CarkFish Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Hi chaps, I have been looking to build a competitive khorne list for playing in my local group, however, the apps available have managed to really confuse me... I hope someone can clear this up: Battletome indicates that the army has access to all the faction abilities by virtue of the KHORNE keyword and no others restrict it Azyr lets me choose just khorne as my allegiance and mix demons and mortals freely... allthough certain units (garreks reavers) are then not avaliable Battlescribe and the warhammer community warscroll builder both force me to choose either demons or mortals and don't let me mix them Hopefully you can see why im confused... And hopefully its because im being daft... but I would really appreciate someone explaining this to me Thanks Cark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Praecautus Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Welcome First the apps are a tool and should not be used to determine rules etc. Briefly you can mix and match units to build your army. The allegiance is selected by you but all the units must share a key word. So you are free to build a khorne army from khorne bloodbound, khorne daemons and other factions e.g. slaves to darkness, if you assign them the khorne key word. On top of that khorne can take allies from certain other armies that don't have a khorne key word but allow you to still be a khorne army - see the GHB 2017 for the list. In a 2000 point army you can take 400 points of non khorne allies. Garrreks reavers can be found on the gw website, they cost 60 points. However note they don't count as a blood reaver unit when determining battalion composition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 38 minutes ago, Praecautus said: Garrreks reavers can be found on the gw website, they cost 60 points. However note they don't count as a blood reaver unit when determining battalion composition. Well they could have if the Battalion looked for the Keyword Bloodreavers, but no Battalion currently does that. That aside, totally correct! @CarkFish hey! I totally get the confusion, a ton of stuff is going on with Age of Sigmar and as discussed elsewhere I believe the time would be ripe soon for another edition due to the many (core) rule changes that have been applied so far with both Generals Handbooks, FAQ/Errata and even more and more added campaign material. That aside, the awnsers to your questions/remarks: 1. That is correct, at the same time the Battletome: Blades of Khorne predates GH2017 and because of that the suggestion of Ally rules given there now works differently (so does Blood Tithe but that is all in the Age of Sigmar Chaos FAQ/Errata). In addition to that we have recieved confirmation that Faction Blades of Khorne and Faction Khorne are one and the same based on the GH2017 info we recieved. Check out this page for all the official rulings that are commonly applied: https://www.warhammer-community.com/faqs/ 2. Azyr is an app full of minor flaws, report them to them if you can and ideally see it updated. *Garreks Reavers can be used in Matched play in conjunction with GH2017. Their Pitched Battle Profile is on their Warscroll, which is also on Games Workshop their website. 3. Battlescribe is an app full of minor flaws, report them to them if you can and ideally see it updated. *As above, Khorne can incorporate every Warscroll with the Khorne Keyword and not thake up 'Ally points'. This indeed means that models like Archaon or Khorne Chaos Knights can be included without thaking up 'Ally points'. Creating a mixed Daemon and Bloodbound Khorne list isn't only fun it's arguably the best thing the army can do right now. Lastly being daft isn't really the case here, Age of Sigmar just requires you to dive really deep in the rules content. Because in order to play Khorne "now" you need to have/know: - Battletome: Blades of Khorne - Generals Handbook 2017 - Rules FAQ/Errata (latest) - Generals Handbook FAQ/Errata (latest) - Chaos FAQ/Errata (latest) Then if you want to use Forgeworld models you need to know theirs too. Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucio Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 As an aside, the Warscroll List Builder on the GW site does let you mix and match units. Pick your allegiance, then pick from the first list of models, and then switch to pick from the second list of models. AFAIK it doesn't actually enforce alleigance in it's validation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenshin620 Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 8 hours ago, Killax said: 1. That is correct, at the same time the Battletome: Blades of Khorne predates GH2017 and because of that the suggestion of Ally rules given there now works differently (so does Blood Tithe but that is all in the Age of Sigmar Chaos FAQ/Errata). In addition to that we have recieved confirmation that Faction Blades of Khorne and Faction Khorne are one and the same based on the GH2017 info we recieved. Check out this page for all the official rulings that are commonly applied: https://www.warhammer-community.com/faqs/ Yea as a fellow noob to AoS myself, I think one of the