DantePQ Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 Nope Lifetakers aren't good at all, army is tight on points and lifetakers are just flat out worse then Heartrenders. Temple Test could be very cool for more elite army with -1 to hit shooting, and mortals on hit rolls of "1" againt Battalion they are quite scary but then you got to have Medusa as General as otherwise points are getting quite tight. I would go with Medusa 2xSpells HagQueen on Cauldron 3xPrayers Hag Queen Meudsa 10 Blood Sisters 10 Blood Sisters 30 Sisters of Slaughter 2x5 Blood Stalkers 2x5 Heartrenders 3 spells a turn, 4 prayers a turn, lot of bodies, quite fast, ability to redeploy one unit. A little shooting, some tactical tools, Cauldron, Avatar. But it that kind of army Morathi should be dropped for more troops as I think you just need Heartrenders in every army one unit min, but two would be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burf Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 52 minutes ago, DantePQ said: I think it's hard choice between cults : 5++ in 7" plus rerolls of all hits from turn 3 or -1 to hit plus ability to redeploy one unit. Also I like Sisters of Slaughter with Bucklers a lot. Good save ability to dish out mortal wounds even against - 2 rend. Also big unit is much better then Witch Aelves as with 6" pile in and 2" weapon range it's quite easy to make them all attack and to tie more units in combat. 1" sacrificial knives aren't that good of them. Witch Elves will work better in 10 or 20 to dish out crazy numbers of attacks. Also will be using Slaughter Queen on Cauldron as my general with item that gives you 4++ save against mortals. 13 wounds, 4+ save, 5++ fanatical faith, bravery 10(as Avatar boost it), 4+++ against mortal from magic. With possibility of healing, re rolling 5++ etc Even in army with Morathi as I don't like Morathi as General if there are no really good shooting units. Blood Stalkers are just bad for that point cost. They should be 120-130 max. Fragile with limited damage output I rather have 2 units of Heartrenders for every unit of Snake Ladies. Blood Sisters on the other hand are amazing as even without buffs - 10 of them have 30 attacks 3+,3+,-1rend plus 5 mortal wounds on average,also range 2",move 8. Battalions are quite bad but usable as they are just cheap. Blood stalkers are okay for their cost. They do basically the same thing judicators do and judicators are pretty darn good. They're mostly for single splash units or mega buffing though. If they were 140 i'd be loving it. Heartrenders being 80pts makes them pretty intense. I agree on blood sisters as well. You can't say the battalions are 'quite bad' and 'usable' in the same sentence! That's not how words work! I will say that the shadowhammer compact has potential to be pretty darn good and w/e one is the cheapest might be worth it just on the basis of getting a second relic considering how good some of them are and the fact that the triple prayer relic is so insane that azyr and warscroll builder should just attach it to your most expensive priest automatically. For witch elves I very rarely have problems getting all 30 in. Perks of a 25mm base. The rest I agree with. I'd also add missing out on the +1 to power from pain trait sucks but both hagg narr and nothellebron are too good to pass up. The 4++ from the relic only works on mortal wounds from spells btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekrund Oath Splitters Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 Word of pain would makes those 2's also 1's would it not so 33% of bouncing back a mortal and then the blood sisters kick out some extra with a reroll to hit turn 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DantePQ Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 @Burf Yep I know Relic works only against mortals from magic as I said in my summary but it's amazing on centerpiece model. I guess only Temple Nest and possibly Shadow Patrol (but tax is huge) are playable shadowhammer maybe. Temple Nest could work very well along wit Bloodwrack general bit requires to build army around it. Rest of Battalions have really bad composition. I guess Sisters of Slaughter in big more tanky unit are awesome with 6" pile in. It's just so hard to choose between extra protection and extra attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekrund Oath Splitters Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 Also there is a benefit of blood stalkers, they can hold back field objectives and still do something. You wouldn't have to waste a 10 lady squad of SoS or WE and they can target heroes that you wouldn't want to waste the HR 2 rend on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burf Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 1 hour ago, shadowgra said: In fact was: 6+ (normal SOS save) +1 because shields, +1 because cauldron 6+ cause allegiance, 5++cause temple, rerollable cause prayers. I think it is a fairly strong thing to use. However if it only within 7" i am a bit more cautious in claiming them fyreslayers like. Reminds me a lot of harbinger of decay. You can actually make a unit impossible to attack pretty easily, take a unit of 30 WE and give them shields, mindrazor, the prayer/spell that makes them reflect extra mortal wounds, witchbrew, the 5++, reroll ++, blood shield and bam! A unit with a 4+, 3.5++, 120 damage 2 rend -1, reroll hits, reroll wounds attacks that reflects mortal wounds back so hard that you could accidentally clear out a 40 block of skellies with their own attacks. Also keep in mind this is combo is only 700ish points. You could pile on WAY harder. I wish we could get WE and SoS up to 60 per unit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burf Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 7 minutes ago, DantePQ said: @Burf