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Everything posted by Kasper

  1. Things are being "invalidated" all the time. There could have been someone investing into Seraphon or whatever prior to a new book because they love the "current" playstyle, only to find out a new one comes out and alters it. Units are "invalidated" through FAQs with rule changes or point changes. I dont think this is new or extraordinary at all. I think dropping new stuff in waves is just fine. It means the release wont be as overwhelming to some and currently if you dont like the release you might as well wave goodbye to the army for another 5 years. With this method you might have some hype that they will introduce some interesting things down the line - Either new models or batallions in white dwarf etc to spice things up. Fyreslayers is an example where they could have used a little extra love down the road.
  2. Im guessing this means by the end of the month. If it was next week I feel like the wording would have been different.
  3. Think its great that IDK got some love, but the issue is that the eel spam (which was already incredible good and super annoying to play against) is now just eel spam + 1/2 leviadons.
  4. Would love to hear about your experience with the tome from the event. Do you see any use with the tome in other lists? I played your other list and switched a Changecaster + Balewind + Magister for Great Bray Shaman + Ogroid. Played against a "Starcast" with Stardrake, Lord Arcanum with Everblaze Comet, Slann, Heraldor (the guy that blows a horn and explodes a terrain), Lord Celestant to buff the Stardrake and then it was 3x5 Judicators with a Prime. Soooo much MW output, and a lot of it doesnt need any dice rolling. It was on "Battle for the Pass" and despite him taking first turn and and pretty much nuking Kairos to ~7 wounds remaining in turn 1, I won pretty hard by turn 3. Not gonna lie, but we played in Realm of Light and every terrain being Mysitcal helped my little dudes a lot. I rolled some pretty hot 6s to deny some of the mass MW output the SCE list does from terribly far away. I opt'd to use Kairos dice to stop a Comet's Call after having used Be'Lakor on the Lord Arcanum to give me some more time. Both guys are sitting 40ish inches away (which is honestly so stupid - the range on both abilities is insane) so there is no unbinding to do here. In turn 1 he dropped his Judicators on the two middle objectives (Prime came down on one of them) and started sniping away, which got him 5 VPs. The following turn I DD charged Pinks into each unit and they kept the objective the remaining of the game (we played until my turn 3 (the end of turn 3) and he conceeded). This gave me 5 VPs in turn 1, 5 VPs in turn 2 and in turn 3 I summoned 10 Pinks onto his back objective, so it was 19-7 by the end of turn 3 which he couldnt come back from. There was no way he could re-capture his own objective while also getting my home objective. Bodies simply won by this point. The Ogroid felt kinda meh. He just stood around and gave Kairos an additional spell to cast, beyond that he did nothing. He felt way too squishy for me to even consider moving him forward and into combat. Obviously the list I played against has a TON of AoE MWs output, which doesnt help agaisnt our tiny guys. But at least the Changecaster provides an additional spell casting source with 2+ spell casts a turn that can have some ooompfh. The 24" from Balewind also gives me something to play around with so my opponent simply cant just sit outside of 18" and chill. In my game I felt it was literally just Kairos casting spells, all the other dudes sat around and did nothing beside offering up their lore spell. The healing from the Ogroid spell is also kinda whatever. I think it healed Kairos 2 wounds total in that game. If the healing was equal to the MWs it did, I would value it much higher, but using the spell on 2+ wound models or against single heroes (like a Prime or Stardrake) is kinda wasted. The lower casting value is ok, but not that big when you have rerolls from the Manticore. The Great Bray Shaman felt great. His Prime was around 22" away from Kairos when it came down, so I decided to bank on the Devolve which got the Prime within 18" inches, meant he got nuked dead in a single turn. I think the ability to mess with people so they cant just say "ohh you have 18" reach? gotcha! i will just sit outside of 18" then" is pretty valuable. You also have the option of just yoinking something into unbinding range through Spellportal (I didnt want to try on his Lord Arcanum since he had do a crazy high roll on 2D6 to be within 30"), something out of buffing range