Let's Chat Sylvaneth

[Lordneylon]

Dear Friends,

Do the special abilities of OAKEN and HEARTWOOD wargroves, that bring back (recycle) entire units that have been previously detroyed, count as SUMMONING or not in MATCHED PLAY?

Sorry in advance if this question has already been clarified in other posts!

Best regards.

 

[Nico]

Yes - they would use reinforcement points, hence they are rarely discussed as part of strategies.

[Lordneylon]

Thanks a lot for your clear and quick replay!

[Orruk'sPizza]

Hi guys,i need an help. In the biggest italian forum tgere is a discussioni about the woods.

1 or 1-3 ?

My guys say only One, but i think its wrong.

I have read the topic here, but ..... you have some official confirm???

[Nixon]

One Wyldwood consists of 1 to 3 citadel forests. So 1 Wyldwood = 3 bases. 

[ravman]

No one had an issue with me deploying 3 citadel woods at Blood and Glory. Plus I did it on the live stream too! (albeit I didn't realise they had to be within 1 inch of each other!)

[Nico]

Quote

No one had an issue with me deploying 3 citadel woods at Blood and Glory. Plus I did it on the live stream too! (albeit I didn't realise they had to be within 1 inch of each other!)

Les Martin is probably right as a matter of literal English that each of the 3 Citadel Woods need to be within one inch of the other two (although the fact that I've rewritten it in about 5 more words to make it unambiguous for if they wanted it to mean what Les thinks it means does point the other way. It's a good spot . 

However there is compelling purposive evidence that a Wyldwood can be in a chain of 3 - namely the photograph of a Wyldwood on the Warscroll which is in a line - as I pointed out to him when he mentioned it to me (before the Event - I didn't get a chance at a rematch after The Warlords - he's great fun to play against and talk to and look at his army). Obviously the TO can rule it one way or another. 

The fact that no-one has pointed this out until now (despite the many people who want to nerf Sylvaneth) is telling that it's not intended to be limiting all 3-Wyldwoods to triangle shaped blobs.

 

Hard counter to Kunning Rukk

Moreover massive Kudos to Les for using the No Retreat Household (35/36 ignoring rend of -1) combo against the Bonesplitterz Kunning Rukk Arrer Boyz spam. That must have been a joy to play. Really looking forward to hearing his rendition of that game on Facehammer.

Maybe we should rechristen it the Counting Rukk or the Boring Rukk.

More thoughts on balance and Blood and Glory in the pipeline.

[Bowlzee]

Rob Symes on the feed made a point to spell out the a Sylvaneth Wyldwood consists of 1-3 citadel bases.... He said it a few times in the same paragraph. So I'm happy to now point others from this forum to it when they try and tell me it's 1 base only  

[Tommm]

15 hours ago, ravman said:

No one had an issue with me deploying 3 citadel woods at Blood and Glory. Plus I did it on the live stream too! (albeit I didn't realise they had to be within 1 inch of each other!)

That poor Durthu - you had a rough game! Any chance you'd take the time to write up your other games?

First game, day 2 for people that didn't watch it: https://www.twitch.tv/warhammer/v/103679419?t=11737s

[scrubyandwells]

15 hours ago, ravman said:

No one had an issue with me deploying 3 citadel woods at Blood and Glory. Plus I did it on the live stream too! (albeit I didn't realise they had to be within 1 inch of each other!)

Congrats on such a great showing with your Sylvaneth! It was awesome seeing the Alarielle + Durthu combo on the live stream. 

It would be cool to learn more about your games: who you played / what lists, the scenarios, and how you got on. 

On paper, your list seemed to have some real limitations, especially the relatively low model count; but it looks like a major testament to how well you played it. 

[ravman]

Thanks, you are right I found the scenarios harder because of the low model count, but if you look at my total VPs from the tournament I pretty much took most things off and then mopped up in turns 4 and 5. I'll try and remember what I did. Was all a bit of a blur to be honest! I'll write up a brief synopsis of each game when I get a chance

[Knight of Ruin]

Hey,

As a lot of other people, i'm jumping on the rumour for a nice new BIG start collecting box for Sylvaneth. I have purchased the smaller one so far, and hoping for the big one with christmas. That should give me quite a decent base to start off with.

