Let's chat Kharadron Overlords

[Beliman]

Can't wait to play this new edition!!

From my pov, the main AoS 2.0 features are:

-Summons (new mechanics): KO out of this feature.

-Magic (new spells and mechancis): Same, KO out.

-Multi-Command Abilities with CPs: KO are short in command abilities. But our battalions will be eazy to be taken with all this new points reduction.

-More customization between new items and realms: Good, we have an awesome rules between the Code, Aether weapons, Treasures and our Endinworks, now we are going to have MORE options!!!

So, ignoring the ranged rules and this tipe of tweaks, our KO generals are going to use CP mechanics (with only two command abilities+standard ones) and be more custmoizable. I hope to see some new features (that are not just tweaks), maybe something close to 40k Stratagems? Or maybe new Command Abilities for other heroes (Navi, Khemist and EndinMaster)? Well, one can dream!!!! But still, I like what I see, even if the main features are not aimed for our armies.

[stato]

46 minutes ago, Furuzzolo said:

I don't know exactly why but i keep thinking about a couple of fulminator as ally ?

Has someone experimented with Stormcast ally?

Not fulminators, ive heard good things about them as allies though.  Ive ran Azyros and Prosecutors, and more recently a Venator.  Its fun to have something a bit different, the Azyros especially is quite survivable and fast for objectives. They do obviously miss any allegiance benefits but away from the main force there isnt often a lot to benefit from.

[Qaz]

I think the lord ordinator and dispell scroll caddy is going to be staple in my list hah.

[Dez]

I wonder what we'll get as we don't benefit from Summoning/Magic? Do we get more Command Points? I hope we get some tweaked Allegiance rules that allow us to continue shooting as is. Bring back Mortars the way they were and I'll go back to Urbaz again....

[wanderingrogue]

20 hours ago, Midjithero said:

Just an FYI, you are better off dropping 1 frigate for an Ironclad in this (assuming point drops to fit it in).  Otherwise I would drop the Ordinator.  Frigates can already reroll 1s to hit, albeit slower movement, but they can already do it.  

 

Ironclad will give you more range or shots, and the Ordinator lets your ironclad double shoot.  Also with Urbaz, you could potentially fire 3 times in one turn with the ironclad!!!   you will go from a 2 drop to a 3 drop though sadly...but your list is very similar to the list I have been building.

3 frigates is part of the battalion. dont take 3 then i can see any benefit even taking 1. 

[Dez]

Iron Sky Squadron is 2-10 Frigates and 2-10 Arkanaut Company. I think it's a good battalion, that just missed out with Frigates being so expensive points wise. I still think it runs really well with Mhornar (being able to disembark, run with a reroll and shoot). We'll see at launch when the new books are in our hands

Let's also hope some of our Battalions come down in points as they make it hard to build an army. I'm looking at you, Aetherstrike Force! Oh the bad, bad things I could do....

[stratigo]

6 hours ago, Dez said:

I wonder what we'll get as we don't benefit from Summoning/Magic? Do we get more Command Points? I hope we get some tweaked Allegiance rules that allow us to continue shooting as is. Bring back Mortars the way they were and I'll go back to Urbaz again....

Likely nothing but point adjustments, and I wouldn’t count one them all being down. GW has never really gone “well what happens if this army can’t really use any of our new mechanics?” The answer is “they can just buy some stormcast”

[erasercrumbs]

1 hour ago, stratigo said:

The answer is “they can just buy some stormcast”

"My Overlords don't have access to..."

"STORMCAST."

"But I'm not really into Stor…"

"STORMCAST."

 

[Jagd]

10 hours ago, Dez said:

I wonder what we'll get as we don't benefit from Summoning/Magic? Do we get more Command Points? I hope we get some tweaked Allegiance rules that allow us to continue shooting as is. Bring back Mortars the way they were and I'll go back to Urbaz again....

Well those new fancy spells cost points according to the latest GW podcast, so they have to pay up front beforehand for the spell. Combined with the fact that the opposing player can control the movement of predatory spells in their turn, really takes the edge off the power of those spells. What they did also mention however, is that to remove an endless spell from play, you have to choose between casting a spell and removing the endless spell. Does this mean that dispel only units like our navigator can't actually remove an already in-play endless spell since he can't cast any actual spells, only attempt to stop the initial cast? Interesting loophole that needs addressing already.

[Dez]

5 hours ago, Jagd said:

Well those new fancy spells cost points according to the latest GW podcast, so they have to pay up front beforehand for the spell. Combined with the fact that the opposing player can control the movement of predatory spells in their turn, really takes the edge off the power of those spells. What they did also mention however, is that to remove an endless spell from play, you have to choose between casting a spell and removing the endless spell. Does this mean that dispel only units like our navigator can't actually remove an already in-play endless spell since he can't cast any actual spells, only attempt to stop the initial cast? Interesting loophole that needs addressing already.

Yeah we saw that and hope it gets fixed.