etc. I really like this guy and I think its super valuable to give your opponent a ton of different questions, as we have talked about in the past. Im really torn on what to cut in the list for the Shaman. I like the Magister because he offers another source of a Spawn which is insane in HostD but sprinting forward in the later turns to summon 10 Pinks onto an objective (or within 9" to DD a charge) is pretty sick. The Blue Scribes can do the same though, and I feel like by turn 3 he has done his job by supporting Kairos with the Spellportal or learning Wind of Chaos on a 4+ to cast on a 2+ through the Spellportal later on etc. Otherwise I could go with the Changecaster + Balewind, but it puts me at this awkward spot of having 1960 pts. It means I get to have a triumph in 99% of the games (probably), which isnt too bad I guess? Could always use the reroll saves on Kairos, or hits/wounds on the Pinks. Im honestly sad I cant slot in Geminids, but I wont dwell too much on the exact list since we are so close to the winter FAQ which could change things around - The GBS could drop in points to give me Geminids (lack 10 pts!), maybe the Gaunt Summoner drops significantly (rightfully so tbh after his nerf to "just" 5 Pinks) which might change the heroes choices around. I have yet to use the Palisade + Spawn trick to halt the movement of enemy units
  5. I mean I completely understand wanting to switch things up. You have played the list a fair few times by now, so I would probably want to switch things up too. Play some games and report back! Im curious how it will be on the table. Sometimes things look great/bad on paper but on the table things turn out significantly different.
  6. Any 6s is "almost" unstoppable on its own though (12/13 is rather difficult to beat) and it isnt difficult to get access to casting rerolls in the first place. My biggest gripe is that it takes up an Endless Spell slot and the fact you will bracket Kairos simply by turreting spells. I guess it hugely depends on what you play against (+3 unbind Kroak/Teclis), what your list is made up of and what exactly your plan is. If you dont have a specific gameplan in mind with it, it seems rather terrible to be fair.
  7. Yeah I can see the potential in the Tome, but I just dont like the idea of risking that Kairos brackets himself. This is without even considering random chip damage like Comet's Call or other long range shooting attacks etc. I feel like you could achieve almost the same effect but still having access to Wind of Chaos by taking your other "control list" and shaving off Blue Scribes, Be'lakor etc. The randomness does suck, but I could see it working out alright as a threat. Even if you dont roll well, I think most opponents would think twice before "invading" said space at the risk of getting halved movement, -1 hit, suffer D3 MWs and have a Chaos Spawn appear (Host Dup) makes this even more fun. As I read the Endless Spell, you get to roll a D6 and then see the result and pick a unit afterwards. So if you get a positive buff, you can select your own unit, if not you can select an enemy unit. If there is no enemy unit within 12" of the Sigil, you can just move outside of it as it happens at the end of your movement phase.
  8. Why Guild of Summoners? I would go Host Arcanum in a list like this. Switch 10 Pinks to Screamers and include Portal + Geminids.
  9. I have been looking at the Endless Spells for Tzeentch for a while.. My local shop got 30% off due to "black week" so I decided to buy the Tzeentch and S2D ones. I find the Tzeentch ones really awkward after studying the scrolls. While I get the point of Tome of Eyes, I just fear the risk of rolling double 2s or 6s when Kairos is casting 4 spells a turn. He could bracket himself pretty fast on his own without even considering any kind of chip damage, and you have no sustainability? I thought of including the Burning Sigil in your other list. The idea of is controlling the midfield and while the Burning Sigil is random, I feel like it could maybe cause a zone (18" setup range and then 12" radius around that) that your opponent likely dont want to walk into. This could cover objectives/midfield somewhat. It is annoying that we have a limit on 3 endless spells though..
  10. I havent ever summoned more than once, but I have missed this rule! I thought it was unlimited just like Seraphon. It seems odd though, I mean by that token why cant you summon 10 Blues/Brims for the cost of 10 Pinks? 10 Brims should certainly drop in FP value. On the flip side if they get too cheap it would be a no brainer in most cases to summon in 10 Brims every turn to act as a speedbump while you grind to 20 FP for 10 Pinks.
