GH2017 - Ironjawz Review & Discussion

[Lysandestolpe]

It sucks if all you ou can reach are bubble wraps, like brimestone horrors. #makepigsfly

[Screamer]

Yup, a bubblewrapped opponent is hard to reach. If it's a small bubblewrap maybe 6 pigs is enough to slam through and pile in and hit with the rest of the units. A big one is tougher, of course. 

[Ollie Grimwood]

48 minutes ago, Lysandestolpe said:

It sucks if all you ou can reach are bubble wraps, like brimestone horrors. #makepigsfly

Hopefully it'll be a bit of a surprise for opponents at events and maybe one would be able to hype it up and panic them into committing too much to try and stop it. 

[Lysandestolpe]

I mean, with 15" + 9" + 3d6 charge there is absolutely enough room to perhaps avoid charging the bubblewrap. Youll have to flank tho and hope your opponent dont have a 40 man bubblewrap unit lol.  

id like to try this list tho. It seems really fun. 

[Titcher]

Do you think the list could work with less units and a maw crusha. Something like:

Gordrakk - 620

Megaboss on Maw Krusha - 460

6 gore gruntas - 280

6 gore gruntas - 280

3 gore gruntas - 140

Gorefist - 220

 

2000 points

[Megaboss Gorstag]

Has anyone tried out an Orruk Warboss with Waaagh banner? The 16"  combat phase reroll  1's to wound seems mighty tasty.  

[sporadicMike]

1 minute ago, Megaboss Gorstag said:

Has anyone tried out an Orruk Warboss with Waaagh banner? The 16"  combat phase reroll  1's to wound seems mighty tasty.  

I haven't gotten any games in with mine yet. But i have him on a war boar for the 9" move and extra attacks. 

I basically look at my list and always struggle with the more small hero's vs maw krusha debate. 

[BunkhouseBuster]

1 minute ago, Megaboss Gorstag said:

Has anyone tried out an Orruk Warboss with Waaagh banner? The 16"  combat phase reroll  1's to wound seems mighty tasty.  

I really, really want to.  I had a plan at one point to get a Start Collecting Greenskinz box, but then other things happened and I was out of the hobby for a couple months and my interests have since shifted.

But yeah, that aura for all ORRUKS is nice.  Keep him near a block of Brutes attacking big targets and I could see them chopping things down even quicker than usual!  Waaagh!!!

[Malakree]

38 minutes ago, Megaboss Gorstag said:

Has anyone tried out an Orruk Warboss with Waaagh banner? The 16"  combat phase reroll  1's to wound seems mighty tasty.  

The reroll does seem amazing, add in a Megaboss and your Brutes are rerolling 1s in both hit and wound. Having dealt with something close to that it's horrific to deal with.

You probably will need a large brute squad (maybe 15-20) with a warchanter to really make it pop. As @sporadicMike said I'd guess it involves cutting the MK for it, which this forum seems to think is mandatory....

 

EDIT: Came up with this. The idea was to have a Megaboss, a Waaagh! Bannerboss and much magic as possible. Also Managed to fit in a Maw Krusha but it's a little light on the units. That said pure target saturation for heroes and the ability to pump out 4 spells a turn should hopefully give an edge. The Wardokk isn't actually as terrible as he looks since his dance can effect himself or the Wurrgog Prophet, giving either a heal or the +1 to cast/unbind. If you then add in that the Wurrgog is casting 2 spells a turn you get extra milage out of it, the fact the Wardokk can also cast Bolt and Mystic Shield is a sweet plus meaning your weirdnob should be casting either Foot or Puke everyturn while all 3 are alive.

