RuneBrush

Happy to say that I've finished off Brutogg Corpse-Eater! Really happy with how he's come out despite having to strip back the horn on his shoulder and repaint it. He was really enjoyable to paint too which is what I've found with all the Cursed City models so far. Technically he was pretty challenging too, he's got lots of little details on that you don't realise and all of them ideally want to be painted slightly differently to make them look like he's collected them from lots of different places.

Super impressed! Looking forward to seeing what interesting uses people find for those models now!

+++ MOD HAT +++ Come on folks, Gaz posted up asking you to get back on topic and some of you have continued the conversation - you're taking the mickey and starting to test our good nature

+++ MOD HAT +++ Think we've probably veered off track for a little longer than we should have on the subject of what's a starter set and what isn't (and yes, I'm applying this to myself too). Could we try to pull the topic back onto the original topic please 😊

I've not equalled Dominion as a start collecting box or starter set - in fact I explicitly said that it wasn't intended for beginners.

Not a stupid take at all (frowns in Mod for your use of stupid). The start collecting boxes were always intended to help you start collecting a new army or as an expansion of one. The fact that for some armies you can buy multiples to make a reasonable matched play force doesn't change the fact that they weren't specifically intended for that.

Indomitus & Dominion aren't really intended for beginners. They're intended for existing hobbyists as a good point to jump into the new version plus provide a bucket of new models to add to existing armies or start new ones. There will be a series of beginner sets released that include everything you need to play - so dice, ruler (thingies) etc. Personally one of the confusions with both AoS and 40k is that you need to start off at 2000 points and matched play is the only way to play. For a new player it's far easier to learn the game with a handful of units and just using the core rules.

+++ MOD HAT +++ Appreciate that people are concerned about Lumineth and Unleash Hell, but I think we're are at the point where we need to mark it down as an "area of concern" and see what the FAQ brings this weekend. I'm sure there are other rules to discuss 😉

Really interesting topic as it's one that can be viewed from a variety of angles. On the one hand GW seemed to have loads of stock left - the fact they didn't immediately sell out of the command point tokens was a surprise for me. That said, some places were selling Dominion up to £30 lower than GW - are six metal tokens really worth that amount? Looking at FLGS's, I have a feeling that there has been a general overestimation on how many people were going to pick Dominion up, it felt like the attitude being taken was "if we have the stock we'll sell it". That was highlighted when some places dropped the price to £85 less than a week after the preorder date (they'd basically overordered and didn't have the storage space). I don't think Dominion sales were as high as anticipated, I also believe that there was a much larger number produced to ensure GW didn't get slated for selling out in five minutes. Together that gives the impression sales were lower than they probably were. If we're honest the fact there are still sets available to buy is a positive thing for us as hobbyists. My own view is that there are multiple reasons why not as many people have picked up Dominion as some other releases. Product saturation - let's be honest if you've been in the hobby for more than a few years, you're going to have a pile of shame/potential. There's a limit to how large you allow this to grow and people are a lot more aware of what they have waiting to assemble / paint than in the past New faction - I think introducing a brand new faction was risky. Kruleboyz have no history or background available for people to connect to, so you're relying 100% on the miniature range. Although you may argue Nighthaunt were a new faction too, there was already a chunk of established lore for them and the models were pretty unique Stormcast - quite simply, they're not Space Marines and somebody somewhere needs to accept this fact. Not everybody has a Stormcast army they could add these models to - actually that's likely not true, most people will have a Stormcast army, but it'll be in their pile of shame/potential and going to be reluctant to add more to it Box format - although historically popular, I think this big box format has become stale over the years. It doesn't contain an entire army and if you split it with a friend there's only one rulebook. A large number of people pick it up and then try and sell off the army they're not interested in which is a really weird sales model if you think about it Lack of gaming - I believe that AoS has suffered more from the pandemic than 40k. There has been a significant reduction in the number of games being played. Love them or hate them, organised events get a lot of attention on social media and forums which build up keen. Without those games being played there's been a general lack of enthusiasm for painting up brand new armies in comparison to a "normal" year Timing - tying into the above item, many of us feel that a 3 year rules lifecycle is too short, the pandemic has prevented 18 months worth of gaming (and it's not over yet), so to have a new version thrust on us feels a bit soon. This has been compounded by the fact that many people haven't even used their 2020 Generals Handbook Cursed City - the issues surrounding Cursed City continue to cast a cloud over AoS, but my inclusion of this game is more that many of us picked up Cursed City earlier this year. Quite a few people have a "one big box a year" rule Push fit models - GW's push fit models are stunning, probably the best in the business. However we all know that in the next six months there will be new boxes out that contain multi-part miniatures that offer more variety Over hyped - I know I'm not on my own in getting fed up from having something being hyped for weeks on end. The ironic thing is that it probably switches more people off than it does on, because we get to a point and go "but do I really need this". Hype is a great selling too, but it's easy to go too far Sorry, this has turned out a lot longer than I'd intended 😁 Ultimately I don't think Dominion was a failure, but I equally don't think it's been the success it could have been.