  11. I have been searching high and low as to understand why you can pick between 10 Blues or 10 Brims for the same Fate Point cost. I thought it was a mistake for sure. I cant see an arguement for EVER picking 10 Brims. Even if you want more damage output in melee, it would be better to pick Blues and fire more shots in the shooting phase - Same damage in the end. You just get 10 free wounds by picking Blues.
  12. Not only that, but when you field 30 Pinks you are looking at transporting 150 models. (30 Pinks + 60 Blues + 60 Brims). This can come as quite a surprise if you are new to the faction and tinkering with army lists. Thankfully they are on 25mm (Blues and Brims) so they dont take up as much space. It is also a significant number of models to paint. Luckily those little guys arent the toughest to make "table top ready".
  13. I joined the server, but Im not super familiar with Discord. Didnt seem like there was a Tzeentch channel, only a general Chaos one?
  14. Im not sure why this was even a question to begin with though. Longshanks is effectively a worse version of fly. If you could freely "retreat" out of combat with Longshanks, there would be nothing stopping flying models from doing the same, which they havent.
  15. Since AoS has become a game of nitpicking, it seems crazy to me that they changed the indiviual models' abilities instead of just errata the universal "Longshanks" ability itself. So effectively the Bonegrinder is still screwed by endless spells, magmic invocations and judgements, since there is no mention of him in the errata. Maybe Forgeworld will update his warscroll? Im guessing the mercenary Mega Gargants are screwed too since they are their own thing and not specifically the dudes mentioned on page 76, 77 and 78? Seems like a potential silly oversight. The answer to Mightier Makes Rightier is so incredible stupid and it just opens up a lot of abuse as it is. I like the idea that you can bring your SoB to a tournament and not autolose either Places of Arcane Power or Better Part of Valor depending of your list, but there the answer given just opens up a lot of implications.
  16. That sounds so crazy to me. A lot of armies are super easy to pilot and they pretty much play themselves or are super straight forward once you have slammed them down on the table. I think people get a bit frustrated playing against this kind of list because it is very unique - Typically when you play AoS you get to play your army the way you want to - It might not be good enough and your opponents army might be superior in combat/counters yours, but this list basically tells your opponent "no" or asks a question a bunch of times, which isnt how AoS is typically played. It also got a ton of tools for almost any situation - I havent really had good usage out of Wind of Chaos until now, but good grief is it insane when you are hitting a horde unit and not 5-10 model units. Im surprised there is nearly no shooting in your local meta.. We have quite a few that play Stormcast and sometimes opt for a shooty list, Seraphon players with Thunder Lizard (Bastiladons in that are so insane vs Tzeentch), some KO and also some LRL with Sentinels. I think this list is significantly better in a more combat/magic focused meta since you dont have to worry as much about keeping your stuff way back. In my matchup against Seraphon I almost couldnt get my heroes within range of the objectives in fear of 2 Bastiladons just ripping apart Kairos or removing 2 squishy heroes per turn. Combining additional movement with Devolve will certainly make it stronger, but I do think sometimes it is worth implementing tricks that dont necessarily always grant you a huge bonus, but instead provides a threat that your opponent needs to worry about. I used to always include teleport mechanics in my lists - Not because they always did a whole lot of work for me, but it messed with my opponent's head since he constantly had to think about zoning out the possiblity of me deepstriking something. Not every army got a ton of cheap chaff, so by simply having a teleport mechanic I suddenly "wasted" alot of his forces that would otherwise be pushing against my army. I think this is another case of a trick where your opponent will go "Damn, if I roll a 10+ on the move, my unit is done for.. Better place it way back!" which already there typically gives you value. I guess it will just require some more getting used to. In my example I had 2 blues and 18 brims left on an objective. That isnt a lot of wounds. They would probably die to 2 Bastiladons shooting the following turn, where as getting additional Pinks and using a DD 1 would secure the objective for at least 2 rounds. Rolling a 1 meant he would get the objective. Guess it is tricky to figure out if it is worth it or not. The Ogroid spell is actually kind of interesting. I