KillagoreFaceslasha Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 I asked mainly because the spanish translations are infamous in how hard they mess up the rules, so just wanted to make sure. Just so we understand each other, its the "corners" of the table top, kay. I like the idea. D-d-drop the Heraldor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turragor Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 9 minutes ago, KillagoreFaceslasha said: I asked mainly because the spanish translations are infamous in how hard they mess up the rules, so just wanted to make sure. Just so we understand each other, its the "corners" of the table top, kay. I like the idea. D-d-drop the Heraldor. Hmm "corner" might be a translation problem here. I know from Swedish to English that confusion with geometric shapes is common! In Eng when talking about a table or rectangular object, corners are where each side meets. The edge is the perimeter composed of both sides and corners. The net result of this for in pursuit deployment is kinda: Between the black (table edge) and the red (limit for in pursuit deployment) and not taking any enemy unit's position into account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KillagoreFaceslasha Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 Okay, apparently I had it right this time XD. Which is great for my hunters and using the Lord Aquilor to fly away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baymaks Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 1 hour ago, AdamR said: Yeah, that's the case. Liberators are always battleline. Judicators are battleline with Stormcast allegiance, Hunters are battleline with Stormcast allegiance and a Lord Aquilor general. Wicked, Thank you for clearing that up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olincay Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 I think we've discussed this tactic with long strikes, but has anyone thought of running a large unit of hurricanes *say a unit of 9* and trying to get blessed weapons off with the Relictor. 9 of them will pump out 81 shots, I'm sure there will be plenty of 6's in there to generate more attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baymaks Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, Olincay said: I think we've discussed this tactic with long strikes, but has anyone thought of running a large unit of hurricanes *say a unit of 9* and trying to get blessed weapons off with the Relictor. 9 of them will pump out 81 shots, I'm sure there will be plenty of 6's in there to generate more attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 In terms of raw damage it's around 27 wounds before saves if you get Bless weapons. 480 points worth of crossbow Judicators only nets you around 19 (again if they're stationary and blessed). So yeah, I'd say that's worthwhile! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Let's 'ere it for da boyz! Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 How does everyone feel about the Celestial Vindicators Stormhost? Those buffs seem pretty tasty and the cost to entry isn't as high as it is with other Stormhosts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Requizen Posted March 30, 2017 Author Share Posted March 30, 2017 Celestial Vindicators are considered the most straightforward in power of the different Stormhosts, given that Hammerstrike is an extremely strong Battalion already and this just makes it better. I would expect to see it popping up in the future. I dunno if I'd call a 200 point buy in "low", even on a relative scale. You're paying 1/10 of your army to get all that stuff. But, you do get 2 Artifacts, one-drop autowin deployment, the bonus to Blade type weapons, and the powerful Hammerstrike bonuses. Bonds of Hatred doesn't actually do anything because of wording, I'm reaching out to them and waiting on a response. So, that might be worth the points cost, but you're also playing down points in an army that is already really elite-heavy and low model count, which can be quite daunting. I would expect to see this mostly with Hammerstrike backed up by nothing but shooting, since 3 units of Paladins should be more than enough to do any melee you want to get done. Maybe an Aquilor for mobility or a LCoDracoth for the Battleshock bubble, but for sure no Liberators or Dracoth units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Let's 'ere it for da boyz! Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 47 minutes ago, Requizen said: I dunno if I'd call a 200 point buy in "low", even on a relative scale. Yeah, I agree with this. But it's not as if you're getting nothing back. If there were a hero that had a Command ability or trait that granted re-rolls to hit and extra attacks for an 80 point price tag, I think that would be a bargain by any measure. The other Stormhost I'd considered was the Anvils of Heldenhammer. It took me several read-throughs to realize the cornerstone ability of the formation (a 1/6 chance of an extra activation for each unit each of your hero phases) while potentially powerful, requires not just the minimum buy-in (Thunderhead Brotherhood+) but also the "optional" Lords of the Storm formation in order to function. THAT is a very high cost of entry in my opinion and made the Vindicators much more attractive. 47 minutes ago, Requizen said: Bonds of Hatred doesn't actually do anything because of wording, Could you explain this please? I'm not sure I see what you're talking about, but then I am typically a little slow on the uptake! 47 minutes ago, Requizen said: I would expect to see this mostly with Hammerstrike backed up by nothing but shooting, since 3 units of Paladins should be more than enough to do any melee you want to get done. Maybe an Aquilor for mobility I've got a couple of ideas I'm toying with. Both are eerily similar to your expectations. I'm thinking either the standard 3x5 Retributor + 1x6 Prosecutor Hammerstrike along with 3x5 Vanguard Hunters for Battleline with the requisite Aquilor as general and Raptors and support heroes to suit. The other build I considered was the above with Protectors instead, a smaller unit of 3 Prosecutors and the Vanguard Angelos formation. There's not a lot of wiggle room in this one, and it's even MORE points not spent on models, but I think it could be a fun, flexible and potentially pretty powerful list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Requizen Posted March 30, 2017 Author Share Posted March 30, 2017 1 minute ago, Let's 'ere it for da boyz! said: Could you explain this please? I'm not sure I see what you're talking about, but then I am typically a little slow on the uptake! Bonds of Hatred increases the range of Hammerstrike Force's Celestial Supercharge from 6" to 12". However, the rule that you use to place models is called Hammerstrike. Celestial Supercharge is the ability that gives you +1 to Wound when you set up via the Battalion. Pretty sure that it was suppose to increase the range of Hammerstrike by 6", but instead it does... nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Let's 'ere it for da boyz! Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, Requizen said: Pretty sure that it was suppose to increase the range of Hammerstrike by 6", but instead it does... nothing. Okay, I see it now. So the wording doesn't allow for you to take advantage of the improved Celestial Supercharge ability because per Hammerstrike you can't deploy outside 6" of the Prosecutors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olincay Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 9 hours ago, AdamR said: In terms of raw damage it's around 27 wounds before saves if you get Bless weapons. 