AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

[KibaWildFang]

Also, I was thinking of a list that used mainly 2 gheists and bunch of flayers (as well as the archregent and infernal general).

2 Battle Regiments in Feast Day

Archregent (dermal robe, deranged transformation)

2 Terrorgheist Kings, one with Gruesome Bite, both with spectral host

Infernal Courtier, general-Dark Acolyte (deranged transformation)

4x 3 flayers

(Or, 3x3 flayers and 2x10 ghouls)

Edited September 7, 2021 by KibaWildFang

[Dejnar]

2 hours ago, KibaWildFang said:

Whoa, which list was this?

The one a bit further up this thread! 🙂

[KibaWildFang]

1 hour ago, Dejnar said:

The one a bit further up this thread! 🙂

The one with the corpse cart? My friend who pretty much exclusively plays SBG now says that the cart only buffs the wizards from their faction, not just Death Wizards. How did that work for you?

[Honk]

12 hours ago, KibaWildFang said:

now says that the cart only buffs the wizards from their faction

The „aggressive“ brazier variant is pure debuff… -1 to cast within 18“ and -1 to wound within 9“ 

Worth it for 80 points ? 🤔maybe🧐

4“ move and 6hp with 6+ (no deathless) is tricky to position, but the debuff aura might be a live saver for ghouls on an objective 

[Dejnar]

13 hours ago, KibaWildFang said:

The one with the corpse cart? My friend who pretty much exclusively plays SBG now says that the cart only buffs the wizards from their faction, not just Death Wizards. How did that work for you?

Yeah, list shows wrong.
I played with the other corpse cart!

Edited September 8, 2021 by Dejnar

[KibaWildFang]

6 hours ago, Honk said:

The „aggressive“ brazier variant is pure debuff… -1 to cast within 18“ and -1 to wound within 9“ 

Worth it for 80 points ? 🤔maybe🧐

4“ move and 6hp with 6+ (no deathless) is tricky to position, but the debuff aura might be a live saver for ghouls on an objective 

Huh. Yeah those stats kind of made me glance over it cuz its a bit of an easy kill. But it does sound good for ghoul lists. Wonder if I can shove one into mine or not. One of my lists runs 3x10 ghouls. Not quite sure its worth it unless you’re doing multiple squads of 20+ though.

Edited September 8, 2021 by KibaWildFang

[KibaWildFang]

The whole Corpse Cart thing got me thinking of a list. I’ve wanted to use the CC for a while now, especially for the “supply caravan” flavor as a decent ally to FEC. But when I heard the lodestone got narrowed down to SBG only I begrudgingly gave up. Now I hear that the Brazier is actually a good aggressive option, that gave me the inspiration to make this list:

Feast Day, Battle Regiment x2

Archregent (general: Dark Wizardry, Deranged Transformation, maybe Dermal Robe)

AGKoRTG (spectral host, gruesome bite, maybe Amulet of Destiny)

Varghulf

Ghast Courtier (the return of Sir Reginald?!)

20 ghouls

10 ghouls

10 ghouls

3x3 flayers

2 Corpse Carts with Brazier

Comes out to 2k exactly. To keep the area of effect up I decided to try 2 corpse carts in this list. Normally I’m a fan of the 20 man blob being the summon, but I can also summon in 20 more to bring out a full 60. One cart won’t be *as* protected, so I may cut it down to one and just have the blob of 20 and the ghast courtier guard it. But I know I love flayers so I threw in at least 3 units. Only have one big monster here. It could use 2 but I’d rather have a Varghulf on the main board than summon it in.

I also realized that corpse carts would be a lovely addition to Morgaunt lists!

[KK in HK]

10 hours ago, KibaWildFang said:

The whole Corpse Cart thing got me thinking of a list. I’ve wanted to use the CC for a while now, especially for the “supply caravan” flavor as a decent ally to FEC. But when I heard the lodestone got narrowed down to SBG only I begrudgingly gave up. Now I hear that the Brazier is actually a good aggressive option, that gave me the inspiration to make this list:

Feast Day, Battle Regiment x2

Archregent (general: Dark Wizardry, Deranged Transformation, maybe Dermal Robe)

AGKoRTG (spectral host, gruesome bite, maybe Amulet of Destiny)

Varghulf

Ghast Courtier (the return of Sir Reginald?!)

