New Editions of Rule Books

[Alfascozzesi]

Hi all,

I have just recently joined and am amassing a stormcast army along with my son who is collecting a Khorne / Skaven army.

We bought the GHB last weekend which is great but reading on here there is a new one about to be released which I think the GW guy in the shop should have told us 

We are about to buy the stormcast battle list as well as the chaos one to help us prepare our lists for our first tournament and to see what battalions etc to go for as well as make sure we were not too out of date.

Are these about to be updated? Are we buying the right thing?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[shadowgra]

in my opinion you can get the stormcast one for sure. it's pretty new, i don't think they'll update it until next year (even if we heard some stormcast rumours so nothing is sure). 

about ur son's army i will skip entirely the GA chaos book, is outdated and apart from battalion u can download everything from the app. i will instead purchase the blades of khorne if he is playing them, is new, well written and has everything you could want to start a khorne army. 

i personally would keep the skaven apart until they get a new battletome anyway, very few list with skaven battalions are good for competitive.

 

hope i helped!

[Alfascozzesi]

Thanks for the info. He is pretty set on Skaven and has a fairly even split with his big units being a hell pit and and bloodthirster. If he was to play with a mix would there be any special rules he could use and where would we find them without the Chaos book?

Am I right in thinking if we got the Khorne book this would only be applicable if he only played his Khorne contingent which is possible but his loyalty to the Skaven is quite strong (pet rats and everything!)

Although we are entering a comp. it's all about fun so not looking to be the most competitive but would be nice to be as good as we can be.

[Tzaangor Management]

No one is quite sure when GHB 2017 will arrive, other than it will be in 2017, or what it will contain, other than new points and new rules of one. I think it's a good purchase regardless and will be useful if you're planning to play competitive (or otherwise) games prior to the new version.

I also like the Chaos Grand Alliance book and picked one up around six months ago. The difficulty you may find is that a number of the warscroll have been superceded and / or changed in the two years since it was released (particularly DoT and BoK). However, if you want a physical book with the Slaven warscrolls all in one place, then that's where they are. 

Another option would be to download the warscrolls that you need to an iPad or similar (free from the GW site). This would ensure that you have the most up-to-date versions of each. I think there is a thread somewhere that contains the warscrolls that have been changed, which might help you decide on whether the GA Chaos book will be useful.

[Guest]

10 hours ago, Alfascozzesi said:

Thanks for the info. He is pretty set on Skaven and has a fairly even split with his big units being a hell pit and and bloodthirster. If he was to play with a mix would there be any special rules he could use and where would we find them without the Chaos book?

 

Games Workshop seem to be herding people towards single-faction armies these days, which is a shame in my opinion. Single factions are gradually being given a ton of useful and characterful special rules in the form of Allegiance Abilities. So you'll find a lot of special abilities in the Blades of Khorne book, but you can only use them if you ditch the Skaven. Skaven don't have any equivalent Allegiance Abilities yet, but this is coming in The General's Handbook 2017 - but to use them you'll have to ditch the Khorne.

You do have the option to use the more general Chaos Allegiance Abilities when fielding a mixed Chaos army (which are in the GHB you already own) but these are much more basic and less useful than the faction-specific rules they're introducing.

Personally, cool though they are, I wish they'd never introduced Allegiance Abilities because they undercut the 'collect what you like' ethos that AoS was founded on and pressure hobbyists into building more homogenised armies to get a competitive advantage. If collecting, building, painting and casual play are more important to you than competitive advantage then keep collecting Khorne and Skaven, Allegiance Abilities be damned.

[Alfascozzesi]

@Jamie the JasperI agree with you the extra rules and bonuses do seem to promote a uniform army which is a shame.

From what you say then we may as well just download the warsrolls for the Skaven and make our own "book" and use the pennies to buy more models to build up either of the Chaos factions.