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (460)
- General
- Trait: Ironclad 
Orruk Megaboss (140)
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)
Orruk Warboss (140)
- Great Waaagh Banner 
- Allies
Wurrgog Prophet (140)
- Allies
Wardokk (100)
- Allies
10 x Orruk Brutes (360)
10 x Orruk Brutes (360)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)

Reinforcement Points (0)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Allies: 380 / 400

 

An option Without the MK

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
Orruk Megaboss (140)
- General
- Trait: Ironclad 
- Artefact: Daubing of Mork 
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)
Orruk Warchanter (80)
Wurrgog Prophet (140)
- Allies
Orruk Warboss (140)
- Great Waaagh Banner 
- Allies
10 x Orruk Brutes (360)
30 x Orruk Ardboys (450)
30 x Orruk Ardboys (450)

Reinforcement Points (0)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Allies: 280 / 400

You could also 50 Ardboys and take 20 extra Brutes. The Ardboys are here for meat, objective holding and beefing up the weirdnobs, 1 each.

Really does feel like the choice now boils down to MK or not to MK.

[Megaboss Gorstag]

@sporadicMike, @BunkhouseBuster it does seems to come down to whether the MK is an auto include.

 

@Malakree I am tempted to try a foot MB plus a few heroes and flood the table with a ton of MSU Brutes and Gore gruntas

Mega Boss 

Banner Boss

Grot Shaman 

Warchanter 

5 x Brutes

 5 x Brutes

5 x Brutes

5 x Brutes

5 x Brutes

10 x Brutes 

3 X Gore Gruntas

 3 X Gore Gruntas

[Malakree]

Just now, Megaboss Gorstag said:

@sporadicMike, @BunkhouseBuster it does seems to come down to whether the MK is an auto include.

 

@Malakree I am tempted to try a foot MB plus a few heroes and flood the table with a ton of MSU Brutes and Gore gruntas

Mega Boss 

Banner Boss

Grot Shaman 

Warchanter 

5 x Brutes

 5 x Brutes

5 x Brutes

5 x Brutes

5 x Brutes

10 x Brutes 

3 X Gore Gruntas

 3 X Gore Gruntas

Literally just playing around with this haha

I'm thinking that if we are guna drop the MK we need to go full out with the Heroes to get the target saturation. I'm looking at double footboss, to make sniping one out that much harder and maximizing the odds of a Reroll 1s for Brutes. Then going with 3 spell casters and a warchanter, again forcing the opponent to choose if he wants to remove your casting or your Megabosses.

In light of that I also decided to go for the 5 MSU Brutes with a Brutefist to get the extra artefact on the second Megaboss. Means with a combination of spells and Brutefist charges you can actually do some srs mortal wound output.

There's a huge variety of Wizard Options if you load up on them. 

• Weirdnob - Gets a roll on Mighty Destroyers. Probably getting +1 due to nearby units and has both Foot of Gork/Green Puke which have high potential.
• Orruk Great Shaman (Greenskinz) - Gets a +1 if in range of 20 Orruks, doesn't have the mortal wound self harm. Gaze of Mork is easier to cast than FoG or GP but is lesser damage, averaging 1 mortal wound.
• Wardokk - 20 points cheaper than other Shamans, Ritual dance is alright but gets way better with another Bonesplitterz unit/wizard. Only has Bolt/Shield.
• Wurrgog Prophet - 20 points more expensive but gets 2 spells a turn not 1. Fists of Gork is huge anti-blob at CV 8. Combines super well with a Wardokk giving you Bolt+Shield+Fists of Gork every turn for the same cost as 2 Weirdnobs. Has huge synergy with Wardokk because of the 5/6 on Ritual Dance.
• Maniak Weirdnob - The worst of the 120 Shamans. Ability to reroll a Failed cast once per battle is potentially huge but his extra spell is useless without a Bonesplitterz.
• Gitmob Grot Shaman - Only 80 points, worse save and a mere 4 wounds but has a 5++ save that shifts wounds to a nearby unit instead. Good for a cheap Bolt/Shield every turn.
• Moonclan Grot Shaman - Same as the Gitmob but trades his 5++ for Madcap Mushrooms. Also has Curse of Da Bad Moon as his 3rd spell which is a CV8 (6 with Shrooms) aoe Bolt.
• Arachnarok + Grot Shaman - Gets 2 spells a turn and provides a big gribbly monster, a slightly less costly Monster Wizard. Goes well with another 120 Orruk Wizard Like a Great Shaman.
• Troggoth Hag - I've done this one to death, will stop flogging the dead horse.

