Turragor

Shock and awe is also active if you use a prayer or CA that redeploys your units - anything that sets up a unit of Stormcast again in the ability/prayer description.

Drakesworn templar also helps in this regard

This has always been pretty strong for Judis. They're just dear and suffer from being only 5 with 1 attack each. I like judicators though.

Its entirely possible that, until SCE get their next tome, the best way to use all our SCE models is to play Order with a bunch of toys. I saw an interesting list involving Tickles (my name for Teclis), Kroak, the Prime and a bunch of interesting Order chaff. I reckon that philsophy, combined with the majority of SCE models that everyone here owns (surely) can lead to some really interesting "Stormcast (wolf) in Order (sheep) Clothing" lists. As pure SC you really lose very little (staunch - the main thing for me) switching to Order. I know I've considered a few Cities lists but they are quite restrictive. In the end though, that's just a theory. And what it points to is that we're going beyond wringing every bit of SCE faction juice out of the tome and have moved onto just seeing what our Stormcast centric model collections can do with the minimum extra Euros/dollars spent. Time and many minds focusing on the problem will tell! NB/ if you read this and think "oh so if time, money, painting effort - all that - weren't a consideration, I'd play Seraphon or Lumineth then?" - then yes, yes you absolutely would. But one of the joys (for me) in this hobby, because I'm a slow painter with a job and young family, is finding out the best list I can make with what I already have, rather than getting the newest, hottest, netlist.

I am not sure if there was ever an answer on this but for me it is (sort of) simple: If A) the mws back to the opponent are procced on a 6 and then the opponent rerolls, then B) mws towards you (from any of the units in game doing mws on unmodified 6s to hit) go through and then the opponent rerolls. This would allow for double procs. I reject B so must reject A.

I second this, the Prime with rr to hit arriving on r2 or 3 can make ppl sweat.

This is wrong from TO pov even I think. You can pick 1 or more targets and roll the number of times on the damage table. So you could pick a banner bearer and 1 pink horror and roll for the banner bearer (fail), roll for the banner bearer again (succeed) and then the final pink horror (succeed). Or Roll for banner bearer (succeed), final pink horror (succeed) - no more targets for 3rd roll. There's no mention of repeat targeting at all. I feel they're being awkward about this for no reason - it's like Stormwinged, folks get all twisted up about minutiae of SC rules when the SC tome and units have to be bled dry to get semi-respectable use from them. Me too! Well Stockholm. I'd offer to play and show you the ropes but as anyone who plays at my local knows, I barely get time to play other than tournaments

tbh I can see why they think that, but it doesn't say that you pick all at once. Just that you pick 3 or more. TO decision is always best in any case!

I think they maybe just misunderstand what is happening - before I decide if they're trying to misinterpret. Its normal that most damage in the game is taken at once after multiple weapons have been rolled. Then the opponent removes casualties at once. I have played OBR and Tzeentch which both have replace on death mechanics and on both occasions they were okay with replacing as each bite roll was completed before the next was rolled.

It's because the Tzeentch players are waiting until 3 models have been eaten then placing whatever they can via split from those 3 at once. Which means: But if the Tzeentch player has to place after each model is slain, they've to be more careful with how they setup their unit the entire match when a stardrake is near the pinks. It increases the pressure on them, and the chances of error and losing a chunk of horrors to battleshock

I mean, I play it (and have never heard issues with) as if it is resolved independently. When you attack with claws and hammer - multiple attacks - wounds are allocated after, then models are slain and removed fully in opponents control. Cavernous jaws doesn't play exactly by those rules/that flow. Wording wise its - pick one or more (so you can try to bite the same model 3 times - ergo you resolve before you choose subsequent bite targets) targets after pile in and before main attacks. You pick the target and roll - if its above wounds stat on warscroll the target is slain. Removed right away. & Pinks split when slain. Then you would repeat. I mean they will prob challenge (because it means they've to play so much more carefully) and itll then need TO (or FAQ). But it is a sequence. It ends. Then you can do it X times. I'd bring it up before the match I think so at least you are both on the same page

But it sounds like you played it perfectly great job! When is the next match played? And when do you find out the scenario? This one is very scenario/opponent skill dependent - I think that is where you want the most luck here. I have beaten a similar list mainly due to the scenario.

Cool that you go through! As I've said a bunch of times now, I still need to get some Kroak experience in the list. However, even were I not playing Kroak, that first matchup would be very touch and go depending on scenario and as always luck. I would probably rely on stardrakes a lot. Once enemy magic is dampened (as you would hope with starcast). As roadblocks mostly. I've not met new Serpahon and I haven't fully studied their tome, but I think bar magic (main threat) and maybe luck with his big hero and mw artefact, this army cannot hurt your drakes. I think that the fact it is coalesced is really good for you. Starborne is more problematic v starcast (again - no experience here, just playing through in my head). I might try to remove their small heroes r1. You have to get Kroak/casters down. I can't see an advantage to giving away r1. Ofc you could deploy v deep and hope to have his army sufficiently pruned r2 or 3 but then you will have an uphill struggle with objective points - depending on the scenario. So the list isn't impossible - it shouldn't be easy for your opponent anyway. It should be FUN and at least it's not a very hard matchup (30 pinks - yes haha) for the first elimination round. Good luck when it rolls around!