like the idea of implementing some healing to keep Kairos alive and perhaps counter some chip damage that would otherwise bracket him by turn 2 (like Comet's Call). Going from a D6 MW spell to a secured 6 flat MW is pretty big when you are trying to snipe something. Edit: I dont really see this list falling out of fashion anytime soon. I think it is currently at its worst against all the shooty lists that are really hot (at least in my playing field) - If things shift around and there is a much bigger focus on combat units, then I think it will only get better since you can comfortably sit back behind screens and dominate the midboard. I sometimes wish I had a screen or two of 10 Brims, especially to lock down my backline as I push forward, or simpy to layer up with screens against a potential double turn. I also cant really decide on my endless spells. I think Balewind Vortex is too good for the Changecaster, even if just for Fate Points. But as we talked about, sometimes the Changecaster is hot, sometimes he is not. I think thats a general theme with this list - Not every single piece is incredible against every single matchup, but the effects are powerful enough that it works regardless. Im a bit uncertain of Balewind Vortex on the Magister on Disc and his "Magic-touched" ability. What if you cast Balewind Vortex with a double, then cast his Bolt of Change on a double, will he die then? Or can you just say you used up the extra spell from the Balewind (prior to casting obviously), instead of using his extra spellcast from "Magic-touched"? Otherwise Balewind could be reasonable on him so he can cast his -1 hit/wound and his Bolt of Change with extended range and securing he wont suicide. When you need to zoom across the table, you can just auto dispell the Balewind. Spellportal is absolutely a must-take. The third slot is kinda where Im uncertain. Geminids is great for getting extra MWs and stacking -1 to hit, especially since you dont care as much about it being thrown back at ya with the way the army plays. I havent tried Daemonrift yet. I really like the Palisade against a shooty meta and as we talked about it offers some options to really mess with your opponent coupled with a Spawn and HD no retreat.
  17. @Gwendar Been playing 5 games in a combination of IRL/TTS recently with the "control list" and it is a lot of fun! There is so much depth to the list, and it certainly isnt a list that plays itself unlike many other armies where you just slap them on the table and they will do all the work for you by default. I really like that you have such a huge toolbox so you almost have something against any given matchup - This is generally my issue with AoS - Where I play we typically make an "all comers list" instead of tailoring our list based on what we are gonna play against. This creates super frustrating situations at times where you have a list that dont really have a lot of tools against the given army it is gonna face. I havent felt like this yet with this list yet, since there is a tool for pretty much any job. Yesterday I played vs FoS Seraphon with Kroak package, 1 set of Skink heroes, Slann, 40 Skinks, 30 Skinks, 2 Bastiladons and Spellportal. Those 7 boardwide unbinds with +2 is super frustrating to play against! I also really hate Bastiladons with their immense threat range - Its almost impossible to hide from them, where as the Skinks can be screened easily. I outdropped him and opt'd to go first as we deployed our units - We played on Battle for the Pass but noticed his Skink heroes were rather far forward - So I deployed in such a way that I could 2+ Spellportal with the Blue Scribes and then DD 11 a Gift of Change into his Skink Priest right away. Used my Be'lakor on one of his Bastiladons in case he got the double, meant I likely wouldnt have to fear being dropped by 2 Bastiladons shooting twice in 2 turns. I won priority and managed to DD 9 a Wind of Chaos into his 40 Skinks. It did something stupid like 27 MWs. I love this spell against hordes! I rolled kinda hot on some of the 6s for D3 MWs. His face was priceless when he saw his 40 Skinks decimated in no time. The remaining ran to battleshock. I moved some Horrors + Kairics up to shoot his other 30 Skinks and reduced them significantly and he basically called it already there. I dont think it was entirely over, but his Kroak was sat so far back that I could easily cap the 2 middle objectives without getting within 22" of Kroak. I had no intention of pushing to his side of the board, although by turn 2 I had 25 fate points and could easily have ran my Blue Scribes up to summon 10 Pinks 9" away from his objective and then attempted a charge, or I could have bolstered one of the other objectives with another 50 Wounds. He basically only had 2 Bastiladons to deal any kind of damage by now, and even though they wreck Daemons, they