Yep I know Relic works only against mortals from magic as I said in my summary but it's amazing on centerpiece model. I guess only Temple Nest and possibly Shadow Patrol (but tax is huge) are playable shadowhammer maybe. Temple Nest could work very well along wit Bloodwrack general bit requires to build army around it. Rest of Battalions have really bad composition. I guess Sisters of Slaughter in big more tanky unit are awesome with 6" pile in. It's just so hard to choose between extra protection and extra attacks. Fun little sidebar: Lightning chariot works on non-stormcast units so a big unit of heartrenders with a relictor could theoretically give them the bonus rend on their shooting for the whole game in an SCE army. Too bad no mindrazor I like the battalion with SoS and Heartrenders. The bonus is 'meh' as all get out but it's dirt cheap using units you were gonna take anyway. It basically works out to 20pts worth of army bonuses and 60pts for an extra relic and reducing your drop number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amradiel Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 Do we have any word on the price for wave 2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burf Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 29 minutes ago, Amradiel said: Do we have any word on the price for wave 2? Leaked french white dwarf had one at 35 euros and the other at 40 euros Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Traitor Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 Pretty excited with the new rules. Not convinced about Morathi though, I’m going to wait some time before I make an statement. For now I think my army is going to be based around WE and SoS with shrine support, some warlocks and khinerai... Also have to decide which temple to use, aside from the Kraith I’m still tore appart between the other three... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedatkinszed Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 4 minutes ago, The Traitor said: Pretty excited with the new rules. Not convinced about Morathi though, I’m going to wait some time before I make an statement. For now I think my army is going to be based around WE and SoS with shrine support, some warlocks and khinerai... Also have to decide which temple to use, aside from the Kraith I’m still tore appart between the other three... I'm on the same page here. First I'll be buying one of each and then deciding what more I want. I'm really interested to see the painting section and teh painting tutorials that GW do over the next few weeks. In the interim while I'm buying and painting the rest I'll be playing Shadowhammer compact and adding to it as and when I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amradiel Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 45 minutes ago, Burf said: Leaked french white dwarf had one at 35 euros and the other at 40 euros Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black_Fortress_Immortal Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 4 hours ago, Ekrund Oath Splitters said: Prayers aren't limited to one use a cast? So with the artefact that allows 3 prayers per turn, a Hag can do that reroll +++ 3 times Nope. The rule of 1 is only for spellcasting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DantePQ Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 Problem with not taking Morathi is that in her place you need two Medusas/Medusa+Doomfires to have some kind of magic presence and that's 280 (and still they won't be that good as one Morathi) it could work with Temple Nest sure but outside of this it isn't that obvious,of course there are Doomfires but they aren't very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucentia Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 I put down a pre-order for Morathi anyway, the model is stunning and even if she proves too inefficient to really squeeze into competitive lists I'm not going to be too upset if I only get to throw her on the table for fluffier affairs, I think that's where a lot of the big named characters fit best in any case. In the meantime I'm applying a fresh lick of paint to a Bloodwrack Medusa so she looks more, er, suitable as a hero model, and trying to find where I put the crossbow pieces from the dark rider kit now that warlocks want to have those glued on as well, I know I stuck them in a box somewhere... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burf Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 Blood Sisters Deathstar (featuring Morathi) Points may be slightly off. Hagg Narr Slaughter Cauldron Gen. Triple prayer. Reroll FNP Hag Queen: 6s to get double hits. Morathi:Mindrazor Bloodwrack:-Bravery 10 SoS 10 SoS 30 WE 20 BloodSisters Slaughter Cauldron gives itself, Morathi, and the BloodSisters 5++ reroll FNP. Morathi Casts Mindrazor on Blood sisters, bloodwrack hits enemy with -bravery, hag queen gives exploding 6s, Slaughter Cauldron gives double pile-in. Transform Morathi turn 2, turn 3 if you're on the double and she's not in danger/in a good position to strike. Possible alterations: Non-Morathi version, drop 10 WE for a second Hag Queen with +1 power from pain, Kellebron version(SCaul takes +1 pfp second foot hag would be heal D3) In a perfect world the kellebron version has the bloodsisters doing 120ish damage to a 4+ save before exploding 6s or mortal wounds. Under ideal circumstances you could wipe literally an entire 2000pt army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DantePQ Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 I did some thinking and math and there is no way I am taking any Blood Stalkers for the same price I got two units of Heartrenders who : - have the same number of wounds - similar active range (26" vs 32") but can be deployed anywhere on the table - —2 