With that in mind, i'm thinking to build towards 1000 points first, and then on to 2k. I'm just wondering, are the Battalions and Wargroves needed to make Sylvaneth useful? 

I mean i quite like the Free Spirits battalion. Love the Kurnoth hunters. But then to put them in a Winterleaf Wargrove (so they can start on a board edge, Wyldwood OR an archway), or in a Harvestboon Battalion (so they get +1 to charge and run moves), it gets a little clunky, i feel. I'm not sure, that as a casual gamer, i want 4 units of dryads, or 2 branchwraiths..

So, do you always want to use a Wargrove and or Battalion?

[Nico]

Quote

Rob Symes on the feed made a point to spell out the a Sylvaneth Wyldwood consists of 1-3 citadel bases.... He said it a few times in the same paragraph. So I'm happy to now point others from this forum to it when they try and tell me it's 1 base only  

Nice! They seemed to quiet down a lot when some genius pointed out their approach made all artillery crew illegal.

What is more worrying is that it seem that the comp to the Free Spirits is likely to be how GW rules it.... Hopefully, this would be limited to that battalion only (it does have the wording about moving closer to the target unit or Wyldwood to distinguish it from other rules).

The Dreadwood Wargrove on the other hand is clearly the intended (and very expensive) alpha strike option. It shouldn't also be hard nerfed (Sneak Attack) just because Free Spirits is perceived as broken or required too many jumps through the rules.

[Forestreveries]

Hey,
As a lot of other people, i'm jumping on the rumour for a nice new BIG start collecting box for Sylvaneth. I have purchased the smaller one so far, and hoping for the big one with christmas. That should give me quite a decent base to start off with.
With that in mind, i'm thinking to build towards 1000 points first, and then on to 2k. I'm just wondering, are the Battalions and Wargroves needed to make Sylvaneth useful? 
I mean i quite like the Free Spirits battalion. Love the Kurnoth hunters. But then to put them in a Winterleaf Wargrove (so they can start on a board edge, Wyldwood OR an archway), or in a Harvestboon Battalion (so they get +1 to charge and run moves), it gets a little clunky, i feel. I'm not sure, that as a casual gamer, i want 4 units of dryads, or 2 branchwraiths..
So, do you always want to use a Wargrove and or Battalion?

I like Winterleaf, Gnarlroot and Free Spirits Battalion.

All three of these or even 2 of them combined make for a competitive list.

I've played all of the other Wargrove bar Dreadwood, and don't rate any of them anywhere near winterleaf or Gnarlroot when it comes to matched play.

The access to and order wizard opens up some great options too.

The biggest thing though is that Wargrove allow you to drop your entire army in one drop and therefore almost always have the choice to go first or second on turn one, which is invaluable.


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[Knight of Ruin]

Do you think that Gnarlroot is still worth it if you do not take the Order Wizard? 

I do struggle getting varied lists when using Free Spirits, due to the costs involved with Durthu and 3x Kurnoth hunters. I personally like Winterleaf and Free spirits because it just enhances the movement shenanigans, which can be counter played with tactics. But Gnarlroot in a friendly game is a bit unfair if the opponnent doesnt bring heavy anti magic i feel. Is that a justified feeling?

[Louzi]

8 hours ago, ravman said:

Thanks, you are right I found the scenarios harder because of the low model count, but if you look at my total VPs from the tournament I pretty much took most things off and then mopped up in turns 4 and 5. I'll try and remember what I did. Was all a bit of a blur to be honest! I'll write up a brief synopsis of each game when I get a chance

Dont you think it would be better to play 2x20 Dryads rather than a Drycha? I like the model, but she always disappoints me...

[Forestreveries]

Do you think that Gnarlroot is still worth it if you do not take the Order Wizard? 

I do struggle getting varied lists when using Free Spirits, due to the costs involved with Durthu and 3x Kurnoth hunters. I personally like Winterleaf and Free spirits because it just enhances the movement shenanigans, which can be counter played with tactics. But Gnarlroot in a friendly game is a bit unfair if the opponnent doesnt bring heavy anti magic i feel. Is that a justified feeling?

Gnarlroot is definitely worth it without the order wizard.

Only way you can bring back models to units. It makes Kurnoth Hunters much more resilient as they almost never get deleted in one turn.

Also double spells is just tasty.

Whether you take 2 wizards and get more flexibility for less investment or take loads and get off as many spells as you can rousing wyldwoods all over the place... it's still worth it.