haha I lost on stream too - its interesting, like a true performance environment where you are inclined to make a few more mistakes Congrats on 2-1 too! I feel that is the kind of peak for the starcast school (and perhaps SCE as a whole) - as you mention. As for list changes - I guess you know best. You are now the official expert on Kroakcast (as far as I know) so I cannot guide you with recommendations there I do note you mention some of the times you do poorly is when meeting a stronger caster list - there's no way for us to be better than Kroak. The only other option is to opt for almost no magic (and then, what do you lose in the games where Kroak helps you win?). The only path there (which I'm sure you're following) is to focus everything on the unit that beats kroak first round. However, when Kroak is a part of the barrage that does this, how do you accomplish this? Personally, pre-Kroak I was always most in dread of a Nagash list, which I have had the good luck to never face. I feel with Kroak it's probably the same story then.

Remember that guy? Finally painted him close to three years later

More aweome tips! As I said, I've not used Kroak yet so really want to dig into his subtleties. Re: Gaming - yes I should be free (or hopefully) one evening or two over the next few days for guidance Can PM steam username - its steam right?

I would add here (for anyone else reading and looking for general starcast tips) - if you play 1 wizard or as many as you like, and can't get 1 of them within dispell range t2 you are really hamstringing your comet performance. ALTHOUGH I have played very successful games where the r1 comet and following prime/stardrakex2 barrage was enough to win me the game by taking out the key buff pieces. It really depends. The 1st one is the MOST important but why play to only get one if you can get more? The answer is you don't play that way, unless you are forced to.

Thanks, yeah maybe I can find time to get "coached" one evening - with 2 small kids my time is kind of broken up a lot. Even in normal circumstances. - but I guess if you are playing you can pause the game and have the state preserved? So you could play out a round per night or so?

I dont know what plaguebearers are supposed to do tbh. Think their locus needs changed to a bonus to their ward save instead of rerolling saves of 1. Or maybe rerolling all saves. Anyway, thats another thread!

Grats on 3-2! With your group I think thats great. Its what we expect of Starcast - SC arent going to go 4-1 without lucky matcups and never 5-0 without a lot of blood, sweat and tears because when you are running that hot you meet the really tough lists and there are just some we haven't the tools to take out. What's the shootcast player's last matchup? Its not really important, if we're being honest Shootcast will stretch a little ahead of starcast in performance - or should - even on equal matchups (if they are truly random). One question I have for you, Seraphon have unlimited unbind range right? I always found that I can position to always get the comet off turn 1 because its range is so obscene. Unlimited unbind range makes it more of a lottery buuut you still have the plus 2 to cast I guess. I think Kroak is great but against a lot of magic there are definitely the old school options. I am dying to play now. I might have to figure out the tabletop game software - its a bit daunting at first glance.

I love the sideboard idea in general but think you are right. I think it also punishes SC to an extent because we're so points dense we can't have an entirely different flavour of army by swapping 500 points in and out.

Something like this is worth a try you know. I have said this a bunch of times, and it's not just starcast specific, not Stormcast specific. It's the propensity for ppl to tweak a list before they learn to play it more. Like I still have a lot to learn playing the basic starcast list. The Kroakcast list would be sufficiently different that I'm back to a beginner level (ish). This philosophy has been the main driving force behind my pursuit of starcast lists in 2019 (and starcasts inspiration list the year before) - results get better the more you play. Ofc that means in theory you'll still lose to someone who knows a list as well as you do when that list is better in the meta. That's not a concern I have as I paint so slow I never build meta lists

haha yes! I still think I could have won that game but I got "stage paralysis" with my decision making On watching the replay, the path to victory was obvious (given gotrek is so slow)

I like this idea. I know its no longer starcast as its not SCE but I always thought of starcast as the method of playing the cool SC models rather than a pure SC army. Ofc Stormcast need that also but I mean if someone (me) has 3 stardrakes they want to use them, even if they step outside the faction. Its a sad judgement of the faction but thats nothing new or interesting to discuss. I'm up for "honourary" starcast lists from that perspective. That said, I really miss the healing drake combo (which needs staunch) and the comet. So you've replaced deepstriking libs (for my money) but alas they're not battleline. So a bit less efficient. Castellant Healing - there is probably a mage or priest with a d3 heal you could make use of but that may fizzle and not add the extra save (but ethereal mitigates and renders save bonus obsolete). What about mulitple healing warscrolls? Thats probably too much focus on the drake health... Hmm I think there's legs but I also have this feeling that the SC Kroakcast list can probably do better. I agree with what Rob said - it's not going to win tournaments but it is its own sick fun against some buff combo lists. And I am 80% sure it will do as well as Shootcast (though each have strengths and weaknesses) against a random field. Bring on the next SC tome and we'll not need to try to squeeze more out of the starcast approach (though there will probably be an heir to the throne - anything that focuses on dragons and comets).

Awesome! Fyreslayers are tough and I think that troggoth list is precisely what starcast has issues with What changes would you make to the list with your experience so far (I've yet to play with covid about)? Would you try a non starcast sce list against the same opponents you had?