20 ghouls

10 ghouls

10 ghouls

3x3 flayers

2 Corpse Carts with Brazier

Comes out to 2k exactly. To keep the area of effect up I decided to try 2 corpse carts in this list. Normally I’m a fan of the 20 man blob being the summon, but I can also summon in 20 more to bring out a full 60. One cart won’t be *as* protected, so I may cut it down to one and just have the blob of 20 and the ghast courtier guard it. But I know I love flayers so I threw in at least 3 units. Only have one big monster here. It could use 2 but I’d rather have a Varghulf on the main board than summon it in.

I also realized that corpse carts would be a lovely addition to Morgaunt lists!

Side note: i think master of magic (universal command trait) is better than dark wizardry.

1) avoid miscast (double one)

2) higher chance to cast/ unbind an important spell

[Honk]

18 hours ago, KibaWildFang said:

To keep the area of effect up I decided to try 2 corpse carts in this list.

Sounds interesting…

I think the wording „ unit within 9“ " is a nice debuff for everything, not only ghouls. Elite going from 3+ to meager 4+ might save the day, fe graveguard with greatswords only wound on 4+, but do 2 damage, a -1 to wound leaves them  pretty much useless…

and about protection 🤔 not sure if I would bother too much. If the opponent chooses to focus on a rather unimportant debuff piece, instead of shooting the GkoTg or something with threatpotential fine.

[KibaWildFang]

7 hours ago, Honk said:

Sounds interesting…

I think the wording „ unit within 9“ " is a nice debuff for everything, not only ghouls. Elite going from 3+ to meager 4+ might save the day, fe graveguard with greatswords only wound on 4+, but do 2 damage, a -1 to wound leaves them  pretty much useless…

and about protection 🤔 not sure if I would bother too much. If the opponent chooses to focus on a rather unimportant debuff piece, instead of shooting the GkoTg or something with threatpotential fine.

More importantly, the corpse cart’s -1 to wound applies only to enemies!

You do have a point there. One round of combat to kill a cart is one less round of combat going for the thing that will actually kill them

[Nqshou]

On 9/7/2021 at 1:10 PM, Dejnar said:

Tournament is over now and boy did it go well. 

I managed to get most of my spells through every hero phase thanks to the +2.
Spectral Host + 4 extra attacks + rerolling hits for maw + feeding frenzy sent in turn 1 won me all games basically. 
And even if they managed to kill the first Gheist another took it's place. 

The other units basically never saw combat.

Went 3-0.
 

Well done for the wins! Could you please give us some intels on how you played this list?

[Honk]

6 hours ago, Nqshou said:

Could you please give us some intels on how you played this list?

My tea leaves tell me: smash bat with a bigger bat …

stare hard at your opponent, find something juicy, declare finest hour for GkoTg #1, supercharge said GkoTg, send him crashing into poor opponent, feeding frenzy… post intermingled smoke, prepare for round two 

rest of the list stays very defensive and tries to score 

trouble might be defensive anti-magic (teclis/Nagash), denying the buff spells.  although bonepope probably dies to a GkoTg or is almost useless after the frenzy 

@Dejnar : guessed rightly?

[Dejnar]

6 hours ago, Honk said:

My tea leaves tell me: smash bat with a bigger bat …

stare hard at your opponent, find something juicy, declare finest hour for GkoTg #1, supercharge said GkoTg, send him crashing into poor opponent, feeding frenzy… post intermingled smoke, prepare for round two 

rest of the list stays very defensive and tries to score 

trouble might be defensive anti-magic (teclis/Nagash), denying the buff spells.  although bonepope probably dies to a GkoTg or is almost useless after the frenzy 

@Dejnar : guessed rightly?

About 100% correct. 

The summons placed behind the enemy for extra pressure and annoyance. 

[Nqshou]

Thanks to both of you, I'm totally a novice! I don't see any grand court choice in your list though @Dejnar, is that normal?

Edit: Ok I found the reason why. If you pick a Delusion (in your case "The feast day"), you cannot pick a Grand Court.

Edited September 17, 2021 by Nqshou

[Honk]

3 minutes ago, Nqshou said:

don't see any grand court choice in your list though

Let me take a close look at my coffee stains:

his court is „feast day“ for free feeding frenzy each turn… got a bit nerfed from 2.0 since you can only issue it once (not on two units), buuuut: free choice of general trait and artifact. And while you can only feeding frenzy once per turn, you might as well do it for free (still 8-10cp saved during 4-5 rounds of fighting) …

(☝️🧐 no AlloutAttack/Defense allowed)

The other „grand courts“ still have merits, but even before I often took „feast day“ for wizzard infernal general and dermal cloak for the regent (and feast day spam)

hollowmourn was cool for smashbat (varghulf) lists, run&charge, extra damage, extra attacks, but AoS3.0 prevents the CA piling, not sure how good it still is

blisterskin extra speed, CA for 4+ CP and -1 shooting artifact is very good, but a tough decision against the pure power and free choices of the generic court  

morghaunt I tried, but my 120 ghouls were totally steamrolled by a Waaagh of IronJawz

gristlegore, still nice, but as above, the first strike trait might be cool, but an unmounted beast is not really worth it and the artifact nothing to write home about.

to give your main caster (regent) +1 to cast for the essential buffs, you’ll need an artifact 🤷🏿‍♀️ Battalions are tricky to implement and the less drops the better

[Nqshou]

Thank you Honk, it's crystal clear now.