[DanielFM]

10 hours ago, stratigo said:

Likely nothing but point adjustments, and I wouldn’t count one them all being down. GW has never really gone “well what happens if this army can’t really use any of our new mechanics?” The answer is “they can just buy some stormcast”

This doesn't have to be that way. Maybe GW haven't realized they are neglecting Duardin. Or think people doesn't care enough.

But if all the Duardin (Kharadron, Fyreslayers, Dispossessed) players in TGA organized to write GW a collective complaint, including reasonable suggestions, they could take it seriously and give you a FAQ/errata with some countermeasures.

They have understimated the effect of not giving three whole factions access to any of the new exciting things on top of shooting nerfs,  washing it out with "take allies" and points drops. If you don't voice your opinion as one, you will be ignored.

[stato]

4 minutes ago, DanielFM said:

This doesn't have to be that way. Maybe GW haven't realized they are neglecting Duardin. Or think people doesn't care enough.

But if all the Duardin (Kharadron, Fyreslayers, Dispossessed) players in TGA organized to write GW a collective complaint, including reasonable suggestions, they could take it seriously and give you a FAQ/errata with some countermeasures.

They have understimated the effect of not giving three whole factions access to any of the new exciting things on top of shooting nerfs,  washing it out with "take allies" and points drops. If you don't voice your opinion as one, you will be ignored.

I'll probably wait until ive played some games in the new version before writing to them to tell the 'its broken'.  ?

[DanielFM]

43 minutes ago, stato said:

I'll probably wait until ive played some games in the new version before writing to them to tell the 'its broken'.  ?

It's not as much "it's broken" as "we got nothing from the new edition but being cheaper"

[Kramer]

11 hours ago, stratigo said:

Likely nothing but point adjustments, and I wouldn’t count one them all being down. GW has never really gone “well what happens if this army can’t really use any of our new mechanics?” The answer is “they can just buy some stormcast”

I think so as well. But where you interpreted it as GW not really caring or pushing stormcast. I'm happy they allow faction to maintain their uniqueness. I think it would make for a less exciting game if all factions have an option on everything from cavalry to magic. Let the dwarfs not mess with unlogical magic, it's for pointy ears and squishy people  

[Kramer]

1 hour ago, DanielFM said:

But if all the Duardin (Kharadron, Fyreslayers, Dispossessed) players in TGA organized to write GW a collective complaint, including reasonable suggestions, they could take it seriously and give you a FAQ/errata with some countermeasures.

 

Good idea, but I second @stato because for all we know we could get all kind of things or (something I think is quite likely) the impact of magic won't be much bigger than is and the look out sir rule is something I want to experience first before judging. 

[DanielFM]

10 minutes ago, Kramer said:

I think so as well. But where you interpreted it as GW not really caring or pushing stormcast. I'm happy they allow faction to maintain their uniqueness. I think it would make for a less exciting game if all factions have an option on everything from cavalry to magic. Let the dwarfs not mess with unlogical magic, it's for pointy ears and squishy people  

But that's weakness, and letting other people solve your problems. Totally un-Duardin. Kharadron (and Fyreslayers too) should get their own (efficient) way to counter magic dominance. A dispel a turn from an otherwise almost useless character (Navigator) is hardly an answer. Other armies getting free troops but you getting less from you firepower is also unfair.

A system of aethermatic superiority, where you gain resources by taking objectives, killing units (pillage their equipment) or anything of that sorts, which give you options to buff, unbind or reinforce, would be very fluffy and give the army something beyond being cheaper. Something similar with ur-gold runes for Fyreslayers.

Edit: to elaborate, look at that imaginary mechanic.

Aethermatic superiority - an army of Kharadron, with cutting edge technology and led by inventive generals, fights like a force from centuries into the future, leaving more primitive adversaries in shock and awe.

You get one command point every time you ...

All Kharadron heroes get access to the following command abilities:

.....

Like that, you give Kharadron an interesting resource mechanism, based on already existing rules, and solve the shortage of CAs without changing warscrolls.

[Kramer]

Just now, DanielFM said:

But that's weakness, and letting other people solve your problems. Totally un-Duardin. Kharadron (and Fyreslayers too) should get their own (efficient) way to counter magic dominance. A dispel a turn from an otherwise almost useless character (Navigator) is hardly an answer. Other armies getting free troops but you getting less from you firepower is also unfair.

 

Haha well put. But do you know what is also unfair!? My Slaanesh list has no shooting! My Ogors have no flying! My runelord gets +2 to unbinding! Oh, that's actually cool! But in general life is unfair and GW will never perfectly balance AoS.  

And I agree it's a shame if you aren't on the recieving end of the updates, it really is. And i'm lucky enough I have several armies so if one doesn't inspire me anymore there is something else that does. But these things seem to move in cycles. So i'm not worried, i'm still having fun. 

4 minutes ago, DanielFM said:

 A system of aethermatic superiority, where you gain resources by taking objectives, killing units (pillage their equipment) or anything of that sorts, which give you options to buff, unbind or reinforce, would be very fluffy and give the army something beyond being cheaper. Something similar with ur-gold runes for Fyreslayers.

