Major Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Hi everyone, So I have 60 skeletons to build and I am left with a dilemma. So... swords or spears? Which do you prefer? Why? What are the benefits of either? Is there really a difference (lower hit roll vs range for back row etc)? Would really like the communities thoughts on this one lol. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divinemadman Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Anything above 10-20 skeletons spears win out. Consider 1 blob of 40 skeletons with spears maybe 2 10 man units with swords for chaf or objective sitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWilddog Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Just now, divinemadman said: Anything above 10-20 skeletons spears win out. Completely agree. With big blobs the 2' range will let you hit two lines deep and more than make up for the +1 to hit. These big units have such a tough time getting all their attacks in and the spears help that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Posted September 1, 2017 Author Share Posted September 1, 2017 10 minutes ago, divinemadman said: Anything above 10-20 skeletons spears win out. Consider 1 blob of 40 skeletons with spears maybe 2 10 man units with swords for chaf or objective sitting. 7 minutes ago, TheWilddog said: Completely agree. With big blobs the 2' range will let you hit two lines deep and more than make up for the +1 to hit. These big units have such a tough time getting all their attacks in and the spears help that. Yes I think you are both right personally. I do see a lot out there with the swords hanging in big blobs still though, I guess if the pile in works out they are good but I just cant ignore that sweet sweet range allowing the second row to get some hits in too. They already get extra attacks at 20 or ore then again at 30 or more so that, plus the added range and the +1 to hit from nearby (18") general makes it the better of the two I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotrek Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Spears are mathmatically better. The extra attacks are just too good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themortalgod Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Its really no contest in any unit except maybe a small unit of 10 as other have pointed out. x2 attacks is so much better than +1 to hit that its ridiculous (x2 attacks being because twice as many skeletons get to swing). Mathematically it comes out to be about a 25% increase in wounds for a big unit to take spears instead of swords. Also, another consideration, if you are a TK player, there are enough +1 to hit bonuses in a Settra/TK in Exalted Chariot army that you can get spears to 2+ to hit, at which point they are ridiculously better than swords. Unfortunately, the same benefits don't exist for Deathrattle. My 2¢ is that for any unit you intend to deploy that is big, spears are a no brainer, but a couple groups of 10 that might be used for summoning swords become the more attractive option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillofNagash Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 3 hours ago, themortalgod said: Its really no contest in any unit except maybe a small unit of 10 as other have pointed out. x2 attacks is so much better than +1 to hit that its ridiculous (x2 attacks being because twice as many skeletons get to swing). Mathematically it comes out to be about a 25% increase in wounds for a big unit to take spears instead of swords. Also, another consideration, if you are a TK player, there are enough +1 to hit bonuses in a Settra/TK in Exalted Chariot army that you can get spears to 2+ to hit, at which point they are ridiculously better than swords. Unfortunately, the same benefits don't exist for Deathrattle. My 2¢ is that for any unit you intend to deploy that is big, spears are a no brainer, but a couple groups of 10 that might be used for summoning swords become the more attractive option. With the spell from the Liche Priest i would go sword and board all the time. I prefer the swords because i would rather not roll a million dice. 40 skeletons with swords will get you about 20 models into combat in my experience, and with spears probably 30 or so. So yeah that is a lot of dice, but i find the sword and board ones get the job done anyway, and i don't need to bring a bucket to throw dice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoffeeGrunt Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 It's not really twice the attacks. If anything it's an extra 50% because swords can attack two ranks deep anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipoo2 Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 Spears for hordes, swords for the rest. Thinking about the legion of death battalion I would go with 1 unit of 40 spears and 2 units of 10 with sword's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelmaster Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 10 is an expendable unit for holding objectives, screening your other units, and engaging other small throwaway units. Swords are slightly better but it doesn't make much difference. 20 is a bad size for skeletons — to expensive to be expendable, but not really hard-hitting enough to be a threat. Which weapon is better depends what you're up against, I'd say there's not much in it. 30 is hard-hitting, but needs to go first because even a single casualty will massively lower their hitting power (until it gets back up). Definitely go spears. 40 is only slightly more hitty than 30, but a lot more durable and absolutely worth it with the new horde points. Again, go spears. Depending on how you arrange them, spears can more than double your attacks because it's not just extra ranks, it extends sideways too. You're kinda increasing the radius of a circle. Of course assuming you're measuring base-to-base, it depends what bases your models are on and what you're up against. Still, if we assuming it's a 3+ to hit with swords and a 4+ with spears, swords will only be 33% better, so even 50% more attacks would give spears the advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 I run 40 with spears, and 2x10 with swords in a legion battalion and am pretty happy with it. Everything Squirrelmaster said about unit sizes and what weapon to give them is on point, ime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Posted September 4, 2017 Author Share Posted September 4, 2017 yeah that sounds like a great idea. I will go and try that out then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centuryslayer Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 But swords are cooler than spears ;p I'm with WillofNagash that swords get the job done anyway. Even if spears are better most of tge time. Unless you get debuffed I guess. Also I usually take a Necrodancer for some sweet extra activation so I want to avoid rolling two buckets of dice and go for a bit more quality over quantity (even of quantity is better here). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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