[sporadicMike]

I enjoyed this list last night. Used open war cards and the game was heavily skewed in my favor. Deployed within 12 inches of each other and I despite the odds took turn 1. 

(140) Megaboss
(160) 2x Warchanter
(360) Troggoth Hag
(360) 10 man unit of brutes
(180) 5 man unit of brutes
(180) 5 man unit of brutes
(180) 5 man unit of brutes
(280) 6 man unit of gore gruntas
(160) Iron Fist

First time playing with the hag and first time with a 6 man unit of gruntas. The gruntas tied up the entire middle of the board it was awesome. The hag is just WOW, she seems really under pointed for everything she does. Will be ordering one for pickup at Adepticon if not sooner.

I can easily see myself using her instead of a maw-krusha. 

[Skumbaagh]

So I got a question about how the waagh ability plays out when I count  up all the units within 10 inch of each other in the combat phase. So I just check the distance between the boss and the next unit and then the distance to the next and the next? Its not a bubble? And in the hero phase,  I state that I will do the waagh in the combat phase. 

[Malakree]

28 minutes ago, Skumbaagh said:

So I got a question about how the waagh ability plays out when I count  up all the units within 10 inch of each other in the combat phase. So I just check the distance between the boss and the next unit and then the distance to the next and the next? Its not a bubble? And in the hero phase,  I state that I will do the waagh in the combat phase. 

it's a 10" bubble around the megaboss which is counted in the combat phase. 

[Skumbaagh]

Are you 100% sure about the bubble? I have always played it like that, but read somewhere it wasnt like that but more like a chain with the explanation that it say "units ten inch from them". 

 

[PlasticCraic]

3 minutes ago, Skumbaagh said:

Are you 100% sure about the bubble? I have always played it like that, but read somewhere it wasnt like that but more like a chain with the explanation that it say "units ten inch from them". 

 

Yeah that is definitely the way it's played.  "If a Megaboss uses this ability, count up the number of IJ units within 10" or 15" of them at the start of the combat phase".

"Them" can only possibly refer to the Megaboss himself in this sentence.  It's literally just a non-sexist version of "Him", in case you had a female Megaboss.

[PlasticCraic]

On 9/30/2017 at 5:39 AM, sporadicMike said:

(140) Megaboss
(160) 2x Warchanter
(360) Troggoth Hag
(360) 10 man unit of brutes
(180) 5 man unit of brutes
(180) 5 man unit of brutes
(180) 5 man unit of brutes
(280) 6 man unit of gore gruntas
(160) Iron Fist

I've been playing with 3x Spear Chukkas since GH17 dropped, and I've had no joy at all so far.  In 5 games so far (approx. 20 rounds of shooting in total x 3 Chukkas), I have killed a Knight Venator and 2 Judicators.  I've mainly been targetting squishy heroes, so I don't know what more I can really do with them, except drop them!

I've got 3 games lined up on Saturday, and the Troll Hag is making her debut!  Can't wait to get her on the table.  I'll be running something similar to this, but with an MBMK and fewer Brutes.  Can't drop the MBMK personally - I'm just loving Ironclad too much!  

[Skumbaagh]

Alright. Thx for the clarification! I hope that peeps that dont play it like that will comment on this. 

[Malakree]

21 minutes ago, Skumbaagh said:

Alright. Thx for the clarification! I hope that peeps that dont play it like that will comment on this. 

It's a quirk of the English language to do with the fact the IJ book is one of the first they released.

As a result the language is a bit questionable but it is clear.