In truth, this is a huge subject and one me and a few friends often talk about 😁 Depending upon what fantastical background you're looking at, sometimes a Dragon is the overarching genus or family and Wyvern a sub-species, in others a Dragon is a distinct species alongside Wyverns, Basilisks etc. Interestingly, although what defines a Dragon is pretty variable, Wyverns nearly always have a pointy tail and pair of limbs and wings, in some cases the wings will form a second pair of limbs which can be used to walk on or climb. You can see wyverns in many historical sources of heraldry (Owain Glyndwr springs to mind). It's one point of discussion/contention amongst geeks that Smaug in The Hobbit film actually is a Wyvern. Within the text of the book Tolkien doesn't describe him as having any legs, but the artwork he drew depicts him as having four legs and two wings (it still doesn't explain how he moved all that gold into a single pile) From an AoS perspective, we've actually had very few new miniatures to determine what (if anything) is the common depiction. There is one piece of artwork that shows Dracothion as being a snake/worm with wings, yet all his "children" have four legs (some with and without wings). Dragon Ogors also have four legs, so there's an argument that AoS dragons have four legs - my own view is that we've seen a tiny portion of all the dragon-esq creatures in the mortal realms, so the term dragon may well be one that varies as much as our own world, depending upon the denizens of each realm.

Will be honest and say I'm of the same opinion! My feelings are that the current zombie dragon doesn't scream "dragon" and is far too similar to the Terrorgheist in silhouette than dragons within the mortal realms. By definition a zombie is a dead creature that has been recently raised by necromantic means and still has some flesh/muscle on it, so it ought to have more similarity to other dragons than not. That said, the mortal realms is a huge place - but I digress... From a modelling perspective, 130mm round base with an armoured rider on a dragon-shaped-entity (DSETM) would be fine under most circumstances as it would be recognisable as Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon. Rider wise, I'm sure there's people out there who put together the Terrorghest and have the Vampire spare, we also have the awesome new Blood Dragons so you may be able to find one of those on a bits site.

+++ MOD HAT +++ Not sure why I'm needing to clarify this, but firstly please refrain from being rude to each other. If you feel aggrieved by a comment there's a report button next to posts where you can flag it up to the mods. I don't expect to read members taking virtual swipes at each other.

I may have misunderstood this, but the impression I got was that having the subscription would give you access to the 40k app and (upcoming) AoS app. I didn't think they mentioned removing them as standalone entities - however I would imagine the new AoS app could well be priced the same as the 40k one is currently.

My own view here 😊 I was originally fairly on the fence about this. I already have Netflix and Disney+, so yet another streaming service didn't really appeal initially, especially as the animations seem to be pretty short in duration. That was combined with very little information on how it was being distributed, being completely honest I'm a grown up with my own house, I own a decent sized TV for watching shows. I'm also not a fan of the plethora of subscription services that currently exist - especially ones where you lose access to content if you stop subscribing. I've revised my opinion to "I'll probably give it a punt for a year". I've put my feelings on each of the items in a bulleted list as I felt it was the easiest to digest: 👍 Content wise, there's actually quite a lot going on 👍 The Vault seems like quite a neat way to get access to things that I missed at the time such as the original Realm Wars books 🤷‍♂️ WD interests me less as I've got every issue from the early 90's onwards, however it could be a good way to extract certain articles out to make them easier to access 👍 Higher level painting does interest me, I think there's been a lack of "start to finish" miniature painting like we originally had with AoS 1 and for centrepiece models like Nagash & Archeon. Louise is a great presenter for this type of thing too - a very precise painter who I know has had various painting sessions with the 'Eavy Metal guys 🤷‍♂️ Battle reports I'm going to reserve judgement on. There have been so many different formats over the years and being harsh, watching people roll dice for 3 hours isn't much more exciting than watching a washing machine. I'm keeping my fingers crossed we see a really smart professional format 🤞 Loremasters could be really good! Having access to the GW archives and various staff will give a much more comprehensive background on things than a double page spread in a book. I hoping that we may have Black Library authors contributing to these shows too 🤞 GW getting external people in to assist with the animation distribution - as I said above content like this needs to be accessible on smart TV. I'm hoping that all video content will go through the same means too 🤷‍♂️ Automatic sub to the AoS & 40k apps. This makes sense but I think a lot more development needs to be made long term (including a tablet mode) 👍 Exclusive miniatures - was expecting to have to buy any exclusive models. Both have a resellability value, but the do also appeal to me as a painter. Bit weird you have to wait a whole year if you pay for the sub up front 🤞 VIP bits at events. This intrigues me and as somebody who attends OpenDays (or at least when the world was a safer place) I wonder what type of thing we could be looking at being included The price point I actually think is pretty good - in fact it's really good. If you take £20 (and that's being pessimistic) for the free model, you're only looking at £30 for a year - I've spent more than that on a box of models that's sat on the shelf gathering dust... My view on the length of the animations hasn't changed - most Netflix & Disney+ animations are 25 ~ 30 minutes long and series tend to be 12~20 odd episodes. 10 ~ 15 minute episodes barely give you time to warm your seat. That said, for me the animations currently aren't a major drive to subscribe to Warhammer+ - I'll likely still watch them (not going to cost me extra) but they no longer feel like the biggest benefit One concern I do have is how much new content we're going to see being added each year going forward. It's a huge commitment/gamble on GW's part. I also think we're still missing some key pieces of information - exactly how do we gain access to this content, what funky stuff are we likely to get from our VIP status etc Usual disclaimer - this is only my own feeling based on what we've seen so far.