biggest obstacles to entering AOS is the factions. Back in the day of old, you have one book, one faction (with exception of the old dogs of war). But with the massive split up to creating all these mini factions, suddenly one old book became 3-5 factions with Grand Alliances or more focused Battletomes and a whole myriad of faction keywords. Honestly while many people may complain both warhammers becoming too streamlined, the faction thing could be a tad more clearer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Túrbóbelja Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 Piggybacking on this topic.. what is the difference between the Blades of Khorne book and the Khorne Bloodbound book? Just picked up Khul and a Blood Secreator so I can swing my StD units on the Khorne side for fun but really unsure how to go forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Praecautus Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 Blades of khorne is the latest battletome for all khorne, mortals and daemons including bloodbound. It replaces the bloodbound battletome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Túrbóbelja said: Piggybacking on this topic.. what is the difference between the Blades of Khorne book and the Khorne Bloodbound book? Just picked up Khul and a Blood Secreator so I can swing my StD units on the Khorne side for fun but really unsure how to go forward. As above the older Battletome is the older one. It was just created for Bloodbound and doesn't have any info or link to Khorne Daemons. Content wise it was Bloodbound's narrative design that actually put me of from AoS for a while. I simply didn't like it and thought it was too repetitively written. The times mentioned that the Khorne axe is ideally designed for lopping off heads is just very uncreative... If you start a Blades of Khorne army all you really want to consider is the following : 1. The great beginnings, indeed pick up Mighty Lord of Khorne + Bloodsecrator or the Khorne half of the Age of Sigmar starter box. Sadly this is the only way to obtain Bloodstokers other than Ebay and you certainly want a Bloodstoker! 2. Consider which route you want to go, Bloodbound heavy or Daemon heavy and I recommend picking up the Start Collecting box for those. You can pick up both later. 3. Buy the Blades of Khorne Battletome. Ideally check if someone has GH2017 for you or if you can find a digital copy for the updated points (if you aim to play Matched play). 4. Check out the Errata and FAQ after you've finished reading the Blades of Khorne Battletome. Link: 5. Continue however you like! Blades of Khorne has still a few powerfull tricks left and I'd say the following models are just 'must haves'. - Bloodsecrator (1-2) - Bloodstoker (1-2) - Slaughterpriest (1-3) - Wrath of Khorne Bloodthirster (1) - Mighty Lord of Khorne (1) *No worries, he and Khorgos Khul are the same model - Khorne Lord on Juggernaut (1) The latter 3 are basically ideal generals and in terms of units you can't really go wrong with anything except for Bloodcrushers in my opinion. Other than that units of 30 Bloodletters are feared with a reason and Blood Warriors are awesome to have. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenshin620 Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Killax said: Content wise it was Bloodbound's narrative design that actually put me of from AoS for a while. I simply didn't like it and thought it was too repetitively written. The times mentioned that the Khorne axe is ideally designed for lopping off heads is just very uncreative... I'm pretty sure that any khorne fluff could be replaced with BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD, SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE and no one would really notice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 46 minutes ago, kenshin620 said: I'm pretty sure that any khorne fluff could be replaced with BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD, SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE and no one would really notice! Well there simply said where some more oddities than that but they where somewhat fixed in the Battletome Blades of Khorne. To give an example of an unresolved oddity is that Mighty Lord of Khorne, Khorne Lord on Juggernaut and Skullcrushers all do not have a Daemon Keyword whilst they are on a Daemonic mount. Whatever the reason might be this Keyword change occured with the Bloodbound book thing and stayed that way... All the while litterly every other Chaos model on Daemonic mount (and then some) did gain the Daemon Keyword. Silly part is that Maggotkin of Nurgle's Poxbringer Wizard Keyword fix got solved litterly a week after the book was released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Túrbóbelja Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 4 hours ago, Killax said: As above the older Battletome is the older one. It was just created for Bloodbound and doesn't have any info or link to Khorne Daemons. Content wise it was Bloodbound's narrative design that actually put me of from AoS for a while. I simply didn't like it and thought it was too repetitively written. The times mentioned that the Khorne axe is ideally designed for lopping off heads is just very uncreative... If you start a Blades of Khorne army all you really want to consider is the following : 1. The great beginnings, indeed pick up Mighty Lord of Khorne + Bloodsecrator or the Khorne half of the Age of Sigmar starter box. Sadly this is the only way to obtain Bloodstokers other than Ebay and you certainly want a Bloodstoker! 