Best units in destruction

[Killacat]

I'm looking to bring together all the best troops in destruction together in one mass of power!!!!

if you have any suggestions or combos please comment

[Malakree]

So the problem is that a lot of the answers to that are entirely situational.

For example the Kunnin Rukk is supposedly the strongest destruction army in the game right now. The extention of that is that the savage orruk arrowboyz are the strongest unit, however outside of bonesplitterz, outside of the Kunnin Rukk, outside of all the internal buffs and synergies they are actually mediocre. Same thing with Ironjawz Brutes, absolutely terrifying and will eat stuff. Is kinda dependent on all the other things which they get from an Ironjawz army. As a result it's really hard to single out any specific unit and go "this is awesome". It's easy to say "this unit is pants" but that's not the question you're asking.

So the summery is then, look instead for complementary units, armies and styles. That's what list building is and it's what makes units strong. 

[Killacat]

2 hours ago, Malakree said:

So the problem is that a lot of the answers to that are entirely situational.

For example the Kunnin Rukk is supposedly the strongest destruction army in the game right now. The extention of that is that the savage orruk arrowboyz are the strongest unit, however outside of bonesplitterz, outside of the Kunnin Rukk, outside of all the internal buffs and synergies they are actually mediocre. Same thing with Ironjawz Brutes, absolutely terrifying and will eat stuff. Is kinda dependent on all the other things which they get from an Ironjawz army. As a result it's really hard to single out any specific unit and go "this is awesome". It's easy to say "this unit is pants" but that's not the question you're asking.

So the summery is then, look instead for complementary units, armies and styles. That's what list building is and it's what makes units strong. 

Ah ok, what about the forgeworld big models, like the rogue idol or gaping maw or magma dragon, they look nuts. Also as for heros, which are the best for the grot ones?? Or is that not really clear

[Malakree]

51 minutes ago, Killacat said:

Ah ok, what about the forgeworld big models, like the rogue idol or gaping maw or magma dragon, they look nuts. Also as for heros, which are the best for the grot ones?? Or is that not really clear

So the "battleline if" actually makes it really important what allegiance you're running. The cheapest battleline is 90 points. That means if you're running say Ironjawz you're first 3 battleline units are actually not costing you that much more in terms of points over battleline tax. 

What I mean by this is as follows.

Destruction Allegiance

• 3*Battleline = 3*10 Orruks at 90 points each for 270 points total.
• If you then want to include 15 Ironjawz Brutes it's 180 points per 5 giving you 540
• Total points is 810.

Ironjawz Alleigance

• 3*Battleline = 3*5 Brutes for 540 Total
• Then making it up to the 810 we had before we get 720+90
• ie. 720 points for 20 Brutes and a warchanter for 80 points.

So if you want a large core of Brutes your Ironjawz allegiance is getting you a warchanter and 5 extra brutes instead of 30 normal orruks. This is why the "Battleline if" is so important. It means you have to justify not taking that alleigance. When you then add in extra rules for some alleigances it gets very messy as to what is the "best" as an example list below

Spoiler

Allegiance: Bonesplitterz

Leaders
Savage Big Boss (120)
- General
- Granite Choppas 
Savage Big Boss (120)
- Granite Choppas 
Wurrgog Prophet (140)
Maniak Weirdnob (120)

Battleline
30 x Savage Orruk Arrowboys (360)
- Bonesplitterz Battleline
30 x Savage Orruk Arrowboys (360)
- Bonesplitterz Battleline
10 x Savage Orruks (120)
10 x Savage Orruks (120)

War Machines
Grot Rock Lobber (100)
- Allies
Grot Rock Lobber (100)
- Allies

Battalions
Kunnin' Rukk (160)
Kunnin' Rukk (160)

Reinforcement Points (0)

Total: 1980 / 2000
Allies: 200 / 400
 

This list is actually illegal without the bonesplitterz allegiance, then taking it gets you 2 extra special rules for free. 

So then as to what are the best units it really comes down to what you want them to do. A big example of this is the forgeworld Troggoth Hag. She's a huge super tanky behemoth who can cast and unbind. If you're playing spiderfang alleigance you probably just want another Arachnarok instead but for Ironjawz she's an amazing ally just due to how awful the wizard options are for a pure IJ army.

I realise this isn't really answering your question so I'll try to at least sort of answer it below. As a note I have no experience playing with the forgeworld monsters, I can't say how strong they are/aren't. For the grot heroes.