@Tzaangor Managementwe have all the warsrolls on the app. And yes although it would have been ideal to get the new version of the GHB it is a good purchase as it has given lots of scenarios to play.

Think we will carry on with what we have. 

Thanks for the replies.

[Alfascozzesi]

Had another thought. If we were to field a mixed army (Khorne and Skaven) but each "half" met a battalion warscroll criteria which are listed in the app could these be used.

For instance in my sons case the Skaven half of his army meet the conditions for the "Skreet Verminkings Horde" or the the "Ripsnikks Raiders" battalions. Could he field these and their bonuses with the Khorne side of his army all under the umbrella of the Chaos allegiance rules for the artefacts and command traits?

I guess I asking if battalion rules can be applied in a mixed faction but same allegence army.

[Guest]

Yes to all of the above! 

[Arkiham]

15 hours ago, Alfascozzesi said:

Hi all,

I have just recently joined and am amassing a stormcast army along with my son who is collecting a Khorne / Skaven army.

We bought the GHB last weekend which is great but reading on here there is a new one about to be released which I think the GW guy in the shop should have told us 

We are about to buy the stormcast battle list as well as the chaos one to help us prepare our lists for our first tournament and to see what battalions etc to go for as well as make sure we were not too out of date.

Are these about to be updated? Are we buying the right thing?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

I do believe you will still require the first book for scenarios 

[AverageBoss]

Be careful about picking up the Stormcast book, is the current is actually their 3rd (the first was Stormcast Eternals, the 2nd was a supplement called Stormcast Extremis, the 3rd is once again Stormcast Eternals). And that is the one and only book you want to get for them. It will have this cover:



Also, while armies are getting bonuses for being homogenized, having a larger variety of models and interactions has its own advantages. A recent major tournament was won by a Slannesh/Khorne/Tzeentch/Skaven army. Sure it was filled with ridiculous models from all four of those groups, but it beat out the homogenized armies with their special pure faction benefits. And a pure Lizardmen army placed 3rd in that same event, and they lack faction benefits.

[Alfascozzesi]

My son has decided to play with his mix of factions and has a choice of battalion warscrolls for his Skaven. It seems that the only reason to purchase the Chaos alliance book is to see if there are any Bloodbound battalions available for the models he has and use the Chaos allegiance from the GHB.

 The models he has are the Bloodbound starter set plus a bloodthirster.

Are there any battalion lists he is close too?

If not then I can't see the point in purchasing the book as his focus is in expanding the Skaven side first and who knows when reprints etc will happen.

On the storm cast side thanks for the tips on which edition to check for. I will go for a single faction on this army as the only non SCE models I have are some battle mages and I think the relictor picks up wizard talents in this book.

Thanks for all the advice.

Let me know if there are any Bloodbound battalions which are close to his line up.

[Tzaangor Management]

There is one Bloodbound formation in there and that's been designed with the Starter set in mind, as it contains all of the units: Goreblade Warband.

If at least one unit from the formation charges successfully, all others get to reroll failed charges for that turn. If a unit dies in melee, the whole formation gets extra attacks.

[Mr. White]

I also have a question about the Battletomes.

I believe the first of the 'new wave' started with Sylvaneth, is that correct? I mean, it set a new standard that the others are now following if I read the 'net correctly. So, would that mean any of the ones prior to that (such as Ironjawz and Fyreslayers) are more place holders now and I should wait for some updated-to-new-format Battletomes in the future?

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Tzaangor Management said:

There is one Bloodbound formation in there and that's been designed with the Starter set in mind, as it contains all of the units: Goreblade Warband.

If at least one unit from the formation charges successfully, all others get to reroll failed charges for that turn. If a unit dies in melee, the whole formation gets extra attacks.

This battalion is available for free via the AoS app by the way, besides also being in the softback book that comes with the starter set.

 

28 minutes ago, Mr. White said:

I also have a question about the Battletomes.