[bonzai]

Anyone else hoping that GW doesn't get us a new book for a while? At least until they are ready to give us a bunch of new models? I play Bonesplitterz as well, and the way that the new Orruk and Stormcast books were treated, I don't think that I want them touching us until they have a bunch of hot new models that they want to push with powerful new rules. With both books they stripped down the flavor and options of the old stuff, while the new models were given the VIP treatment. 

I think I would rather hold on to our options and flavor for a bit more instead of just being brought in line with the new edition without a major model release to go with it.

[Honk]

On 9/20/2021 at 5:10 PM, bonzai said:

I don't think that I want them touching us until they have a bunch of hot new models that they want to push with powerful new rules.

Not sure if I want them touching FEC any time soon. 
the rules are ok, the flavor is great and with the different courts you can play a decent variety of lists, even with only the small model range.

maybe another intermediate hero and maybe a second ghoulish option.

But I rather give it a hard pass, before they come up with some stupid cash grab scheme and more or less invalidate my current army… and / or give us the cheeselords treatment and nobody want to play anymore because imba op 

[KibaWildFang]

6 hours ago, Honk said:

Not sure if I want them touching FEC any time soon. 
the rules are ok, the flavor is great and with the different courts you can play a decent variety of lists, even with only the small model range.

maybe another intermediate hero and maybe a second ghoulish option.

But I rather give it a hard pass, before they come up with some stupid cash grab scheme and more or less invalidate my current army… and / or give us the cheeselords treatment and nobody want to play anymore because imba op 

I think the only thing we may get changed is the addition of Ushoran.

[KibaWildFang]

So my first time using a mounted gheist, I got a little overzealous. I charged near a Kharadron gunboat, forgetting unleash hell was just “in the range of” and not “charging into the thing with guns”. Had also charged buffed Flayers so I elected to go with more attacks, against 20 duardin hammerers. The Gheist, due to my own bad decision, bit the dust, but I took the duardin unit down to 5. The game was a loss however.

I will be focusing on my Seraphon for a while, but I’m not giving up on my court. I just need a mental break. However, I wanted to run a list by you guys I came up with.

Feast Day/ 2 Battle Regiment/ Command Entourage

Archregent (dermal robe, blood feast)[command entourage - commander]
Varghulf Courtier [Command Entourage - sub commander]
Crypt Infernal Courtier (general: dark acolyte, Deranged Transformation). [Command Entourage - sub commander]
Ghoul King on Terrorgheist (spectral host, Amulet of Destiny, Gruesome Bite) [Battle Regiment: Commander]
Crypt Ghast Courtier [Battle Regiment 2: commander]
3 Crypt Flayers

3 Crypt Flayers

3 Crypt Flayers

20 ghouls

10 ghouls

Corpse Cart with Balefire Brazier

…comes out to 1955. The 10 ghouls bodyguard the Archregent, while the Ghast Courtier sticks with 20 ghouls who also stick near the Corpse Cart as caravan guards. The Infernal Courtier is the general to make those flayers battleline and save me points on needing a third unit of ghouls. Also, mobile deranged transformation to put on flayers. The Varghulf does Varghulf things, picking off isolated heroes, helping flayers hammer something, and sometimes receiving the king’s hunger buff. Gheist rampages around, gave it the Amulet of destiny since I couldn’t afford 2 gheists and wanted to better protect my investment.

[bonzai]

2 hours ago, KibaWildFang said:

I think the only thing we may get changed is the addition of Ushoran.

I have been thinking about what new units/models we could be getting down the line. Ushoran is definitely up there. A new Varghulf and Courtier models would also be great. 

Regarding new stuff... there are a few things I could see us getting. I can see three new hero units. A ghast acolyte (aka court wizard). Basically a cheap caster hero option. A Royal Bannerman. He would be some sort of Courtier that holds the royal banner (essentialy a crucified corpse), and would be a totem. Lastly would be the royal jester. I see a some sort of nasty Courtier that is an ambushing alpha strike hero.

