Disadvantaged models

[pforson]

I understand that AoS is WYSIWYG, which is fine by me. However, what about models which are missing a weapon?

I don't mean models that are armed with one particular option instead of another, rather models that are simply worse than other equivalent models.

Example:

Rat Ogors. Warscroll has 2 weapons. 1 shooting, 1 melee. The melee is claws and fangs, so all Rat Ogor models have the melee option. However, some of my Rat Ogor models have a gun and some do not. Those that do not are simply worse, but cost the same points.

In this instance, is it allowed (in tournaments) to shoot with the Rat Ogors who do not have guns? - Or is it a case of tough luck...

Ta,

Pete

p.s I'm asking because I much prefer the models without guns, but don't want to model for a disadvantage

[Thanatos Ares]

So long as at least one model in the unit (of rat ogors) had the correct load out I would be happy. If your worried then explain to your opponent before playing. And for tourneys then ask the organisers BEFOREhand

Waaagh! Skullcrack iz comin fer ya

[Carnelian]

Depends on the situation. In a very competitive tournament probably best to keep it strictly wysiwyg. The more relaxed the game the more you can relax that and use proxies or wysiwyg 

[Nico]

Quote

I understand that AoS is WYSIWYG

I'm not even sure it is - at least not in a strict sense. I personally dislike strict WYSIWYG (since then you cannot try out different weapon options for a unit in practice games) but also hate tuna cans.

[Countmoore]

For me the example you give wouldn't be an issue as they have the weapon on the profile and no choice about taking or not. 

When there is a choice I would like to see the correct options in play so there are no surprises. Stormfiends are a good example here as the various options are massively different in terms of threat and abilities. 

I just don't want to be surprised when I throw my unit of skeletons in expecting an armour buff for none rend weapons and the hand weapon and shield enemy turn out to be armed rend -1 great weapons. 

 

[Ollie Grimwood]

I like to Wysiwyg where possible but I don't think AoS is necessarily strict wysiwyg after all doesn't the FAQ say that musicians, standards and the like are assumed to be equipped the same way as the rest of the unit. 

Of course modelling shouldn't be used to trick opponents as to the real make up of a unit, defo something that should be covered in the pregame chat.  I certainly wouldn't have an issue with the OP if I was told at the start of the game 

[Bjarni St.]

I'm for WYSIWYG as long as it's reasonable but some models just do not cooperate. E.g. Stormfiends, while nice models, have abominable weapon options as far as what's on the sprues goes. They're three models per box and each is customized to use only one of two (out of six!) weapon options and the box only provides enough of each weapon to (fully) equip one model. Even if we ignore the inevitable conclusion that one or two of the weapon options are probably preferable to the others, what are the odds you'd actually want to equip each model with a different one?

So if you want Lion Chariots to actually have Lions (or acceptable stand-in) pulling them instead of horses or Knights with Hammers to not be holding Lances I'm with you but if someone goes in for a close up look at my Stormfiends and makes a fuss about one of the units' models having a mix of weapon options instead of exclusively what they're fielding at the time we're gonna have a problem.

[Arkiham]

my group uses the recommended ( in the generals handbook ) idea of measuring from the base. 

when we deploy a unit we say what the unit is equipped with and explain what it is ( if required & within reason ) an who is the unit champion etc when deployed. 

this lets us build what is coolest looking. as lets face it, most of our armies spend more time on the shelf than on the table top. 

[Sleboda]

1 hour ago, Arkiham said:

my group uses the recommended ( in the generals handbook ) idea of measuring from the base. 

Bit of a stretch to say the GH recommended that rule, isn't it?  I mean, even in the casual reference to it, they say that it adversely affects some other rules.

[Arkiham]

39 minutes ago, Sleboda said:

Bit of a stretch to say the GH recommended that rule, isn't it?  I mean, even in the casual reference to it, they say that it adversely affects some other rules.

how many other house rules to they specifically mention? afaik that's the only one. even if casual it's the only one.

without highjacking the thread what disadvantages are there. 

[Ollie Grimwood]

5 hours ago, Arkiham said:

how many other house rules to they specifically mention? afaik that's the only one. even if casual it's the only one.

without highjacking the thread what disadvantages are there. 

There's a whole separate thread talking  about this. One might suggest that the recommended approach is the one thats actual in the rules. 

Neither base to base measuring or wysiwyg are mentioned in the rules. The whole ethos of AoS is to adapt and choose what suits a group of players best or indeed an individual circumstance. If Stromfiends don't even come with a full set of options in the box, as mentioned above, then insisting a player has to wysiwyg them when the actual GW models don't allow this is a bit harsh. Conversely the new sets (to the best of my knowledge) come with all the options included so the aren't necessarily in the same boat. 

I've seen a number of tournament packs from WHW that deal with conversions/proxies on a case by case as to wether or not they are suitable for an event. Seems the most sensible approach and could easily be applied to non wysiwyg models and let's face it is probably what most people do anyway. 

[Oppenheimer]

Ogre man-eaters have the same issue. The pirate and ninja have ranged weapons on their models but it's silly to think you would buy all pirates and ninjas when the others look so cool (yay lady ogre!). I usually ask my opponent when I start if it's okay with them if I consider all man-eaters to have ranged weapons.