Yeah that would be super cool, and easily applicable to Dispossessed with runes. 

[Dragobeth]

After some time I'm thinking about start KO since I really like the ship's models and duardin are one of my favourites races.

My other armies are SC, Seraphon and Greywaters so I'm used to armies with some "anvil&hammer" (Liberatos&dracoth/paldin, skink&monsters, meatshields&cannons) but I'm not sure if KO follows that type of play. I see a lot of people talking about clown cars and all of that, are KO some kind of "in your face" army or is other style? are the ships the center piece of the list or just a way to move units around and shoot some guys?

[Dez]

1 hour ago, Dragobeth said:

After some time I'm thinking about start KO since I really like the ship's models and duardin are one of my favourites races.

My other armies are SC, Seraphon and Greywaters so I'm used to armies with some "anvil&hammer" (Liberatos&dracoth/paldin, skink&monsters, meatshields&cannons) but I'm not sure if KO follows that type of play. I see a lot of people talking about clown cars and all of that, are KO some kind of "in your face" army or is other style? are the ships the center piece of the list or just a way to move units around and shoot some guys?

Hey Dragobeth,

At this time, we are right on the cusp of a new edition so it's a bit hard to gauge how KO will play. The faction focus didn't give us much, besides some much needed points reductions for our ships. Ships are the main reason I think many of us love this faction, currently they are underplayed because they cost too many points (aren't efficient at all). Buckle up, it's tinfoil hat time as we all are trying to predict the new meta with the changes...so I'd wait on building much :)

[Midjithero]

1 hour ago, Dragobeth said:

After some time I'm thinking about start KO since I really like the ship's models and duardin are one of my favourites races.

My other armies are SC, Seraphon and Greywaters so I'm used to armies with some "anvil&hammer" (Liberatos&dracoth/paldin, skink&monsters, meatshields&cannons) but I'm not sure if KO follows that type of play. I see a lot of people talking about clown cars and all of that, are KO some kind of "in your face" army or is other style? are the ships the center piece of the list or just a way to move units around and shoot some guys?

Welcome to the flying Stunty pirates!

KO are very much a shooting glass cannon army with a lot of tactical/movement finesse.  Clown Car is a way of utilizing the ships ability to act as a transport, and allow skywardens/endrinriggers a free ride(those do not count towards transport quantity).

A singular ship is usually the competitive center piece of an army, however with the upcoming changes announced in AoS 2.0, we might see armies field 2-5 ships a game.  This is definitely going to be aesthetically pleasing, as KO are the only army with ships.  

However, after reading the posts on the Warhammer Community page, and listening to the official podcast, I’m not sure if KO will continue to be a competitive army.  We still need to wait until the new ed actually drops to know for sure, but it isn’t looking bright!

Good luck and let the board know if you have any additional questions, loads of information here

[WatcherintheWater]

I'm not a super-gamer by any means, but I wonder if some of these changes will actually be really good for us. Seems like there is going to be an even bigger focus on taking out enemy heroes/summoners/spellcasters. I know  "Look out sir" makes that tougher, but everyone will have to deal with that, and it will be a bigger deal for things that rely on 6's to do something special (Skyfires, Longstrike Crossbows). Arkanauts  have the +1 vs heroes & monsters, we have a lot of mobility and deployment options, and most skyports have buffs that will be super helpful in taking out those high priority targets early. Unless your opponent really hides him away in a corner, no Slanns are going to survive round 1. I don't think there are a ton of other armies that can take things out this early.

[Dez]

The answer to that is magic. I have a Nurgle list I'm brewing that will absolutely be brutal, and can snipe like crazy without relying on shooting.  We do have really good options for Positioning with KO, but that's mostly tied in to Ziflin. I hope with the new edition some things pop up to make us a bit more strategically versatile besides Clown Car

[Humanatee]

It just occurred to me that with the new artillery changes coming out, we may be getting radically changed rules for our ship's main guns. This might explain the drastic points changes as well. 

Maybe it's wishful thinking, but you would think that if the KO get anything out of the new edition, it would be that.

[wanderingrogue]

On 5/30/2018 at 3:41 PM, Dez said:

Iron Sky Squadron is 2-10 Frigates and 2-10 Arkanaut Company. I think it's a good battalion, that just missed out with Frigates being so expensive points wise. I still think it runs really well with Mhornar (being able to disembark, run with a reroll and shoot). We'll see at launch when the new books are in our hands

Let's also hope some of our Battalions come down in points as they make it hard to build an army. I'm looking at you, Aetherstrike Force! Oh the bad, bad things I could do....

so it is!! i always thought it was 3

 

well there u go

 

[Dez]

4 hours ago, wanderingrogue said:

so it is!! i always thought it was 3

 

well there u go

 

No worries! I hope that helps you build a cool list, I know I've been diving into it.