, the game hinged on the first turn of KO shooting doing nothing and Joel getting the double turn is what gave him the win.  I also think I would probably load up on Ungors still.  at least 60-80.  

I agree with you about BoC monsters coming down.  I randomly rolled up some Chimera rolls the other night and boy,.. 240 points of swingy.  Last time I summoned one it killed 19 ghouls.  That was lucky.  Cause the time before that I forgot the shooting attack, my rolls were bad and it died in combat.  I see no reason to take one.  In Gavespawn you could stack attacks but....

[Derptau]

 

29 minutes ago, Popisdead said:

I agree with you about BoC monsters coming down.  I randomly rolled up some Chimera rolls the other night and boy,.. 240 points of swingy.  Last time I summoned one it killed 19 ghouls.  That was lucky.  Cause the time before that I forgot the shooting attack, my rolls were bad and it died in combat.  I see no reason to take one.  In Gavespawn you could stack attacks but....

Yeah, the Chimera isn't even worth summoning at the moment, though that is the best way to get it. 240pts doesn't matter when it wont make it to combat before being drastically bracketed.

 

[Oak7603]

I have yet to get anything like that for BoC but I was going to get the Chimera as I'd heard/read/seen/cant really remember how that it was the best one to get, followed by the Cockatrice with the Jabberslythe being a complete waste, other than the 'normal' BoC army units of course.

 

[Popisdead]

4 hours ago, Derptau said:

Yeah, the Chimera isn't even worth summoning at the moment, though that is the best way to get it. 240pts doesn't matter when it wont make it to combat before being drastically bracketed.

Well it has +2 to charge.  If you had cogs (something not a bad idea in Darkwalkers to begin with) it has good odds to make combat if you saved a CP for a reroll (I can't recall but you probably need a hero nearby?)  I just don't think it should be 240 points and 200 points of Ungors is a better value.

[Derptau]

Yeah. I think it should be at the most 200pts. Though even then I'll take skyfires before a Chimera in a BoC list any day.