I believe the first of the 'new wave' started with Sylvaneth, is that correct? I mean, it set a new standard that the others are now following if I read the 'net correctly. So, would that mean any of the ones prior to that (such as Ironjawz and Fyreslayers) are more place holders now and I should wait for some updated-to-new-format Battletomes in the future?

I think there was also a small jump in the range and depth of faction-specific rules from Sylvaneth to whichever book came next (Disciples of Tzeentch?) but yes, this was the first one to introduce allegiance abilities.

[Trout]

1 hour ago, Mr. White said:

I also have a question about the Battletomes.

I believe the first of the 'new wave' started with Sylvaneth, is that correct? I mean, it set a new standard that the others are now following if I read the 'net correctly. So, would that mean any of the ones prior to that (such as Ironjawz and Fyreslayers) are more place holders now and I should wait for some updated-to-new-format Battletomes in the future?

It sounds like the new allegiance abilities and artifacts will come in the new General's Handbook. AFAIK, that should put the old books on par with the new ones.

[RuneBrush]

On 10/07/2017 at 9:27 AM, Alfascozzesi said:

My son has decided to play with his mix of factions and has a choice of battalion warscrolls for his Skaven. It seems that the only reason to purchase the Chaos alliance book is to see if there are any Bloodbound battalions available for the models he has and use the Chaos allegiance from the GHB.

 The models he has are the Bloodbound starter set plus a bloodthirster.

Are there any battalion lists he is close too?

If not then I can't see the point in purchasing the book as his focus is in expanding the Skaven side first and who knows when reprints etc will happen.

On the storm cast side thanks for the tips on which edition to check for. I will go for a single faction on this army as the only non SCE models I have are some battle mages and I think the relictor picks up wizard talents in this book.

Thanks for all the advice.

Let me know if there are any Bloodbound battalions which are close to his line up.

Firstly - welcome to the hobby!

Although mixed Grand Alliances are a little on the wane currently, they're still perfectly viable and a really good way to get models that you really fancy.  Single sub-faction tend to have a few more shenanigans available but you have the potential for more versatility if you cherry pick units across different factions - so neither option is "bad".

Although there is a new handbook coming out by the end of the year, the hope/rumour is that the battleplans (scenarios) from the current one will still be valid, so having it in advance isn't necessarily a bad thing.

For battalions from the new Blades of Khorne book, have a quick Google as quite a few of these are up and about on blogs and similar.

[Mr. White]

I want to add, as another father getting into the game with his son, don't worry about the funneling to single faction armies. If you aren't playing in tournaments or with randos at the local game store...roll with what you guys want and have fun. Age of Sigmar has been the most liberating wargame ruleset I've played in the last 20 years and it's because of its initial point to roll your own style. True, matched play and the tournament players are reclaiming the games at the stores, but get into Skirmish, Hinterlands, Open Play/Narrative at home and don't worry about the rest. Cheers!

[Mr. White]

While we're on this topic...I'm considering Fleash-eater Courts and Ironjawz skirmish/Hinterland warbands. Are their Battletomes any good? I understand they may not have Allegiance Abilities...which is fine as they aren't needed for these games...but are the warscrolls withing decent? Is the fluff worth reading? New art or recycled from WFB?

[Guest]

Don't know much about Ironjaws, but I can recommend Flesh-Eater Courts. The fluff is very evocative and arguably some of the best in AoS - it will give you lots of inspiration for converting a warband. The artwork is pretty good (and all new) but a lot of it is quite bold and bright when something more dark and gritty might have suited the army better. How much you get out of the art will depend on your taste.

Unfortunately the rules for FEC don't carry over to warband scale as well as some other armies because they're designed to be played as a horde. Also most troops are very specifically dependent on the presence of a corresponding hero to be effective, so they don't work so well as 'independent characters'.

I play FEC in Hinterlands and they're not great. But I don't care because their fluff is so good and I love my conversions! In fairness it could just be down to the composition of my warband - there may well be very effective builds that I'm not seeing.