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AoS 2 - Legion of the First Prince Discussion (Belakor)


Duke of Gisoreux

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17 hours ago, Hannibal said:

I think due to Covid-19 nobody really got enough experience to justify a solid advice.

 

These days I´m more a collector / painter than a (competetive) player and therefore the Chaos Ascendant list is everything I could have hoped for. The basis of my collection is Nurgle but I always struggled to find a Nurgle Daemon list I really liked. Not enough offense. In 40k I could play Nurgle / Tzeentch combo and now I can play it in AoS too. It´s great!

Modelwise all gods offer some really good looking models and now I can run them without the need of "2000 points mono god". In addition: no special piece of terrain, small number of special rules. I like it.

Even if it won´t be the best, for those 1 game in 3 months opportunities it´s good.

 

And you can still branch out to all these god specific armies once your collection is large enough. Really, it´s just a matter of which models you like to move.

Thanks for the insights. I do like to play, but I'm more on the hobby side of things too. I'll just get all the types painting up during lockdown, and then try it out once I can get back together with my friends! If I end up liking one type of demon more, I can always try their book.

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On 5/13/2020 at 3:49 AM, Wired4War said:

So my journey through Chaos started with a few Beasts of Chaos, started liking the Tzaangor more and more which got me buying some Horrors and Tzeentch heroes. Now I'm trying to decide between going full Tzeentch or a mixed Daemons army through LoCA. I'm not super competitive, but have you guys had fun playing a mix of the gods? I've always loved the demons more than mortals, and the hobbying variety of a mixed army seems exciting too, just unsure on how playstyle compares. It seems maybe more straightforward than Tzeentch with less abilities and spells to figure out? Will I feel too hindered playing this alliance compared to one with a battletome? 

There is something to be said for simplicity I have always loved mixing my daemons in 40k it contributed to me not playing alot of aos for a few years to be fair, as it was slaneesh or khorne I couldn't mix the 2 freely like I do in 40k, so I'm looking forward too it

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2 hours ago, backslide said:

There is something to be said for simplicity I have always loved mixing my daemons in 40k it contributed to me not playing alot of aos for a few years to be fair, as it was slaneesh or khorne I couldn't mix the 2 freely like I do in 40k, so I'm looking forward too it

Yeah, I do like when I don't feel like I'm trying to remember a million allegiance abilities in each phase. Focus on the unit's warscroll abilities instead. I think I'm just going to buy whatever daemons my local shop has in stock and when I get to play again I can take whatever I have painted!

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6 hours ago, Wired4War said:

Yeah, I do like when I don't feel like I'm trying to remember a million allegiance abilities in each phase. Focus on the unit's warscroll abilities instead. I think I'm just going to buy whatever daemons my local shop has in stock and when I get to play again I can take whatever I have painted!

I would stick to things that have the lesser daemons keyword, so BLOODLETTERS, DAEMONETTES, HORRORS and PLAUGEBEARERS 

So infantry and cavalry really to make the most of the dark prince command ablities when you add him to the mix

 

I found an old photo of myrepers of vengence army from back in aos1.0 when battlions were cheap... I want my armies like this but all the gods lead by a gaunt summoner....

FB_IMG_1589485061008.jpg

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33 minutes ago, backslide said:

I would stick to things that have the lesser daemons keyword, so BLOODLETTERS, DAEMONETTES, HORRORS and PLAUGEBEARERS 

So infantry and cavalry really to make the most of the dark prince command ablities when you add him to the mix

 

I found an old photo of myrepers of vengence army from back in aos1.0 when battlions were cheap... I want my armies like this but all the gods lead by a gaunt summoner....

FB_IMG_1589485061008.jpg

Oh yeah, its just the Keyword isn't it!? So it works on basically everything in the start collecting boxes, except tzeentch I guess.

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5 hours ago, Wired4War said:

Oh yeah, its just the Keyword isn't it!? So it works on basically everything in the start collecting boxes, except tzeentch I guess.

The burning chariot has the horror keyword, but you would need a unit of 3 and belicore to really make use of it

 

2x start collecting slaneesh and 2 characters and you have the battlion lol

 

Allegiance: Legion of Chaos Ascendant
Bladebringer, Herald on Seeker Chariot (160)
Bladebringer, Herald on Seeker Chariot (160)
10 x Daemonettes (110)
10 x Daemonettes (110)
1 x Seeker Chariots (120)
1 x Seeker Chariots (120)
5 x Seekers (120)
5 x Seekers (120)
Host of the Depraved (120)

Total: 1140 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 68
 

Lol

Edited by backslide
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Interesting to see this allegiance doing reasonably well right now:


Seems to be a good counter pick to most things out there. Attrition based armies are something I'm big on so I may be joining you all soon enough 😉

Still, seems Pink horrors are another crutch for a list when you can summon such a mass amount of wounds so easily. Curious to see if something happens with them (maybe only summoning 5 instead of 10 as I've seen some suggest).
 