I've been pondering about the new coherency rules. One of the things the new coherency rules does is to reduce the number of models that can get into melee - maybe this is the actual reason for the rule rather than being an unwanted side effect? If you think about the way reinforcements now work, how you can't stack modifiers and can only receive a single command ability once per phase, the new rules basically reduce your ability to create death star horde units.

Oh, sweet summer child. Pretty much all armies get some kind of update every three years or so and there are FAQs & Erratas every six months. Glacial is back in old WHFB/40k days where an army may receive one new book per edition if they were lucky, with no updates if something was printed wrong. I think I went 3 editions of 40k without a new Space Wolves codex... If you can get a collective consensus from 1000 players, hats off to you, it's like herding cats. Let's be honest most threads on here have a dozen people who don't have the same point of view 🤣 Yes, but you can't Unleash Hell the same unit twice in a single phase. You also don't need to have a hero within range - you could feasibly Unleash Hell on a random artillery piece in the corner of the table.

+++ MOD HAT +++ Come on folks, I politely asked people to take the Warhammer+ discussion onto a new thread and have just read a page worth of you continuing the discussion in the rumour thread.

+++ MOD HAT +++ Reckon I ought to get this made into a rubber stamp... "Time for a dedicated thread on this folks and back onto rumours" 😉

Core rules are for the roll off with the person who deploys first gaining priority in the case of a tie. The battle pack for matched play changes this back to the "classic" mode where the person who deploys first gains priority. I would imagine as we see more battle packs, we could see this vary between game modes.

Interestingly, the date on the Pitched Battle Profiles in Soulblight did tie up with the month it was released so I think it was always intended to come out then.

Absolutely! Chaos Duardin will always hold an appeal, but updated Ogors (thoroughly enjoying painting the Cursed City Ogor atm) and getting rid of the last couple of finecast Khorne models are on my wishlist 😊

Would agree that it's fairly army dependant. I loved the look and feel of a huge unit of 40 skeletons in my old Grand Host army - there's something really cool about a silent unending wave of bone slowly but steadily marching upon it's prey. Equally units of 5 or 10 Blood Warriors feels like a group of savages bound together through sheer force of strength, but equally as likely to turn upon each other once their target has been destroyed.

On the talk about Nurgle not getting a new wave, I'd not be so sure. We know that GW are trying to phase out all finecast/resin miniatures from their core ranges and Nurgle still has some. We have a rumour that AoS3 is only going to introduce 2 or 3 new factions, if you combine that with how much GW actually managed to release over the last 3 years (even in the midst of a pandemic) it does leave them with a fair bit of capacity to expand each faction a bit. I don't think we have enough information to be able to say that categorically. It's possible that the physical books weren't ready to be released straight after Indomitus, because world-wide transport was well up the creek at that point in time.

As I read it, aura command abilities aren't "received" by a unit, so a unit could benefit from it and also receive a Rally. Nagash will still count as issuing a Command Ability though, so wouldn't be able to issue the Rally (as they're both Hero phase Command Abilities). I would imagine this will be clarified in an FAQ though.

+++ MOD HAT +++ Not impressed with the tone in this topic . Please don't be rude to each other - most of you have been here long enough to know that now.