arent clearing 10 Pinks any time soon. The score would have been 10-2 by the end of turn 2 and he couldnt really get to mine, so the game was probably over. Some general thoughts/questions Be'lakor Im really not entirely sure how Im meant to play Be'lakor once he is on the table and done his thing. I feel like he is "pretty much just there", hanging back. It is rare I have gotten Enfeeble off. Bastiladons would easily roast him since he is a Daemon, so it seemed pointless to run him forward - Maybe he could have just soaked some damage so my Horrors would have been more healthy? I decided to just keep him back and had him zone out a large part of my backline. My opponent could have teleported 40 Skinks in his turn 1 into the top side of my zone, but all he could do was shoot Be'lakor and then his Skinks were stranded near me and ready to be blasted, or lose all their buffs for his next turn, meaning they are kinda worthless. Seemed like a decent bait which he didnt take. Maybe his purpose is more against combat armies where he can move up behind a screen and cast Enfeeble on some combat unit? Changecaster Im really not sure about this guy. Again, Im really defensive against shooting armies. I feel like he's just sitting back on his Balewind, not in reach of anything. At least he is generating 2-3 Fate Points per turn quite reliable. I played against a Sureheart SCE list where he could sit behind screens and blast, but against any ranged army he's just sitting back? Maybe Im too afraid of losing the guy. Great-Bray Shaman I couldnt really decide between trying to Devolve something or just straight up casting Gift of Change to ensure a low wound hero would die. My fear is using Devolve through the Spellportal, only for my opponent to roll double 1s on the move.. The fact he is there really put a lot of fear into my opponent though. It was the first game with this guy over the Magister on a Disc. I think on a "normal" battleplan it would be easier to pull something forward and have my dudes be within 18" of the target - There is just so much space on Battle for the Pass. He might shine later on in the game where you can pull something off an objective, or pull a unit outside of a buff aura like HGB etc. Imagine pulling HGB outside of their 4+ spell ignore aura and then get blasted! Blue Scribes I keep forgetting to learn spells on a 4+. I probably wouldnt do it on every single spell, but learning stuff like Wind of Chaos is quite huge, since he can 2+ it through the Spellportal the following turns, if my opponent doesnt decide to dispell it. Thats insane against horde units like 40 Skinks. Fold Reality I have actually yet to cast this spell on my Horrors. Might be due to inexperience, but how aggressive are you with casting this? I had 1 unit that was basically 2 blues and 18 brims on an objective. I thought about throwing Fold Reality on them since there are "only" 22 wounds remanining. I just fear rolling a 1 and losing the objective, but rolling anything else, returning at least 1 banner guy and then DD 1 on the battleshock would really bolster the unit immensely. I guess you really need to calculate if you NEED the additional wounds to win the game vs playing it safe. Any indication for when you cast Fold Reality or you just risk it for the biscuit?
  18. I would consider Hosts Arcanum. You get a free 6" move with Archaon and you also get 6 Screamers that you can send forward to screen or grab an objective (in an army that lacks bodies) while you buff up Archaon and force your opponent to do something about him. Not entirely sure about the spell on the Sorc Lord, but I would personally run something like this. Allegiance: Tzeentch- Change Coven: Hosts ArcanumLeadersArchaon the Everchosen (800)- Lore of Fate: Infusion ArcanumChaos Sorcerer Lord (110)- General- Command Trait: Spell Hunters- Artefact: The Fanged Circlet- Lore of Fate: Shield of FateKairos Fateweaver (400)- Lore of Change: Arcane TransformationBattleline10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (220)10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (220)3 x Screamers of Tzeentch (80)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsUmbral Spellportal (70)Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (60)Total: 1960 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 68 DD the Reckless Abandon agenda to give Archaon +1 to all attacks. Arcane Transformation to give him another attack on Slayer of Kings. Infusion Arcanum to give him +1 hit/wound on all attacks. Daemonic Power to reroll all hits and wounds. Oracular Visions to reroll his 3+ save. Once hes in you can throw out Geminids to make stuff -2 to hit in combat against him. With Hosts Arcanum you are basically looking at a 20" move in turn 1 plus a charge of whatever your DD rolls (likely secured a 10"+ charge) to really get him stuck in.