The best thing about Gnarlroot is it contains stuff you already want to take, and isn't a huge points sink


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[Nico]

Quote

Do you think that Gnarlroot is still worth it if you do not take the Order Wizard? 

I do struggle getting varied lists when using Free Spirits, due to the costs involved with Durthu and 3x Kurnoth hunters. I personally like Winterleaf and Free spirits because it just enhances the movement shenanigans, which can be counter played with tactics. But Gnarlroot in a friendly game is a bit unfair if the opponnent doesnt bring heavy anti magic i feel. Is that a justified feeling?

I feel you're wasting one of its best points if you don't take the Order Wizard. On the other hand it's so undercosted that it's still "worth it".

Don't apologise for their strengths. There are still plenty of ways to beat up Sylvaneth. Mourngul with mystic shield standing within 6 inches of two units of 20 Dryads (Bravery 6 for -2 to hit) springs to mind. Destruction can lob two Snowballs at a Durthu and he pops (and pops on average with 4 Blood Vultures thrown in), or just take out 12 Dryads and watch another 8 or so flee from a unit of 30! 

Nagash is absolutely horrible against Sylvaneth. Flooding the board with battleshock immune chaff also works if you hamper their Wyldwood deployment.

 

 

[ravman]

14 minutes ago, Louzi said:

Dont you think it would be better to play 2x20 Dryads rather than a Drycha? I like the model, but she always disappoints me...

Dryads just don't do anything for me! Drycha scares people. Her shooting attack decimates hordes, shes an extra caster and shes pretty mean in combat.

Plus 20 dryads are 240 (480 for 2x20) Drycha is only 280

[Aezeal]

I agree I think Drycha is a good deal for her points.. don't get me wrong.. dryads certainly have their uses and aren't bad either... but killing power is nice too.

[Forestreveries]

Dryads just don't do anything for me! Drycha scares people. Her shooting attack decimates hordes, shes an extra caster and shes pretty mean in combat.
Plus 20 dryads are 240 (480 for 2x20) Drycha is only 280

Dryads are sooooooo good.

The fact that they have average or below averag save and to hit values but then add to them without the need for support makes them awesome.

Just being able to get a 3+ save with no help is great all by itself.


2 attacks, bonus to their to hit roll and bonus to their save mean that when you start putting additional effects on them, they grow disproportionally better when compared to other units.

Shield of Thorns-ed Dryads in cover for example, are better than a 4+ save unit in cover, because they add 1 to their save rolls. This means they have the same resilience but the chance of doing mortal wounds back is increased.

Add mystic shield as well and things get silly.

Winterleaf is another great boon to Dryads.
They get additional attacks on to hit rolls of 6. But in your own turn, you enrapture an enemy and get extra attacks on 5's instead. With no support units abilities or spells.

Then you add say, damned terrain, and you're up to 4's. a Hurricanum maybe and you're up to 3's.

Essentially having poorer stats to start with but boosting themselves is such a great attribute for a battleline unit.

My current list combines all of the above, with Gnarlroot and Winterleaf making the Dryads both more resilient and more aggressive, also giving access to. It's the sisters and the hurricanum, which then do that again.

In my games so far a single unit of 20 Dryads has been able to take on half the opposing army on its own. So good.

Yeah


I [emoji171]Dryads



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[Forestreveries]

Forgot to mention they have innate -1 to be hit when near woods (read: always)

This nullifies things such as blight kings exploding attacks and executioners / retributors mortal wounds on 6's.

So good


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[Paul G]

Could someone explain the nerfs on Free Spirits and Dreadwood for me? Or point me to somewhere that does? Thanks!


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[Forestreveries]

Could someone explain the nerfs on Free Spirits and Dreadwood for me? Or point me to somewhere that does? Thanks!


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Basically, when it comes to Free Spirits you may only move normally in the Hero Phase, even though it is "as if it was the Movement Phase".

This means you can't use abilities like Navigate Realmroots or Forest Spirits for the extra movement.

This as far as I know is only a house rule for the Blood and Glory event at present.

I only ever played it that way anyway to be fair.

When it comes to Dreadwood, the same applies to the "Sneak Attack" Stratagem only.


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[Paul G]

Thanks man, hopefully it gets ruled the other way!


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