Nico Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 Quote Question...if the keyword 'Flamer' isn't in bold then does that mean any Flamers, Exalted Flamers, and Burning Chariots are included in that? The opposite, so as it's not in bold, then it's a unit name - so needs to be (fairly) precise as to the unit name. Trying to say that "Prosecutors" don't exist because there are two different Warscrolls with the weapon options is not a great strategy, when there are more Warrior Brotherhood armies out there than you might expect. If it said "Flamer" then presumably all the ones you mention if they have the keyword. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soulsmith Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 56 minutes ago, Arkiham said: Yeah, it's got the words so should be fine, check for the silver tower release for aos on Google , should be there The Silver Tower rules cover the GS on foot with familiars, I can't find his disc rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 14 minutes ago, Soulsmith said: The Silver Tower rules cover the GS on foot with familiars, I can't find his disc rules. The Gaunt summoner on disk was the original one with the guys on foot coming after I belive. So the points in the generals handbook are for him under the everchosen section in fairly certain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soulsmith Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 26 minutes ago, Arkiham said: The Gaunt summoner on disk was the original one with the guys on foot coming after I belive. So the points in the generals handbook are for him under the everchosen section in fairly certain. Alright, and teh rules for him on disc being in the everchosen book? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 3 minutes ago, Soulsmith said: Alright, and teh rules for him on disc being in the everchosen book? Yeah, give me like an hour and I'll let send you a pic, out currently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soulsmith Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 5 minutes ago, Arkiham said: Yeah, give me like an hour and I'll let send you a pic, out currently. You = the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daedalus81 Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 4 hours ago, Nico said: I've got one back from that Fatesworn army. Definitely a good troll and the rerolls are nice. However still susceptible to flying units right? Also a "phase-dependent" buff, so anyone who has an attack in a deemed combat phase in the hero phase will smash straight through that Hovering Disk rule (it doesn't work as per the new FAQ). For example Kunning Rukk melee. Good point on hero phase attacks. The shield and mystic should hopefully cover against those types since they would be normally low rend. I'll be happy to annoy people until I can afford the rest of the models I want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 1 hour ago, Soulsmith said: You = the best. They must have changed this for a reason. Typically it's advised you use the most recent one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Lyons Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 5 hours ago, Nico said: Interesting point, although I raised this point above and concluded that everything listed in the GH section for a Grand Alliance implicitly has that keyword (or alternatively, it's so obvious that it goes without saying). Not every Stormcast Battalion has the word Order stamped on them (anywhere) for example, but no one would suggest that you cannot use Order Allegiance Abilities if you take such a Battalion. While useful, a Fatesworn Warband is remarkably hard to squeeze into a 2000 point game anyway - 10 units (whether Hero or "regular" Unit) needed. I built a list back in the spring of 2016 using this Battalion). I regretted doing so as soon as the GH came out as the Rule of One killed it (admittedly it became cheaper than under SCGT). I doubt whether it's the biggest loss if we cannot use it. This issue is resolved clearly and decisively by the actual book, in the battalion section, under allegiances. This last sentence makes clear that you can use the Fatesworn Wardband with a Tzeentch army, for those interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soulsmith Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 41 minutes ago, Arkiham said: They must have changed this for a reason. Typically it's advised you use the most recent one. Agreed, but as long as they produce a model for it I want to know how to use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nico Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 Quote This issue is resolved clearly and decisively by the actual book, in the battalion section, under allegiances. Awesome spot. That looks like a rule of general application too. Need more time to read it cover to cover. Quote Agreed, but as long as they produce a model for it I want to know how to use it. It's fully supported in its own Battletome about one year old! It's still usable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sej Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 I ran a fun list on saturday using mostly slaves to daarknesd Battle line 10 warriors 180 warriors 180 Others 5 Knights 200 10 marauder horsemen 200 3 screamers 140 2 chariot 160 Heroes