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2 hours ago, Gwendar said:

Interesting to see this allegiance doing reasonably well right now:


Seems to be a good counter pick to most things out there. Attrition based armies are something I'm big on so I may be joining you all soon enough 😉

Still, seems Pink horrors are another crutch for a list when you can summon such a mass amount of wounds so easily. Curious to see if something happens with them (maybe only summoning 5 instead of 10 as I've seen some suggest).
 

Having issues with internets right now what was in his list?

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9 hours ago, backslide said:

Having issues with internets right now what was in his list?

Here it is, I remade it in warscroll builder rather than giving a link for you😉:

Allegiance: Legion of Chaos Ascendant

Leaders
Verminlord Corruptor (280)
- General
- Command Trait: Ruinous Aura
- Artefact: Fourfold Blade
- Spell: Echo of Hatred
Kairos Fateweaver (400)
- Spell: Echo of Hatred
Gaunt Summoner on Disc of Tzeentch (260)
- Spell: Bolt of Ruin

Battleline
10 x Daemonettes (110)
10 x Daemonettes (110)
10 x Daemonettes (110)

Units
12 x K'Daai Fireborn (480)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Umbral Spellportal (70)
Warp Lightning Vortex (100)
Darkfire Daemonrift (50)

Total: 1970 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 97


The inclusion of the K'daai is interesting and I like the choice.. though I wonder what an alternative could be for those that don't want to invest. The list more or less relied on summoning 10 Pinks a turn (and of course another free 10 from the Gaunt) and it was just hard for anything to take objective control due to the mass amount of free bodies. Quite reactive by keeping the K'daai back until the time was right which suites my own playstyle a lot.

Like I said, kind of makes me wonder if this will stick around or if it will throw another signal off to GW to make a change with free Pinks.

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I gather it won? I cant get into TTS game

 

We are the only faction that gets free horrors so I'm hopeful we are small enough to be ignored lol

 

That said I don't  dig that list lol almost half the points in rat and chaos daemons... did the daemonettes manage anything? They and plaugebearers are liable to be my battleline alot.

Covid restrictions starting to lift in my country so I can finally paint my horrors and crushers, I try never to use unpainted stuff... so the legion hits the table next week I hope!

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7 minutes ago, backslide said:

I gather it won? I cant get into TTS game

 

We are the only faction that gets free horrors so I'm hopeful we are small enough to be ignored lol

 

That said I don't  dig that list lol almost half the points in rat and chaos daemons... did the daemonettes manage anything? They and plaugebearers are liable to be my battleline alot.

Covid restrictions starting to lift in my country so I can finally paint my horrors and crushers, I try never to use unpainted stuff... so the legion hits the table next week I hope!

He got 2nd by 2 points.. Seraphon took 1st and 3rd, though he did beat one of those lists if I recall by a pretty substantial amount (although I think the Seraphon player was entirely too passive). But that's the thing though, isn't it? The more popular these types of lists get and how well they perform, the more likely GW feels the need to change things. Not saying that will happen, just a possibility. I'm building into it regardless.

I don't 100% love this one in particular, but I've seen all sorts of variants do exceptionally well including the one from a couple weeks ago running Kairos + Rotigus + Warpseer + Be'Lakor and 50 Plaguebearers.. that one went 3-0 and got 3rd. So something is definitely working well, no matter how you build it; but I think in the end a lot of that has to do with Pink summoning. The Daemonettes were really just there for Run + Charge for flanking\tagging something for a turn.. and cheap minimal battleline so he could bring 12 K'Daai. Speaking of Crushers, I did wonder about them as a substitute for K'daai.

But hey.. I still need to finish my Slayers and miscellaneous Skaven units I'm repainting\basing so figured I would just hop in here for some tactical talk and get opinions with everyone.

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8 hours ago, Olmdebil said:

Can i use Belakor Once per Game Ability on an Unit wich isnt on the Table at the Beginning ? like Stormcast /Fyreslayer etc?

The wording is one unit on the battlefield so if it isnt on the table it cant be the target

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Thought about this earlier. Wanted to put my own list in:

Verminlord corrupter w/SoJ

kairos

skarbrand

shalaxi

gaunt summoner on foot

10 plaguebearers 

10 Daemonettes or bloodletters

10 Daemonettes or bloodletters

Gaunt can summon horrors, and all 4 ruinous powers represented to summon their bodies in. Corrupter has Nurgle keyword (For PBS) and is the general, he, gaunt and kairos can kill swarms at a distance, Skarbrand kills everything close, shalaxi kills heroes. 1990
 

edit. My numbers are off trying to figure out how I whoopsed!

edit: numbers fixed!

Edited by TimeToWaste85
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2 hours ago, TimeToWaste85 said:

Thought about this earlier. Wanted to put my own list in:

Verminlord corrupter w/SoJ

I like it and have planned on doing something similar.. but I feel the Fearfold Blade would be better here since it doesn't discriminate against Heroes\Behemoths if I recall?