• Gitmob Shaman - Works really well as a +1 wizard, the ability to pass off wounds on a 5+ and the smaller model profile can make it more tanky than other grot wizards. A really cheap way to get mystic shield into your army. Acts as a force multiplier for a Gitmob unit, Sneaky Stabbin can be rude as hell on a unit of 60 Gitmob with bows. 60 shots at 3+/4+/-1 is elf levels of shooting for a fraction of the price.
• Moonclan Shaman - Also works well as a +1 wizard. Loses some of the survivability in exchange for an Arcane Bolt ++. The Madcap Mushrooms let you try to get a +2 on his next spell BEFORE you cast the spell. This is really important if you absolutely must get that mystic shield off and have 2 wizards. He takes the Shrooms and either gets +2 to cast it, if he fails the +2 and loses his turn he hasn't yet declared his spell, this means your other wizard can then attempt the mystic shield. Again is a really cheap way to get mystic shield.
• Arachnarok With Catchweb - Both a wizard and a behemoth coming in at 280 points. Is notably way tankier than any other grot wizard and actually does stuff when it gets to combat. With it's 2 spells a turn it's easily the best option if you have the points. Most noticable thing about it is it's ability to double the wounds inflicted by spider venom. If cast on itself any hit rolls of a 6 or more are doing d3*2 mortal wounds (as opposed to 2d3, important difference). If cast on a large unit of spiderfang grots however it's an enormous force multiplier allowing for an incredible amount of mortal wounds.

So that's JUST the wizard options. You should already be able to see that all 3 of them have a place but more importantly 2 of them are force multipliers for OTHER units, if you have the Gitmob unit then the Gitmob Shaman goes up massively in terms of it's quality. On the other hand without it you should just take the Moonclan Shaman. This then snowballs across all the other heroes and units. As an example the Arachnarok really incentives having a Grot Big Boss on Gigantic Spider to combo the spell and command ability together, those then mean you really want a nice huge unit of Grot Spider Riders to abuse the abilities. Giving you 60 attacks which inflict 2 mortal wounds on a 5+. That's pretty obscene. All of a sudden you now want to use the Spiderfang allegiance, split the Spider Riders into 2 units, maybe another Arachnarok instead. Boom

Spoiler

Allegiance: Spiderfang

Leaders
Arachnarok Spider With Grot Shaman (280)
Grot Big Boss On Gigantic Spider (100)

Battleline
20 x Grot Spider Riders (400)
- Spiderfang Battleline
10 x Grot Spider Riders (200)
- Spiderfang Battleline

Reinforcement Points (0)

Total: 980 / 1000

You're now running a spiderfang list all because you wanted to abuse the Arachnarok spell.

This sort of ripple applies across most of the allegiances in destruction. The exception really being if you want to include Forge World Monsters or LOTS of troggoths. While there are clearly stronger and weaker allegiances, see above about bonesplitterz Kunnin Rukk, the only reason there tends to be "bad models" is if it's out-competed in the allegiance. A good example of this is Savage Orruks which are just bad Morboys, the only reason to ever take them is if you are a pure destruction army and want to use them as your battleline. Even then you could always just pay the 90 point Core Tax and get 10 Greenskinz Orruks instead.

So I guess to Summarise I'll say this. There are hierarchies of allegiances and units within them. There are good models and bad models. For most people, like me and you(?), who aren't the very best all of that is largely irrelevant. I could play the best most refined list in the game and good players will beat me with mediocre ones. Play what you want because you like the models, maybe a year or two from now you will be good enough for the actual power rankings of models and armies to matter. At that point though you will have a year or two of experience and be able to make your own judgements.

In the end it's a game, play to enjoy yourself.

[Ollie Grimwood]

I like Brutes 

[meet.the.doctor]

- Warboss on boar with banner - best as general if you are running mixed Orruk MELEE army

- Ironjawz Weirdnob - if combined with any cheap battleline orruks (20) and Vortex becomes a mortal wounds artillery

- Moonclan shaman - my favourite shaman - +2 to cast (even if fails makes you laugh) and Curse of Da Bad Moon is often much better than Foot of Gork

These used to be my core before GHB17 destro nerf. Now I am playing pure Bonesplitterz with Ironjawz Weirdnob and Moonclan Shaman. And missing my Banner General.

Arrerboyz are not as good as people think. If you play against an opponent with good save or worse - ward save, even with all buffs they won't do much. They are good against chaff. Don't belive in double shooting in one turn. First you need to get them in 18" range which is now short range shooting. Most armies are now mainly shooting with range 20"+. 

 

[Sheriff]

For a grand alliance in Destruction, there doesn't seem to be the same number of opportunities for inter-faction synergy like for Order or Chaos. The one exception to this seems to be Gordrak, who buffs and synergises with any Destruction model, particularly units with charge move rules such as squig hoppers. Seems like an under-appreciated synergy and I've not seen it done. (I'm not doing it because I want a racially pure army). 

[meet.the.doctor]

14 minutes ago, Sheriff said:

For a grand alliance in Destruction, there doesn't seem to be the same number of opportunities for inter-faction synergy like for Order or Chaos. The one exception to this seems to be Gordrak, who buffs and synergises with any Destruction model, particularly units with charge move rules such as squig hoppers. Seems like an under-appreciated synergy and I've not seen it done. (I'm not doing it because I want a racially pure army). 

Gordrakk seems good but his abbility works only once per game and is just twice as good as Warboss. Which is 140 pts. It would be optimal to use it for whole battalion that is in combat. But unless you play pure Ironjawz you rather avoid multiple combats in pne turn.