Lord on demonic mount 160 Ogoroid 160 Herald on disc 120 Was a fun game and worked out well. I split the army into 3 Warriors and ogoroid taking one flank. Lord, and screamers taking the othe flank Center was the chariots, knights and marauder horsemen. Herold floated about sporting who ever needed him. Game worked out well used the lord to buff the chariots and knights. Kept the horsemen back and used them for shooting and area denial (kept the enemy from flanking the knights and overwellming them) The warriors and ogoroid where just hard to shift. Didn't use the new spells as i failed almost every casting but the fate dice where very handy, used them later in the game to bolster wonded units attacks so i could garantee i would get more wounds and one to save my lord from a nasty attack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathadder99 Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 7 minutes ago, Sej said: I ran a fun list on saturday using mostly slaves to daarknesd Battle line 10 warriors 180 warriors 180 Others 5 Knights 200 10 marauder horsemen 200 3 screamers 140 2 chariot 160 Heroes Lord on demonic mount 160 Ogoroid 160 Herald on disc 120 Was a fun game and worked out well. I split the army into 3 Warriors and ogoroid taking one flank. Lord, and screamers taking the othe flank Center was the chariots, knights and marauder horsemen. Herold floated about sporting who ever needed him. Game worked out well used the lord to buff the chariots and knights. Kept the horsemen back and used them for shooting and area denial (kept the enemy from flanking the knights and overwellming them) The warriors and ogoroid where just hard to shift. Didn't use the new spells as i failed almost every casting but the fate dice where very handy, used them later in the game to bolster wonded units attacks so i could garantee i would get more wounds and one to save my lord from a nasty attack That looks like a fun list, who were you facing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sej Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 Was a mix of nurgle/tzeench/slanesh deamons. Was a close game. Only unit that never performed was the screamers 2 rounds of combat with a great unclean one and only caused one wound!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevvermore Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 I'm going to assume the Gaunt Summoner warscrolls in the app are a mistake. My guess is there's supposed to be one with disc, one without, and possibly one with familiars. Right now we have the third one and the second one, although with the photo of the first one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathadder99 Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 1 minute ago, Sej said: Was a mix of nurgle/tzeench/slanesh deamons. Was a close game. Only unit that never performed was the screamers 2 rounds of combat with a great unclean one and only caused one wound!!! Yeah I find screamers are a little pillow-fisted. Though I really like the model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 Fairly certain this is all the proof we need to use a everchosen battalion if you so wish and still benefit for the tzeentch allegiance. Thus, making some heroes, for instance the fatemaster run around with a rend of 2 by giving him a Daemonic power, making him a real combat monster (in the combat phase ) and if you run him as the general you could give him boundless mutation for d3 heal per hero phase Making him a 2+ save 4+ v spells and healing d3 per turn Doing 3 attacks 3+4+-2 rend d3 damage and d3 4+4+-2 rend 1 damage. He would be great against units of medium or light armour with little to no rend. Hold them up and potentially kill alot each turn and not worry about him dying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Votters Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 Has anyone put together a 1000 point list? I was thought of running a wytchfyre coven battlion, but not sure if it would work to well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soulsmith Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 1 hour ago, Nevvermore said: I'm going to assume the Gaunt Summoner warscrolls in the app are a mistake. My guess is there's supposed to be one with disc, one without, and possibly one with familiars. Right now we have the third one and the second one, although with the photo of the first one... I asked a similar question earlier on the AoS FB page. So far I've gotten back from other hobbyists that the one in the General's Handbook is the disc summoner, the one in the Disciples book is the on foot no familiars summoner, and the one with familiars is the silver tower pdf one. However, I am waiting back on confirmation of the points for the ST version. Which GS do people think most viable? The familiars give some great buffs but require the GS being in harms way so to speak, whereas the disc gives him more survivability and maneuverability. @Votters I am theorycrafting a few. I really like the idea behind it, since I think the acolytes look ace, just a little overpriced for what they do. I wonder if the coven will make them more versatile. EDIT: Silver Tower points here: Silver Tower Points.