  19. I would love to man, but as Im still new to Tzeentch Im still having an awful time figuring out spells etc (I printed small Pokemon-like cards for the lore spells + warscroll spells), so I would prefer to get a better hang of them before wasting your time. πŸ˜… Theres significantly more to keep track of than when I play Seraphon. Honestly I used to think Horrors were broken AF, but it was likely my inexperience with them. They get much worse in units of 20, but honestly almost any army got a way of dealing 20 damage in 1 turn to prevent you from DD 1 on the banner.
  20. Brims arent too bad though, they could act as a backend screen to prevent deepstrikes as you push forward with your Pinks/casters (something I sometimes miss). Against super aggressive melee armies it never hurts to have a couple of layers of protection, since many units can easily chew through 50 wounds, but if the second layer is far enough back so they cant pile in, it doesnt matter if it is only 10 wounds, it will stop their charge. But yeah, the issue is points - Another issue is that with so many heroes not fitting into the batallion, you are not getting a low drop army either way, so what is really the point in bending your army list? The teleport is neat though, but not sure it is worth changing everything up. I just figured that 10 Skinks deal no damage and they wont really contest your Horrors on objectives. I can understand generally wanting to kill Kroak since his Celestial Deliverance/Stellar Tempest/Comet's Call really thins out Horrors and threatens some of the low wound heroes. I just figured 40 Skinks is such a juicy and easy target for Wind of Chaos, and it will force him to use a CP for Inspiring Presense 100% with all the deaths. Many Seraphon lists dont start with a CP, so if you get turn 1 and manage to throw it at them turn 1, they are really in neck deep. After those are gone there wont really be a whole lot of damage output beside Kroak. Maybe Kroak is a better target overall - But you could also throw Be'lakor at him and shut him down for 1-2 turns. Again, not trying to backseat - Im just trying to learn. Im building my Tzeentch army as is and have been playing some games on TTS so far. You are obviously great at the army and has been doing really well with it!
  21. You can add Gotrek, Archaon (especially in Tzeentch), 6 Gore-Gruntas, 1 Maw-Krusha with neg3 rend artefact to the list of units that can easily remove a single Mega per turn. πŸ˜… Might be talking from personal experience here.
  22. Great batrep! It is always easy to backseat, but isnt ultimately the biggest threat in his list the 40 Skinks? Is there a reason why you didnt Spellportal + fate dice Wind of Chaos on the 40 in turn 2 to significantly reduce the incoming damage the following turns?
  23. I would never put Kairos so far forward unless I knew beforehand if I was gonna take turn 1 or not. But if you have fewer drops than your opponent, then it is quite neat! I thought about trying change the control list to Changehost to limit drops, but having to field a normal Chicken really messes up with the points. I still want Kairos, Be'lakor and Manticore.. Good point about Gift of Change. Completely forgot about the FAQ that explains it. Still, I should generally be using his 2+ much more often past turn 1. Even if it is a 1/6 of failing, Im fairly sure it is significantly better odds than rolling 2D6. Especially in a world where Kroak/Slann is quite dominant.
  24. Devolve is kinda a neat trick. Especially if you can grab something with fly so it moves over a screen or whatever. That combined with the 6” pregame move could certainly catch people offguard! Question - If Kairos casts Wind of Change with a Manticore nearby, I guess the Blue Scribes can roll a 4+ to learn it off Kairos? I think I need to abuse the 2+ on the Blue Scribes more often. Learning Gift of Change and Wind of Chaos is quite potent for the following turns after placing the Spellportal in turn 1.
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