[broche]

If you make abstraction of synergies, i would say Goregruntas. 

They combine outstanding resistance, are mostly unsensitive to Battleshock, and are mobile. A bargain at 140 pts. They are good in ironjawz, but can also support well other army like Bonesplitterz, Ogor or mix destruction.

[Vespan]

In my opiniion best unit for Destruction is.... Moonclan Grots with Fanatics inside. 

1. It is hard to kill a unit of 40+ grots with sields. 

2. Nets have a lot of atacks and with swords hiting on 4+ you get realy nice dmg thanks to bonus from numbers.

3. Fanatics inside can be used ofensively (unit of 6-9) to deal INSANE damage. 

4. Fanatics inside can be used defensively (small unit of 3)

They are an all-starr unit realy. Also great for table control and blocking access to your characters from thos annoying teleporting stormcasts and lizards. 

 

Ad for heroes Forge World Troggoth Hag is just awesome. Very hard to kill, great dmg (including distance) and a spell that gives enemy -1 to hit and -1 to save. That combined with her stench (-1 to hit) and moonclan grot nets it makes your army really hard to be hit. 

With that theme river trolls (fellwater troggoths) are not that bad, becouse their -1 to hit stench has a nice synergy and they can fight from 2 row from behind the grots (and voimit!)

Arachnarok Spider is another stand-alone good unit if you give him battle brew or trait that gives bonus to hit if he's wounded.  He can also cast 2 spells per turn with one boosting his awesome poison. 

 

 

[PlasticCraic]

10 minutes ago, Vespan said:

Arachnarok Spider is another stand-alone good unit if you give him battle brew or trait that gives bonus to hit if he's wounded.  He can also cast 2 spells per turn with one boosting his awesome poison. 

Good post, although I'm not sure about that last bit. 

The spider is probably classed as a "mount" and therefore not affected by Command Traits or Artefacts, unfortunately.  No way to buff those Venom attacks other than the Boss's  warscroll Command Ability under GH17 I'm afraid...you're relying on rolling those natural 6s!  Unless you are -1 to hit from something like Groundshaking Stomp, in which case you literally can't trigger it at all.  Sad times for the spiders.

[Sheriff]

20 minutes ago, Vespan said:

In my opiniion best unit for Destruction is.... Moonclan Grots with Fanatics inside. 

1. It is hard to kill a unit of 40+ grots with sields. 

2. Nets have a lot of atacks and with swords hiting on 4+ you get realy nice dmg thanks to bonus from numbers.

3. Fanatics inside can be used ofensively (unit of 6-9) to deal INSANE damage. 

4. Fanatics inside can be used defensively (small unit of 3)

They are an all-starr unit realy. Also great for table control and blocking access to your characters from thos annoying teleporting stormcasts and lizards. 

 

Ad for heroes Forge World Troggoth Hag is just awesome. Very hard to kill, great dmg (including distance) and a spell that gives enemy -1 to hit and -1 to save. That combined with her stench (-1 to hit) and moonclan grot nets it makes your army really hard to be hit. 

With that theme river trolls (fellwater troggoths) are not that bad, becouse their -1 to hit stench has a nice synergy and they can fight from 2 row from behind the grots (and voimit!)

Arachnarok Spider is another stand-alone good unit if you give him battle brew or trait that gives bonus to hit if he's wounded.  He can also cast 2 spells per turn with one boosting his awesome poison. 

 

 

I play Spiderfang + Moonclan mix, and totally agree about grots+fanatics and arachnarok. Both are so SO reliable. Sure, the grots die pretty easily, but they're an awesome speed bump / objective nabber. The nets can be used smartly to really make the enemy inefficient. Never tried more than 20 per unit but presume it works nicely too. 

What I love about fanatics is that they are not reliant on any synergy to kick ass - they can form a reliable separate force away from your buffing / synergizing generals and heroes to get objectives etc.. I want to try a blob of 20 grots + 3 trolls + 3 fanatics for this. (whilst the spiders do their thing elsewhere.)

The Arachnarok just does everything: need to zap an enemy hero? Arachnarok. Need to buff a unit? Arachnarok. Need to clear a load of trash infantry? Arachnarok. Need to mortally wound a tanky enemy? Arachnarok. It can do all of this in a single turn! Probably for 2 solid turns of combat before getting killed too. Oh and it looks awesome. 

 

[tom_gore]

A 60-strong moonclan grot unit with max netters, shields and inspiring presence on them is something you will not shift in the whole game. Sure they don't kill much in return, but boy will they make your opponent cringe. Best tarpit vs. cost in Destruction I daresay.

[Chipatola]

+1 for the moonclan, I guess Huskard on thundertusk is worth quoting here, the potential for grinding your opponent through the whole game is potent, if he can't deal with them with magic or ranged attacks. And even in the case of a little bit of ranged attack in the opponent list, running 2 or 3 of them helps healing them.