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Requizen Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 Had an event on Saturday where someone used DoT fresh off the download. He ran a block of 20 Warriors with paired weapons and threw Shield of Faith on them every turn. Everything they didn't butcher, they tarpitted forever. Expensive, but they cut down (Horse) Archaon and a Juggerlord of Khorne over like 3 turns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daedalus81 Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 Oh baby The Fatesworn are back in business! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nico Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 Quote Thus, making some heroes, for instance the fatemaster run around with a rend of 2 by giving him a Daemonic power, making him a real combat monster (in the combat phase ) and if you run him as the general you could give him boundless mutation for d3 heal per hero phase If I didn't say already, the rend buff limited to -1 rend (from "-"). It doesn't go from -1 to -2. Editing is weird lately on some posts. The one on foot is the one you want with the familiars - he has the right spell. The Disk one is useless (except that he is the only one that activates the Everchosen Battalion - the Overlords of Chaos (otherwise known as the Overcosted of Chaos). This is because only his name matches the non-bold wording in the Battalion. I think it's already clear that there are some major trade offs due to the deceptively high costs of the units. 30 Tzaangor for 540 points is quite a whopping investment for a single large block that isn't inherently fast (don't forget that even with +2 bravery in the Battleshock phase (after losing a model, they have 20 or more models), they are still Bravery 5 in other respects - this makes them tasty snacks for Nagash, Terrorgheists and above all Mournguls - welcome to hitting on 6+. The base stat of hitting on 4+ is significant as well, many abilities give out -1 to hit debuffs (not least other Chaos armies with Cunning Deceiver and the Sylvaneth). I'm replacing my hammers with swords asap on Liberators! I'm aware of the problem that this causes with the Lord Celestant on Foot being general, but he isn't going to survive very long and be able to use his command ability anyway. On the other hand run and charge means that non-Tzeentch Chaos armies that include Sayl (and no that's not a tautology) can really benefit from lobbing them forward with a stack of buffs), 18+run+charge. Quote Typically it's advised you use the most recent one. This is more in the context of the old PDFs vs (say) the new Battletome, rather than one Battletome and another Battletome for a different army about a year apart. They are very unlikely to have intended to invalidate the Overlords of Chaos Battalion by deleting the necessary component of that Battalion while still selling the Everchosen book. Just use the GH points cost for the one on the Disk (under Everchosen); the PDF regarding the Silver Tower models for the GS with Familiars; and the new cost and profile for the model by itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nico Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 Buy the Everchosen Battletome - the rules are in there. That Battletome isn't dead until they say it is. They still sell the model for that matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nico Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 Quote Fairly certain this is all the proof we need to use a everchosen battalion if you so wish and still benefit for the tzeentch allegiance. Thus, making some heroes, for instance the fatemaster run around with a rend of 2 by giving him a Daemonic power, making him a real combat monster (in the combat phase ) and if you run him as the general you could give him boundless mutation for d3 heal per hero phase Did you really think that no-one would try to use this battalion (other than a muppet like me) for a whole year for competitive purposes if it allowed you to go up to -2 rend? It's appropriately capped at -1 rend. The sweet combo is with Marauder Horsemen with Javelins, who suddenly become better than Judicators as the shooting attacks, riders and horses suddenly gain -1 rend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakithe Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 6 hours ago, Nico said: The opposite, so as it's not in bold, then it's a unit name - so needs to be (fairly) precise as to the unit name. Trying to say that "Prosecutors" don't exist because there are two different Warscrolls with the weapon options is not a great strategy, when there are more Warrior Brotherhood armies out there than you might expect. If it said "Flamer" then presumably all the ones you mention if they have the keyword. Ok I see that now. I went back to look at the battalion wording and the units themselves. The first part says 'select any Flamer'. Turns out that is only the Exalted Flamers and Burning Chariots. They have keyword 'Flamer'. Turns out normal Flamers have keyword 'Flamers' with the S. Either a typo somewhere or meant to be that way. The second part of the battalion says 'units of Flamers and Exalted Flamers'. That one is pretty straight forward. So I'm going to take that as the LoC can cast through the Burning Chariots and Exalted Flamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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