480 points worth of crossbow Judicators only nets you around 19 (again if they're stationary and blessed). So yeah, I'd say that's worthwhile! I imagine we could use is like the Kunnin'ruk with our Aetherstrike Force battalion. 162 shots over the hero and shooting phase plus any extras you generate from the Relictor. ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledha Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 10 hours ago, AdamR said: In terms of raw damage it's around 27 wounds before saves if you get Bless weapons. 480 points worth of crossbow Judicators only nets you around 19 (again if they're stationary and blessed). So yeah, I'd say that's worthwhile! take not that the judicators are much more resilient, and don't drop efficiency as fast as the raptors. Even when you loose 4 of a 5-man judicator unit, the shockbolt is still active and do damage (because the prime with shockbolt > the rest of the unit). For a 480 points unit, even if you lost 12 of the 15 judicators, they'll be able to dish plenty of damage with the 3 shockbolt. Which is not the cast with vanguard raptor (loosing half of the unit = loosing half of the firepower) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orkimedes Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 What's the story with the Dracoth units, does anyone use them? they don't seem to make it into any of the lists ppl post. What's the issue, too many points for what they do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olincay Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 1 hour ago, Orkimedes said: What's the story with the Dracoth units, does anyone use them? they don't seem to make it into any of the lists ppl post. What's the issue, too many points for what they do? My guess it's the change in meta from the new book dropping. Dracoths are still a super affective unit, we just have new toys and a new book to build lists with now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kozokus Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 4 hours ago, Orkimedes said: What's the story with the Dracoth units, does anyone use them? they don't seem to make it into any of the lists ppl post. What's the issue, too many points for what they do? They are still attractive, but if you wanna play them, you must field at least 4 of them in a unit (except for tempestors) so 480-560 points which is quite a commitment. Plus, you want to add the Castellan to get that mighty 2+ rerollable and eventually a LCOD with drake kin or the Heraldor for charge shenanigans. In the end, playing Dracoth just build your list for 25%-50% so less room for other toys. Plus, people are too busy figuring out how to play the new vanguard chamber. Also, there is a bunch of things now that deal 6+ mortal wounds reliably so 2+save Dracoth are a liability in that case. And people loves to play with them. Otherwise, they just murder rendless armies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kozokus Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 For my part i will always play them. Because mighty warriors wielding lithtnings weapons in golden armours with capes riding dragons that breath thunder is so powermetal. Mighty poooower of the Draaaagonflame! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baymaks Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 1 hour ago, kozokus said: For my part i will always play them. Because mighty warriors wielding lithtnings weapons in golden armours with capes riding dragons that breath thunder is so powermetal. Mighty poooower of the Draaaagonflame! You play them for the same reason I do I was listening to Hammerfall doing my sousltar maces last night Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 I'd like to try some, but a) I can't decide which version to build, and b) the substantial £$ cost put's me off a little. Although I pay as much for individual heroes, so that's probably just psychological! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebiggesthat Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 I would like to run some, but the cost puts me off a bit as well. And there is something about the models that looks a little static maybe. Talking earlier about the chamber rules, I'm desperate to use the Hallowed Warriors, as my paint scheme is similar and I like the fluff. But the 6 heroes really eat the points, and just leave the rest of the army looking threadbare. Has anyone used it to any effect? I'm thinking it could smash face at a larger points cost, but seems too pricey even at 2000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nico Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 The Fulminators are the go-to choice as they automatically hard counter Kunning Rukk Arrers and other high volume, low rend pew pew. They also synergise with the Celestial Vindicators Battalion from memory and they are cheaper than the Concussors. I also rate Tempestors as that automatic -1 to hit debuff is brilliant! However, avoid the Lightning Echelon like the Plague - better on paper than in practice due to the reality of fitting your bases behind enemy lines (as I found out to my cost here): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austin Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 I also tried that Lightning Echelon shenanigans the other day.....long story short I need to get better at it haha. I do love Fulminators and Tempestors though. I am not going to give up on the nasty charge trick. There has to be a way to make it work, and I think its probably just practice. @Nico your army looks amazing btw. If you remember and have the time, could you send a PM with how that Beastman player made those Minotaurs? They don't look stock to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nico Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 That's very kind of you. The marble over lava theme has served me well and spread to various other armies. Wayne Peter's Bullgors are very special. He named every model and seemed to know each one's personality. I'm sure there are some conversions in there, but I thought they were just exceptionally well painted Bullgors. Bullgors are a rare sighting indeed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Requizen Posted March 31, 2017 Author Share Posted March 31, 2017 Dracoths are really solid, but they're also expensive. There are a handful of things out there that can just instagib them - Durthu deals 6 wounds with his Sword, Skyfires deal multiple d3 MWs at a range if they roll well, Clan Skryre and Thundertusks will just remove them from the board, etc. However, once they get into combat, they're one of the strongest things we have, so it's really a question of what you face. I ran a unit of Fulminators at Adepticon and sort of regretted it. I was using Skyborne Slayers, so when my opponents would either turtle up, forcing me to stay back and make bad charges, or I would drop in on their side of the board and the Fulminators wouldn't get a charge until T3 because all the fighting would be far away. They also got gibbed by Durthu in one game and Skyfires in another. They really want to be run in an army that goes together up the board, or is more defensive. Maybe in a shooting heavy list, where they can act as flankers to hit the units coming in or as a strong counter-charge deterrent. They don't fit very well in an Alpha Strike list, though. Which is awesome to say, honestly, because it just means that our army has so many different ways to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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