[Malakree]

25 minutes ago, PlasticCraic said:

I've been playing with 3x Spear Chukkas since GH17 dropped, and I've had no joy at all so far.  In 5 games so far (approx. 20 rounds of shooting in total x 3 Chukkas), I have killed a Knight Venator and 2 Judicators.  I've mainly been targetting squishy heroes, so I don't know what more I can really do with them, except drop them!

I've got 3 games lined up on Saturday, and the Troll Hag is making her debut!  Can't wait to get her on the table.  I'll be running something similar to this, but with an MBMK and fewer Brutes.  Can't drop the MBMK personally - I'm just loving Ironclad too much!  

Give us a report afterwards !

[BunkhouseBuster]

I played a game this week, so I'll give my report:

1800 points (ish), my Ironjawz vs. Khorne

My list:

Spoiler

Megaboss - General, Ironclad, Boss Skewer

Megaboss - Destroyer

Weirdnob Shaman

Warchanter

Brute Squad (5)

Brute Squad (5)

Brute Squad (5)

Gore-gruntas (6)

Ardboys (10)

Aleguzzler Gargant

Ironfist

His list:

Spoiler

Skull Grinder - General, something to ignore damage, something that gave him Mortal Wound output

Bloodsecrator - second artifact that never came up

Bloodstoker

Bloodstoker

Blood Warriors (10)

Blood Warriors (10)

Wrathmongers (5)

Wrathmongers (5)

Wrathmongers (5)

Chaos Warshrine of Khorne

Slaughter Brute of Khorne

A formation that let him ignore Rend -1 weapons like a Seraphon

No special missions, no objectives, and we forgot our Open War cards.  We elected to just put models on the field and bash each other!  Waaagh!

Turn 1

I finished deploying first, and gave him first turn.  He shuffled his heroes around, and didn't move forward at all with his units, which threw off my plans a bit, since I was expecting him to move forward.  I make my Ironfist rolls, and get 1s on all but my Gore-gruntas, who are moving around on the flank.  I then run my units forward, getting 1s again, and again except for my Gore-gruntas.

Turn 2

He moves up some of his units, scootching forward with his main line, but throwing a unit of Blood Warriors and his Slaughterbrute forward, charging into my Destroyer-boss, but only doing 3 Wounds to him.  And his Blood Warriors make into melee with two of my Brute Squads in the middle of the board.  My Megaboss and third Brute Squad wipe out the Slaughterbrute in his turn, and the Brutes kinda whiff their rolls against the Blood Warriors.  In my turn, I charge my Gargant and Ardboys into one flank, and the Gore-gruntas charge into the other.  That +1 Charge for being Ironjawz Allegiance is nice!

Turn 3

Not much happens or gets killed, even with the Wrathmongers giving out their extra attacks.  Each side loses an even amount, though the Gargant did stuff a Blood Warrior in his bag

Turn 4

Things turn ugly for the Ironjawz quick.  The Gargant goes down, the Brutes get whittled down, and his General tears through the Piggies with Impunity.  I manage to finish off the last of Wrathmongers with an Arcane Bolt, but the Ardboys are already down, and all I have left at the end of the turn is a couple Brute bosses, my General, Shaman, and Warchanter.

Turn 5

Warchanter buffs up the Megaboss, Shaman successfully casts Mystic Shield, but it was shut down by Khorne anti-magic shenanigans (2+ Ironclade Megaboss was my last hope, oh well).  He charges in the Warshrine as my Megaboss was making quick work of the remaining Blood Warriors.  But alas, to no avail.  I end up with the Shaman left as my only remaining model, and despite taking out the last Blood Warrior on his own, the Warshrine is able to finish him off.

KHORNE VICTORY

What I learned:

The Boss Skewer is really handy, that +1 Bravery makes Gore-gruntas not hardly afraid, and Brutes MSU much more resilient to Battleshock.  While I do miss the old Battlebrew, Destroyer and Boss-skewer are both good (and the other artifacts look to each have a good use).  Gore-gruntas are awesome on the charge, but if terrain messes up your charge and you only get two into melee range in Combat instead of 4 or more, then that d3 damage doesn't mean as much.