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1 hour ago, Gwendar said:

I like it and have planned on doing something similar.. but I feel the Fearfold Blade would be better here since it doesn't discriminate against Heroes\Behemoths if I recall?

You’re right, just looked and it’s WAY better; Unmodified 5+ for D3 is better than 6+ for D6, all the way. 
 

and Shalaxi is a hero killer. Against hordes, he’s wasted. Which is why Kairos, the GS and Verminlord can neuter hordes at a distance. Skarbrand and the Verminlord deal with hordes close up, and Shalaxi has been math-hammered to smoke most heroes. 

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So I've played 8 games now with Legions testing out various lists and comps. The one below gives great games to top tier lists and I have beaten Seraphon bomb etc with it. That does not mean I am claiming this is the best, just one I have settled on.

**Disclaimer your mileage may vary and you may own or prefer different models 😊

Verminlord Corruptor with 4fold blade and Ruinous aura - Echo of Hatred

Kairos - Bolt of Ruin

Great unclean one - Spirit Gouge

BT of insensate rage

Syll'Esske

Battleline

PlagueB 10

PlagueB 10

Daemonettes 10 (could be bloodletters)

Endless spells

Spell portal

Vermintide

I think if you owned a keeper of secrets you could take out the Grandpapa Nurgle and Syll'Esske and put in a cheaper Nurgle hero for summons.

Also I think Deceiver + Verminlord is extremely powerful.

The best thing about this allegiance is that the viability of many lists and that most lists don't remove from the strength of the allegiance. 

Also Verminlord C with 4fold buff with his own ability can slay so many things. I have one shot a Bastiladon with one just from fishing for 5s/6s

Edited by Blisterfeet
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I know the army benefits the base troops (letters, bearers, daemonettes, horrors) the most, but do you something like Wrath and Rapture would be a good way to expand out of my current Tzeentch daemon army? Possible use for the Fiends or Fleshhounds? Or should I just go with the Start Collectings?

Edited by Wired4War
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@Blisterfeet I feel like Slaanesh hurts the most from it's allegiance abilities due to losing exploding hits and AFL.. outside of that though, yeah I feel everything fits in well. I like the idea of running a KoS but I'm not sure how well it would do compared to bringing along Flamers or K'Daai.

How did the BT do for you? I've been considering Skarbrand a lot, although I think running a large unit of Flamers + Exalted or K'Daai would work out better in terms of damage a lot of the time. Rotigus was in a few lists as well but.. really that was due to the board wide spell; he wasn't bringing much to the table aside from that.

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4 hours ago, Gwendar said:

@Blisterfeet I feel like Slaanesh hurts the most from it's allegiance abilities due to losing exploding hits and AFL.. outside of that though, yeah I feel everything fits in well. I like the idea of running a KoS but I'm not sure how well it would do compared to bringing along Flamers or K'Daai.

How did the BT do for you? I've been considering Skarbrand a lot, although I think running a large unit of Flamers + Exalted or K'Daai would work out better in terms of damage a lot of the time. Rotigus was in a few lists as well but.. really that was due to the board wide spell; he wasn't bringing much to the table aside from that.

I tried K'dai and they were very good in a big blob but when you add in the model cost etc they were not THAT good, if you get what I mean especially as I don't own any.

I found Skarbrand while extremely good if he gets into a fight, his slow movement means he languishes mid board alot of the time. 

I valued the higher movement, fly and AoE possibility of the BToIR. 

Usually the list plays with a early charge from VLC, BToLR and Esske and maybe Daemonettes dealing with screens and clearing a hole for the VLC to stay alive and get through to the centre. 

You then move the Kairos into the mid board, spell portal + gift to snipe a support hero and then summon pinks. The backboard is plaguebearers and GUO (I do try and keep him up with Kairos).

This on most scenarios will stop DS, Fly high, teleporting and allow to get the most obj to get a lead and maintain it. 

I know the VLC can summon @TimeToWaste85 but he is usually either focused down, frontline and has so much around him the space to summon pb is not available, hence the backfield Nurgle hero with a ranged spell (with or without portal help).

I'm playing a 1 drop Ironjawz list this week. I'll let you know how it goes. So far though it's getting alot of wins, losing only to Kroak bomb and a Cities shooting list (40 handgunners). All the matches were super close though.

I think there might be other variations this one just perfectly fits my playstyle and what I enjoy. If I had 2 VL and some K'dai is be tempted to try that more as well. 

I might try Archaon as well as I own him too. 

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1 hour ago, Blisterfeet said:

I tried K'dai and they were very good in a big blob but when you add in the model cost etc they were not THAT good

Yeah, kind of what I was worried about. I think the value in them isn't killing potential, but that combined with their staying power with the 5+ ethereal on top of the 5\6++ FNP.

At this stage I'm really just waiting out for the GHB for increases before investing into it.. so lots of theorycrafting for now and always curious to see how games are going for others.

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  • RuneBrush changed the title to AoS 2 - Legion of the First Prince Discussion (Belakor)

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