rend and ability to move on 4+ is better rule then mortals on 6 - better mobility - 10 shots instead of 5. Also there are some abilities to make Heartrenders use extra rend rule more than once a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedatkinszed Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 From what I can see the optimal list for Morathi, with a Cauldron and a decent number of SoS and WAs might be: Cauldron Guard (with Hag Queen on Cauldron, two units of 30 WAs, but all other units at minimum) + Morathi + 20 Sisters of Slaughter. That's 1980pts, 3 drops and 92 models. Another way to do it is deploy Slaughter Troupe + Cauldron Guard (with Hag Queen on Cauldron, and all units at their minimum) +Morathi + 140pts allies. That's 2K, 4 drops and 63+ models (depending on your allies). But YMMV with this one - 10 more SoS would have this as a 3 drop with 72 models at 1980pts. The other option and the one I'll have once the 2 new units launch is: Shadowhammer Compact (including Slaughter Queen on Cauldron, one unit of 10 WAs and one of 30 WAs, but with all others at their minimum) +Morathi + Death Hag (on foot). That's 2K, 3 drops and 71 models. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richelieu Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 9 minutes ago, DantePQ said: I did some thinking and math and there is no way I am taking any Blood Stalkers for the same price I got two units of Heartrenders who : - have the same number of wounds - similar active range (26" vs 32") but can be deployed anywhere on the table - —2 rend and ability to move on 4+ is better rule then mortals on 6 - better mobility - 10 shots instead of 5. Also there are some abilities to make Heartrenders use extra rend rule more than once a game. I think a single unit of stalkers will be quite effective at objective camping. I never regret taking Judicators in SCE lists and they're functionally nearly identical. I do agree that the Heartrenders are an overall superior unit, one that I will more than likely take with every list. At 80 points they're better than prosecutors with javelins ever were and those INCREASED in cost in ghb2017 from 80 to 100. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keldaur Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 I hate not having the full cost of units. It makes it harder to plan what to buy in advance. Yeah yeah, I know, there is only a few day lefts... damned hype. 1 Blood coven is a given (planning on 1k points before anything else). From there probably a second blood coven would be better, and then add a unit of heartrenders and a unit of bloodsisters. Buuuut i can't figure out what else to add and how many extra WE/SoS boxes to add on top of that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedatkinszed Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 14 minutes ago, Keldaur said: I hate not having the full cost of units. It makes it harder to plan what to buy in advance. Yeah yeah, I know, there is only a few day lefts... damned hype. 1 Blood coven is a given (planning on 1k points before anything else). From there probably a second blood coven would be better, and then add a unit of heartrenders and a unit of bloodsisters. Buuuut i can't figure out what else to add and how many extra WE/SoS boxes to add on top of that Watch the GMG rulebook review. It's linked to a few pages back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgecoc Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 What are Blood Sisters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keldaur Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 25 minutes ago, Edgecoc said: What are Blood Sisters? Melee melusai @zedatkinszed do you have a timestamp for point costs ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Traitor Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 If anyone’s interested, if I got it right from the GMG review this are the points for the army: Morathi 480 Bloodwrack Shrine 220 Hag Queen 60 Slaughter Queen 100 Hag Queen on Cauldron of Blood 300 Slaughter Queen on Cauldron of Blood 330 Doomfire Warlocks 160 Avatar of Khaine 180 Bloodwrack Medusa 140 Blood Sisters 140/ x Blood Stalkers 160 Heartrenders 80 Lifetakers 80/ x Sisters of Slaughter 120/ 300 Witch Aelves 100/ 270 In bold you can see the prices that were confirmed in Atia’s photo. I think I got everything right, though I’m not sure about the SoS. In the video he said they went down 20 points, which would leave them in 120, but that would mean they get a discount of 60 points when taken in maxed squads, while usually you only get 30, so they might be 110 points instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamister1 Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 16 minutes ago, The Traitor said: If anyone’s interested, if I got it right from the GMG review this are the points for the army: Morathi 480 Bloodwrack Shrine 220 Hag Queen 60 Slaughter Queen 100 Hag Queen on Cauldron of Blood 300 Slaughter Queen on Cauldron of Blood 330 Doomfire Warlocks 160 Avatar of Khaine 180 Bloodwrack Medusa 140 Blood Sisters 140/ x Blood Stalkers 160 Heartrenders 80 Lifetakers 80/ x Sisters of Slaughter 120/ 300 Witch Aelves 100/ 270 In bold you can see the prices that were confirmed in Atia’s photo. I think I got everything right, though I’m not sure about the SoS. In the video he said they went down 20 points, which would leave them in 120, but that would mean they get a discount of 60 points when taken in maxed squads, while usually you only get 30, so they might be 110 points instead. Did the GMG review mention witch elves as I didn't hear them, and would have said they would be 120/300 as it looks like there discount is 300 from the WoS image Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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