Ironfist is still handy, but without that extra d6 from the old Destruction Allegiance, those 1s mess up plans.  Not getting a higher average roll on 2d6 hurts the mobility.  Nowadays, I think we can view the Ironfist as a tax to get the super-Battalions and that extra artifact.

Also, Wrathmongers and Blood Warriors are annoying.  Not brutal to face against, but getting in extra attacks even in defeat can be handy.

Additionally, Khorne synergies are depressingly good.  Sure, I knew about the Bloodsecrator's buffs, but I never before saw a perfect storm of Khorne.  A Warshrine dishing out buffs is nasty.  That re-rolling all To Hits combined with the re-roll To Wound rolls of 1 on units from the Blood Stokers, and the extra attacks from the Bloodsecrators, and the extra attacks from the Wrathmongers, leads to some nasty buffed up combat units that really do some damage.

And to be fair, the dice made things weird too.  We both whiffed a bunch of our attacks but made a bunch of our Saves.  My Shaman barely contributed to the battle, and my poor early Ironfist move also mess up my original plans, as I wasn't able to get everything into his line at once like I would have liked, where I would have gotten off a Waaagh! with my Megaboss much easier.

It was a fun game, if a bit strange.  Any time that Ironjawz goes up against Khorne, you know that bother armies are winners

I really want to get my Maw-krusha in a playable state.  Working on it before anything else right now

WAAAGH!

[Sangfroid]

@BunkhouseBuster sounds a suitably gory game the fact that only the warshrine was left standing sounds about right and that you have done a good job bashin :-) we usually fight better and generally are more survivable, but Khorne with its synergies can tip the balance back the other way. One good thing is our units do fight well on their own so part of the strategy agaisnt Khorne if you can’t just snipe out his bloodsecrator is to spread out very wide (scenario and table terrain depending of course), then using classic Macedonian tactics overload one flank with your strongest troops (so in this game say a unit of brutes a Megaboss and the giant) deal with what’s in front of them then whatever is left alive rolls along the line to the next combat and overloads that etc... 

because Khorne players are so reliant on their synergies I often find they often deploy symmetrically which is perfect because then you are at an advantage with the flank push. Also a great general tactic with ironjawz is to retreat units out of combat (only 3” or so) if you aren’t positive you will gain smashing and bashing and this get to strike first or feel that the Khorne unit will eventually win out the grind.

that way you are holding you lines while neutering the Khorne guys only real damage output in your turn. Meanwhile your focusing on combats where you fight first and thus also tip the balance, add this to a flank overload and you will begin to pull the Khorne apart. 

If they get next turn they will charge but still only get to fight first once so your no worse off, if you get next turn you can either charge back in or charge another combat (thus overloading this combat even more heavily in your favour) literally every wound you don’t lose counts and this way you should limit a fair amount of damage back at you as well as potentially tearing a hole in their line exposing g their characters and buff pieces so that they then have to react and change strategy. 

 

[BunkhouseBuster]

@Sangfroid, yeah, it was a great battle.  I was almost able to get around to his Bloodsecrator with my Gore-gruntas, but his Skull Grinder was able to tie up my piggies and finish them off.  That, and he made an awful lot of 5+ and 6+ saves, which kept his Wrathmongers up for a long while.

With any luck, my Destruction movements and Ironfist movements will be more useful next time.

Also, I'm finding the Shaman is just not very effective.  I have yet to roll doubles to possibly damage my other guys, but even when casting Mystic Shield or Arcane Bolt with the +2 on first turn, it just doesn't work.  I guess my dice just don't like him

[Lysandestolpe]

GOGO IRONJAWZ AT GT!!!

quick 30min sketch ^^

[Malakree]

@Lysandestolpe

That sketch is disgusting, it truly sickens me.

What kind of an ironjawz orruk doesn't have a single piece of steel stapled to them. Have we sunk so low we must import bonesplittz cheerleaderz!