As far as other units, I would like to see us pick up batswarms as a new Battleline. A deep striking tarpit unit that sucks at combat, but is cheap. Soulblight lost them, so fair game for us to pick them up. Lastly I could see us getting Royal Hounds. They would be large mutated dogs that are relatively cheap, 8 wound monsters that could be Reinforced (Battleline in gristlegore).

I think those options could shore us up as an army and fill in some gaps. Especially if they follow their current trend with the battle tomes.

[KibaWildFang]

4 hours ago, bonzai said:

I have been thinking about what new units/models we could be getting down the line. Ushoran is definitely up there. A new Varghulf and Courtier models would also be great. 

Regarding new stuff... there are a few things I could see us getting. I can see three new hero units. A ghast acolyte (aka court wizard). Basically a cheap caster hero option. A Royal Bannerman. He would be some sort of Courtier that holds the royal banner (essentialy a crucified corpse), and would be a totem. Lastly would be the royal jester. I see a some sort of nasty Courtier that is an ambushing alpha strike hero.

As far as other units, I would like to see us pick up batswarms as a new Battleline. A deep striking tarpit unit that sucks at combat, but is cheap. Soulblight lost them, so fair game for us to pick them up. Lastly I could see us getting Royal Hounds. They would be large mutated dogs that are relatively cheap, 8 wound monsters that could be Reinforced (Battleline in gristlegore).

I think those options could shore us up as an army and fill in some gaps. Especially if they follow their current trend with the battle tomes.

We are so overdue for a new Varg it’s not even funny. The Vargskyr was originally gonna be made into that new model I guarantee it.

[Honk]

15 hours ago, bonzai said:

Lastly would be the royal jester. I see a some sort of nasty Courtier that is an ambushing alpha strike hero.

I rather see him as a 4++ pass wounds bodyguard or a small debuff hero / wizard (Enemy is -1 to hit / reroll 6s to hit within 6“)… like a corpse cart but funny and on 32mm

[Liquidsteel]

I reckon we get a new book with a new hero and that's it, maybe a new Varghulf.

The start collecting FEC is still a staple box for both FEC and also Soulblight, I don't see them changing that anytime soon, despite the aged sculpts.

We still have this rumour engine, which I'm going to imagine is still FEC, though could quite easily be a second Warband.

 

Edited September 24, 2021 by Liquidsteel

[Sception]

there was also this one:

As far as I know, this one hasn't been identified yet, and imo it could easily be the right hand of the same model as the left hand with sword above.  If that's the case, we're talking about a bare-armed, clawed, gaunt-but-muscly figure, sitting in a crumbling throne holding a skull with one hand and a worn sword in the other.

To me, this kind of screams 'Flesh Eater Courts special character', and could even be a model for the Carrion King himself.  CK or no, a ghoul king on a throne w/ a more regal pose would do a better job of selling the FEC delusions narrative than any of the existing models.  Likewise, whether or not it's the Carrion King, a FEC special character could do a lot to raise their profile in the game's lore.  Currently the lack of any central personalities to follow is, imo, one of the reasons the FEC faction doesn't get as much attention in the narrative as it deserves, and the lack of narrative attention contributes to a lack of community hype.

That's why, as long as my wish list for new FEC models is (plastic varghulf!  actual models for the other courtiers!  court mage ghoul wizard type!  corpse-cart-esque banquet wagon!  dire wolves, fell bats, and bat swarms!  ghouls riding dire wolves or fell bats cavalry!  new crypt ghouls with more upright posing and scraps of armor, cloth, & ragged weapons to indicate their deluded self image!), at the very top of that list is new FEC special characters to sell their faction narrative and drive their presence in the overall game narrative.

Give us the Carrion King!  If ghouls effectively think they're brettonians, give us ghoulified takes on Brettonian special characters!  Maybe the ghoul equivalent of a green night who appears in various FEC communities during their time of need?  Maybe a ghoul equivalent of the fey enchantress who seems sane and travels from one FEC community to another tending to them and temporarily easing their madness?

Or maybe something crazy and new.  Maybe a Gargant that has succumbed to the FEC delusions, or an Ogor chieftan who ate an abhorrant and was corrupted by it's version of the soulblight curse, becoming an Ogor ghoul king?

I don't care what form it takes, but this faction imo needs headline personalities more than anything else.  Hopefully GW's designers will use Nagash's well deserved nap as an excuse to bring all sorts of weird and interesting FEC personalities out of the woodwork.  After all, of all the death factions, FEC are probably the ones that are the best fit in personality, temperament, and aesthetic for 3e's focus on the Realm of Beasts.