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kleinemade

Umbral Spellportal & predatory endless spells

Question

Hi all,

My question is related to the use of the Umbral Spellportal in combination with predatory endless spells.

 Let’s say the spell portal is on the board and I cast the Aethervoid Pendulum and move it within 6” of the portal. So according to the text I have to set up it again within 6” of the other Portal.

Get units which can be effected by the Pendulum now damage ?

The test of the Spellportal says: … set it up again… “ so the question is, is the setup a move ?

The text from Pendulum says “ After this Modell have moved….” So it possible to argue that the move had ended on the other side ?!

 

Second question – If I already send a cast through the portal and afterwards cast a predatory endless spells and move it within 6” of the portal is the rule still in place ?

Thanks

 

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On 7/15/2019 at 4:04 PM, kleinemade said:

My question is related to the use of the Umbral Spellportal in combination with predatory endless spells.

 Let’s say the spell portal is on the board and I cast the Aethervoid Pendulum and move it within 6” of the portal. So according to the text I have to set up it again within 6” of the other Portal.

Get units which can be effected by the Pendulum now damage ?

The test of the Spellportal says: … set it up again… “ so the question is, is the setup a move ?

The text from Pendulum says “ After this Modell have moved….” So it possible to argue that the move had ended on the other side ?!

I think the problem here is the point "after ending his move" which is before the first portal. The ability of the Spell Portal doesn't count as move because it is a set-up to the model, like the corerule FAQ said here:

Quote

Q: Some abilities allow you to remove a unit from the battlefield
and set it up again, and say that this ‘counts as their move for
the movement phase’ (or words to that effect). Do these units
count as having made a move for the purposes of any other
rules or abilities?
A: No, it simply restricts them from making a move
later on.

 

On 7/15/2019 at 4:04 PM, kleinemade said:

Second question – If I already send a cast through the portal and afterwards cast a predatory endless spells and move it within 6” of the portal is the rule still in place ?

The Arcane Passage ability is split into two paragraphs. One for Spells and one for Endless Spells. After both paragraphs ent with the sentence "..., you cannot unse the Arcane Passage ability again for that Umbral Spellportal in that phase" you can't it for an endless Spell after you already have casted a spell through it.

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On 7/15/2019 at 5:13 PM, King Taloren said:

Pendulum damages any unit it passes over plus any units within 1”  of it after it finished moving so it will hit everything it passes over to the portal and then once it is set up anything within 1” of that.

You cannot move the spell after it goes through the portal and set up on the other side. You  cannot send more than one endless spell through the portal a turn.  Any other spells that end up within 6” will just sit there.

They have this in the designer commentary for Malign Sorcery in WarhammerCommunity

 

Edit: Really now if you guys are going to downvote an answer then at least come  and say what is wrong with what I said.

The spellportal reads that if the predatory spell ends it's move within 6" then remove it from the battlefield and set it up again.

 

I would argue that means Pendulum for instance will not pass over any units when it travels through the portal as it is removed and set up again. 

 

I would also argue that the pendulum ends its move on the initial point of the portal so it will not damage units within 1" on the other side. However, in regards to this point I'm a bit more uncertain

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What I found myself wondering was does the Pendulum have to be set up again facing the same direction?

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7 hours ago, King Taloren said:

That is what I said....

It won’t hit any units while traveling through the portal. But on the way TO the portal. 
 

It can pass over units on its way to end its move to trigger the spell portal. Before it reaches the 6” from the spell portal the pendulum still has 8” of movement and can still hit any potential units that are in the way to that point.

 

Right, which is great. 

 

You also said "it will hit everything it passes over to the portal and then once it is set up anything within 1” of that".

Which sounds like you would say it damages everything within 1" on the other side of the portal when it it set up again. I'm just not so sure of that, and would like to hear what others think and why you think it works like that.

The pendulum spell specifically states that it damages "...each other unit that is within 1" of it at the end of 
its move.".

And the portal reads "If a predatory endless spell finishes a move within 6" of an umbral spellportal model, remove it from the battlefield and set it up again ...".

So it seems for the pendulum to travel across the spell portal the move needs to end on the initial side of the portal, so it will damage everything within 1" on the initial side.

 

Maybe it's intended to work otherwise but from the wording isn't that what it says?

 

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7 hours ago, Aelfric said:

What I found myself wondering was does the Pendulum have to be set up again facing the same direction?

I would say you can change its direction as it is a new "set up".

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Add on to this question. The Umbral spell portal is split into two passages, one for casting through it, and one for moving a predatory spell through it. My question is, can you CAST a endless spell through the umbral portal? Can I cast pendulum and use the portal for range to place the pendulum, then have it begin its move? I know endless spells and spells technically arn't the same so I didnt know how that would work. 

 

Thanks,

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4 hours ago, Hebroseph said:

My question is, can you CAST a endless spell through the umbral portal?

No, Spellportal allows to measure range and visibility through it, but the distance from the caster within which you must set up the spell is neither of those things.

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Pendulum damages any unit it passes over plus any units within 1”  of it after it finished moving so it will hit everything it passes over to the portal and then once it is set up anything within 1” of that.

You cannot move the spell after it goes through the portal and set up on the other side. You  cannot send more than one endless spell through the portal a turn.  Any other spells that end up within 6” will just sit there.

They have this in the designer commentary for Malign Sorcery in WarhammerCommunity

 

Edit: Really now if you guys are going to downvote an answer then at least come  and say what is wrong with what I said.

Edited by King Taloren

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21 minutes ago, Rune said:

The spellportal reads that if the predatory spell ends it's move within 6" then remove it from the battlefield and set it up again.

 

I would argue that means Pendulum for instance will not pass over any units when it travels through the portal as it is removed and set up again. 

 

I would also argue that the pendulum ends its move on the initial point of the portal so it will not damage units within 1" on the other side. However, in regards to this point I'm a bit more uncertain

That is what I said....

It won’t hit any units while traveling through the portal. But on the way TO the portal. 
 

It can pass over units on its way to end its move to trigger the spell portal. Before it reaches the 6” from the spell portal the pendulum still has 8” of movement and can still hit any potential units that are in the way to that point.

 

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