2. Consider which route you want to go, Bloodbound heavy or Daemon heavy and I recommend picking up the Start Collecting box for those. You can pick up both later. 3. Buy the Blades of Khorne Battletome. Ideally check if someone has GH2017 for you or if you can find a digital copy for the updated points (if you aim to play Matched play). 4. Check out the Errata and FAQ after you've finished reading the Blades of Khorne Battletome. Link: 5. Continue however you like! Blades of Khorne has still a few powerfull tricks left and I'd say the following models are just 'must haves'. - Bloodsecrator (1-2) - Bloodstoker (1-2) - Slaughterpriest (1-3) - Wrath of Khorne Bloodthirster (1) - Mighty Lord of Khorne (1) *No worries, he and Khorgos Khul are the same model - Khorne Lord on Juggernaut (1) The latter 3 are basically ideal generals and in terms of units you can't really go wrong with anything except for Bloodcrushers in my opinion. Other than that units of 30 Bloodletters are feared with a reason and Blood Warriors are awesome to have. Cheers, Wow! Thanks for such a crazy detailed and well written answer! I will check this further and maybe invest more into the bloody side of chaos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted March 12, 2018 Share Posted March 12, 2018 On 25-2-2018 at 11:41 PM, Túrbóbelja said: Wow! Thanks for such a crazy detailed and well written answer! I will check this further and maybe invest more into the bloody side of chaos. Your welcome! I think Blades of Khorne is an awesome army of choice thanks to it being so combat focused and me liking the combat phase the most in the Age of Sigmar game due to tactical depth. In terms of infantry/cavalry units you never can really go wrong (with except Bloodcrushers for competitive reasons), which is the awesome part. It's a very healthy community here on the Chaos side of TGA. Despite Khorne being in it's shadow in terms of competitive results versus 2016 (due to stackable Bloodsecrators). Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brimmstorm Posted March 12, 2018 Share Posted March 12, 2018 On 2/24/2018 at 2:51 AM, Killax said: - Battletome: Blades of Khorne - Generals Handbook 2017 - Rules FAQ/Errata (latest) - Generals Handbook FAQ/Errata (latest) - Chaos FAQ/Errata (latest) They have made the game play a lot simpler with AoS but the pregame work you have to do now is a lot more. Which is good/bad but I personally enjoy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted March 12, 2018 Share Posted March 12, 2018 1 hour ago, brimmstorm said: They have made the game play a lot simpler with AoS but the pregame work you have to do now is a lot more. Which is good/bad but I personally enjoy it. It is what it is But also a good reason for all to consider that at some point its better to go to a second edition that incorporates it all in one place eventually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOtherJosh Posted March 12, 2018 Share Posted March 12, 2018 On 2/24/2018 at 2:28 AM, CarkFish said: Hi chaps, ... Battlescribe and the warhammer community warscroll builder both force me to choose either demons or mortals and don't let me mix them ... Thanks Cark Okay ... on the Battlescribe side ... The AoS Battlescribe catalogs are (for the most part) horribly out of date. They’re created by a group of volunteers using the Battlescribe roster builder tool. The small team of volunteers is currently working on a set of updates for the AoS Battlescribe catalog files. Yes ... they’re aware and in the process of redoing the AoS catalogs. Hopefully new stuff will be up in the near future with a redo that encompasses the GHB 2017 and more recent catalogs. The old set of catalog files didn’t work well with the Allegiance concept, didn’t have many profiles, (depending on the catalog file) had odd validation issues... etc. On bright notes, the catalogs are actively being being worked on to solve some of that. That being said, the roster building tools (like The Battlescribe catalogs) are only tools, and at best can only provide the Rules as Written ... the people handling the configuration aren’t any better (or worse) at being “rules interpreters” than folks in the community. At worst the validation is wrong because of a mis-interpretation ... the communication channels are better than they were. As for updated Battlescribe AoS catalog files .... soon... that’s all I can really say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent of Chaos Posted March 12, 2018 Share Posted March 12, 2018 ^^^^^ Thats good to hear. I just deleted the app the other day as I grew tired of waiting for updates (it still has all of the GHB2017 points for Khorne). Would be happy to use it again once accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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